Max, I don't smoke the stuff and never did. I see you have the "Reefer Madness" sensation. The mirror does shake since day one. Could be that there isn't any liquid engine mounts in my Accord that causes this.
I maintain my Accord to the "T" especially the finish of the car. I use Zaino (3 step process) which I apply 4 times per year.
Lately, I have noticed an alarming amount of paint chips on my car. One is even is even starting to flake to the size of a quarter. I took the car to a "high end" collision shop and they indicated it was a Honda paint flaw problem. The service writer indicated that they have seen this problem numerous times from 1998 on. They suggested that I contact American Honda and provided me with a written explanation.
My 3 year 36K warranty is up in four months. What steps should I take at the dealership level to correct and resolve this problem. The last time I was at the dealership, the service writer told me it was normal wear and tear.
mikegold, Yup, maybe they forgot to add the liquid engine mounts in your Accord. Good thing my mirrors don't shake when the car is standing still. Hell, they barely shake when the music is turned up.
Why does Honda have such a short power train warranty at 3 years or 36,000 miles? Is it to save money and force the customer to pick up the cost of problems that occur after 3 years? Just read were Chrysler is making permanent its 7 year 70K power train warranty. Notice also that VW now has a 4 year 50K bumper to bumper warranty.
Paulo---take the car back to the dealership and talk to the service manager. Provide the documentation given you by the collision shop. You shouldn't have a problem.
My rear view mirror vibrates when bass hits but it usually doesn't do it. My concern is another vibration, which is caused by the engine. Before I got my EX V6 sedan, I drove a friend's TL and found it to be remarkably smooth and quiet. When I got in and started the car I had to look at the tach to see if it was running. My car, on the other hand, has this slow, pulsing vibration coming through the seat and then a high-frequency vibration coming through the steering wheel. The slow vibration doesn't bother me as much as the steering wheel vibration though I still feel that a car with electronically-controlled, liquid-filled engine mounts shouldn't have any pulsing vibrations. Strangely, when I bought the car it had a power steering fluid leak that I didn't notice until the fluid was almost gone. I took it to my dealer and one of the service guys said I was lucky that my power steering pump didn't burn out. I'm just hoping that the power steering pump wasn't damaged, causing the vibration that I feel at idle.
Sorry about the long post. What do you guys think? Is this vibration normal or do I have a problem on my hands? Thanks!
The mirror vibrates because it is loose! Go around with some screw drivers and tighten it down. Also, try putting some sponge foam into the spaces of the mirror holder to absorb da bad vibes.
Honda paint is their weak link. Every grain of sand (road salt, construction dust, etc.) that hits my '98 Accord Coupe tends to scratch the paint. In addition, the surface under most of the paint panels is white. Great contrast with my Emerald Green paint surface. I too am a Zaino user. Zaino is great but connot possible stop small rocks at 65mph. Better paint treatments such as used by Lexus use more (ie: thicker) layers of similiar water based paint formulations. Multiple layers seems to be the solution. I don't have the large chip problem, but that is probably due to the amount of time used to heat dry the paint at the factory. In other words, if you are seeing such large chips, the original paint was not dried correctly. Either the temperature lamps were too hot or not applied for a long enough period of time. That's a Honda problem and you should talk to one of their National Reps (rather than just your dealer).
Definitely a problem at Honda's end. The thin water based paint is the cause. Have Honda repaint the area in question as a "good will gesture". They use that term all the time at the dealership when their is a customer problem.
Did you read the article in Automotive News about 6 months ago regarding warranties? Seems like all the manufacturers want to reduce their warranty periods due to escelating costs, but nobody wants to be the first. We both know that longer warranties serve one of two purposes: 1- a sales tool to increase market share. 2- an excuse for the build quality of the product (do Hyundai or VW come to mind?)
I feel that Honda's 3yr/36K warranty is just fine. The past 2 cars that I purchased, I wouldn't have bought with a 3yr/36K bumper to bumper and 3yr/36K powertrain warranty. My first car was a Mitsubishi and for me to buy it, just a 3yr./36K warranty wouldn't have been enough. But with a Honda, 3yr/36K warranty is OK with me, since I have more faith in the product that Honda puts out.
Honestly, a longer warranty would be a added selling feature on a Honda, but I don't think HOnda products sell less because they have a 3/36 vs. Toyota, which has a 5/60 powertrain warranty.
Dodge now has the 7yr 100k powertrain warranty to rebuild confidence in their products, even though it may be false confidence. I had a 97 Dodge truck (never again) and even though it was still under warranty, the 15th time to the dealer for warranty repair was the end for me. The warranty does not determine how many times you will have to take a trip to the dealer, not matter how good the warranty is. It was free for me but after awhile it wasn't worth my time for them to have my truck for a week at a time or more. I have had my Honda for over a year now with 20k and it has yet to have warranty repair. I would never base the quality of a product based on the warranty. The ones that have the longest warranties are the ones that need it.
VW had a substandard 2/24 year warranty for a long time; they only this year changed it to a 4 year/50K mile warranty. (While dropping the 10/100K powertrain warranty.) Even with the 4 year warranty, I wouldn't buy one due to reliability concerns. Once burned as badly as they burned me, they don't get another chance.
I bought an Accord 2 years ago, even without the longer powertrain warranty that Toyota offers; I was reasonably certain I wouldn't need it. With a Chrysler/VW (and GM/Ford), you will likely need the long warranty.
I don't understand. If Honda cars are so great that they rarely need warranty repairs, why not just bump up the length of the warranty? The cost will be nominal to Honda since the cars hardly ever break down and customers will be happier. Seems like a win-win situation to me.
They don't increase the warranty because they will incur greater warranty expenses and will have to estimate and show those cost on their financials. Also Honda has a loyal customer base and a high perceived reliability. Most people who buy Hondas will not switch to a Dodge because of a better warranty.
Honda salesman tend to sell extended warranties to offer you trouble free protection. In addition, they make a nice commission on the sale of an extended warranty---right isellhondas? Honda is betting that you never use it.
I have noticed that on my new coupe, the drivers side doors seems to stick a bit when I open it. When I open the door with the handle, I have to give an extra slight pull to open it. I think it may just be the the rubber molding sticking together, and may need some lubricant. However the passenger side door opens without the sticking. Anyone notice this on their car? The first oil change I will bring it to the dealer to attempt to fix. Maybe it is just slightly off alignment?
Stopped by a Dodge display at the Milwaukee Bastille Day do yesterday and the first thing out of the sales reps mouth was their warranty. I specifially asked why should I buy the Dodge versus the Oddy. $3K he said and a better warranty. He was a nice kid so I didn't skewer him but that is DC's line. Wonder when they will get around to making a dependable vehicle.
Don't post too often just read everyones interesting posts {most of the time}, but I would like to get my two cents in when it comes to the extended warranty Honda offers. Its really skewered toward Honda.I did not purchase the warranty when I bought the car because I assumed the normal 3 yr 36000 mile coverage was enough. My 3 yrs on my 2000 V6 will be up in June {wife does'nt put much milage on it} and I recieved an offer to purchase the extended warranty. After reading the brochure it states that the warranty goes into effect the day I purchased the car.That means on a 7yr extended warranty I only have four years left and I still have to pay the entire amount for the contract.Is that fair? They should pro rate it or give their customers a fair deal and start from the day you purchase the warranty. Especially when most of the warranties are never used. Pass that on to some of the bigwigs from Honda when you have your meetings tell them its from an irate accord and crv customer, as if it will do any good.
With exception of the luxury brands like Mercedes and Lexus every extended warranty I've heard of out there that is from a manufacturer like HondaCare is starts the day the regular warranty ends and runs for 2-4 years. That's why it's called an extended warranty since it extends the regular warranty out to 7 years/100000 miles. If it were 7 years added on it would be called an additional warranty. Honda really is no different here than anyone else wrt extended warranties.
I am fully aware of how the warranties work, apparantly you did not get my gripe about hondacare maybe other car companies are also like honda but I don't like the fact that the warranty goes into effect the day the car was put into service not when my original warranty expires. To put it another way Honda expects you to purchase the extended warranty at the time of purchase in this way you are paying extra for a warranty that is already included for 3yrs or 36000 miles. and after the original warranty is over you are left with the balance of the warranty you contracted for.Do your math and you will see why I am teed off. Deduct 3yrs or 36000 miles from the contract you purchase and you will notice how expensive it can be. They are penalizing customers who want to purchase further protection at the end of the normal warranty. You mentioned additional warranties maybe Honda should consider offerring this type of warranty. It makes more sense to me.
You can consider it an additional warranty of 4 years. If anything, you should be *penalized* for buying the warranty at 3yrs/36k because you had 3yrs/36k more time/miles than me (if I buy mine at the time of sale) to think about it. You get the same product as the person who buys it at the time of sale, do you not? I can't see that they would value your warranty at 4/7's of its purchase value when you buy it at 3yrs, but they don't when you buy it at the time of sale. Is that what you are saying?
HondaCare warranties cost something like $1000 or so for a $0 deduct 7yr/100k miles - less than $300 per year for the 4 extra years. This also upgrades the warranty to include roadside assistance, trip interruption service, rental reimbursement and more. You may not ever need it, but I don't think it's such a bad deal. Chrysler's much touted powertrain pledge is $100 deductible per visit.
good luck trying to get a paint job from them. unless you've only recently bought the car new, have been bugging dealership people about it since the first month or so, have been documenting the problems and how the dealership, local customer service, and local reps act, and are prepared to go to your local better business bureau you won't get jack from honda. took me almost 2 years to get my car repainted and they only did the front end and roof. and i had to go thru all that b.s.
Generally I have found it easier to deal with small town honda dealers-used to live in Mpls and had some real live crooks in the sales dept but one of them had a great bunch of service guys-when I ran into trouble doing my own repairs-would ask them and they would tell me what to do.
Interesting to look at CR's dealer satisfaction question-Toyota and Honda ranked at the very bottom of the list-lots of demand so they don't have to take care of their customers.
I hired an attorney that specializes in product defects. He has represented over 40 Honda customers since 1998 regarding paint defects. He has won 31 of 40 cases to the customers satisfication. 9 cases ended in a customer/Honda split on repainting.He also indicated that the New York State Attorney General's office has numerous complaints against Honda and paint defects.I go to court on September 17th.
Maybe I missed your comments on it, but what do you have to say for all these paint problems?
*Can anyone tell me if Honda may have corrected these paint problems with the 2002 models? I really want the 02 V6 Coupe and I don't want any transmission problems, is this still happening?????
I just read where Toyota is going to the water based stuff. Wonder if this means Toyota doesn't care if it holds up or if they have statistical facts showing this type paint is just as good as solvent based. Considering their reputation, I would choose the latter.
What do you mean by transmission problems? There was a case where Honda had a bad batch. That was for year 2000. If you're talking about poor shift quality the last V6 I drove (a 99 model) was not that great but you would have to see if you like it yourself. I had only driven V6 GM automatics which are very smooth shifting. As for have transmission problems, nobody wants them it just happens :-)
I didn't want my windshield to be installed incorrectly but it was :-(
Well...I read about paint chips in these forums and really don't have much of an opinion.
I see lots of cars in my line of work and I see a lot of paint chips. My own black 99 EX V-6 coupe has a fair number of them. I don't lose sleep over this.
I've heard some "experts" here say thae Japan built cars have better paint and don't chip as badly? Well, I've seen plenty of "J" cars with paint chips.
Water base make a difference? I have no idea. I do know that our enviromental laws require certain kind of paint to be used.
Personally, I think that a flying rock hitting a car can and will chip paint no matter what the make of car is or the brand of paint.
Toyota has been producing vehicles over in the US for quite some time now. And based upon this recent announcement,apparently have not been using water based paint.
good for you, man.. if i'd had the resources to hire a lawyer, then i might have done that, but the BBB worked for me. it's interesting for me to see that he's represented 40 people so far in paint issue cases, especially since east coast AND corporate honda touted to me that they'd never had complaints about their paint before. very interesting.
anyway, good luck to you.
p.s. just as an aside to water-based vs. oil-based paint... my parents have an '88 accord that was most likely done with oil-based, and though the paint is cracking from age, it cleans up beautifully when waxed so that you can't even tell... and there are only a few visible stone chips. take that for what it's worth.
i think it's great that car companies are trying to protect the environment by switching (and prolly lowering their costs), but then they owe it to us, the consumer, to keep working on the paint methods and quality to be more comparable and reliable to what was being used before.
If the U.S. has a law that forces Honda to use water based paints doesn't it mean that all brand names have to? I had a CRX quite a few years back and it was a great car, but I noticed that the paint did seem to chip off easier than any vehicle I had ever had. Unlike you, I have not noticed that other cars chip so easily. I guess it is just something I have to get over in order to get the reliability of a Honda. I wish there was something that could be done about the front hood chipping besides a bra.
This has been debated over and over. Water based vs Oil based paint. If I had my choice, it would be oil based paint. Noticed that Lexus has a very nice finish on its cars. Since most are made in Japan, I can bet they use an oil based paint.
I remember some cars back in the 1970s where you could drive down a gravel road behind another car at 40 mph and never get a stone chip on the paint. The paint was durable and surmise that it was oil based paint over a heavy primer coat.
Yet cars from the 1970's also had dull finish's and the paint faded within a couple of years.
My 2K Accord silver, very few chips. What isellhonda says is partially true. Keep your distance from other cars, and don't follow trucks, dumptrucks, etc. and you get less chips. I do that all the time, that is why I have very few chips on the front bumper and hood, after 30K miles.
I noticed a big difference regarding the paint of my previous Honda Accord and my new Solara. Honda paint tends to chip a lot easier as compared to Toyota's paint. The first week that I owned my Accord, I noticed numerous paint chips on the front bumper and hood.
I drive the same roads and in the same traffic each day and I do not have one paint chip on my Solara!
I was reading that Honda was smart enough to keep the wishbone suspension on the new 2003 Accord. It would have been a terrible mistake if it had gone the "Civic" route.
My 02 Accord V-6 seems to have a slight hesitation when downshifting. It happens under both gentle and aggressive driving. The engine doesn't race momentarily but there is enough delay to feel your body moving forward before the power of the lower gear kicks in. Anyone sense the same thing in their car?
Isn't this the problem that was only seen in some models of the V-6 back in 1998? It seems that I keep reading here it is all years from 1998 on! It doesn't sound as if Honda ever got the kinks out of the V-6 transmission.
Comments
Lately, I have noticed an alarming amount of paint chips on my car. One is even is even starting to flake to the size of a quarter. I took the car to a "high end" collision shop and they indicated it was a Honda paint flaw problem. The service writer indicated that they have seen this problem numerous times from 1998 on. They suggested that I contact American Honda and provided me with a written explanation.
My 3 year 36K warranty is up in four months. What steps should I take at the dealership level to correct and resolve this problem. The last time I was at the dealership, the service writer told me it was normal wear and tear.
Paulo---take the car back to the dealership and talk to the service manager. Provide the documentation given you by the collision shop. You shouldn't have a problem.
Sorry about the long post. What do you guys think? Is this vibration normal or do I have a problem on my hands? Thanks!
Honda paint is their weak link. Every grain of sand (road salt, construction dust, etc.) that hits my '98 Accord Coupe tends to scratch the paint. In addition, the surface under most of the paint panels is white. Great contrast with my Emerald Green paint surface. I too am a Zaino user. Zaino is great but connot possible stop small rocks at 65mph. Better paint treatments such as used by Lexus use more (ie: thicker) layers of similiar water based paint formulations. Multiple layers seems to be the solution. I don't have the large chip problem, but that is probably due to the amount of time used to heat dry the paint at the factory. In other words, if you are seeing such large chips, the original paint was not dried correctly. Either the temperature lamps were too hot or not applied for a long enough period of time. That's a Honda problem and you should talk to one of their National Reps (rather than just your dealer).
You are absolutely right regarding Honda's water based paint. It will show every nick no matter what hits the car.
Honda feels that they have a great, proven product and that the current 3/36 warranty is more than sufficent.
And, of course, an extended warranty is available for those who are nervous.
And, there are costs applied by the car makers who have longer warranties. We pay for these warranties in the price of the cars.
Still...my personal opinion as a salesperson, is that Honda should consider a longer warranty even if they have to raise the prices of the cars a bit.
There are some folks who measure the quality of a product by the length of the warranty.
And there are "warranty freaks". To these people all they care about is the warranty.
But...that's just my opinion. Honda has yet to invite me to a brainstorming session with their marketing folks!
Honestly, a longer warranty would be a added selling feature on a Honda, but I don't think HOnda products sell less because they have a 3/36 vs. Toyota, which has a 5/60 powertrain warranty.
On
Day
Guarantee
Expires = DODGE
Sorry...couldn't resist!
Still...to some people, just a few....the length of the warranty can make or break a sale.
VW had to do the same thing Chrysler is doing now a few years back in a desperate attempt to try to restore confidence in a troublesome product.
I bought an Accord 2 years ago, even without the longer powertrain warranty that Toyota offers; I was reasonably certain I wouldn't need it. With a Chrysler/VW (and GM/Ford), you will likely need the long warranty.
Honda is betting that you never use it.
the average customer is insignificant to them.
Interesting to look at CR's dealer satisfaction question-Toyota and Honda ranked at the very bottom of the list-lots of demand so they don't have to take care of their customers.
*Can anyone tell me if Honda may have corrected these paint problems with the 2002 models? I really want the 02 V6 Coupe and I don't want any transmission problems, is this still happening?????
I didn't want my windshield to be installed incorrectly but it was :-(
I see lots of cars in my line of work and I see a lot of paint chips. My own black 99 EX V-6 coupe has a fair number of them. I don't lose sleep over this.
I've heard some "experts" here say thae Japan built cars have better paint and don't chip as badly? Well, I've seen plenty of "J" cars with paint chips.
Water base make a difference? I have no idea. I do know that our enviromental laws require certain kind of paint to be used.
Personally, I think that a flying rock hitting a car can and will chip paint no matter what the make of car is or the brand of paint.
You name the brand, I've seen paint chips!
anyway, good luck to you.
p.s. just as an aside to water-based vs. oil-based paint... my parents have an '88 accord that was most likely done with oil-based, and though the paint is cracking from age, it cleans up beautifully when waxed so that you can't even tell... and there are only a few visible stone chips. take that for what it's worth.
i think it's great that car companies are trying to protect the environment by switching (and prolly lowering their costs), but then they owe it to us, the consumer, to keep working on the paint methods and quality to be more comparable and reliable to what was being used before.
just my .02...
People who drive at high speeds and tailgate are far more prone to get chips than others.
But those folks probably don't want to hear this...:)
My 2K Accord silver, very few chips. What isellhonda says is partially true. Keep your distance from other cars, and don't follow trucks, dumptrucks, etc. and you get less chips. I do that all the time, that is why I have very few chips on the front bumper and hood, after 30K miles.
I drive the same roads and in the same traffic each day and I do not have one paint chip on my Solara!