Subaru Impreza WRX Wagon

locke2c

steve,

the WRX is tuned for much more neutral handling out of the box than a 99 2.5RS even though it's some 250lb heavier than my car. I suspect the major reason for that is the standard 20mm rear swaybar. my personal car is significantly modified with including coilovers and a 20mm adjustable rear bar. it handles a lot better than a stock WRX but the ride quality is brutal.

steering feels about the same. not bad in either vehicle, but a little overboosted and pretty slow steering ratio. the stock tires on both are the same and were a handicap enough on the RS; they're shameful on the WRX.

-Colin

stevesr0

Ouch -

For someone who owns an RS, spends so much time on the Impreza Wagon boards and offers such good advice usually, your comments come over as surprisingly negative.

When you say the the ride quality is brutal, I imagine you mean in your RS -- that is the first time I have heard anyone say that about the RS. Are you reasonably satisfied with your car?

Would you recommend other cars over the WRX, or do you recommend routine 'upgrades' to the tires and roll bars and coil (c?)overs, or am I over interpreting what you wrote?

Thanks

Steve

paisan

I think he was saying his RS handles better or equal to the WRX, but he has a very stiff ride due to this. I could be wrong though.

-mike

locke2c

that's exactly what I'm saying. a stock WRX's ride strikes me as a pretty decent balance between ride quality, on road performance and light offroad performance. it could be better without being harsher, but that would mean more $$$. that's probably best left to the aftermarket.

my car is the brutal one-- 400lb/in springs tend to do that (stock is 150lb/in). unsurprisingly it corners like it's on rails.

the only thing I meant to be particularly negative about on the WRX was the stock tires. bleh! but I do like the WRX, I like it a lot. if I bought a $23k car right now, it would absolutely be a WRX wagon.

-Colin

stevesr0

Thanks for clarifying -- that is much more reassuring.

Steve

hgutstein

next year, but only in sedan form. Likely to cost much more than WRX as well. If you want it your daughter will have to start playing the piccolo!

keithllb1

Hi I am new to the board but have been in the market for a good all around handling car with some pep! I noticed the Subie getting rave
reviews, My question is should I trust in the WRX wagon, or go elsewhere,say 3.5 Altima,or Maxima for the long list of standard features, or the new Jetta vr6? I am in a quandary I test drove the Maxima Se and was fairly impressed with its tight
handling for a car with a 255 hp v6.
But I am still wanting to hear some feedback from
anyone out there who knows about good handling cars. The AWD feature is intriguing but not a must! I appreciate the feedback.

tlutz

Keith - I recently chose the WRX wagon (5 speed) after driving just about everything between $25-30,000. I picked the WRX for the following reasons:
All Wheel Drive - great in snow, great handling, and the wagon can be provoked to oversteer and driven like a true sports car (unlike front-wheel drive).
It is the ultimate sleeper car - guys in BMW 3 series and Audis can't believe they can get smoked by some middle-age guy in a WAGON!
The car has personality - between the sounds of the boxer engine, the notchy but precise 5 speed, and the ugly, but endearing front-end, the car remains unique.
The price - $23,000 buys a car that is fun to driver every day.

Enjoy your shopping.

Tom

barresa62

Good summary!! :-) Same list for me even after 12k miles on my WRX 5spd wagon, bought March 2001.

Stephen

WarpDrive

I test drove the V6 Altima before taking delivery of my WRX and I could not get excited at all. Sure it's got some power, but it's just a big 'ol family car with a big honking motor to me accompanied with lots of torque steer. I did get a nice free CD holder for my effort By the end of the test drive, all I could think was, I hope my WRX gets here soon. With the Golf GTi, it felt sloppy in the handling department. Not to mention that I don't think they are reliable. If you think the Maxima feels light, the WRX feels even lighter. Throw the WRX in a corner and you'd be pressed to think it weights anywhere close to its 3100 or so lbs.

Subaru has AWD's great traction, neutral handling, turbo power. It stands alone in pure driving fun.

saintviper

Just got the pictures back from my trip to LA. Here's a picture of my car at a rest stop in Utah. The crud on it is from driving through a snowstorm the day before in Iowa and Nebraska.

lark6

Gorgeous scenery and a Subaru doing what it does best. A lot of us fuss and fret over keeping them clean and polishing out scratches and the like, but we have to remember that these cars like getting dirty!

Hope you had a great trip.

Ed

bluesubie

stevesr0

After driving a BMW today, I finally felt comfortable that I would be missing nothing by buying a WRX.

I called the two "internet" dealers I have spoken with (Fitzgerald and vanBortel) and opted to go with the latter. I ordered a red 5speed wagon; the salesman said he would arrange for a silver if the red wasn't available (the other salesperson said he understood that Subaru was discontinuing the red because of lack of demand).

The only two options I added were an armrest extension and the rear differential protector.

Hopefully will be able to pick up in late March.

Thanks to all for the helpful input.

Steve

nschulman3

I ,too, have a red wrx-mine is a 5 speed sedan with short shift, armrest extension and security upgrade. I can understand why the red is being discontinued, as i have only seen one other red wrx in new jersey. By the way, i also purchased my car from van bortel subaru. It was worth the 300 mile drive from northern nj. They are very straightforward and when the car was ready, i got a call and picked it up two days later. Good luck with the car. I just leased a 2002 Lexus is 300 sportcross, but the wrx is more fun.

stevesr0

Thank you.

Since I also live in NJ (north/central), that would make three. After owning it a while, do you still like the color (my alternative was silver, but everybody has one of those)?

What route did you take back to NJ the thruway and 87 or alternative twisty roads (I live close to 287 and 78)?

Steve

yellowbikedon1

Nice bike on the roof!

Don

paisan

There is at least 1 other red one in Northern NJ. Chook from I-club has one.

-mike

saintviper

It's a Giant XTC-DS2. I really like it. It's a full suspension bike, so it rides really nice, but no bob on the hills and relatively light. I got it from a shop that was going out of business, so I got a great deal on it.

It's attached to a Yakima rack. For those of you looking at putting bikes on the roof, you may want to consider an aftermarket rack. With mine, I have to put the bike racks outside the roof rails so that I can still open the rear hatch without hitting the rack. If I had gone with the flat Subaru bars, I'd have to mount the bikes backward to be able to open the rear hatch with the bike attachments on (which would look kind of lame).

d7sub

I noticed that other forums, members enthusiastically add pics of new parts additions and their travels with their cars or motorcycles. I think we all should put as much photos as possible. Very nice photo of Utah by the way.

keithllb1

I test drove the wagon and the Maxima, now I have to figure out if the fun I had in the Subie offsets the interior stylings of the Max, I don't like front wheel drive cars so I'm leaning to the WRX, the Altima 3.5 is a real nice ride but their options arrangements are a rip off. You have to buy this to get that, I don't think so, give that car another year for the dust to settle. I had a blast in the wagon but noticed slight hesitation when I punched it out of 2nd gear, also the Potenzas don't seem like a good match for that car
a little mushy on the corners at high speeds. Needless to say, the salesman wasn't with us on the drive. If I buy the car should I buy the bigger wheels from a cheaper internet site? And is the suspension package worth the extra cash?

WarpDrive

You might be feeling turbo lag. It takes a split second (up to a full second) for the turbo to fully spool up. This is something you can get used to and is a characteristic of any car that has a high revving engine with a high pressure turbo.

As far as wheels, yes, by all means get your wheels elsewhere. It will make a HUGE difference. You can buy wheels that are nearly as light as those optional 17 inch wheels for half the cost (e.g. OZ Racing Superleggera) And new summer 225/40R17 tires such as Toyo T1-S, Bridgestone S-03 or Dunlop SP9000 will make a huge difference in the drip and wet grip of the car. I personally don't think the suspensio is worth upgrading. The WRX has good settings for dry roads and the rougher stuff you might encounter in winter. The only thing you might think about is upgrading the rear sway bar to the 20mm (like in the sedan) to reduce the understeer.

bluesubie

Steve - Congrats on your purchase!

You NJ guys should check the Tri-State forum of the i-club for meets. There's something for all tastes. Drag racing, auto-x, back-road drives (almost every Sunday), off-roading, dinner meets, etc.

-Dennis

levislej

I have a WRX wagon. Do I need snow chain for heavy snow roads? Is it going to hurt my 4WD if I put the chain on?

barresa62

Fact is the Subaru crossbars and attachments are made by Yakima. Like it was posted a couple of posts back, Subaru doesn't make their own racks (crossbars and attachments). I have a WRX wagon which doesn't come std w/the crossbars as the OBS does, only the side rails. I went to my local SportsRack store and bought the Yakima round cross bars w/towers. The advantage was that the towers and bars lock to the roofrack side rails. It's fine to have lockable ski attachments and such but if someone w/an allen wrench can undo your crossbars from your side rails, it would be conceivable that they could take your skis or whatever attached to your crossbars in one big sweep. I only paid about $35 more in total than if I would have gotten the set from Subaru dealer. Just something to think about.

Stephen

ponm

How much did you pay for the yakima bike rack if you don't mind me asking?

keithllb1

Warp Drive, is it possible to have the 20mm upgraded sway bar added to the wagon at the time
of purchase, I like the feel of the Sedan but am worried about space restrictions, I would be interested in improving road performance in the wagon. Can you fit a nice set of golf clubs in the trunk of the Sedan? Or two?

paisan

No dealer in their right mind would upgrade it at the time of delivery, for liability reasons.

-mike

jbkreegs

Hi, I bought a new Jetta in '99, and I wish I would have waited until the WRX came out. Your discussion board is so much more positive. WRX is really a great car. Maybe I can get a STI when they come.
When do they arrive, and are they doing a wagon STI? Thanks, WRX envious

hunter001

According to this site, whose link was posted a while back by Dennis, there is an STi wagon.

Check this link out:

http://www.iwoc.co.uk/jpnewage.html

Later...AH

WarpDrive

Keith

Upgrading the sway bar is something you can do yourself easily. Lots of people have done it (talk to barresa62 on this board).

The difference in the wagon and sedan is very minute, I'd be surprised if most people can feel the difference at all. If anything, the wagon has slightly better weight distribution and replacing the rear sway bar to the wagon will make it very easy to rotate in corners. I find the wagon already very neutral. Anything other problems with the handling are mostly due to the undertired wheels. But that's something I'm working on right now.

bluesubie

Jon, welcome to the board!

If they bring the STi Wagon from Japan it would be a huge hit. The WRX Wagon is a hit, but who knows.
IMHO, Subaru is slow to make major changes like this especially since they're a small company. I think Japan also likes to keep the best things for themselves. :-)

People have been asking for the WRX for years, and we finally got it. It would be nice to see more super Subaru's here. Like:
- WRX STi Sedan and Wagon
- Even a few of the STi type RA's
- One of the many Legacy twin-turbo models

-Dennis (dreaming)

cinosweive

Do many folks have much experience w/ bike roof racks on this car?

Is it true that if you have a roof rack on the wagon you have to remove the bike to open the tailgate?

barresa62

Only the STI sedan is coming first w/no definite plans to bring the wagon version over. The number of sedans is really limited. I don't know why the number 700 keeps running through my mind. My salesguy said that their dealership already has taken names for a waiting list and have about 30 names already. We talk quite a bit when I bring my car in for its (paid by dealer) oil changes. Joe is a car nut like myself. :-)

Stephen

p0926

Stephen- I'm curious, since your dealer is paying for it, how often do they change the oil?

-Frank P.

saintviper

I think I paid about $300 for my Yakima rack. I bought it at a bike shop that I used to work for, so I got a good deal. I think the retail price for what I got would be close to $450. I have the Doublecross rack with 48 inch crossbars, 2 Viper bike mounts, a fairing, and locks for everything. I got the Viper cause it locks to the rack, and it's compatible with the disc brakes on my mountain bike. At first I didn't get the fairing, but the rack made tons of noise without it. The fairing cured the noise problem completely.

The Viper is a fork mount, which means you have to take the front wheel off to load the bike. I think this holds the bike more securely than an upright mount. With my rack, if you attach the bike mounts inside the roof rails, the glass on the rear hatch will contact the bike mount tray (not the bikes) before it is all the way open. I got around this by attaching the bike mounts outside the roof rails. This allows the hatch to open in between them.

With an upright mount, you may be able to slide the mounts far enough forward so that they don't interfere with the rear hatch. This isn't an option with the fork mounts because the part where the fork mounts is right at the front rail.

I'll take some pictures and post them here when I get a chance so you can see exactly what I mean.

barresa62

Yeah, I was curious too when they threw it in to sweeten the deal. They change it every 3k even though the paperwork says 3500 miles. I started supplying them w/Mobil 1 beginning w/the last oil change at about 10k. So, I guess my oil change isn't totally free anymore since I'm buying the Mobil 1 myself. :-)

Stephen

yellowbikedon1

I've had racks on my '96 Outback and '01 LL Bean wagon and assure you, you don't have to remove the bikes to open the tailgate!

I agree with Saintviper that the fork mount style rack is probably the most secure for the bike. Even though one has to remove the front wheel (which really is very easy with quick releases), mounting is relatively simple and fast.

BTW juice, I am proud of you! Keep up the good work and ride more often. And, don't forget to service the bike periodically!

Don

keithllb1

What are the options that really enhance the cars
performance? Is the short throw shifter worth the
extra cash? I like the extended armrest. What about the speaker upgrade? Is it worth it? Wasn't to impressed with the stereo in the wagon.
Thinking about the upgrade there. What is an option that most people seem to gravitate to the most? THanks.

cinosweive

Thanks saintviper. If you do get the chance to post them, I would like to see those pictures.

edcoak2001

Keith,

I see differing opinions on the short shifter. I have the standard and it works fine for me. If you're planning on auto-crossing, then it may be worth getting. Keep in mind that it doesn't effectively "improve" performance so much as slightly reduce the distance your hand has to move.

As far as the upgraded speakers, I would skip it if you're willing to put in aftermarket speakers later. The front speakers are very shallow, so I ended up have to cut a simple spacer/adapter ring out of 5/8" plywood to fit some Polk EX365 speakers ($119/pair at Crutchfield). If you don't want the hassle putting them in on your own (or paying someone else to install), then it would probably be worthwhile to take Subaru's upgrade.

Craig from Seattle (OK, Kenmore...)

cinosweive

I test drove the short throw shifter and found it stiffer and more vague than the standard. Maybe a stiff shifter is good if you are racing, and maybe the vagueness vanishes once you get used to it, I don't know. It did have nice short throws - but I ended up w/ the standard shifter in mine - I just found it easier to live with.

I kind of like the autodimming mirror. I originally thought "big whoop", but after using it for awhile I am sold - not a must have though. The compass is a nice bonus too - it's reassuring to know that my driveway still points north at the end of the day.

I went for the upgraded speakers and powered subwoofer because I didn't want to mess w/ after market hassles. I just trusted the salesman on that one. Not the best I have ever heard but I don't have much to compare it with. In retrospect, I don't listen to rap so maybe the subwoofer was a waste of dough - I guess I'll never know.

I have a turbo gauge. That needle sure does go around. Not a must have.

I think the armrest extension is a must have, depending on your height. I find it real comfortable and a great place to keep your shades, tire gauge, pen and cell phone accessories. Small stuff can get lost in the huge glove box. Interesting they call that a glove box. Does anybody keep gloves there? I wonder what it's called in other countries?

Sorry I can't be more help than that.

bluesubie

FYI - the sub is adjustable. There are two screw knobs on it somewhere.

-Dennis

keithllb1

Well at this point I'm getting calls from the Nissan Dealer in my area,and he really wants to make a deal on a Maxima sitting in the lot. But I
know its the end of the month and he has to meet a quota, I feel I can get a good deal on a Max, but I still gravitate to the Subie Wagon. I will say that the Max has a little of everything, strong V6 and good looks and plenty of standard features included, more than the over-hyped Altima. But I still kind of like the performance 1st and looks 2nd mantra. My question is, Does the Subaru 4 banger rate high in reliability and do its moving parts,ie clutch, brakes,timing belt,
go thru its paces with good reliability ratings? I do like the fact that the MAX has a timing chain. Thanks for all your help on this board.
This is my 1st new car purchase and I don't want to be stuck with a car payment and a car that routinely goes to and from the garage.

locke2c

you like the Maxima's looks?

well I suppose there had to be someone that did. :-D that's part of the reason for the Altima's hype, that it looks so much better than an Maxima, has the same power as a Maxima, and costs less.

anyway, nevermind that. a timing chain stretches. a timing belt can cheaply and easily be replaced when the time comes, and they don't break suddenly. with proper inspection and replacement they are no problem and are in fact far lighter than a chain which is less drag and more net power.

-Colin

wheeldog

I agree with your point about the belt being lighter, and that adding up to quite a bit of difference in efficiency over the life of the engine. I have one vehicle with a belt and one with a chain, I've replaced both, and I don't see changing the belt as a big deal every 60,000 miles. To be fair, though, I think you've made some hefty generalizations. Timing chains stretch? OK, but do they stretch enough to mess up the timing? I haven't found that to be the case. And what do you mean by saying that timing belts don't break suddenly - I think they sure do if the owner ignores the regular replacement schedule. Anyway, not meant to provoke, just trying to understand what you meant.

paisan

"And what do you mean by saying that timing belts don't break suddenly - I think they sure do if the owner ignores the regular replacement schedule."

Yep, and if you ignore regularly scheduled oil changes and tire rotations and tire and brake replacements, is that the fault of the car or manufacturer? At 100K you replace the timing belt, simple enough.

-mike

keithllb1

Colin,
Folks, I just feel reliability is a big factor in buying a car. The reason why I asked about timing belt vs. timing chain, is because I was
curious if anyone has experienced any quirky malfunctions with some of the moving parts in the Impreza? I want to buy the car, but I don't want to "go to bed with beer goggles on." And I think if you examine the Maxima inside and out it is a
pretty good looking car. Especially the loaded GLE. The Altima was designed to take over some of the GXE sells, which is the low end Max.
But really the Altima's sells were lagging far behind Accord and Camry, which is why it got such a nice face lift and engine redo.

The Subie is a car enthusiatists dream, but good-lookin' it ain't. I feel that the Subie is beautiful to me because I like the "Un-cola" kind of car, which the Subie fits the mold. Still if
I get the Nissan dealer to the point where he is throwing a $29000 Max at me for a couple dollars below invoice I might be tempted. That said I'm on my way to the Subaru dealer tommorow to talk about financing and options.

BTW,I had a timing belt go out on me twice in my Honda Accord, great engine but timing belts don't
always break right at 60,000 miles. I changed the oil every 3-4000 miles. It's just something I felt the need to ask about. Thanks.

subaru_team

In my experience, timing belt failures at 60K are extremely rare (I haven't heard of any in the past few years). In the '80's we had some premature timing belt failures, but we also initiated a service program to take care of the cost of these because they shouldn't have failed.

I hope this helps (because, of course, I'd like to see you buy the Subaru)

Patti

paisan

Were known to go at 60K miles, that was the replacement interval on them. Heck that is what it is on my XT6 as well. Now with California Emissions the interval is required to be 105K miles so if you change it ever 100K you should be ok. The maxima hasn't excited me since the 90-93 model years when it was the "4DSC" and had 4-wheel indy suspension, and a non-camary/accord dash, etc. Also nissans and maximas in particular are known for bad electronics.

-mike