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Comments
they ARE selling fast,and now with the motor trend award.. I would imagine even faster.
Go to google, type in American Honda Motors. CAll up the customer relations department and ask them about the production of Honda Civic '06 cars. Ask them where they are being built. You will find out that this year, there are more factories that produce them than ever.
Read about the Automotive Industry. Read about the many new factories and excess production capacities of cars with foreign plates in North America. Read about the worries of these foreign car companies that built these factories.
There is no shortage of Honda Civic '06 sedans. There are more of these cars produced each and everyday. The car buyers though are not being churned out in assembly lines. There can be no new factories to make car buyers.
And there are a limitted number of car buyers in these hard times. And the trend will continue to accelerate.
There is no need to pay MSRP or anywhere near it for a Honda 06 Civic now.
We car buyers have all the advantages. We are the ones with the purchasing power. We can choose our time and place to make our purchase. The car sellers though, must have their cash inflow, or they will go out of existence.
I have to admit, I do admire the car sellers' courage and
cleverness. Even though they are in such a weak position, and all they have is the 'spin'. And spin they do, trying to creat the myth of a shortage, and try to spin up the price.
We must see through their spin. They do not have the Car Buyers' interest, 'our interest' at heart. But we are no fools.
Manny
I wish you were in my area so I could walk you through our massive lot. Six acres of cars and NOT ONE Civic sedan to be found. A few coupes but NOT ONE LX or EX sedan.
But...we do have some in transit that are unsold at this point.
I guess reality is a "spin" or a "myth" for you?
They also worry about "days supply". The cars have to keep moving. I think they were blindsided by the demand for the new Civics. They can only build so many cars so fast.
We are selling and delivering Civics. We just don't have them sitting around. In other words, most of them are pre-sold. We take deposits and deliver when they arrive.
Then Motor Trend awards the 2006 Civic Car of the Year!
Hopefully, the situation will improve quickly.
Remember all the discussions on Motortrend about car manufacturer's dilemma of producing too many car and diluting their exclusive image, and not making enough to make ends meet?
Here the establishment and the supply side is trying to have it both ways. Trying to grab back market share. (The Honda Civic's market share has declined in the waning years of the last model.) And try to maintain that it is a rare car.
What can they do? Answer, produce more and make others believe that they are still rare cars, artificially pumping up the sales, by making people who would wait to buy to hurry up and buy now.
Take a lesson from General Motors, they pumped up their sales in August with Employee's Discount. They make all the other companies jealous. The man that created Employee's Discount was touted as a genius. Now look at what the results are. Accelerating sales today means no buyers left for tomorrow.
Now if Honda Motors can figure out a way to assembly new buyers.......
Civic '06 Buyers are harder to find than Civic '06 cars.
Manny
He insists that he is right about the car, 06 Civic EX with MT and Navi does not have a passive, self activating alarm, implying that he might be right in trying to add a passive alarm from Lojack on top of that.
I made him assure me that he did not do it.
The description you gave me is that of a passive alarm.
Thank you for your post.
Manny
Here is the Deal.
2006 Honda Civic 4 dr. sedan with Manual Transmission and Factory Installed Navigation System.
Total Price: $22,824.73 because of $500 deposit
With Deposit it is: $23,324.73
Breakdown: Car Price: $19,395, including delivery fee
Registration: $130
Inspection: $10
Document Fee: $45
Honda Care Extended Warranty, 8 years and 120,000 miles:
$950
Lojack Premium Early Warning Anti-theft GPS tracking System with life time ownership garrantee, and $5000 dollars credit towards a new car if car not recovered:
$995
Tire disposal fee for the new tires for the car: $12.50
New York State Sales Tax: $1787.23.
Minus $500 Deposit
Also there is a seperate $130 dollars for a set of new License plates.
All feedbacks and opinions welcome indeed.
Manny
Passive alarm is an alarm that you do not have to activate when you exit the car. After a delay of seconds the car alarm goes on automatically, just as you described. There is a blinking light showing that it is activated. From then on any tampering with the car trickers the alarm.
Active alarm is an alarm that you or I have to activate, either by a switch or a remote before we step away from the car. If we forget, the car will not sound the alarm when tampered with.
Difference is slight, one self activating mechanism. Probably a couple of dollars in equipment cost.
But the insurance company would give a discount for the self arming alarm, and not the one you must turn on with a button. And the car thief would like it better if you are a forgetful person with an active alarm.
From your description, the Honda Built in Alarm qualifies in total as a passive alarm. Thanks again.
Manny
Me? I have to deal with the REALITY of the situation on a daliy basis.
I don't mean to bash, but your credibility lacks sometimes. You always sound like a corporate yes man, but you know little about what you are selling. How can you sell Honda's every day for a living and have no clue they come with an alarm?
I've spoken to friends who work for some of the dealers. The reality is that they can sell all of the LXs; so they aren't going to move much on the price right now. If something happens - a glut of cars, higher demand because gas prices go up again, - then the price will change. But right now, there is little incentive to move on the prices. They expect that after Christmas, they will sell the LXs from a waiting list.
Maybe other areas are different. Maybe some areas have lower demand. I know that other areas have much higher demand. Maybe individual situations are different. I spoke to one salesman who I know has personal financial difficulties. Maybe someone will squeeze something out of him since he presumably needs a commission. I do know that if there is another fuel "crisis" the demand could go up.
-In some markets, the car is readily available and priced accordingly.
-In some other markets, the car is not readily available, and thus priced accordingly.
Is this rocket science? Hardly.
Unlike some of you, I respect Isell's opinions and his presence here. What he is describing is a situation that is common when a car is first introduced - the dealer allocations in individual markets often don't match up precisely with the demand in those markets. This doesn't hint at dark conspiracies [Honda withholding production? That's a laugh.] or misrepresentation [Isell is in one of the hottest markets for small Japanese cars, and the Civic is a home run in all West Coast markets].
The Ohio plant has only been online with the NEW Civic for about 5 weeks; most of the West Coast has seen nothing but Japanese-made cars, and the ships are only so large, and arrive at intervals, and that's it.
Pricing is like politics, all local. This is why I have repeatedly asked people to ALWAYS state their home market whenever posting on this board. Then, and only then, can patterns emerge and useless misunderstandings be minimized.
In sum, the car is a hit. In some markets, that means the cupboard will temporarily be bare, and prices higher. In others, the opposite will be true. No one has to be guilty of anything for these situations to coexist.
Yes, I guess I should add the words..."In MY marketplace" when I talk about inventory shortages.
I need to remember that in many parts of the country, "imported" cars are not popular.
And, yeah...I was waiting for this...I really didn't know the 2006 Civics come standard with an alarm. Silly me!
My dealer here in Ohio has six LX sedans and five EX sedans on the lot, so I'm sure their pricing would be more flexible than a dealer with no 2006 Civics.
In the price break down list that I showed earlier I showed a final bill of $23,324.73 including everything.
In the breakdown of the pricing there listed a $130 registration fee.
Now the saleman called me up today and told me to bring a seperate check for $130 for the license plate.
The registration fee of $130 is probably the same item as the license plate fee by another name.
Have you guys ever heard of a seperate license plate fee and registration fee?
Double billing is common in hospital bills. It could happen here too. Any comments? Can't blame people for trying!
And thank you all for the diverse opinions from all angles about the supply and demand situation of Honda Civic '06's.
Things do look different from different perspectives.
I admit I have been a tough customer indeed. No 'trade ins', no financing, and just adding a Lojack and an extended warranty, and bargaining to the very end.
I do find the Civic Buying experience to be interesting, and the people I deal with interesting indeed. I do admire
the skills with which some of the people I negotiated with exhibitted.
Manny
Your funny... LMAO
My dealer dosent have any Civics on the lot cause there a fair dealer and sell at $1500 under MSRP on sedans, coupes and hybrids. The same will follow with Si. This trend will change as production ramps up across the board for all models. Invoice and below will happen sooner than later. You need to speak with your dealer manager and tell he or she you want some of the backside money. And have there alotment and ordering bias increased.
OOO and study up on the cars you are trying to sell. If I didnt know my product line I rep any better than you do yours. I wouldnt have a job.
$23,089
Price is after taxes, all fees, financing, and includes the Platinum extended warranty (6 yrs/100,000 miles). It may seem high, but I felt good about the purchase all day and I have loved driving the car all day too. I had a rather high interest rate due to my first time buyer status, so that may also be the cause of the high total cost. Thats what I paid anyway, so think what you will. BTW, the car had literally come off the truck, and the salesman called me cause he knew i was looking for the car. in and out in 2 hrs.
Freddy
PS: thanks for all the tips on this thread.
You must really be in a depressed area or something?
And tell me what "backside money" you are talking about.
As far as product knowledge...I am the E-Commerce Director at our store. Because of this, I don't go to the Ride and Drives ect. Yes, I should know EVERYTHING about EVERY car we sell but I don't. If I don't know something, I will go find out as I did with the security system question.
I knew people like you would pounce on that one.
I caught the mistake, made by a salesman with over ten years of experience at the present job.
I wish it did not happen. I feel sad about human nature. But I have to accept it.
Manny
What happened to me was no math error. It was an item listed on the Bill as Registration and License for $130. Then I was asked by the Internet Manager to bring a seperate check for $130 for the License Plates.
The seperate check was cancelled when I pointed out the License and Registration Item should be the same as the seperate charge for License Plates.
This is from a man who works in the same dealership, who gives bills to customers over ten years. It is more logical that he was trying his luck. Some people do come up with a seperate check. A few hits a month would add up in the long run.
Easy thing to get out of when caught. Just apologize and say that it is a mistake.
Boy, every trade has its ways to get over. It is like squeezing a balloon when you try to bargain for a lower price for a car.
Squeeze it on this side, the balloon swelling comes back on the other side. The energy that I spent to save the few dollars are disproportional to the gain.
I just had to do it, because I do not want no one to take me for a fool.
What do you think of the fact that the vin number that the salesman gave me weeks ago to reactivate my Geico Insurance is changed when I call up yesterday to have it finalized.
I cannot figure this out for the life of me. I just know that I must be extra careful when I pick up the car.
Any advice would be appreciated.
Manny
It can be a real war out there, trying to negotiate the best possible price on a new car. My point about bringing the calculator was that you can't be too careful before signing the purchase agreement. There are a lot of numbers and you need to check the math. And as you found out, you also need to check to make sure every entry is legit. Glad you caught them on that "error" and didn't pay twice for the same tax.
As far as the VIN number is concerned, it's hard to say why it changed without knowing exactly what went on during the buying process. It could be that the car they had earmarked for you was sold to someone else before you consumated the deal, and they had more than one of the same trim level and color. Or it could have been an inadvertant mistake - the salesman was looking at the wrong car when giving out the VIN number originally. Either way, what counts is that you are happy with the transaction and more importantly the car itself.
After your LoJack fiasco, I'm just hoping that it doesn't get stolen on you - wouldn't that be an ironic and sad turn of events!
Congrats on your purchase - a big step up and I'm sure you'll be happy with it.
On Dec 2nd (yesterday), user "psyran" wrote under the title "lease frustration":
"I leased a 330i (e90) in May. Now I think I got a horrible deal... Is there anyway to reduce this payment through BMW financial....Can I do this with little or no down and lower my monthly?? I now see others leasing similarly equipped 330's for almost a hundred less."
Your trusted host "kydfx" replied:
"You leased the car the first month it was introduced... Selling prices were higher then... the money factor was higher, etc, etc...You paid for being the first person on your block to get a brand new model... I don't think your lease price is out of line for the time that you bought the car..."
User "selm" replied:
"I kind of feel the same way, but I don't let it get me down. I ordered my e90 when it was only out for 3 weeks. There will always be a better deal, so you just have to realize that you made the best decision at the time with the information you had available."
Just don't say you didn't know it's coming when in a few months the civic will be going for a lot less, probably even well below invoice. History is bound to repeat itself, the wise try to learn from it and be prepared.
Bingo!!! There's too many variations in local markets and dealers to compare deals over the internet. If you got the car you wanted for a price you can afford and felt it was a good deal at the time of purchase, move on.
The salesman's classical defense was that it could have been sold on my way there.
Well I would find out how long it takes for the transaction. I do know how long it takes to prepare for the transaction, the activating of the Insurance, the finalizing of financial arrangements which takes hours and some took days.
I really did not believe that other deal had that real car and had managed to sell it during my travelling time to the dealership. It was a Bait and Switch.
You are real, trying to buy a car at any price is a war. It is total war when you try to buy it at a reasonable price.
Manny And Thank You. I have to be so careful today. I got my calculator with me. I should bring a magnifying glass too.
This is exactly what happened. Car dealers have how many ways to make money on you? 12? I hadn't heard this one, but is anyone surprised to hear about this?
You have the car, financing is in place, why would you fall for this trick? I guess some do. I'd call the GM at that shop and expose this trick and rub their nose in it. What the heck. They had no problem trying to jam you.
"Okay Honda has a real problem here if they cannot produce enough of their bread and butter car to meet the demand, but how high is this demand really? It may be a case where the same pool of buyers are looking for a Civic today, but this is a limited # of buyers, the loyalists or hardcore buyers or ones that for some reason need a car right now. This will not last long though. If Honda really thinks they will sell 300,000 of these, then they better start making them fast. This also could be a case of Honda holding them back to create a shortage at the dealers, to attempt to drive up the demand. They did this with the Odyssey when it was redesigned. ... Right now everyone is frustrated, it is hard to believe Honda with all its capacity cant make enough."
A lot of people seem to be making conjectures based on what they see locally at their dealers' lots. You don't have to do this. There are published national numbers out there, if you look. Yesterday's NYT had a table with monthly sales figures for November 2005:
Honda Civic 23,695 (+18% from 11/2004)
Honda Accord 23,548 (-3.4%)
(Civic is #3 best-selling car, behind Camry & Corolla)
I think this data is more useful than personal anecdotes. So, with current sales extrapolated over the year, it would work out to 284,000. Now, there's problems with that, but it does seem Honda is cranking them out, and they are selling pretty well. It does not seem Honda is intentionally creating a shortage.
By the way, capacity is pretty expensive. You don't want to have too much. Ask GM.
Looks like Honda Motors does intend to sell 300,000 Civics and they might succeed.
Studying these statistics that you cited, there is buying momentum for this car, but I thing that the upper limits are about 300,000 Civics to be sold this year. This is just
below the full capacity of the factories.
Yes, I can say it with a certain amount of confidence that
it would get easier to buy this car at a more reasonable price from here on.
Manny
No sense in rubbing their nose in it. Nothing happens by accident. The GM of that shop knows more than he lets on.
By not falling for this scheme that appears simple but can work is enough for me. For most people, they might not even stop to contemplate it when they catch it. They just call it a plain mistake.
If buying a new popular car at a reasonable price is like going to war, one must remember that,"All is fair in Love and War."
Manny
If you don't mind me asking - what was the price before TTL? And after? Was it a coupe or sedan? Navi?
I'm in the CHicagoland area, and have been given a quote for the '06 EX Coupe w/Navi (AT). The OTD price is $21,689. The price of the car is $20,200. Is this good, or can I do a lot better? Thanks!
Thanks.
-Only someone else from the mid-Atl area can really tell you, and...
-Why worry about it now?
So can anyone here confirm if the 2006 Civic come standard with an audible alarm once you lock the doors and then someone opens it? Thanks in advance.
The Civic 06 LX and EX comes with a security system, it is controlled by a remote. After you arm it by pressing the button, the alarm arms itself. There is a blinking red light visible from the dash board for all to see.
If you try to open the door or trunk a loud alarm sounds.
The security system also involves a coded key, without which you could not start the car. The key with the code can only be made by someone with access to the code. Otherwise the physical replicate of the key is useless.
If you forget to press the button to arm the alarm when you leave the car, after about 15 seconds the red light blinks on. The car's alarm goes on itself.
The above fits the description of a passive alarm system with an engine immobilizer.
The Moniker of the system is called the Honda Vehicle Security System. It should have been more obviously named the Passive Alarm System with an Engine Immobilizer. Thus the confusion.
You are hearing from a fellow that have a car with it. And you are hearing it from a fellow that almost was sold another passive alarm system from Lojack onto his car. Luckily it did not happen. It would have damaged the car.
Hope this helps. I have been helped so many times here, I am glad to return the favor.
Manny
I'm just kidding. What difference does it make if other's paid less or not. You got a fine vehicle.
But if you really want to compare deals, you need to post ALL the details, coupe/sedan, don't include TTL.
I'm in the Chicagoland area, and have been given a quote for the '06 EX Coupe w/Navi (AT). The OTD price is $21,689. The price of the car is $20,200. Is this good, or can I do a lot better? Thanks!
1. The salesman may not know. Else where I had posted my opinion about salesmen's knowledge of the cars they sell, and of automobile engineering and designs. It is my considered opinion that for the most part, their knowledge is superficial.
2. They also come with vested interest. Beware of people who come with vested interest of their own. So do not take their words for anything granted.
I got my 27000 lbs baby home already. And the passive alarm works very well. Even as I was taking my baby home, the salesman who was handing me the keys had insisted that he was right, and I could have had a Lojack Vehical Security System with Alarm installed and improve the security.
Luckily Lojack did not do it. Luckily I discovered that too. Luckily I did not pay for something that is already there. And most luckily of all is that no passive alarm system was grafted onto my vehicle that already have one. That would harm the vehicle.
No sense in trying to get even by pointing it out to a salesman either.
Manny
There are some posts that advocate to buy later, it will be easier to get a car with a fairer price.
It is my considered opinion to disagree. Buying a car at anytime is difficult. We are dealing with professionals.
Back in June when my old car was given to charity(really a junkyard operator in a charity's name), I started to look for 05 cars.
Now the lines that the salesmen gave me was that the 05 cars are just about at the end of their production. So I must buy what they have on the lot. Because there were less choices then. And also I must pay more, because there are not many of them left.
Then when I started to look for 06 cars later on, even up to the end of November, they told me that there are not many of 06 cars produced. I must pay more because they are so rare. I better take whatever they have on the lot.
Remember this, amateurs are dealing with well rehearsed professionals. A car buyer better admits that he is an amateur, and be more humble, just do the best an amateur can. And live with the best deal an amateur can get. That is reality.
Manny