Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations

driver100

I haven't rented a car for a long time but didn't they eventually have a plan where you could pay for a full tank of gas, which was a lower fee than what they charge to fill the car up.....and you could bring the car back on empty if you wanted to. It worked well in most cases.

They could do that with an EV....charge for a full charge....and bring it back on empty if you want to.

laurasdada

One more time:
The Tesla is able to map his trip with recommended stops to charge (e.g. Stop here to charge/have lunch as there are no chargers local to your destination...).

And there are apps you can put on your phone to do similar, check an area in advance (e.g. Plugshare).

Even my Audi PHEV will list charging stations in the nav.

If you buy a technology, understand your new technology.

ab348

mjfloyd1 said:

Tesla recalls over 2 million vehicles over autopilot software

https://www.newser.com/story/343808/its-autopilot-under-scrutiny-tesla-recalls-2m-vehicles.html?utm_source=part&utm_medium=uol&utm_campaign=rss_top

Maybe Elon saw the scene in Leave The World Behind where the pack of self-driving Teslas gets hacked to nefarious purposes and wants to prevent that.

dino001

stickguy said:

I would have an issue with needing to recharge since I am sure hertz does nothing to explain the process, just gives you the fob and says good luck.

Bingo. If they explained thing for you, you might pick up on the fact you need extra hour to charge the vehicle before turning in the keys (fob) and that's what we call lost opportunity for additional revenue.

tjc78

@driver100
I’m sorry I have zero empathy for someone who is on their second Tesla (with the best charging network) failing to route himself along the way to available chargers.

Poor planning regardless of circumstances.

I used to travel for work constantly. Most of my trip delays, etc were of my own doing. Not booking things early enough, not looking up the best routes etc etc.

Remember - Sense is not common.

Good to read that the Mercedes EVs are exceeding mileage estimates.

roadburner

@laurasdada said:
One more time:
The Tesla is able to map his trip with recommended stops to charge (e.g. Stop here to charge/have lunch as there are no chargers local to your destination...).

And there are apps you can put on your phone to do similar, check an area in advance (e.g. Plugshare).

Even my Audi PHEV will list charging stations in the nav.

If you buy a technology, understand your new technology.

Nah- it’s much better to whine about things in an attempt to generate a pity party.

stickguy

A quick google maps search popped up an EV connect charging station 6 miles from the heart of downtown mayville. Nearest superchargers are a bit further away in bigger towns but basically ring that little town so would have been hard to get there without going near one of them.

That’s what the map planner is for in the car. If it knows your itinerary it will have you charge early if needed when it is convenient.

stickguy

And lots of hotels and shopping areas have a couple chargers now too

mjfloyd1

Probably would have been worthwhile to stop at a supercharger on the way and again on the way out

driver100

mjfloyd1 said:

Probably would have been worthwhile to stop at a supercharger on the way and again on the way out

....and sometimes you just want to get to the funeral on time and don't think to stop and recharge while you are trying to make it somewhere by a certain time.
Who knows, maybe was running late, maybe a mother-in-law complaining, maybe concerned about a speech he had to give.........didn't think to stop at the last charger on the way.

roadburner

driver100 said:

mjfloyd1 said:

Probably would have been worthwhile to stop at a supercharger on the way and again on the way out

....and sometimes you just want to get to the funeral on time and don't think to stop and recharge while you are trying to make it somewhere by a certain time.
Who knows, maybe was running late, maybe a mother-in-law complaining, maybe concerned about a speech he had to give.........didn't think to stop at the last charger on the way.

"didn't think" summarizes why he ended up in that situation...

stickguy

People still run out of gas all the time and it boggles my mind how that could possibly happen.

dad23

stickguy said:

People still run out of gas all the time and it boggles my mind how that could possibly happen.

There are people who take risks and there are people who don't...

tjc78

@driver100 said:
....and sometimes you just want to get to the funeral on time and don't think to stop and recharge while you are trying to make it somewhere by a certain time.
Who knows, maybe was running late, maybe a mother-in-law complaining, maybe concerned about a speech he had to give.........didn't think to stop at the last charger on the way.

You missed your calling as a defense attorney!

dino001

driver100 said:

I haven't rented a car for a long time but didn't they eventually have a plan where you could pay for a full tank of gas, which was a lower fee than what they charge to fill the car up.....and you could bring the car back on empty if you wanted to. It worked well in most cases.

They could do that with an EV....charge for a full charge....and bring it back on empty if you want to.

Yes. This could be done, too. I think for such a new technology and time crunch issues, it would be better to have that "non-optional" (included in the price) for at least a few years before people get used to it and there is sufficient infrastructure, including charging stations around airports for those who don't mind spending extra hour before turning the vehicle in. It would also build more a little more goodwill and trust of the customers. Basically small differentiation between renting an ICE powered vehicle and EV. Could be a marketing tag line "with EV you get one charge free, not like with that stinky gas car" (even showing exaggerated scenes of unhappy people struggling with pump hose vs. happy people pulling into a garage with near empty batter and just signing off), like "bags fly free with Southwest", even though we know it's not exactly free - but it's not another gotcha profit item.

ab348

stickguy said:

A quick google maps search popped up an EV connect charging station 6 miles from the heart of downtown mayville. Nearest superchargers are a bit further away in bigger towns but basically ring that little town so would have been hard to get there without going near one of them.

That’s what the map planner is for in the car. If it knows your itinerary it will have you charge early if needed when it is convenient.

Maybe the guy is allergic to the charging app the way I am to nav apps.

stickguy

Traveling with an EV Is probably not a good idea for someone with a flip phone and an atlas.

qbrozen

dino001 said:

No surprise with Ford. There is plenty of evidence how useless it is as a towing working machine, even something light - plenty of torque, but the range reduced at regular highway speeds to less than 100 miles. It's basically due to increased air resistance from the trailer more than actual weight. Seems like there is long way to go for them to become useful. They have to figure out power going into range, not burning tires. This is by the way one of the thing that make me stay away from even thinking of getting an EV, other than the grid issues - too much emphasis of speed/acceleration performance, not enough on range. Seems like a conscious decision to distract consumers and build expensive toys for well-off people rather than useful machines for regular folks. They probably cannot figure out how to direct that power into range rather than wheel torque. They keep bundling large batteries with engine power. Sure, they can offer high power-large batter combo for those who want it, but why they somehow find impossible to conceive to put large battery into lower powered trim is really beyond me.

Agreed on several points. I'm no electrician, but shouldn't they be able to simply reduce the max power going to the motor? Kind of like putting on a smaller carburetor. What would be a tremendous step forward, IMHO, is giving the consumer a slider in the menu that let's you adjust the hp up and down and showing the resulting estimated range.

explorerx4

The Lightning performs no differently than any other electric truck.

mjfloyd1

driver100 said:

mjfloyd1 said:

Probably would have been worthwhile to stop at a supercharger on the way and again on the way out

....and sometimes you just want to get to the funeral on time and don't think to stop and recharge while you are trying to make it somewhere by a certain time.
Who knows, maybe was running late, maybe a mother-in-law complaining, maybe concerned about a speech he had to give.........didn't think to stop at the last charger on the way.

Did he check to see if they had cordless chargers?😇

stickguy

can't you just push down less on the accelerator pedal and not use as much juice?

oldfarmer50

dino001 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

I had coffee with my buddy from Hertz today. Hertz has gone all out for EVs and many of their customers have no clue what that to do with an EV. Many bring them back at near zero charge and get upset that they have to pay for Hertz to do it. They argue “why can’t you just plug them in a wall socket somewhere” as if electricity was free.

I bet the energy charging fee per kWh is at similar rate to those ridiculous gas refueling rates per gallon when you turn the vehicle without full tank and not prepaid gas, or perhaps at even higher ratio than just typical $7.99-$9.99 per gallon- wouldn't surprise me if it was actual 5x or 10x price of the energy put in. This is a perfect example of a corporation getting "too smart" for its own sake. Instead of comprehensive pricing recognizing that it's not the same to gas up a vehicle 5 minutes before turning it in then waiting for God knows how long to charge it up when you're about to miss the plane. The problem would have easily been solved if the rental price simply included that charge, but that would be too simple and no American corporation would pass on an opportunity to charge some back-end fee rather than removing a friction point. This way we can advertise low prices and spring some got you fee when you're just about to board a plane. Who needs a happy customer with comprehensive price when you can lure them with slightly lower price and then charge them something exorbitant later when they inevitably slip?

Then again, taking an EV out of service for the time it takes to charge is an actual expense. In fast pace environments like airports a delayed turn around time could result in a customer who is angrily waiting without a car. We’ve had that happen even with gas cars.

And yeah, you’re paying for that fill up service. They all do it. Yesterday I wanted to pay a bill with Verizon and they wanted a $10 premium to actually talk to a person.

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

I haven't rented a car for a long time but didn't they eventually have a plan where you could pay for a full tank of gas, which was a lower fee than what they charge to fill the car up.....and you could bring the car back on empty if you wanted to. It worked well in most cases.

They could do that with an EV....charge for a full charge....and bring it back on empty if you want to.

I know our company has two options if you don’t return it full: prepay for the fuel in the car at a price about the same as at the pump or bring it back unfilled and pay for an employee to fill it at a substantial premium. I never asked it it’s the same for EVs.

I’m sure there are other arrangements for corporate accounts.

jmonroe1

driver100 said:

mjfloyd1 said:

Probably would have been worthwhile to stop at a supercharger on the way and again on the way out

....and sometimes you just want to get to the funeral on time and don't think to stop and recharge while you are trying to make it somewhere by a certain time.
Who knows, maybe was running late, maybe a mother-in-law complaining, maybe concerned about a speech he had to give.........didn't think to stop at the last charger on the way.

————————————————
With all those things to be concerned about is why I don’t want an EV. I’ve driven too long to start changing the way I have to think about getting somewhere. Call it whatever you want but being set in my ways is a good starting point.

Now, having said that, you have to know what’s in store for you when you have an EV and like I’ve said before I’m not willingly going to change my driving habits now.

FWIW, if I showed up at a rental car counter and they had an EV waiting for me I’d refuse it unless it was the last car on the lot. And even then I’d try another counter before taking it.

jmonroe

roadburner

The discussion of the hopelessly inept BIL reminds me of how completely stupid otherwise intelligent people can be.

On a couple of YouTube channels I follow there have been some in-depth discussions of a plane crash involving a female pilot who was a YouTube celebrity. She was flying her Beech Debonair which was fitted with a Century 2000 autopilot. At least one of her YT videos demonstrated that she did not understand how it worked (during the video she mutters, "I hate this autopilot."). One person who helped develop the 2000 stated, "The pilot appeared to not only lack a fundamental understanding of flying but also the features of the autopilot." The ultimate result was both she and her father died in the crash.

At least BIL's ignorance only resulted in his having to wait several hours to charge a car- a car that could have provided the information he needed prior to his fiasco had he taken the time to learn its features.

qbrozen

@stickguy said:
can't you just push down less on the accelerator pedal and not use as much juice?

I could be wrong but I don’t think it works as well. For one, of course, the human input can’t be nearly as accurate as a computer. For another, you know that, no matter how gingerly you drive a 600hp v8, it is guzzling fuel. Probably not a direct correlation since the gasser always needs fuel to continue running. It would be an interesting experiment. If nothing else, the manufacturer who offers such an option would have a temporary advantage.

driver100

dad23 said:

stickguy said:

People still run out of gas all the time and it boggles my mind how that could possibly happen.

There are people who take risks and there are people who don't...

Actually, this reminded me of something my friend said. His B-I-L was in a hurry, he was running late, he was tired, and he just wanted to get to the motel and a bit of him knew he was taking a risk, but he thought he could do it.
If you remember, my other friend who had a Tesla was arriving home at midnight, he didn't want to go to an out of the way mall to charge up, he risked it and ran out of power a few blocks from his home.

I have never run out of gas (hope I didn't jinx myself) but it can and does happen to people. Some of us are more perfect than others, but I am thinking some people are not as careful about these things as others. It is probably easier to find and get to a gas station than it is to find a charger that is working.

driver100

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

I haven't rented a car for a long time but didn't they eventually have a plan where you could pay for a full tank of gas, which was a lower fee than what they charge to fill the car up.....and you could bring the car back on empty if you wanted to. It worked well in most cases.

They could do that with an EV....charge for a full charge....and bring it back on empty if you want to.

I know our company has two options if you don’t return it full: prepay for the fuel in the car at a price about the same as at the pump or bring it back unfilled and pay for an employee to fill it at a substantial premium. I never asked it it’s the same for EVs.

I’m sure there are other arrangements for corporate accounts.

Prepaying for gas for a rental car is good for everyone. The customer just walks away and doesn't have to find a gas station on his way to the airport. The rental car company makes a few dollars from the few gallons of gas still in the tank, and it takes 5 minutes to fill the car up.

With an EV, the car is out of commission for 30 to 50 minutes while it is being charged up. And do you charge them to 80% or 100% which isn't good for them? Also, you may need 50 chargers and parking spots at a large airport....that's expensive real estate. And a lot more labor intensive, drive in, pick up car when filled etc. With gassers you drive up, fill up, the next car drives up.

stickguy

a bit hyperbolic here IMO. but, I got time!

normally cars don't drive in and drive out. everyone I have ever gotten has been parked and cold. they also have to get processed/cleaned/whatever. are there times where a car comes it and they don't even turn it off or check anything? Could be. probably shouldn't, but has to be a pretty rare occurrence that someone has to wait an extra 20-30 minutes for their EV.

and 50 spots? you think they will convert the entire fleet to EVs? Even then they will not have 50 EVs all coming in fresh off the street at the same time, so they will not need that big a percentage of chargers. Plenty will come back in needing little to no charge, and it just needs to be part of the process to check the charge state and if below where it needs to be, put it on the charger for a short time then move it off to its spot. that is actually likely even easier, quicker, and less labor intensive than having to send Farmer from the airport garage, out of the airport and down the road to a station to fill up, then bring it back.

just put the chargers right at the check in booth, and the lot person can plug it in while they are doing everything else they do (like clean it and do computer work), and once charged just have Farmer go stick it in a regular spot.

and yes, if the rental companies want to rent out EVs absolutely they need to put in the infrastructure (Chargers) to support that. But it really is not that difficult.

stickguy

Rental companies make a bundle on those policies I bet. Last time I had it offered it was really a bad deal since it assumed the car would come in almost on fumes. I was not going all that far (typical work type trip) so a full tank when you were probably not going more than 50 miles, and they were charging for 12-15 gallons. Each time they did it. and not bothering to ever fill it up.

probably make more on that than the actual rental charge!

mjfloyd1

@driver100 said:
Actually, this reminded me of something my friend said. His B-I-L was in a hurry, he was running late, he was tired, and he just wanted to get to the motel and a bit of him knew he was taking a risk, but he thought he could do it.
If you remember, my other friend who had a Tesla was arriving home at midnight, he didn't want to go to an out of the way mall to charge up, he risked it and ran out of power a few blocks from his home.

I have never run out of gas (hope I didn't jinx myself) but it can and does happen to people. Some of us are more perfect than others, but I am thinking some people are not as careful about these things as others. It is probably easier to find and get to a gas station than it is to find a charger that is working.

Situational awareness

driver100

mjfloyd1 said:

@driver100 said:

Actually, this reminded me of something my friend said. His B-I-L was in a hurry, he was running late, he was tired, and he just wanted to get to the motel and a bit of him knew he was taking a risk, but he thought he could do it.

If you remember, my other friend who had a Tesla was arriving home at midnight, he didn't want to go to an out of the way mall to charge up, he risked it and ran out of power a few blocks from his home.

I have never run out of gas (hope I didn't jinx myself) but it can and does happen to people. Some of us are more perfect than others, but I am thinking some people are not as careful about these things as others. It is probably easier to find and get to a gas station than it is to find a charger that is working.

Situational awareness

Easy for you to say.

driver100

Keep in mind he has owned a Tesla before......so he is experienced with Tesla's.
He did something humans do, he risked not charging when he should have because of circumstances.
Not everyone is as knowledgeable as you guys about cars or always being prepared, people run out of gas, they forget to plug in their EV, they get tired, they don't feel well, they get stuck in snow and realize they should have put on snow tires, their battery dies, .....the best laid plans and all that!

I could be wrong but I looked up "Tesla Charging Stations Near Mayville N.Y." and the closest ones seem to be 30 miles away;
https://www.way.com/ev-chargers/tesla/new-york/mayville

driver100

stickguy said:

Rental companies make a bundle on those policies I bet. Last time I had it offered it was really a bad deal since it assumed the car would come in almost on fumes. I was not going all that far (typical work type trip) so a full tank when you were probably not going more than 50 miles, and they were charging for 12-15 gallons. Each time they did it. and not bothering to ever fill it up.

probably make more on that than the actual rental charge!

If you are only using 2 to 5 gallons don't take the pre-paid fill up option. In fact for 1 or 2 gallons let them charge you at their ridiculous rates, better than stopping to fuel up.
But, if you are using 3/4s or more of the fuel in the tank, it is the better option.
At least it is nice to have an option!

driver100

stickguy said:

a bit hyperbolic here IMO. but, I got time!

My point is that to fill up the gasser will take less than 5 minutes, and the car is back in action and the pump is free for the next car.
With an EV the car will be out of commission for an extra 30 to 45 minutes and it is taking up a fueling spot.
I imagine that in the rental car business downtime is lost revenue for the car rental company.

mjfloyd1

@driver100 said:
Keep in mind he has owned a Tesla before......so he is experienced with Tesla's.
He did something humans do, he risked not charging when he should have because of circumstances.
Not everyone is as knowledgeable as you guys about cars or always being prepared, people run out of gas, they forget to plug in their EV, they get tired, they don't feel well, they get stuck in snow and realize they should have put on snow tires, their battery dies, .....the best laid plans and all that!

I could be wrong but I looked up "Tesla Charging Stations Near Mayville N.Y." and the closest ones seem to be 30 miles away;
https://www.way.com/ev-chargers/tesla/new-york/mayville

I totally get it but you have to be prepared. I had a diesel when diesel wasn’t as common so I checked to make sure it was available and would have taken a different vehicle, filled up early etc.

He was probably emotionally a wreck so it is what it is.

ab348

Bad week for GM's Cruise self-driving unit. On Wednesday 9 top execs got fired. And today it was announced they will be eliminating 24% of their workforce.

driver100

mjfloyd1 said:

@driver100 said:

Keep in mind he has owned a Tesla before......so he is experienced with Tesla's.

He did something humans do, he risked not charging when he should have because of circumstances.

Not everyone is as knowledgeable as you guys about cars or always being prepared, people run out of gas, they forget to plug in their EV, they get tired, they don't feel well, they get stuck in snow and realize they should have put on snow tires, their battery dies, .....the best laid plans and all that!

I could be wrong but I looked up "Tesla Charging Stations Near Mayville N.Y." and the closest ones seem to be 30 miles away;
https://www.way.com/ev-chargers/tesla/new-york/mayville

I totally get it but you have to be prepared. I had a diesel when diesel wasn’t as common so I checked to make sure it was available and would have taken a different vehicle, filled up early etc.

He was probably emotionally a wreck so it is what it is.

Exactly, most humans aren't perfect.
My neighbors went to dinner with other neighbors, there were 4 of them. They arrived at 5:35 and missed the early bird pricing by 5 minutes. Instead of paying $11. for a Grouper dinner it was $21. I almost always check a menu before going to a new restaurant, but not everyone thinks about these things.
AVAILABLE MONDAY – THURSDAY,
2:30 – 5:30 P.M.
ALL ENTRÉES ARE SERVED WITH CHOICE OF
SOUP OR HOUSE SALAD.
NO SUBSTITUTIONS.


GROUPER PICCATA Lightly breaded grouper placed on a bed of steamed white rice, accompanied by chef selected seasonal vegetables, topped with a light lemon butter sauce and fried capers. 10.9
This same dinner was $21 after 5:30.

jmonroe1

ab348 said:

Bad week for GM's Cruise self-driving unit. On Wednesday 9 top execs got fired. And today it was announced they will be eliminating 24% of their workforce.

————————————————
GM had enough problems building cars with a full workforce. I wouldn’t want to be buying a Cadillac now with a 1 chance out of 4 that it will be missing some parts.

jmonroe

explorerx4

@ab348,
You have to pay for that gigapress company somehow.

explorerx4

With so many good players opting out of football bowl games, I feel even worse for Florida State not being chosen for the playoff.

jmonroe1

explorerx4 said:

With so many good players opting out of football bowl games, I feel even worse for Florida State not being chosen for the playoff.

————————————————-
I’m sure you can understand it’s all about future paychecks. Bowl committees will have to get used to the adjustments they’re going to be making from now on. And you thought NIL was crazy…just watch what goes on now. As they say follow the money.

jmonroe

imidazol97

jmonroe1 said:

ab348 said:

Bad week for GM's Cruise self-driving unit. On Wednesday 9 top execs got fired. And today it was announced they will be eliminating 24% of their workforce.

————————————————
GM had enough problems building cars with a full workforce. I wouldn’t want to be buying a Cadillac now with a 1 chance out of 4 that it will be missing some parts.

jmonroe

Does that article mean 24% of the workforce for the self-driving vehicle group that were being used for the taxi fleet as a test--or 24% of all GM workers.

Here's why I've lost interest in defending GM: another premium, high-priced vehicle promised for a year in the future. Reminds me of vapourware that used to be touted in the computer software markets.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/ev-market-skepticism-cadillac-is-undeterred-as-it-unveils-its-new-vistiq-suv-140027852.html

dino001

driver100 said:

My point is that to fill up the gasser will take less than 5 minutes, and the car is back in action and the pump is free for the next car.
With an EV the car will be out of commission for an extra 30 to 45 minutes and it is taking up a fueling spot.
I imagine that in the rental car business downtime is lost revenue for the car rental company.

Agreed, but here's the thing - it's a choice for that a company can make:
1. Calculate proper all-inclusive rate (at least for a time being, when we all get used to EVs and the infrastructure is still not fully supportive) to include these supposed cost, while optimizing its operations to minimize these costs.
OR
3. Make it all customer's problem with small print on the contract, adding all these gotcha clauses, collect exorbitant fees at multiple of the real cost when customer inevitably slips.

In my experience vast majority of American corporations run by alumni of MBA programs, advised by McKinsey or other similar organizations, choose the latter and then brag to their investors about their ancillary fees are 10-15 percent of their revenue coming from 5 percent of their customers (the rest quickly figures it out, usually after one gotcha), but produce 50 percent of their profit and it's the smartest business model on Earth.

Of course most of their customers despise them, but they couldn't care less, cause 80 percent of these customers rent a car once a year or less and the rest get some frequent customer perks that make them forget about all that abuse, or even feel superior to these poor suckers that just got taken by a gotcha fee. I'm sure we all've been on either side of that wall.

stickguy

Plus as long as every rental company does it (or airline or whatever) you get stuck no matter what.

ab348

imidazol97 said:

Does that article mean 24% of the workforce for the self-driving vehicle group that were being used for the taxi fleet as a test--or 24% of all GM workers.

That 1300 or so being let go are from the Cruise self-driving unit.

mjfloyd1

Youngest has gotten into Belmont, Butler, DePauw, Miami of OH, and Clemson. Amount of merit scholarships varies widely and seems to be reflective of the amount of each school’s endowment so offers of 12k to 46k of merit academic scholarship per year. Only waiting on Vanderbilt to make final decision but Vandy seems on only give need based aid and it is a bargain at 89k/yr so that one is out unless some miracle occurs

roadburner

My son got into Belmont but on his second visit he watched some students playing with a frisbee and one of the kids was actually scared when he tried to catch it. That took Belmont off the table.

oldfarmer50

stickguy said:

a bit hyperbolic here IMO. but, I got time!

normally cars don't drive in and drive out. everyone I have ever gotten has been parked and cold. they also have to get processed/cleaned/whatever. are there times where a car comes it and they don't even turn it off or check anything? Could be. probably shouldn't, but has to be a pretty rare occurrence that someone has to wait an extra 20-30 minutes for their EV.

and 50 spots? you think they will convert the entire fleet to EVs? Even then they will not have 50 EVs all coming in fresh off the street at the same time, so they will not need that big a percentage of chargers. Plenty will come back in needing little to no charge, and it just needs to be part of the process to check the charge state and if below where it needs to be, put it on the charger for a short time then move it off to its spot. that is actually likely even easier, quicker, and less labor intensive than having to send Farmer from the airport garage, out of the airport and down the road to a station to fill up, then bring it back.

just put the chargers right at the check in booth, and the lot person can plug it in while they are doing everything else they do (like clean it and do computer work), and once charged just have Farmer go stick it in a regular spot.

and yes, if the rental companies want to rent out EVs absolutely they need to put in the infrastructure (Chargers) to support that. But it really is not that difficult.

Actually, at the relatively small Albany airport Farmer takes all cars down the road to be cleaned and gassed/charged. I think we have 4 chargers there plus one off of the towel dryer circuit. Airport rules don’t allow cleaning on site and certainly not gas pumps or charging stations in the garage. Some sort of liability thing.

Hertz is the one with the big EV fleet. Their cleaning facility is down the road next to ours which is where they would have to charge them. I have no idea of how many charging stations they have.

I was told each charger cost $50k. That needs a lot of rentals to amortize.

oldfarmer50

dino001 said:

driver100 said:

My point is that to fill up the gasser will take less than 5 minutes, and the car is back in action and the pump is free for the next car.
With an EV the car will be out of commission for an extra 30 to 45 minutes and it is taking up a fueling spot.
I imagine that in the rental car business downtime is lost revenue for the car rental company.

Agreed, but here's the thing - it's a choice for that a company can make:
1. Calculate proper all-inclusive rate (at least for a time being, when we all get used to EVs and the infrastructure is still not fully supportive) to include these supposed cost, while optimizing its operations to minimize these costs.
OR
3. Make it all customer's problem with small print on the contract, adding all these gotcha clauses, collect exorbitant fees at multiple of the real cost when customer inevitably slips.

In my experience vast majority of American corporations run by alumni of MBA programs, advised by McKinsey or other similar organizations, choose the latter and then brag to their investors about their ancillary fees are 10-15 percent of their revenue coming from 5 percent of their customers (the rest quickly figures it out, usually after one gotcha), but produce 50 percent of their profit and it's the smartest business model on Earth.

Of course most of their customers despise them, but they couldn't care less, cause 80 percent of these customers rent a car once a year or less and the rest get some frequent customer perks that make them forget about all that abuse, or even feel superior to these poor suckers that just got taken by a gotcha fee. I'm sure we all've been on either side of that wall.

Sounds like the auto dealer industry.