Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

driver100

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

graphicguy said:

Thanks, all. I’ve had everything from a Golden Retriever to a Miniature Pinscher. This guy is my first mixed breed. And, he’s probably the sweetest of them all.
Poor guy was abandoned in the woods. Who would just dump a dog in the woods?
And, you guys are correct. They do find you, more than you find them.
Just a good, loving dog. It’s been awhile. I forgot how much joy and love dogs bring to a home.
And yes, he gets the front seat treatment.

Congratulations GG....looks like a real find.
We haven't seen Trixie for 8 days.....we pick her up at 4 today, really miss her.
Life isn't the same without a pet.

Except for Monroe....wants to put the dog to work waxing cars!

There are such things as "working breeds" ya know. :@

jmonroe

Everyone else has a dog just for company and to make their life and ours better.

Only JM wants a dog so it will work for him! :@

driver100

carnaught said:

One thing I like about it here is that besides being lovers of cars, a whole lot of us love dogs (pets) too.

But dogs don't care what kind of a car they have to travel in....as long as they can go with

oldfarmer50

suydam said:

He’s a mix though, so he might not.

Mix breeds make better pets. They have fewer health problems and are better tempered.

jmonroe1

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

graphicguy said:

Thanks, all. I’ve had everything from a Golden Retriever to a Miniature Pinscher. This guy is my first mixed breed. And, he’s probably the sweetest of them all.
Poor guy was abandoned in the woods. Who would just dump a dog in the woods?
And, you guys are correct. They do find you, more than you find them.
Just a good, loving dog. It’s been awhile. I forgot how much joy and love dogs bring to a home.
And yes, he gets the front seat treatment.

Congratulations GG....looks like a real find.
We haven't seen Trixie for 8 days.....we pick her up at 4 today, really miss her.
Life isn't the same without a pet.

Except for Monroe....wants to put the dog to work waxing cars!

There are such things as "working breeds" ya know. :@

jmonroe

Everyone else has a dog just for company and to make their life and ours better.

Only JM wants a dog so it will work for him! :@

It's not too much work for any dog to fetch a wax rag for its master.

jmonroe

berri

Don't know if the link will automatically open, but an interesting article about new car satisfaction and reliability.
If it doesn't open automatically, paste it in your browser or check the auto section of www.freep.com (Detroit Free Press).

https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/mark-phelan/2019/05/11/mercedes-bmw-audi-porsche-nissan/1161446001/

imidazol97

I was so pleasantly surprised not to see a GM car in the autos list that I had to provide most of the listings in the article here. There are GM's in the pickup list.

The most quickly resold car in Detroit was the Nissan Versa Note, an unassuming subcompact hatchback. A whopping 19.3% of metro Detroit buyers unloaded their Versa Notes in less than a year

Prices for a 2019 Versa Note start at just $15,650, but the rest of the top five on Detroit’s dumped list are luxury vehicles:

Audi Q3 subcompact SUV, sold by 13.9%
Jaguar XF sport sedan, 11.7%
Audi A3 compact car ,10.2%
Audi A4 sport sedan, 9.9%

The 10 vehicles most frequently sold in the first year nationally are even richer in luxury models, with a dash of Nissan thrown in for diversity:

Mercedes-Benz C-class, 12.4%
BMW 3-Series, 11.8%
Land Rover Discovery Sport, 11.8%
Land Rover Range Rover Evoque 10.9%
Mini Clubman, 10.7%
BMW X1, 10.4%
BMW X3, 9%
Nissan Versa Note, 9%
Jaguar XF, 8.8%
Nissan Versa, 8.7%

The Mercedes C-class led the list in a number of metro areas, including Boston, Dallas-Fort Worth, Chicago and Atlanta, where a whopping 33.7% of new C-classes were unloaded in the first year.

“Despite the popularity of these vehicles, they generally have below-average reliability ratings from Consumer Reports, which could contribute to why owners get rid of them so quickly,” iSeeCars CEO Phong Ly said.

German luxury brands top the list of brands most frequently sold in less than a year:

BMW, 7.9%
Porsche, 7.6%
Mercedes, 7.4%
Land Rover, 6.5%
Jaguar, 6.4%
Mini, 6.2%
Fiat, 5.2%
Audi, 5.1%
Nissan, 5.0%
Infiniti, 4.7%

Nissan also wrapped up the top three spots on the pickup list:

Nissan Titan XD, 7.9%
Nissan Titan, 7.6%
Nissan Frontier, 5.3%
GMC Canyon, 4.8%
Toyota Tacoma, 4.7%
GMC Sierra 1500, 4.6%
Ram 1500, 4.1%
Chevrolet Colorado, 4.1%
Toyota Tundra, 3.9%

berri

I think GM is quite capable of making excellent cars when they aren't rushing it out or playing to short sighted Wall Street. Back in the 70's when everyone was writing GM off, their downsizing of the large cars was just outstanding, and even Toyota took notice. I also think Ford is quite capable when they make the effort.

ab348

I posted that same article the other day in the Chronic Car Buyers board. One thing I picked up on in going to the source cited was that the German makes are likely getting service loaners counted as being dumped when a dealership sells them as a used car, which would distort the numbers somewhat.

fintail

Seeing that 95% of the loaner fleet at my local dealer is a C or GLA, I can believe it.

imidazol97

ab348 said:

I posted that same article the other day in the Chronic Car Buyers board. One thing I picked up on in going to the source cited was that the German makes are likely getting service loaners counted as being dumped when a dealership sells them as a used car, which would distort the numbers somewhat.

But other makes also use loaners and demonstrators that are sold.

driver100

imidazol97 German luxury brands top the list of brands most frequently sold in less than a year:

BMW, 7.9%
Porsche, 7.6%
Mercedes, 7.4%
Land Rover, 6.5%

*According to iSeeCars.com’s CEO Phong Ly, luxury-car brands often give their dealers incentives to buy a few new models to use as service-department loaner cars, then proceed to turn them over after a year's duty.

*some drivers can find themselves disenchanted if they happened to choose the cheapest versions of what are otherwise opulently equipped luxury cars.

*motorists report having issues with technology-related woes like Bluetooth phone pairing, voice recognition, and navigation/audio systems, which are typically the most complex and confounding to master among gadget-packed luxury cars.

driver100

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

graphicguy said:

Thanks, all. I’ve had everything from a Golden Retriever to a Miniature Pinscher. This guy is my first mixed breed. And, he’s probably the sweetest of them all.
Poor guy was abandoned in the woods. Who would just dump a dog in the woods?
And, you guys are correct. They do find you, more than you find them.
Just a good, loving dog. It’s been awhile. I forgot how much joy and love dogs bring to a home.
And yes, he gets the front seat treatment.

Congratulations GG....looks like a real find.
We haven't seen Trixie for 8 days.....we pick her up at 4 today, really miss her.
Life isn't the same without a pet.

Except for Monroe....wants to put the dog to work waxing cars!

There are such things as "working breeds" ya know. :@

jmonroe

Everyone else has a dog just for company and to make their life and ours better.

Only JM wants a dog so it will work for him! :@

It's not too much work for any dog to fetch a wax rag for its master.

jmonroe

Please don't volunteer to take in a rescue dog....poor dog will be exploited!

ruking1

driver100 said:

imidazol97 German luxury brands top the list of brands most frequently sold in less than a year:

BMW, 7.9%
Porsche, 7.6%
Mercedes, 7.4%
Land Rover, 6.5%

*According to iSeeCars.com’s CEO Phong Ly, luxury-car brands often give their dealers incentives to buy a few new models to use as service-department loaner cars, then proceed to turn them over after a year's duty.

*some drivers can find themselves disenchanted if they happened to choose the cheapest versions of what are otherwise opulently equipped luxury cars.

*motorists report having issues with technology-related woes like Bluetooth phone pairing, voice recognition, and navigation/audio systems, which are typically the most complex and confounding to master among gadget-packed luxury cars.

MB loaner cars are typically $43k to $45 k MSRP.

fintail

In other words, people who had microwave and VCR clocks blinking "12:00" all day in 1985. Things can only be dumbed down to a certain point. I've driven a fair number of cars, never had a Bluetooth pairing issue. I'll trade a somewhat complex menu system for the display quality of a modern MB nav screen. Also, not a touch screen = good.

Regarding MB MSRP, if you pay sticker, you're probably doing it wrong, few models of any brand command MSRP. For MBs, probably only the new G-Wagen right now.

driver100 said:

*motorists report having issues with technology-related woes like Bluetooth phone pairing, voice recognition, and navigation/audio systems, which are typically the most complex and confounding to master among gadget-packed luxury cars.

ruking1

fintail said:

In other words, people who had microwave and VCR clocks blinking "12:00" all day in 1985. Things can only be dumbed down to a certain point. I've driven a fair number of cars, never had a Bluetooth pairing issue. I'll trade a somewhat complex menu system for the display quality of a modern MB nav screen. Also, not a touch screen = good.

Regarding MB MSRP, if you pay sticker, you're probably doing it wrong, few models of any brand command MSRP. For MBs, probably only the new G-Wagen right now.

driver100 said:

*motorists report having issues with technology-related woes like Bluetooth phone pairing, voice recognition, and navigation/audio systems, which are typically the most complex and confounding to master among gadget-packed luxury cars.

Your responses to MB MSRP USED LOANER cars might be misleading on several points.
1. Would I pay MSRP? One can easily guess the answer
2. ‘MSRP” was given as a point of reference
3. Real/actual prices plus+/minus- MSRP are between seller & buyer.
4. 1 - minus to 2 year old - - used cars reasonably can/should command 1 to 2 year old (depreciated) prices.
5. Did we like any of the new to 2 year old loaner cars? Not enough to consider or even make offers.
6. We did appreciate driving loaner cars for the times ours were in the dealers shop.

oldfarmer50

Here’s a new angle.

A local Honda dealer is touting “market based pricing” on their cars. This is what they say it means:

“Market Based Pricing
Get a transparent, better-than-fair vehicle price with the Mohawk Honda Market Based Pricing commitment. We know that price shopping is available at your fingertips, so we’ve done the research for you. Our industry-leading software helps us base our prices on supply and demand, and not on book value. Market Based Pricing saves you time and money. Ask us for a complete Market Based Pricing detail today”

The part that interests me is the where they say they base their prices on “supply and demand” not book value. That sounds ripe for abuse (remember when a salesman told me that 5 year old Chryslers were going UP in value?). Seems as if this is just a slick way to counter someone waving a printout of Edmunds TMV around the showroom.

qbrozen

imidazol97 said:

I was so pleasantly surprised not to see a GM car in the autos list that I had to provide most of the listings in the article here. There are GM's in the pickup list. The most quickly resold car in Detroit was the Nissan Versa Note, an unassuming subcompact hatchback. A whopping 19.3% of metro Detroit buyers unloaded their Versa Notes in less than a year Prices for a 2019 Versa Note start at just $15,650, but the rest of the top five on Detroit’s dumped list are luxury vehicles: Audi Q3 subcompact SUV, sold by 13.9% Jaguar XF sport sedan, 11.7% Audi A3 compact car ,10.2% Audi A4 sport sedan, 9.9% The 10 vehicles most frequently sold in the first year nationally are even richer in luxury models, with a dash of Nissan thrown in for diversity: Mercedes-Benz C-class, 12.4% BMW 3-Series, 11.8% Land Rover Discovery Sport, 11.8% Land Rover Range Rover Evoque 10.9% Mini Clubman, 10.7% BMW X1, 10.4% BMW X3, 9% Nissan Versa Note, 9% Jaguar XF, 8.8% Nissan Versa, 8.7% The Mercedes C-class led the list in a number of metro areas, including Boston, Dallas-Fort Worth, Chicago and Atlanta, where a whopping 33.7% of new C-classes were unloaded in the first year. “Despite the popularity of these vehicles, they generally have below-average reliability ratings from Consumer Reports, which could contribute to why owners get rid of them so quickly,” iSeeCars CEO Phong Ly said. German luxury brands top the list of brands most frequently sold in less than a year: BMW, 7.9% Porsche, 7.6% Mercedes, 7.4% Land Rover, 6.5% Jaguar, 6.4% Mini, 6.2% Fiat, 5.2% Audi, 5.1% Nissan, 5.0% Infiniti, 4.7% Nissan also wrapped up the top three spots on the pickup list: Nissan Titan XD, 7.9% Nissan Titan, 7.6% Nissan Frontier, 5.3% GMC Canyon, 4.8% Toyota Tacoma, 4.7% GMC Sierra 1500, 4.6% Ram 1500, 4.1% Chevrolet Colorado, 4.1% Toyota Tundra, 3.9%

Wow. Only Fiat from FCA on those lists, and even they edged out MINI. I can see the commercials now “in a nationwide study, Fiat aggravated fewer owners in the first year than MINI. #wesuckalittleless”

driver100

qbrozen said:

imidazol97 said:

I was so pleasantly surprised not to see a GM car in the autos list that I had to provide most of the listings in the article here. There are GM's in the pickup list.

The most quickly resold car in Detroit was the Nissan Versa Note, an unassuming subcompact hatchback. A whopping 19.3% of metro Detroit buyers unloaded their Versa Notes in less than a year

Prices for a 2019 Versa Note start at just $15,650, but the rest of the top five on Detroit’s dumped list are luxury vehicles:

Audi Q3 subcompact SUV, sold by 13.9%
Jaguar XF sport sedan, 11.7%
Audi A3 compact car ,10.2%
Audi A4 sport sedan, 9.9%

The 10 vehicles most frequently sold in the first year nationally are even richer in luxury models, with a dash of Nissan thrown in for diversity:

Mercedes-Benz C-class, 12.4%
BMW 3-Series, 11.8%
Land Rover Discovery Sport, 11.8%
Land Rover Range Rover Evoque 10.9%
Mini Clubman, 10.7%
BMW X1, 10.4%
BMW X3, 9%
Nissan Versa Note, 9%
Jaguar XF, 8.8%
Nissan Versa, 8.7%

The Mercedes C-class led the list in a number of metro areas, including Boston, Dallas-Fort Worth, Chicago and Atlanta, where a whopping 33.7% of new C-classes were unloaded in the first year.

“Despite the popularity of these vehicles, they generally have below-average reliability ratings from Consumer Reports, which could contribute to why owners get rid of them so quickly,” iSeeCars CEO Phong Ly said.

German luxury brands top the list of brands most frequently sold in less than a year:

BMW, 7.9%
Porsche, 7.6%
Mercedes, 7.4%
Land Rover, 6.5%
Jaguar, 6.4%
Mini, 6.2%
Fiat, 5.2%
Audi, 5.1%
Nissan, 5.0%
Infiniti, 4.7%

Nissan also wrapped up the top three spots on the pickup list:

Nissan Titan XD, 7.9%
Nissan Titan, 7.6%
Nissan Frontier, 5.3%
GMC Canyon, 4.8%
Toyota Tacoma, 4.7%
GMC Sierra 1500, 4.6%
Ram 1500, 4.1%
Chevrolet Colorado, 4.1%
Toyota Tundra, 3.9%

Wow. Only Fiat from FCA on those lists, and even they edged out MINI. I can see the commercials now “in a nationwide study, Fiat aggravated fewer owners in the first year than MINI. #wesuckalittleless”

I believe, what was failed to be mentioned was that only about 1% of cars come back within the first year, so when we are talking 5% on this list, that is still a very low number of cars. I don't know if there is any real value in the list if you consider that....buy what you like, not because fewer people couldn't adjust to a specific brand.

I wonder how many people buy an MB C Class and it is their first German Luxury car, and they find the ride harsher than they are used to, or it is a little smaller than their van or old SUV? All kinds of reasons for the statistics.....it's figuring out what it all means.

dino001

Those frequent changes of luxury vehicles are mostly due to a new car itch. Just ask Mike

There may be some stories of something going wrong, but it's usually because the guy wandered into a showroom and saw a new shiny object, the salesperson saw an opportunity and ran with it.

imidazol97

driver100 said:

I believe, what was failed to be mentioned was that only about 1% of cars come back within the first year, so when we are talking 5% on this list, that is still a very low number of cars. .

I am not clear where you get 1%

The story says in metro areas (where a higher number of MBs are sold) "The Mercedes C-class led the list in a number of metro areas, including Boston, Dallas-Fort Worth, Chicago and Atlanta, where a whopping 33.7% of new C-classes were unloaded in the first year."

A whopping 33.7% of new C's were unloaded in the first year...

That's not 5% or 1%.

graphicguy

laurasdada said:

Our current dog (alas, now 3k miles away from me) was a rescue mix from the streets of Arkansas. For the first three days he owned us, he made not a sound. But, as he grew comfortable, the barking began. In a good way.

Remember, despicable, evil, heart breaking acts are the exception. Else they wouldn't be news. For every story of human evil, there are exponentially more acts of kindness, selflessness and civility, such as adopting an abandoned pet or helping a fellow human being. Not newsworthy, but it's what the majority does. "Give 'em dirty laundry..."

Just a theory, of course.

Truth there, sadly! Took Bisket for his first vet check up yesterday. While he’s healthy, the vet found signs of him being kicked (or whacked) in/on his snout repeatedly as his teeth were broken at one point. He’s found a way to eat, regardless. But, just shows the cruelty some people have.

Thanks for all the nice words. I think he and I are going to be just fine.

graphicguy

oldfarmer50 said:

Here’s a new angle.

A local Honda dealer is touting “market based pricing” on their cars. This is what they say it means:

“Market Based Pricing
Get a transparent, better-than-fair vehicle price with the Mohawk Honda Market Based Pricing commitment. We know that price shopping is available at your fingertips, so we’ve done the research for you. Our industry-leading software helps us base our prices on supply and demand, and not on book value. Market Based Pricing saves you time and money. Ask us for a complete Market Based Pricing detail today”

The part that interests me is the where they say they base their prices on “supply and demand” not book value. That sounds ripe for abuse (remember when a salesman told me that 5 year old Chryslers were going UP in value?). Seems as if this is just a slick way to counter someone waving a printout of Edmunds TMV around the showroom.

The question is who determines the market’s supply and demand? If one Honda dealer is selling Ridgelines like there is no tomorrow, and the one across town can’t move them, wouldn’t it make more sense to go to the dealer who can’t sell them to make a deal?

After all, the dealer is using “industry leading software” for supply and demand info “at their dealership”. Sounds like all bets are off if you include all the dealerships within a 100 mile radius.

fintail

My MSRP comment had nothing to do with loaner cars. Sorry if the context wasn't clear.

Biggest problem with loaner cars is that most of them will be modestly optioned at best. For those of us who want premium toys on a premium car, there's likely some disappointment.

ruking1 said:

Your responses to MB MSRP USED LOANER cars might be misleading on several points.
1. Would I pay MSRP? One can easily guess the answer
2. ‘MSRP” was given as a point of reference
3. Real/actual prices plus+/minus- MSRP are between seller & buyer.
4. 1 - minus to 2 year old - - used cars reasonably can/should command 1 to 2 year old (depreciated) prices.
5. Did we like any of the new to 2 year old loaner cars? Not enough to consider or even make offers.
6. We did appreciate driving loaner cars for the times ours were in the dealers shop.

fintail

Like some others here, I would love to see the raw data and methodology behind those numbers. The original source was pretty sparse when it comes to details. A full third is a bit tough to swallow even if the car in question was an Alfa.

imidazol97 said:

The story says in metro areas (where a higher number of MBs are sold) "The Mercedes C-class led the list in a number of metro areas, including Boston, Dallas-Fort Worth, Chicago and Atlanta, where a whopping 33.7% of new C-classes were unloaded in the first year."

A whopping 33.7% of new C's were unloaded in the first year...

That's not 5% or 1%.

abacomike

dino001 said:

Those frequent changes of luxury vehicles are mostly due to a new car itch. Just ask Mike There may be some stories of something going wrong, but it's usually because the guy wandered into a showroom and saw a new shiny object, the salesperson saw an opportunity and ran with it.

You are dead on, Dino.  I was probably the cause of first year Mercedes trades.  I feel awful about that!  

tjc78

While he’s healthy, the vet found signs of him being kicked (or whacked) in/on his snout repeatedly as his teeth were broken at one point.

That's terrible. Thank goodness he is in good hands now.

stickguy

Farmer, I’ll be right around the corner from Mohawk this weekend. Maybe I should pop in and grill them!

As to dogs, I work with a lab rescue and the history on some of the dogs we see is horrible. People that abuse pets are special kind of evil..

bwia

Home Depot makes a wrong delivery and for weeks refuses to make things right. This headline sounds like it came from one of our Edmunds posters but alas, the story is about a Maine resident. Here is the short version:

Home Depot delivered a washer-dryer to the wrong address. The tenant argued that he did not order the appliances but the delivery men paperwork showed otherwise. They went on to remove his old appliances and installed the new ones. Even though Home Depot quickly realized the mistake and picked up the misdelivered appliances the next day, they claimed they couldn’t bring back the old ones; they apparently had already been reduced to scrap metal. Really? Within 24 hours?

When the tenant called Home Depot they offered him this deal: Pay $600 toward a new washer and dryer, since the company felt he was partly responsible for the delivery mixup. Deal? Not a chance. But 2½ months later when word of the controversy bubbled up to the corporate level, things changed quickly. Home Depot promised to install new appliances at no cost. Happy ending I hope, but I wonder if there is a gift tax involved?

Read full article at: https://www.bostonglobe.com/business/2019/05/12/home-depot-makes-wrong-delivery-and-for-weeks-refuses-make-things-right/IQvSwAoFqa4AHkygQvWclN/story.html

stickguy

I wouldn’t have let them back in the house unless they had the replacements with them. Of course, I wouldn’t have let them install stuff I didn’t buy in the first place! Though it mentions tenant so I guess in theory the landlord could have done it?

jmonroe1

stickguy said:

I wouldn’t have let them back in the house unless they had the replacements with them. Of course, I wouldn’t have let them install stuff I didn’t buy in the first place! Though it mentions tenant so I guess in theory the landlord could have done it?

I agree and it sounds like someone needs training on how to lock doors. Even tenants should possess this skill.

jmonroe

henryn

I might have been tempted to accept a new washer and dryer (gratis). Probably not, but ... maybe.

Once I had them in my possession, however, there is no way in h___ they would have gotten them back.

imidazol97

I'm with HenryN. Unless they had replacements for the erroneously installed items which were ones I had chosen, they wouldn't have been back in my home to retrieve the others.

I would have been online with the police and my attorney, especially since I protested the originals not being mine.

This is another case where the customer is always right. The original delivery guys should have listened to the "customer" who didn't order them.

BTW: Home Depot was the supplier of kitchen cabinets and the big contractor who installed them. After several years the heavy weight was moving the cabinets away from the wall at the top. Only one screw had been used to hold the backs to the wall.

Home Depot saw to getting replacement boxes and having them installed correctly with the correct number of screws in the back to hold the weight.

They moved the old doors to the new boxes since they were light maple and needed to match the rest of the cabinets upper and lower.

driver100

imidazol97 said:

driver100 said:

I believe, what was failed to be mentioned was that only about 1% of cars come back within the first year, so when we are talking 5% on this list, that is still a very low number of cars. .

I am not clear where you get 1%

The story says in metro areas (where a higher number of MBs are sold) "The Mercedes C-class led the list in a number of metro areas, including Boston, Dallas-Fort Worth, Chicago and Atlanta, where a whopping 33.7% of new C-classes were unloaded in the first year."

A whopping 33.7% of new C's were unloaded in the first year...

That's not 5% or 1%.

I got it here:

NEW CARS DUMPED IN THE FIRST YEAR

According to the used-vehicle website iSeeCars.com, 1.5% of all new cars are traded in within the first year of ownership, which is admittedly a drop in the proverbial bucket.

It isn't like 33% of all C-Class cars are dumped in the first year, it is 33% of the 1.5%.

driver100

graphicguy said:

laurasdada said:

Our current dog (alas, now 3k miles away from me) was a rescue mix from the streets of Arkansas. For the first three days he owned us, he made not a sound. But, as he grew comfortable, the barking began. In a good way.

Remember, despicable, evil, heart breaking acts are the exception. Else they wouldn't be news. For every story of human evil, there are exponentially more acts of kindness, selflessness and civility, such as adopting an abandoned pet or helping a fellow human being. Not newsworthy, but it's what the majority does. "Give 'em dirty laundry..."

Just a theory, of course.

Truth there, sadly! Took Bisket for his first vet check up yesterday. While he’s healthy, the vet found signs of him being kicked (or whacked) in/on his snout repeatedly as his teeth were broken at one point. He’s found a way to eat, regardless. But, just shows the cruelty some people have.

Thanks for all the nice words. I think he and I are going to be just fine.

I don't get how people can be that cruel to an animal....takes a special kind of evil person.
Glad Bisket has found a good home now.

ruking1

fintail said:

My MSRP comment had nothing to do with loaner cars. Sorry if the context wasn't clear.

Biggest problem with loaner cars is that most of them will be modestly optioned at best. For those of us who want premium toys on a premium car, there's likely some disappointment.

ruking1 said:

Your responses to MB MSRP USED LOANER cars might be misleading on several points.
1. Would I pay MSRP? One can easily guess the answer
2. ‘MSRP” was given as a point of reference
3. Real/actual prices plus+/minus- MSRP are between seller & buyer.
4. 1 - minus to 2 year old - - used cars reasonably can/should command 1 to 2 year old (depreciated) prices.
5. Did we like any of the new to 2 year old loaner cars? Not enough to consider or even make offers.
6. We did appreciate driving loaner cars for the times ours were in the dealers shop.

Perhaps that is one of the MB (others 2) dealers’ more profitable end goal/s/result/s/game. It would be to sell/lease much high priced LOADED model/s, along with a trade ? Why sell a $44k car when a $60k plus+ model will do?😉

laurasdada

I bought a '13 Jaguar XF. After one year, I kept it. Damn the statistics, full speed ahead!

ruking1

laurasdada said:

I bought a '13 Jaguar XF. After one year, I kept it. Damn the statistics, full speed ahead!

Here’s hoping that you got one of the more statistically better made ones !

oldfarmer50

graphicguy said:

oldfarmer50 said:

Here’s a new angle.

A local Honda dealer is touting “market based pricing” on their cars. This is what they say it means:

“Market Based Pricing
Get a transparent, better-than-fair vehicle price with the Mohawk Honda Market Based Pricing commitment. We know that price shopping is available at your fingertips, so we’ve done the research for you. Our industry-leading software helps us base our prices on supply and demand, and not on book value. Market Based Pricing saves you time and money. Ask us for a complete Market Based Pricing detail today”

The part that interests me is the where they say they base their prices on “supply and demand” not book value. That sounds ripe for abuse (remember when a salesman told me that 5 year old Chryslers were going UP in value?). Seems as if this is just a slick way to counter someone waving a printout of Edmunds TMV around the showroom.

The question is who determines the market’s supply and demand? If one Honda dealer is selling Ridgelines like there is no tomorrow, and the one across town can’t move them, wouldn’t it make more sense to go to the dealer who can’t sell them to make a deal?

After all, the dealer is using “industry leading software” for supply and demand info “at their dealership”. Sounds like all bets are off if you include all the dealerships within a 100 mile radius.

Exactly. The software is probably on the Commodore 64 where they store the sales figures. If the sales force doesn’t supply the sales, the manager demands they try harder.

dino001

henryn said:

I might have been tempted to accept a new washer and dryer (gratis). Probably not, but ... maybe.

Once I had them in my possession, however, there is no way in h___ they would have gotten them back.

Not even with the police holding a warrant?

stickguy

Well, file a police report against HD. they literally stole the people’s washer and dryer.

ruking1

Is one really sure that will hold up in small claims court? 🤪CA $10,000 individual, $5,000 business entity. Nolo.com Purely my guess, but the guy/landlord/owner of the machines would have probably max got a depreciated value for “loss” of his machines. In the name of goodwill, Home Depot stepped up.

oldfarmer50

“Farmer, I’ll be right around the corner from Mohawk this weekend. Maybe I should pop in and grill them!”

I don’t know, you might end up driving home in a new Civic. If you get over there you might as well take a look at the air museum across the street. They have some nice old jets.

oldfarmer50

bwia said:

Home Depot makes a wrong delivery and for weeks refuses to make things right. This headline sounds like it came from one of our Edmunds posters but alas, the story is about a Maine resident. Here is the short version:

Home Depot delivered a washer-dryer to the wrong address. The tenant argued that he did not order the appliances but the delivery men paperwork showed otherwise. They went on to remove his old appliances and installed the new ones. Even though Home Depot quickly realized the mistake and picked up the misdelivered appliances the next day, they claimed they couldn’t bring back the old ones; they apparently had already been reduced to scrap metal. Really? Within 24 hours?

When the tenant called Home Depot they offered him this deal: Pay $600 toward a new washer and dryer, since the company felt he was partly responsible for the delivery mixup. Deal? Not a chance. But 2½ months later when word of the controversy bubbled up to the corporate level, things changed quickly. Home Depot promised to install new appliances at no cost. Happy ending I hope, but I wonder if there is a gift tax involved?

Read full article at: https://www.bostonglobe.com/business/2019/05/12/home-depot-makes-wrong-delivery-and-for-weeks-refuses-make-things-right/IQvSwAoFqa4AHkygQvWclN/story.html

That story sounds fishy. Why did the tenant let them take the old appliances. If they were his personally. Then it sounds like he was trying to get something for nothing. If they belonged to the apartment he had no right letting them go and the problem was with the landlord.

stickguy

oldfarmer50 said:

“Farmer, I’ll be right around the corner from Mohawk this weekend. Maybe I should pop in and grill them!”

I don’t know, you might end up driving home in a new Civic. If you get over there you might as well take a look at the air museum across the street. They have some nice old jets.

First I heard about an aviation museum. But I haven’t been up state street in many, many years.

houdini2

imidazol97 said:

driver100 said:

I believe, what was failed to be mentioned was that only about 1% of cars come back within the first year, so when we are talking 5% on this list, that is still a very low number of cars. .

I am not clear where you get 1%

The story says in metro areas (where a higher number of MBs are sold) "The Mercedes C-class led the list in a number of metro areas, including Boston, Dallas-Fort Worth, Chicago and Atlanta, where a whopping 33.7% of new C-classes were unloaded in the first year."

A whopping 33.7% of new C's were unloaded in the first year...

That's not 5% or 1%.

The article cited Consumer Reports rating the cars not very reliable was a reason.

ab348

That Home Depot delivery snafu story is hilarious. While I too would question why the fellow let them in a second time to remove the erroneous items without replacements ready to go back in, it sounds like the offer of paying $600 for a new set was the idea of someone local, a store manager or someone further down the food chain, trying to stay out of trouble with the higher-ups. Once it hit the national media, corporate had to step in and fix it.

That sort of thing is just a cost of doing business. When I was working here at the liquor board I gave away apology gift cards like business cards when even semi-legit complaints arrived on my desk. At the store level we also had a no-questions-asked policy on product returns for quality reasons. It was not uncommon for someone to bring back a near-empty bottle of wine, vodka, whisky or rum and complain that it had an off taste. We always replaced it. Why did they drink most of it before realizing it was not right? A common answer was that they had a party and most everyone had some before they realized there was something wrong. When you take into account that was likely something that cost us $5 to buy that we sold at much more it was a good customer relations practice to just replace it with no questioning and move on.

Sometimes the level of thoughtlessness at retail is shocking. When I was renovating my bathrooms a couple of years ago I spent a long time looking for the right vanities. Finally I found them at a home center that was the closest of all to where I live, about a half-mile away. I had gone there first and didn't see anything I liked, and in the interim they got a bunch of new models in and when I saw a sale flyer I went back and found both. As the associate is writing up the order (close to $2K) she asks "Do you want them delivered?" Well, duh, yeah. That was an extra $50 and she couldn't guarantee they could get them into the house if they had to go up any stairs. WTH? It grated on me. I dunno what margin they were making on my purchase but the delivery on something like that should have been gratis in my mind, and saying they would leave them on my lawn if the 5 steps up from the driveway was too much for them was ridiculous. I told her to forget the whole thing when she wouldn't budge. A day later I got a call from the store saying they would do free delivery if I still wanted the items, no uncertainty about getting them up the steps. I gladly took it, but the clerk should have been empowered to resolve all of that on the spot. It's just dumb to not do things like that.

dino001

oldfarmer50 said:

That story sounds fishy. Why did the tenant let them take the old appliances. If they were his personally. Then it sounds like he was trying to get something for nothing. If they belonged to the apartment he had no right letting them go and the problem was with the landlord.

I thought that first, too, but after rereading the story, I see how it happened. The guys is a tenant of a house owned by a people with the same last name as one on the delivery papers. People show up with papers showing a delivery for a house with the last name matching the owner he never met. He does not know owner's phone number (the rental was through an agency), so he has no immediate means to confirm it's true. He didn't try to get something for nothing, he simply likely thought the owner ordered a new machine without telling him, so he let them in.

driver100

If you can believe the Boston Globe the story is true:

Home Depot

Look up problems with Home Depot and you will probably never buy an appliance from them ever again.

driver100

houdini2 said:

imidazol97 said:

driver100 said:

I believe, what was failed to be mentioned was that only about 1% of cars come back within the first year, so when we are talking 5% on this list, that is still a very low number of cars. .

I am not clear where you get 1%

The story says in metro areas (where a higher number of MBs are sold) "The Mercedes C-class led the list in a number of metro areas, including Boston, Dallas-Fort Worth, Chicago and Atlanta, where a whopping 33.7% of new C-classes were unloaded in the first year."

A whopping 33.7% of new C's were unloaded in the first year...

That's not 5% or 1%.

The article cited Consumer Reports rating the cars not very reliable was a reason.

It is still 33.7% of the 1.5% of all cars that were returned in one year. And that 33% was only in some areas.

The dealer we buy from has lots of demonstrators for sale...I think they have deals with head office and possibly other sources......maybe dealers with too many demos for sale, because they have more demos for sale than they could possibly need for their own use.

stickguy

I have used Lowes more recently with no issues. But at this point prefer a local mom and pop appliance shop, even if it costs an extra $50 (and it doesn't always).