Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy

raleigh

A while back, Bobfish indicated he was having trouble getting Eibach springs ... that they were all on back order. I got mine in July, with no wait, from Stylinconcepts ... for a good price, too. I put them on my '04 Envoy, along with Bilstein HD shocks (from Shockwarehouse) and the Hotchkis rear sway bar with new front bar bushings. Let me say that this combination really firms things up -- perhaps too much. GM did a terrific engineering job in giving the stock Envoy a velvety smooth ride. I was looking to maximize the handling and have apparently done so, but at the expense of ride. The ride now feels very "busy." Basically, you feel everything. In retrospect, rather than changing everything at once, I might have been better off starting with the Hotchkis bar and bushings (Hotchkis claims this is all that is necessary to firm up the handling on these vehicles.) The Eibachs do lower the vehicle by about 1 1/2 inches and it looks a lot better that way.

jcat707

I saw an 05 Trailblazer in the Target parking lot today and I don't like the changes they made to it on the exterior. There is no labeling on the side at all so now it looks very plain. Also they changed the Trailblazer font on the back and it doesn't look to good to me. The new black on white gauges look pretty cool though.

01_hoe

Do you think that the HD Bilsteins did anything to make the ride "busy"? Do you still have the OEM tires/wheels on the vehicle?

adamjeeps

Also, I have read that 05 tires will be 235-75 16 inchers. I saw an 05 and the tires looked even weaker than the 245's they replaced. Why would the General do this? Extra mile per gallon?

tidester

No buying and selling in Town Hall!

tidester, host

ross1962

...anyone notice a shudder or bad gear change (not smooth) when when the automatic transmission goes from 1st to 2nd gear?

Yes! The dealership uploaded a PROM update for this and it didn't fix the problem. I'm taking it back in this week.

ross1962

...I have read that 05 tires will be 235-75 16 inchers. I saw an 05 and the tires looked even weaker than the 245's they replaced. Why would the General do this? Extra mile per gallon? <i/>

Possibly! It would be going "Minus one" compared to the ones that came stock on mine and putting a little less rubber on the road. But if they didn't go to a tire with a stiffer sidewall, such as an LT tire vs. a P, then the handling would surely suffer, producing more body roll.

gmfan

Maybe because the 235's are a more common tire size to give us more flexibility in selecting tires from the different name brands. I went the other way and put 255's on 02 TB when it was time to replace tires. Did you notice if the 05 TB were BF Goodwrench or Michelins? I had terrible wear on my factory BF Goodwrench's and went to Michelin LTX M/S, definitely no regrets.

01_hoe

Saw a 2005 Envoy SLE today. It had Goodyear tires on it. No more Michelins?

raleigh

The HD Bilsteins were supposedly made to "work with" the Eibachs. I understand that the difference between them and the stock Bilsteins is all in the valving -- and GM ordered light valving for a smooth ride. Were I doing it over again, I would probably keep the stock shocks on to at least see how it worked with that setup.

And, yes, I made no changes to the tires and wheels.

Incidentally, does anyone know what happened to Trailblazer SS that was supposed to be a "sure thing" for 2004?

ross1962

...does anyone know what happened to Trailblazer SS that was supposed to be a "sure thing" for 2004?

What I'd like to see is a Trailblazer Z71!

poles

i read that the trailblazer SS will be coming out as an 06

01_hoe

Another question. How does the vehicle handle as far as in curves, etc. since it is lower?

tjcishere1

Well it happen to me the other day with no warning i happen to be on vacation and im about 200 miles from home. got into the turn and nothing i had power to the windows and everything else but the truck wouldnt start had to be towed. dealer found the ignition switch #12450251 and cylinder #88954645. seems to be ok now But was wondering if some of the people who had switches replace were these the same #"s

cmr239

My wife bought a 04 Envoy and I was amazed that it does not have tow hooks on the front. Not too big of a deal until I went to the parts department to order them. Simple bolt-on item. No such thing for Envoys. Trailblazers, but not Envoys. Surely I am not the only person out here that needs hooks on these trucks. Has anyone else found hooks that fit the new Envoy? Ideas? Thanks in advance. Charles

01_hoe

The elegant styling of the Envoy doesn't lend itself to tow hooks (which to some suggest off roading)in my opinion. I guess maybe you could have someone fabricate them (or adapt maybe the TrailBlazer or Tahoe hooks) and have them located somewhere in the lower front bumper.

gmfan

Well, this will come across as childish, but an associate and I had been debating for two years...which SUV is faster from 0-90 mph, my 02 TB or his 02 Jeep Grand Cherokee V-8? His engine is rated at 260 hp (he as the High Output upgrade-their stock V-8 is rated somewhere b/w 235 or 245?), while I have 270 hp, but deep down I was worried about his higher torque. I used to have a GC V-8 and I remember running even with automatic Ford Mustang GT's V-8 and used to laugh when my GC would hang with mustangs 0-60!! It used to drive those punks crazy (not to mention embarrass them in front of their dates) Well, he ended up dusting me 0-35 pulling 5 car lengths in front, and then I started inching up. By the time we hit 90 I was close to a half car length back. The faster we went, the faster I started to gain. I am sure I would have passed him at 105. I wonder: Had I had the 4:10 gearing would I have beaten him?

Does anybody know the 1/4 mile time difference and 0-60 time b/w 3:42 and 4:10 TB?

I know these are not race cars, but I like to see how this Vortec competes and I am still very impressed. This is the first time I have actually run it hard and it did well.

kidace

Hey gang,

I've got a 2000 Olds Bravada w/ 67000 miles. I'd like to change the Spark Plugs on it, but haven't kept up with what's the best of the best, out there.

Does anyone have a recommendation as to what's the best?

Thanks.
Ace

ross1962

On my '93 Blazer, I thought I was doing a good thing and put some Bosch Platinum plugs in it and fried the ignition. My advice, since you say you have a 2000, which has the same 4.3L V-6 my Blazer had, would be to stay with the OEM AC Delco plugs. (Fixing the ignition, which was covered under warranty, would have cost me $600).

adamjeeps

The 4.10 gears certainly would help, as clearly the 4.2 shines above 2500 rpm where the 5.9 is a torque monster. I bet the 4.10's would have got you even to sixty and then you'd blown by him after that.

poles

does anyone know how to find out what rear end you have?
thanks, poles

kidace

Thanks for the advice. I appreciate it and will stick with the OEM recommendation.

Sorry to hear about your ignition. Good thing it was warrantied.

tblazed

GU6 = 3.42 GT4 = 3.73 GT5 = 4.10

The code will be on the sticker inside the glove box door.

If it has the locking differential it also will say "G80" on the sticker.

Also you can tell by driving it. Mine has 3.42 gears. At 70 mph, in OD and torque convertor full lockup, engine RPM will be about 1950 with 3.42, each step up in ratio will increase engine RPM by about 10%. ( 3.73 about 2200, 4.10 about 2400 RPM).

tblazed

Pretty hard to beat the factory spec ACDelco Platinum plugs. Good up to 100k miles. I too had bad results with Bosch Platinum plugs. Put a set in a Mustang GT 5.0 V8 I used to own. Didn't fry the ignition module, but the center electrode burned itself down into the ceramic insulator within 13,000 miles, causing a bad misfire, and had to replace them. Went back to stock after that.

envoyenvy2

Not sure how fast I can go from 0-35, but with my 3.42 gears I suspect I have more "real world" power, as in maybe 35-70 (passing ability).

scottc454

I'd take that bet.
With my 3.73's, I'll always be a couple hundred RPM's higher in the powerband.

There'd have to be case where upon "floorage", a 3.42 would downshift into first and a 3.73 wouldn't. I don't see that happening. Maybe for accleration above 70, 3.42's would be better.

tblazed

Here's a chart from my Carchip recorder of what happens when you stomp on it at 75. Good to about 97 in 2nd.

ficuss

Ed, that looks like a pretty violent 1/4 second. Going from 3500 rpm to 6000 rpm and back , and from 75 to 97 mph in such a short time reminds me of the day before my engine fell apart. I did something like that when the engine was still cool. I wonder now if that had any effect on the cylinder sleeve breaking loose.

poles

thanks for giving me the information on how to find which rear end i have. Now that i know which rear end i have ,3.73, what does it really mean.
thanks, poles

scottc454

It means it takes 3.73 turns of the driveshaft to turn the rear wheels once.

It's like riding a bike. The higher the number is, the better it is for towing and off the line acceleration (at the expense of highway gas mileage).

envoyenvy2

I was thinking of 35-70 with the 3.42 gears versus the Grand Cherokee. Always gonna be an advantage with lower gears on the 4.2, at least until you get up in speed, as was mentioned.

I actually drove a new rental Envoy the other day, I am sure it had 3.73 gears as they are standard now (I believe 3.42 and 4.10 are options now at $50 ea). Even though the HP is now rated at 275 versus the 270 that my '02 is rated at, I could "feel" no difference between mine with 3.42 and the new one with 3.73, at least just driving around town. (And believe me I tried, what are rentals for!)

Only mods on mine are a K&N filter and modified (slightly) air box.

ylab

Actually the 3.42 axles are standard on TB/Envoys (Both Standard length & EXT/XL) and the 3.73 & 4.10 gears are optional at $50.00. The Buick Ranier on the other hand doesn't even offer the 3.42 gearing and only comes with 3.73 or optionally 4.10 with the 4.2 only. (5.3L Raniers are only available with 3.73 gears).

Funny part is that the rental 2004 TB EXT I was given while my Envoy was having the motor swapped seemed better off the line than my Envoy does (with either motor), even though the Envoy is lighter. - Both were 3.42 axles...I checked.

Ray

gmfan

tblazed- I like the chart. Were you going a little downhill when you punched it? Seems like you got to 97 mph in a hurry (8s). I wonder what the top end of these things would be if there was no restrictor? 130mph?

Yesterday, I was behind a Nissan Murano (some kid driving his mom's car) merging on long straight uphill ramp and when he punched it around 30 mph (saw small poof of smoke from his tail-pipe), I punched mine, and he could not pull away. I'm proud to own an American vehicle.

wpkelleysr

My outside air temperature indicator, after the car has been (i) run, (ii) parked, and (iii) restarted, seems to goes to 50 degrees and stays there for about ten minutes. Occasionally, it goes to 22 degrees or some other frigid number (It's 90+ outside these days). When it goes frigid, the a/c blows hot air (ouch). Has this happened to anyone else?

Any ideas for a fix?

Anybody know where exactly the outside air sensor is?

- WPK

blink3

Sounds like maybe it is reading Celsius???

wpkelleysr

Actually, I just went back through some old posts and it sounds like TWINROTTS had the exact same issue. Are you still out there TWINROTTS? Did you find a fix?

wpkelleysr

Nope, more like Kelvin.....

blink3

Just purchased an '02 envoy. Love it. the brakes feel odd though. say you are approaching a stop, you slowly apply the brakes (real slow, just easing them on) it seems the pedal goes further and further and the brakes not really "clamping" down. The pedal never reaches the floor or anything like that, it just seems like there is a lot of "play" before you get to the actual pressure of the master cylinder, then when you get to it, it feels almost "mushy". If I jumped on the pedal, I think I could get it to lock up, but the brakes just don't feel very confident. Anyone had this or is it just me?

envoyenvy2

Blink,

I have an '02 Envoy as well but have had it a couple of years, so probably not the best to answer this question as I am used to the brakes.

I do recall when the truck was new the brakes having a different feel from the truck that I had before (S-10 pickup). Seems like they just had to be pressed a little harder. I just kind of figured it was because of the extra weight of the Envoy and the 4 wheel discs vs 2 wheel on the S-10.

At any rate, I sold the S-10 and started driving the Envoy exclusively, don't notice it anymore. In my opinion the brakes work great for a vehicle with this weight. You might want to swing by a dealer and drive a new one to see if it is different just to make sure it is not another issue. I drove a rental 2004 the other day and noticed no difference from mine.

tblazed

Were you going a little downhill when you punched it? That stretch of highway (I-30 btwn Dallas and Ft. Worth through Arlington) along there is pretty flat and level. People had been passing me doing 70-80 in a 60 mph zone so I waited 'til there was at least a clear mile ahead before I put it to the floor.

Could be the combined (or possibly synergistic) results of the low restriction Green air filter and the Borla exhaust coming alive above 3,000 rpm. One thing about it, it definitely has passing power!

rad225

I have a 2002 TB LTZ with the 17" wheels. I like the smooth ride but suffered from too much body roll on sharp curves. The TB also required many little steering corrections in crosswinds or on rough roads. I just installed a Hotchkis rear sway bar kit (with their front bushings), the difference is amazing, I find that I have better control on the highway even going 10 mph faster. Also the rear seat passengers are not tossed around from side to side as before. I did not change the springs, shocks, wheels, or tires. Truck has 51K miles, love it!!
I will be changing to Michelin Cross Terrain tires when the original BFG Rugged Trails wear out (I estimate about 58K). The BFG's are very noisy on concrete highways, I hope that the Cross Terrains fix that. I plan on installing 265/65-17 size to replace the 245/65-17's. Has anyone used that size? any problems with engine/speed calibration?

twinrotts

Had almost the exact problem that is documented above and yes, the dealer did fix.
In my case it was simply the air temp sensor found under the hood. Sensor was replaced back in May/June and the fix has remained fixed.
The only difference in how I would describe my problem is, when the temp sensor read 50, A/C became less efficent. It never blew hot air.
This makes sense as there are multiple sensors inside the vehicle plus the outside air temp that determines how the climate control responds

cirdan

My outside air temp sensor did the same thing. Now it's just flat stuck at 50 degrees.

The problem is a failed/faulty sensor. I'm out of warranty, and the dealer quoted me $225 to fix, so I'll live with it. In theory, it doesn't impact anything else, but I've also experienced A/C problems. However, many, many people have had A/C problems without a bad temp sensor so . . .

bobfish

Thanks for the info on the Hotchkis sway bar. I purchased a Hotchkis sway bar a month ago and was waiting for my Eibach springs to arrive so I could install everything all at once. Now that the springs have been on back order for over a month I think I will just install the sway bar and see how it handles and forget the springs and save a couple hundred.

cp1227

I have searched past postings and it seems that some people have had the same issue I have with with my Envoy (2004SLT). Haven't seen anything recent though. Problem occurs when I stop at traffic light - truck in drive, foot on brake. There is a surging that is felt every few seconds. Strange feeling. Some people have described it as a feeling of being bumped from behind or jerking type feeling, but without the truck moving. Anyone else still have this problem?

01_hoe

My 03 Envoy SLT (Build date 8-02) has a similiar occurance when the vehicle first starts up. If I go to a stop sign or stop light and am waiting 20 seconds I will feel a slight bumping sensation. Might feel another, then as truck gets to operating temp no more problem.

cp1227

Mine will continue with the problem even when it is warm. It won't happen every time, but so often that I don't even want to drive it anymore. I purchased in January and it has gone to the dealer three times for this issue. They have done engine control module reprogram, deburred the "output" shaft. (maybe drive shaft?), and lubed everything possible. Now they just claim they can not duplicate. What a joke!

seiford

CP1227: We have that problem with our '03 Envoy. It's had the problem since it had 1,000 miles on it.

I escalated the issue up through GM's Customer Service Center and they admitted it's a known issue but they don't have fix for it (and won't say whether they are even working on a fix). We got a letter upping our transmission warranty to 100,000 miles and they consider the case closed.

We even tried arbitration, but that was a total waste of time. Their only choices for resolutions are "Buy Back" or "No Buy Back". We wanted a "Make GM fix it!" resolution. The arbitrator agreed the truck has a problem, but since it isn't a safety issue he couldn't rule for "Buy Back".
   
Each time I bring the Envoy to a dealer for service I have them look at this again. But it's still not fixed. The last try was an update to the PCM.

I empathize with you.. it's very frustrating, isn't it? This last time we tried a different dealer.. time for trip #2 this coming week.

baltychen

I have a 2002 Trailerblazer LS. I never following the manual to change my oil. My own schedule is every 5000 miles but recently my oil light stay on and last aroung 10 seconds then goes off. I reset the oil light system by following the manual. It didn't work. It still stays on for a while. Eventually, I took to the dealer to have them to reset for me.

wlbrown9

Been away from the forum for about 2 weeks, so this may be a little late. We have an 2004 Envoy XL SLT with the 3.42 gears. Only thing I have really noticed (wife drives it 95% of the time) was on vacation about the first of August. Driving on Interstate about 70 MPH with the cruse control on..this is the first one I can remember downshifting TWICE to keep up to speed going up a pretty good hill..of course it was loaded probably to the maximum recommended weight. Not a problem, but if I could have found one with the 3.73 gear equiped like we wanted, I probably would have gone that way.

Bill