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What is this thing worth?



  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 56,775
    I didn't say they might not be correct--I just said I hate chrome wires. I think they are hideous on a British sports car IMO. Gaudy tarting-up of a classic design, as well as impractical. Once they start to rust (which they will) or need re-tightening, you have an enormous expense on your hands. Wire wheels are enough of a PITA as it is, without compounding it and making them jewelry instead of real wheels! First thing I'd do is get rid of them or paint them. We of the British car types who actually drive their cars extensively identify a trailer queen by chrome wires, as a car not seriously driven (or understood) by the owner. The worst crime is chrome wires on an MG TC.

    Think of a baseball bat that is highly varnished and hung on a wall as opposed to oiled up and used in a baseball game. That sort of thing.

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  • texasestexases Posts: 7,658
    I think you're right in passing on it - they seem to have put everything on this to make it look good, rather than to be an enjoyable driver (except maybe the tranny). Imagine trying to keep it looking this way with use - that spotless engine bay would never be the same!
  • ljgbjgljgbjg Posts: 374
    Sorry - I took your comment to mean that you did not think chrome wires were "original" - "And last of all, I hate chrome wires--they should be painted. This is a 60s British sports car for gawd's sake". I guess the manufacturers did not agree with you. :) I used my 4.2L XKE as a daily driver w/chrome wires - simply sprayed them with wheel cleaner weekly, and had my mechanic check them when I had it tuned once a year in the Spring. IMHO British sports cars and Ferraris are the ONLY cars that look good with wires - including the MG TC. :D
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 19,468
    I totally agree with you on those chrome wires. They just look tacky on a British sports car.

    I've noticed, people are putting these on mid-fifties Buicks. They just aren't correct unless it's a 53-54 Skylark. Almost as bad as a continental kit of fender skirts!

    I HATE those items on an old car!!
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 56,775
    Chrome wires are a form of overkill to my eyes. I don't mean it's a CRIME or anything--- I just think they really detract from the charm of a British sports car, and make them look more like '65 Thunderbirds or something. "Less is more" seems to apply to my idea of what a British sports car is.

    For instance, I'd much prefer disc wheels or period knock-offs on a British sports car myself. Again, to my sensibilities, TCs look absolutely ghastly with chrome wires. Painted a dull silver they look fantastic. Jags and Ferraris are not so bad with chrome wires, if they are concours cars, since everything else has been over-restored as well by that time, so why stop now? People are often shocked to see how an original Ferrari was bolted together. As Enzo used to say: "You buy the engine, we give you the body".

    But on the road cars, I just love the look of muddy painted wire wheels on a British sports car, lathered in patina, sliding around a corner. British sports cars were affordable cars, for the middle class (at best). They were never built to be fussed over. A Jaguar was considered a bargain in its day (and it was).

    I have friends who won't even SELL parts to people who are over-restoring British cars or motorcycles. Unless they race them, no dice, no parts. Don't know as I would be quite that self-righteous, but I do understand the sentiment behind it.

    As for British car makers disagreeing with me, I'd consider that a compliment given some of the decisions they made.

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  • ljgbjgljgbjg Posts: 374
    I have a pretty good memory - 50's British sports cars often had painted wires did they not, or solid discs - withness the XK120, 140, et all? I don't remember any MGTC without chromewires, but certainly TDs. But once into the 60's, having had an E-type and seen many when looking for mine, all had chrome wires. The only solid disc E types I remember seeing were the V12's of Series III in the early 70's, and no, I did not like the wires on them - nor for that matter any of the lines of what had become a bastardized design from the original 1961.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 56,775
    Yeah I think you're right, chrome wires came into play in the 60s---probably they painted them because England was so impoverished in the 50s.

    They also used whatever they had on the shelves and assembly was haphazard. I've seen MG TCs with one door longer than the other.

    Still most early British sports cars were RACED, which is what i liked about them, and which differentiates them from later sports car, or from touring roadsters like the Mercedes 190SL.

    Wire wheels weren't so good for racing. They really can be a pain as they don't take stress very well. I've seen them fly apart or collapse.

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  • ljgbjgljgbjg Posts: 374
    Oh no - I could not imagine racing! No, they are sor street looks only and with that I agree with you, though I did see many a Ferrari at the North American Ferrari outing at Sumit Point racing with wires. not a good idea in my book - agree with you there. And on another point - C&D studied a Ferrari once and none of its spec matcheed up - one side was lower than the other, etc. - far from perfect!
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 56,775
    Early Ferrari build quality is appalling---even though the cars looked great. Lots of body filler, in brand new bodies. Enzo wasn't kidding--the body really was a throw-away item wrapped around a beautifully made engine. Ferraris were raced, and were expected to be wrecked, patched up, rebodied or re-paneled.

    this is why, ironically, classic Ferrari buyers spending millions are far less fussy about matching numbers and authentic sheet metal than a 69 Camaro buyer. This amuses me. :)

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  • YES!! Sad but true, Classic, Sports and Muscle cars are being shipped in containers overseas everyday (Motorcycles also). Go to site to post anything--then look in other countries(Sweeden,etc) under cars for sale. You will be surprised,most of these cars are NOT even posted for sale in the U.S.A.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 56,775
    Well it's a kind of arbitrage isn't it? People are taking advantage of currency differentials and cashing in on them.

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  • hpmctorquehpmctorque Posts: 4,600
    Interesting facts in your message #131 about early Ferraris (the cars) and the company's founder, that I didn't know.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 56,775
    the first truly "mass produced" Ferrari was the Testarossa (from the 1980s).

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  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 11,641
    one of my neighbors told me there is a good demand for certain x5's in russia.
    2017 Ford Fusion SE 2014 Ford F-150 FX4
  • british_roverbritish_rover Posts: 8,458
    Most Black luxury SUVs have good export demands to either Russia, eastern Europe or the middle east. They are some catches though as the SUV had to have been built after a certain date to avoid the majority of the import duties and needs to have a certain mileage range on it.

    Infiniti FX that were built before a certain date are particularly strong and so are all black Escalades.
  • burdawgburdawg Posts: 1,524
    They must be watching American rap videos and want to be "cool" like our gangster rappers.
  • british_roverbritish_rover Posts: 8,458
    Yeah that is part of it and in some of these countries the taxes and duties on these cars when bought new that can triple the price. They can save a ton of money buying the car in the US, even more so now that our dollar is so weak, and avoid most of the taxes and duties if the car is of a certain age.
  • fintailfintail Posts: 40,964
    The bad taste that comes along with new (or simply excess) money knows no geographic bounds.
  • hpmctorquehpmctorque Posts: 4,600
    I agree, fintail, but to the extent that exports of some of these used dinosaurs reduces the supply on our market, they're doing us a favor. It'll help, if only in a small way, improve resale values for those who may want to trade into more fuel efficient vehicles, but can't because they're upside down
  • dbtdbt Posts: 298
    I tried this over on "real world trade-in", and was referred here.
    Minneapolis, MN
    1994 Porsche 968 Convertible (thin market for these)
    6-sp manual, RWD
    70,000 miles
    Black / black
    Leather, CD, heated seats
    Good / Clean condition (no major problems)

    Private Party: Edmunds TMV says $9300, KBB says $14,900

    What's it really worth?

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 56,775
    Price guides are often lame on Porsche pricing.

    I'd say that for a very very nice one, about $16,000 should be all the money.

    Deduct accordingly for paint issues, interior wear, mechanical repairs, etc.

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  • lemmerlemmer Posts: 2,687
    I wish I had my Excellence here. That usually gives a pie-in-the-sky price.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 56,775
    Well one always has to suspect pricing from a source that adores the object under examination.

    Price guides are tricky. One has to know precisely what the "condition" they are showing actually means. One man's "excellent" is another man's "good" or even "average", while another person's "excellent" is actually show quality.

    I don't think price guides should list show quality pricing, since true #1 cars are very rare, are NEVER driven, (some never even started up, lest the engine be discolored or stained) and are trailered with little tire muffs to keep the grass out of the treads.

    Many #1 cars are never even offered for sale publicly, so it's hard to know the prices they bring.

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  • dbtdbt Posts: 298
    Thanks very much. That helps a lot.
  • brookej11brookej11 Posts: 2

    I'm looking to buy a '67 Tbird and have been searching around online to find some numbers to gauge the current value of the car. I found a website online called which sells a database of actual classic car sale prices. It looks pretty reliable, but I was hoping to get some feedback first. Has anyone used this website and bought their database before?

  • scks7scks7 Posts: 2
    I inherited this wonderful car and have tooled around town for the past 2 years. It is a hardtop with approximately 75,000 miles. My aunt was the original owner and the car is all original parts and is running great. Anyone have any idea how to go about selling the car and how to determine a selling price? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 56,775
    Auction databases can be helpful but can also be misleading. Some auction results are in fact fraudulent (we call it chandelier bidding) and of course any car listed as "not sold" is useless information. But if you had a large enough list of "sold" cars that are exactly like the one you are pricing (you cannot compare one body style to another, for example, nor can you compare a show quality car to a "driver", or a modified car to a stock one).

    In the case of the type of car you are looking for I don't think you need to spend money on a subscription, since these are not high dollar automobiles. I think if you checked out, then looked at for comparable ads, you might start to get a sense of value

    You didn't tell us if you are shopping for a coupe or a 4D, or what kind of condition you are seeking (fixer-upper, clean driver, show car) so we can't really offer an opinion of value.

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 56,775
    Does it have factory AC?
    What is the overall condition? Is it show quality, spotless, prisitine? Or is it a "clean driver"? Or does it have a few scrapes and bumps and faded paint?

    What color is it?

    What is the mechanical condition? Does it need overhaul of any major component?

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  • scks7scks7 Posts: 2
    It is black with red interior. It does not have AC. As for the condition, that is a tough question for me to answer. The paint is original but is faded somewhat on the hood and has not chipping but what looks like cracks in the finish. it clearly needs detailing but probably more. The antena cracked off and while the radio worked when I first got it it doesnt work now, but that could be a loose wire for all I know. The body is in good shape but there is rusting on the interior when you open up the front hood and look at the two sides. As for the parts, we replaced the carburator but with I believe an original part, aside from that there have been no replaced parts. the car runs well and handles beautifully. I have driven it around town, into New York City and on the highways. The muffler makes noise but I was told that is part of its attraction. I even have the original manual.
  • burdawgburdawg Posts: 1,524
    I'll wager from your description that there's more rust lurking around than you think. The paint being bad on the hood isn't surprising, since a car that old, unless carefully maintained, probably doesn't have any insulation left under the hood to protect the paint from the engine heat. If it's been around for 44 New York winters then it's going to need a good bit of work most likely.
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