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Here's a link:
http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-57460257-48/2013-toyota-avalon-gets-the-cam- rys-v-6-hybrid-engines/?part=rss&subj=news&tag=title
It just gets worse with every new picture, etc
What is Toyota thinking?
Oh and the article is wrong. The 3.5 268HP V6 is NOT direct injected. The 300HP version in the Lexus IS and GS is DI.
2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve
Some days I like it and some days I don't.
color will make a big difference for me, but not as big as:
- Ride
- Comfort
- Quietness
- Over-all feel when driving
Boy I'm sure my local dealer isn't going to be happy if I get my deposit back and go and buy a used LS 460 L
Skip
http://www.autoblog.com/2012/06/26/toyota-avalon-gets-40-mpg-hybrid-model-for-20- 13/.
If you go there, click on press release.
Since the main difference between the Camry Hybrid (TCH) and the Avalon Hybrid (TAH) will be the slightly larger Avalon, it will be interesting to see what the pricing differential will be. If the price differential for the TAH vs non-hybrid Avalon is large (like the price disparity between the fully loaded non-hybrid Highlander LTD and the hybrid Highlander LTD, ~$7-9K), the choice will be easy--->TCH will get most of the sales, or the non-hybrid Avalon will be the big choice, in spite of the unattractive front-end design.
Jake
Also, Edmunds says the
2012 Camry XLE V/6 starts at $30,115
2012 Camry XLE Hybrid starts at $27,500
So, does that tell us the Avalon hybrid will cost less than the V/6? Several thousand less?! Then yes, I agree, hybrids will sell more.
I like the looks of the new Avalon, grille and all. But, if they're making it smaller and trying to be sportier with it, then it becomes more like every other car. For the money, I'd rather have a Lexus ES, etc.
Fiat says their 500 is EPA rated 30 city/ 38 hwy. The Avalon hybrid is supposed to be 40/39 right?
Looks like Toyota's going to deliver on the "better mileage than a Fiat 500" promise.
1.) More info on 2013 hybrid Avalon from Automobile magazine:
http://rumors.automobilemag.com/toyota-unveils-powertrains-for-2013-avalon-v-6-a- nd-hybrid-options-available-150073.html
2.) 2013 Lexus ES 300h Car and Driver review article:
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2013-lexus-es300h-hybrid-first-drive-review
3.) And 2012 Camry hybrid Car and Driver review article:
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2012-toyota-camry-hybrid-test-review
In my opinion, these three hybrids will all perform about the the same, but the advantages as I see them are as follows:
1) Camry hybrid in XLE trim is a really nice car, and will be the least expensive of the three, and has a fairly decent front-end/grill design;
2) Avalon hybrid will be a little more roomy and comfortable than Camry, but will cost a couple grand more, but will have the most generous room in the rear seat compared to the other two;
3) ES 300h will be most plush, and has a better grill design than the Avalon (unless Toyota surprises us and changes it for the final version; let's hope, but not hold our breath), but will cost a few grand more than the Avalon.
What do you all think?
Jake
If only Toyota would use that grill on the Avalon it would have a perfect car with the looks of a supermodel. Perhaps if we write to Toyota and suggest the Aurion grill they might listen. So start writing.
1) You have to drive better / different / more carefully to get high mileage
2) It will cost more then you might recoup in a reasonable time period
3) The cost in general
4) Repair cost(s) down the road (although I trade ever year or so, so it won't likely concern me)
5) - Add on here your thoughts
I'd like to see the web site show the color options for both interior and exterior (I want to pick out my color combo:))
Skip
And I for one, wanted the car to be a bit bigger (making the comparisons to camry a bit harder)
No one, not even me, wants to be buying a glorified camry, when purchasing an avalon.
Skip
Well some would argue that the Avalon was always a glorified Camry. IMHO there was always enough differences (especially size) that it was worth it. Heck, I've owned two of them and loved them both. This new model is doing nothing for me, what a shame.
2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve
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The 2013 Avalon needs to be a winner to reverse the sales slide of the past dozen years. The hideous grill certainly won't help matters as expressed by many in this forum. Here are the sales data for Version 2.0 and 3.0 respectively:
2000---104,078
2001-- -83,005
2002--- 69,029
2003--- 50,911
2004--- 36,460
2005--- 95,318
2006---88,938
2007-- -72,945
2008--- 42,790
2009--- 26,935
2010--- 28,390
2011--- 28,925
Source: http://www.answers.com/topic/toyota-avalon#ixzz1zC69Tc5r
2000 (Gen 2) had its best years early in the run. 04 was a very light year knowing Gen 3 was coming and was a huge difference (including an all new engine, the 2GR V6).
The current Avalon basically dates back to 05 and IMHO is very long in the tooth (while still being a damn fine car).
If Toyota was serious about keeping a large floaty car in the lineup they would have brought a heavily refreshed version around 2 years ago. If it were me I would have brought the DI version of the 3.5 (from the IS/GS 350) and changed up the looks while keeping the size and ride.
They unfortunately are trying to please everyone and are playing the hybrid game and making it too close to the Camry. I don't know how they plan on selling it. It already overlapped with the ES350 in terms of price, now that it's smaller what's the point? The main reason I bought my Avalons over an ES was the fact it was roomier.
All this is a moot point anyway, as again IMHO the photos we have seen show the new Avalon to be butt ugly with a face only a mother could love.
2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve
- The Economy?
- High Gas Prices?
- Lower Used Car Prices?
- Increased pushing of Camry
- New exciting models from the competition?
- Folks keeping their cars longer?
- Leasing Options?
- Other car sales for same periods?
I see A LOT more Avalon's on the road in the last year, then I use to see. Are all 28,000 being sold on the East Coast?
All interesting questions.
Will the New Avalon sell more / better É YES! Will it be enough to turn it around?
They can't make sweeping changes next year, as this is a pretty big change and new body changes aren't cheap or practical to make the next model year.
Skip
The short answer is that the S60 meets our needs and I wanted something a little different. We wanted a car that is smaller than thr Avy, but did not want to sacrifice, comfort, ride, fuel economy. The front seats in the S60 are very comfortable. Plenty of power and I'll get around 30 MPG on the highway on regular gas. Also, while we both have outstanding driving records, I'm the first to admit that at 62 my vision/hearing/reflexes aren't what they used to be, so I appreciate the numerous safety features the Volvo has. The LaCrosse is a very nice car, but those thick A pillars were a deal breaker. The ES350 is also a great car, but I see them all over the place here. I've always felt that European cars were more expensive to maintain than American or Japanese, but Volvo has free maintenance and covers repairs, including brakes, for 5 yrs/50K miles. The dealership also offers free loaners for the life of the car. The service dept. is also more "upscale" than any Toyota dealership in my area. So all of this factored in.
I had considered Volvo's some time back, and then got hooked on Toyota's (plus the dealer buy's a TON of promotional / marketing stuff from us), and because of that, I went with Toyota's. So far, glad we did. 3 Avalons, 3 Camrys, a 4 Runner, and 2 Tercels, later, no problems with any of these.
I'm hoping the new Avalon grows on me.
Enjoy the Volvo.
Skip
- http://www.flickr.com/photos/vonstringcaldinkal/7521273270/in/photostream
- http://www.flickr.com/photos/vonstringcaldinkal/7521273254/in/photostream
- http://www.flickr.com/photos/vonstringcaldinkal/7521299128/in/photostream
And the winner is?
Skip">
Thanks for posting the links.....
Jake
- http://www.flickr.com/photos/vonstringcaldinkal/7583263288
Skip
Also figuring Toyota isn't going to change the grill for the 2013 model, I just want to convince myself it's better:)
Skip
Skip
If Toyota remains bullheaded and does not change/reconsider the 2013 front end/grill design, I just may jump ship too like Jeffm5. I will now start to seriously look at the competition over next 12 mos: Nissan Altima (2013 SL), Nissan Maxima (2014, when it is introduced in ~ 12 mos), Hyundai Azera (2013), Hyundai Genesis (2014 MY change due in ~ 12 mos), etc. I have been a loyal Toyota owner in past, but...the design wonks at Toyota are changing that. Even dumb politicians have the common sense to appeal to their base, but apparently not Toyota. I am frustrated with the lack of leadership and bad design execution at Toyota. Reminds me of the poor design decision-making that was done at Acura with their polarizing 'bagel cutter' looking grill design that caused many previously loyal Acura followers to look and go elsewhere, jump ship, for the last several years.
Jake
- http://pressroom.toyota.com/releases/lexus+pricing+2013+es350+es300h.htm
So will the avalon be less, and if so, how much? Because to close, will have a lot of folks jumping ship to Lexus??? Is this their plane all along?
Anything less then $4,000.00 lower, will make it VERY hard for me not to switch.
Skip
This will be interesting to see what happens. For me, being on the inside and driving 40,000 miles a year, the inside is REAL important to me, and well, the Lexus looks a lot nice, as well it should, but at a base price that's less then a LTD Avalon???
">http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8289/7593248110_6e6e7c20dd_c.jpg
Lexus 350 - 36.1
Lexus 350h - 38.85
So, Lexus's hybrid version costs @ 2.75 MORE.
Edmunds says
Camry XLE V6 - 30.1
Camry XLE Hybrid - 27.5
So, the Camry hybrid costs 2.6 LESS than the V6.
Aren't they essentially the same car? Same platform, identical power trains? With the Avalon, that makes 3 versions of the same car. Didn't GM get a lot of criticism for "badge engineering" the same car over and over, for Olds and Buick and Pontiac? Guess Toyota still thinks it's a good idea.
But, the main thing that I can't make sense of is the cost of the hybrid. Can it be right that it costs more in one case and less in the other? Then, maybe it will cost the same in the Avalon?
I can say one thing: If the Avalon's hybrid comes with a Lexus-like surcharge, it would be extremely hard to pick it over the Camry hybrid.
Skip
Skip
PS His dealer rep said they should start seeing more information, pictures in the next month or so.
Do you buy a car with great seat for the driver, and all other seats and space, is what it is.
There is and always will be a compromise.
Seeing you (or the driver) drive the car ALL the time seems to make sense that you get that seat as comfortable as possible. And hope the other seats and space in the car works ok of the passengers É or the drivers seat is ok, as is all the other seats and space.
AND OR
You spend a lot more money to hopefully get the best of all worlds, and everyone is very comfortable and there is a ton of space to relax and enjoy the ride.
While Volvo's are great cars, for me they are just 2 small, so I get by with the seats in my current Avalon. I say Current, because I too, hope the DRIVERS seat in my 2013 Avalon will be more comfortable on LONG drives (500 miles or more a day).
Skip
PS My rear passengers have NEVER complained about the rear seats, hell they all rave about them.
I travel a lot (I think a lot 35,000 miles a year), and like the space the Avalon offers, as do the passengers on those occasions when I have them. But I also like the space for carrying inventory and orders.
My friends say I should get a truck as much as I use my car for delivering, but not if it means - Truck and no car.
Enjoy (as I'm sure you are) your new ride.
Skip
Skip
PS I'll be heading out to my car to trying this and other things, as that would make the Nav a whole hell of a lot better then I first thought.
Now I know it will pickup where I am, and if I change directions, after a while it will finish the trip from my new point of entry, but if I can change and know it's now taking my new route, this will be cool:)
http://www.toyota.com/upcoming-vehicles/avalon/
All 2013 Avalons will be FWD. A hybrid option will be available. 2013 Avalon pricing hasn't been announced but expect pricing less than the 2013 Lexus ES 350 which shares the same body and engines ($36,100 for the base, $38,850 for the hybrid)
I really don't understand this car. It has a front end that is just awful. It's also now smaller so even more overlap with the Camry and ES.
Have engines been announced? I certainly hope they give it the direct injected version of the 2GR V6. 300 ish HP vs 268 of the regular 2gr.
As of right now I'll take the 05-12 version any day.
2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve
OK, I found just the right pillow and put it in just the right place and everything was fine. Really comfortable. A few years pass and I'm at the dealer, getting an oil change. Another customer asks me about my pillow and the dealer's service guy overhears my story. He steps up big. "You shouldn't pay over $30K for a car and then have to use a pillow like that." He called Toyota. The car was 3 years old (out of warranty). Didn't matter. He got Toyota to agree to customize the seat for me. He sent me to a local auto upholstery shop. The guy pulled the seat, took it apart and re-contoured the lumbar area. Didn't cost me a penny. Did the trick, too.
I sure was impressed. Still am. With the dealer and with Toyota too.