Lincoln LS

lateralg

I also agree.

Self-insuring pays off.

Consider the outcome If every time we're offered an extended warranty on anything (Auto, TV, Appliance, Stereo, camera, etc.) we put the cost of the extended warranty in a special savings account. Then withdrew from that account if/when needed to pay for any needed repairs. After a few years the account would likely have a balance adequate to cover any repair, with some spending money left over.

Doubt it? Look at your history.

The floor is now open to those who have experienced exceptions to this.

akirby

I've never bought an extended warranty on a vehicle, and I've only bought one or two on electronics and that was over 15 years ago before I knew better.

I can't remember a single car repair, electronics repair or replacement that would have otherwise been covered by an extended warranty. If there were any it was only a few hundred dollars worth. In contrast I've saved several thousand dollars, so there's no doubt I'm way ahead, even if I have a few big ticket items come up in the near future.

The trick is not to pick and choose because you'll end up buying the ones you don't need and not buying the ones you do need.

Some people buy them just for peace of mind and if that's the reason and you understand it may not be saving money - go for it.

YMMV.

marsha7

I must take a small exception, as I see this as kinda apples and oranges...I absolutely agree that an ext warr on TV, Refrigerator, Stove, Microwave, Stereo, camera, and the like is wasted money, because there is not much that expensive to break on those items...but I feel a car is different (and yes, maybe it is just peace of mind that causes me to think this way)...since a car endures more physical abuse than any of the other items (jack rabbit starts, hard braking, skidding, potholes, sinkholes, minor collisions, the strain of interstate speeds, etc), there are many components of a car that may break and cost much money to fix...

Air Cond systems, transmissions, timing chains/belts that break and cause valves to hit pistons, computer electronics, suspension systems, can all be over a grand to repair if they need major repair...

I agree in one sense...if only one of those items breaks, than the cost of the repair is probably about the cost of the ext warr...

But if two or three of those systems break, your total repairs may exceed $3-4,000 or more, then a $1500 ext warr would be quite useful...

Another thought...some folks may not have the lump sum of $1500-2000 for the repair, but the warr cost spread over time ($1500 over 48 month loan is $31.25 per month, a little more, say $35 per month with interest) can be managed by most...

My 2000 Intrepid had a 75K ext warr, and it had something break almost every 30 days once the odo broke 69K miles...I took it in for warr repair at least five times, and I know that the combined repairs cost much more than the $1200 I paid for the warr back in 2000...to me, well worth the cost...

The ext warr is just insuring against risk, and the risk of not having to come up with the lump sum for repairs...if you never have a warr repair in 100K miles of driving with a 5 year, 100K ext warr, you still have not wasted $$$, as you were always covered for the risk, and it just means you bought a damn good car, something that does not seem to exists on these posts, when you read all the complaints that are posted in these topics... :shades:

cdnpinhead

Yeah, but here's the thing. You need to read the contract very carefully. Much of what matters is excluded. The stuff that breaks often isn't covered.

I learned early that Asian vehicles didn't break important stuff. . .ever. Little s(tuff) went south from time to time, but who cares -- pay the man the $90.

If external warranties made sense, they wouldn't be sold. These people aren't looking to lose money. They prey on the fears of people who buy cars that don't last.

It is, apparently, a winning business model. Just leave me out of it.

marsha7

warranties on my Ford and Dodge cover everything except wear and tear like wiper blades, tires, disc pads, but anything mechanical is covered, or so I believe...obviously, you are correct in that if a wiper motor breaks, fixing it under warr for $75 will not offset the $1500 cost of the warr...but if the car has multiple "nickel & dime" problems, adding up to $700 or 800, that is no big deal...the true value of the warr is to ward off the $1500-3000 repairs for AC, tranny, major suspension, or engine problems...I hope it doesn't happen.

I purchase life insurance because altho I am betting I will die, if I don't I do not feel that my premium was wasted if I live another year...

All I am doing is paying a risk premium that covers me for major (and minor) mechanical failure...the coverage for minor failure is gravy, since I buy it for the major coverage...

akirby

But Steve has a valid point - on most extended warranties they don't cover everything. And they only cover a very short period of time. e.g. a 6 yr 75k warranty on a LS is really only a 2 yr 25K warranty since the factory warranty is 4/50. The failed part has to be covered and has to fail in that short window. Before that, Lincoln pays. After that, you pay anyway.

The only thing that makes sense is to finance the warranty. If you can afford to pay $1500 cash for a warranty at the end of the factory warranty (which a lot of people do) then you can afford to pay for just about any repair.

Self-insurance is always cheaper, if you can afford it.

lateralg

I agree mostly. In thinking about this, it occurs to me that I still carry collision and comprehensive insurance even though the insurance company is WAY ahead $$-wise. If I had all the money I ever spent on collision and comp., and subtracted from that the total all my claims, I would probably have enough to buy a very nice new car.

I still carry that insurance because I don't want the potential of a $20,000 hit to my budget hanging over my head. I can deal with a $3,000 hit, tops. So, no extended warranty for me.

Others have different threshholds, and life is better for them by being insured.

Question: How much does an extended warranty cost, and for what time & mileage?

"Asian vehicles didn't break important stuff. . .ever."
Toyota/Lexus engine sludging?

akirby

I guess the engine isn't all that important. Or Honda transmissions.

cdnpinhead

Recall that I was referring to "my" Asian vehicles, not all Asian vehicles.

I drove my '73 Datsun 240Z 224K miles over an 11.5 year period, a '73 Datsun 510 106K miles in 7 years (bought with 164K miles), and two Mazda Miatas (first one was lost in a collison) 78K miles in 4.5 years.

When I compare my experiences with those vehicles against what I endured with my Chrysler products (3) and the LS for that matter, there's no comparison, at least in a favorable light.

Anecdotal & all that, but still quite relevant, at least to me when I select my next vehicle, or extended warranty.

lateralg

"Recall that I was referring to "my" Asian vehicles, not all Asian vehicles."

"I learned early that Asian vehicles didn't break important stuff. . .ever. Little s(tuff) went south from time to time, but who cares -- pay the man the $90."

Thanks for clarifying. I must have mistakenly read the earlier ststement as a general one.

dcls6

At 23-2500 rpm, D5, 62-69 mph there is a slight increase in engine sound - more evident because interior sound level is pretty quiet. Goes away at +2500. I don't think tapping the brake affects it.

lateralg

Does the noise also occur at 23-2500 rpm in fourth gear?

pluskin

Just wondering, as I'm looking at used LS's, is there some easy way to tell whether or not a car is equipped with Advancetrac? None of the salesmen know the difference between advancetrac and traction control (one actually told me that there was no difference), and I'm not sure if you can tell on the basis of a button or switch in the car.

akirby

Actually, the button on the console will tell you. If the button says OFF TRAC , it's only traction control. If it says OFF ATS, that's Advance Trac.

pluskin

So the OFF ATS button is on the center console? Next to the cup holders?

akirby

Yes.

jdadamsjr

The wife's 2002 LS is coming off lease and we want to swap the borla dual exahust onto my duaghters 2002 LS...
am I looking at just a few bolts to undue to move it to her car or is it a bear to swap the cat backs ?
(also have to r&r the lower facia too.... (cut outs for the exhaust tips) )

Thanks in advance...

jdadamsjr

The wife's 2002 LS is coming off lease and we want to swap the borla dual exahust with my daughters 2002 LS stock exhaust...
am I looking at just a few bolts to undue to move it to her car or is it a bear to swap the cat backs ?
(also have to r&r the lower facia too.... (cut outs for the exhaust tips) )

Thanks in advance...

rollier1

I would really appreciate some info on the best place to install an after- market portable Pioneer XM Radio in my 03 LS. Wiring, location, antenna placement etc. I also got a free XM Roady and may want to install that one. Ideas please!

gkarg

You'll want to have a friend to help - although it is possible to change out alone. It has been awhile since I change mine from stock to Borla, but I believe there are probably only 2 nuts/bolts to contend with (not totally sure.) You should be able to just literally drop them down and swap them out in a pretty short time.

dcls6

No, not at same speed, but at a higher rpm - like the engine goes through a resonation at a certain rpm then gets quiet again.

lateralg

Since it happens at a different RPM in 4-th than in 5-th, my thought on the cause is wrong. Sorry.

dcls6

Appreciate your thoughts. I don't think it's a big deal. Was a little more concerned about the moaning sound at that occurs intermitantly w/ stop-start driving. It never happens the few times I've been to a service center. Otherwise a great ride.

chartrand

Our club (Dallas TX)undertook this same project a year or so ago. We were spoiled by having a lift availabe to us but the car from going onto the lift till being back on the ground running was 15 minutes flat. The receiver car didn't have cutouts in the rear facial and so it was trimmed to clear with a dremmel.

klausnomi

I have a 2000 with a manual transmission which I purchased new.
The car has only 32000 mi. after five years of ownership and out of warranty.
Great car to this point.
It seems that (my best guess @ this point) it blew a spark plug.
Dealer says that just the diagnostic will take about 4 hours( and $363.00), as some disassembly is required to know exactly what is wrong!
Is anyone aware of any service bulletins or recalls to this or similar sounding problems?
Has anyone had a similar occurance( blowing a plug), and if so, the severity of the problem?

Thanks for any input.

klaus

akirby

Well, plugs don't "blow" so we need a bit more detail to help you.

What's the symptom? Was the Check Engine Light on?

The LS uses COPs (Coil On Plugs) and they've been prone to failure, especially if the valve cover gaskets leak oil. Maybe that's the problem?

corsicachevy

My wife's boss currently owns a 2004 BMW 530 which, if his example is reflective of other 04 BMW 5 Series, could be the most troublesome car ever produced. I told him to run, not walk, away from the car when he was considering the purchase. He didn't listen.

By Wisconsin standards his BMW is a lemon several times over and whether he chooses to invoke that law of not, he will need a new vehicle. This time, he promises to listen to me.

I was thinking about appealing to his pocketbook by suggesting that he get an 05 or 06 Lincoln LS V8. Thoughts, concerns, suggestions - anything would be helpful.

klausnomi

Thanks for your response!

Well, in speaking with the service tech, that's exactly what happened. Stripped the threads right out! Seems to me to be a defective head or cross threaded when installed at any rate, I'm comfortable with having them (heliocore?) i think that's it, and re thread it and the the new manifold with labor is $1600.00. Seems pretty strange that a vehicle with that few miles (and serviced according to the manual) would develop a problem like this! Just wondering if there is anyone at Lincoln that might be worth talking to!

Thanks for your help!

akirby

If he wants a V6, it will have to be a 2005. They're dropping it for 2006. Should be able to get a heck of a deal on a 2005. The LS will have more room than the 530. Handling is similar with the LS V8 Sport model but ride quality over harsh roads will be slightly worse than the 530. Most everything else will be subjective. If he likes the styling and the test drive, there's no reason not to go for it. A 2005 LS V6 can be had starting around $25K - $27K. The V8 should start in the low $30's.

akirby

That is strange. Are these the factory plugs or were they changed?

Your dealer can authorize an AWA under some circumstances but it's totally up to them.

nvbanker

It's a good suggestion. As an alternative, it'll handle in similar fashion, and be fun to drive. It will be a LOT more reliable, but the problem is, it won't command the respect the BMW does. How much that matters to your friend, will really determine his satisfaction.

klausnomi

The plugs are factory!
Would I inquire to the service department about an AWA?

akirby

Yes - ask your service adviser. Tell him these are the factory plugs and must have been put in wrong or there was some other catastrophic failure and you think Ford should pick up the tab on an After Warranty Adjustment. It helps a lot if you bought the car from them but not required. If you're lucky they might pick up the tab or at least split it with you.

klausnomi

Thanks for your input! Is there a site that I might be able to find so additional info on the AWA, just so I have my "guns loaded" so to speak when I approach the dealer?

Thanks

akirby

Not really. It's an internal dealer/manufacturer thing that they don't advertise. There really aren't any rules or guidelines to publish anyway. I've heard that Lincolns are allowed 2 AWAs and Ford/Mercury vehicles get 1, but that's never been confirmed. It's also possible that it's based on a total dollar amount across the board each month or year.

Whatever it is - it's still the dealer's call.

jdadamsjr

Hey there Guy !!!
I remember now - I was there - I had forgotten about that !!!
you and I live in the same DFW city...

Only issue I find is swapping the rear valance since one has a cutout....

give me a call !!!! or email
John

klausnomi

Just an added note! Just stopped by the dealer, and as it turns out, it blew 2 plugs out on the same side! Sounds to me like they weren't tightened! They said they are investigating!

buggy01

My husband and I are thinking of purchasing a used Lincoln LS. Can anyone offer your feelings of how much you like your car, the year, and whether or not you have a V6 or a V8? Positive and negative comments welcomed. Thank you.

lssoul

Hey, buggy01. I love my LS. It used to get a lot of stares, but no more. There are lot more on the road. I have kept it straight-laced. No chrome rims. No "dubs". But I keep it very clean on the inside and outside. It looks great with tint. I have the V6. I bought mined used with 42000 miles on it about 2years ago. I bought the extra warranty. It has been in the shop for most of the things mentioned in these forums from the 2000 year model: coils, bushings, wheel shimmy, fuel pump. But all covered by warranty. I appreciate the car for all that it has in it. The rain sensing windshield wipers, auto headlights, traction control, duel temp zones. indy style front suspension. rear independent suspension. It is a techno powerhouse.

jdadamsjr

If you want a GREAT 02 LS V8 that is SHARP and LOADED, come to John Eagle in Dallas, Tx around Sept 16th....
we're turning in a pristine leased one that has not had a HICCUP in 32k + miles...

I got some appraisals and they offered me 14500 for it !
it is a superb handling and riding car.... but it would cost me 19000 or more to keep it....
Still considering it, but waiting for them to make it more worth my while...

nvbanker

I would recommend all but the 2000 model year - it has the "first year" issues. The rest of them have been extraordinary cars on the whole. There is always that "one" out there...of course.

I'd get the 8, but the 6 is also a very good engine, just weaker.

lateralg

NV,

I agree in essence. I also wouldn't consider the 6 to be weak.

nvbanker

I didn't say the 6 was weak, just weaker than the 8. That's all.

chartrand

May seem strange coming from a gear head like me that has raced the LS - but the 6 is more than adequate, especially the 04 on up models. We had the opportunity to throw some of them around up at the Dearborn proving grounds a few years ago. The 6 was actually a better balanced and hence better handing car than the V8.
If you want the sinking back in the seat feeling when accelerating then the 8 is the way to go.
I had a 00 and an 02 and given the way I drive, they were both outstanding automobiles with little worth mentioning in the way of service or recalls.. Pity more people don't know about them.

buggy01

Thank you all for your feedback. I was thinking of a 2002 or 2003. I will be the one who is driving it mainly - so I am not sure if I need to the V8. I'll be commuting in it so I want to save some gas. I just think they are so cool looking - I've been noticing them on the road for about 2 years and every time I see one, I know I just love it. Glad to hear from you all. Thanks again.

lobsenza

Direct wire in connectors are available for the LS so you don't have to use FM modulation.

nvbanker

"Pity more people don't know about them."

Exactly. They are Ford/Lincoln's best kept secret.

akirby

Go for a 2003 V6 - over 500 improvements over the 2002 model including more power due to variable cam timing with as good or better fuel mileage. You also get a satin nickel center stack, electric parking brake, etc. I also like the bumper chrome strips on the 03+ much better than the pre-03.

schlimp

I am having the same problem - I can't open the door from the inside or outside. In the post it says to "release the latch as required" - can I get some more specific instructions please? I have the door panel popped off from the top, but screws are located that can only be reached if the door is open...so I can't get it all the way off.

schlimp

Did you ever get this fixed? I am having the same issue and need help?