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Honda CR-V vs Saturn VUE
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Sorry about the poor picture quallity. We've been after this particular owner to get a decent digicam.
Here's the 5 speed model's gearing for both current and old:
Gear: new/old
1st: 3.533/3.500
2nd: 1.880/1.956
3rd: 1.212/1.344
4th: .0921/1.071
5th: .0738/.812
Reverse: 3.583/3.461
The two models in automatic trim:
1st: 2.684/2.722
2nd: 1.535/1.516
3rd: 0.974/1.079
4th: 0.638/0.711
Reverse: 2.000/1.955
My '99 is a five speed and, yes, you use 1st to get started, then shift almost immediately. I can start it in 2nd without too much difficulty, but it takes a few tries before you get accustomed to doing it. It's still easier to deal with the quick shift.
FWIW, the old AWD Civic wagon had a creeper 1st gear to use when slogging through the sticky stuff. It would be a nice addition to the CR-V.
...Demand is so high for Honda CR-Vs at Frank Ursomarso's Union Park Automotive Group dealerships in Wilmington, Delaware, that he said he sold the demonstration model his wife had been driving this week.
"The success of Honda right now is beyond comprehension," said Ursomarso, who has sold Hondas since 1975 as well as Fords and other auto brands. "We sell out of them as soon as we get them." ....
Honda has it's own crash facility where they have tested products in the past. So far their predictions have been accurate, but it aint written in stone. Honda predicts:
5-Star NCAP frontal impact rating for driver and passenger.
5-star SINCAP side impact rating for driver and passenger.
"Good" IIHS rating for front offset impact.
Rear Impact: Exceed all government requirements.
Rollover: Exceed all government requirements.
Flat and angled barrier: Exceed all government requirements.
I just can't resist. Honda has no financing deals on the CR-V and they have less than a 10 days supply of inventory. Even without deals I got 5.75% from AHFC, not bad but I think I will do a home equity and pay the car note off early.
I agree that financing incentives will not help sell the VUE. You have to remember the VUE is an all new model, never before offered. While the CRV is a new model of an already existing vehicle that previously sold well. Whenever a model is refreshed like the CRV, sales typically increase. Look at the Liberty, new Dodge Ram, Chevy Trailblazer, Ford Explorer, and too many others to list. Saturn's VUE will have to gain market share of it's own. I personally think that sales of close to 4000 units in conceivably it's second month are pretty darn good. I think that monthly sales of 5000 will be easily reached by Saturn by the end of this year. Granted those aren't huge numbers, but considering all the competitors in this market it's not bad.
Honda rules!
No car rules. They all have problems. I'm an equal opportunity (to use your word) basher. No different than many here or there or wherever. I will say that (IMO) the Saturn loyalists seem pretty grounded to reality unlike some I run across. People do like their Saturns. A woman I work with had one totalled (I forgot to ask her how the panels held up-obviously it was a bad accident) and she went right out and bought another.
Saturn rules (at least this week).
It can be done though. The Hyundai Santa Fe is carving out quite a niche for itself. They are selling roughly half as many units as the Escape, but they have 1/5th the number of dealerships. I think their sales just about tie those of the Toyota Rav4. It took a little while for Hyundai to build that kind of presence in the market. It's possible that the VUE could do the same.
GM has a put which Fiat can exercise and force GM to buy all of its shares in, I believe two years. GM no longer wants to buy all of Fiats shares (it currently owns 50% of Fiat). In order to assist Fiat turn things around, GM has opted to use the next generation Fiat small car platform in Europe.
The Automobile article is very poorly researched, however. I have read in other sources that the Delta platform will be used in South America and in India, Thailand, and GM's Japanese partners (which by the way, use rhd).
I do not think, as Automobile suggests, the center mount guages in the Ion were designed to facilitate rhd/lhd conversions. The Ion was never itended to sell in Europe. I also note that when people criticize the Ion's center mount, they always bring up the Echo but conveniently foget about the Mini Cooper, which also has center mount, and is considered the hot niche car of the year.
Finally, what on Earth could any of GM's global business plans mean to the Saturn VUE, except maybe a cheap shot?
logic1 : Lots of cheap shots around this thread. Not sure why. Center stack is cool on the Mini but a stupid idea for Saturn. Too funny.
varmit : I think the VUE will carve out a decent market share, probably a 3rd or 4th best seller eventually. It will never top Escape and CR-V but that's ok.
logic1: I believe the article I read was from the Chicago Tribune (don't get Automobile mag). It may have been a version of that article. Was just trying to make conversation, wasn't really trying to get a cheap shot in as someone implied. I have to wonder if people don't have a chip on their shoulder to be so sensitive.
As I said I am an equal opportunity basher, go see my comments about the Honda Element.
"I'm an equal opportunity basher" - Not here you aren't, you strictly bash Saturn
I had a problem with my '02 CR-V. The CEL came on after ~1600 miles. Doing some research I found that it was related to a computer glitch. The dealer pulled a code that would normally have told them to replace the O2 sensor, but Honda told them not to replace it, just reset the CEL. Honda is working on a modification to the computer that will be available in May. Was I happy that I had a problem one month into ownership? No way. But as I have said here, ad nauseum, all vehicles have problems.
Whatever.
Back to the VUE and CRV.
I think we will be getting an Alero at the end of the month as we are getting $1000 CR to buy one. Has the same Ecotec engine and we can probably get by with out an SUV for another 3 years. That said, we will likely get a CVT VUE in 3 years if nothing better comes along as we should have 2 kidlets by then.
Geez, hope the crust stays dry.
It's not worth the effort or time and it's not fun to discuss opinions with a cement wall.
If you want to read what owners are saying about their Vues, go to the Vue board.
Since the one Vue owner only wants to talk about the Vue in it's own forum I guess the CR-V vs. Vue debate is over. Maybe it can be started again once the Vue has comparable models available (AWD AT 4 cyl., etc.)
I have been more than gracious in this thread, yet my head gets bitten off. Enough of that.
You should move somewhere else where you can complain when people tell the truth, debunk other people's blatantly false statements, etc.
And for anyone who cares (apparently no one is interested in talking about the CR-V vs. the Vue), the CR-V costs less than the Vue. Look it up for yourself.
Can't compare identical packages (as they don't exist) so you can't say one is cheaper than the other. Unfortunately you don't understand that.
Let's say Honda's are cheaper , better and you win.
The prices are close; you can option them up or down. Who gives a flying fig about which is cheaper in what configuration?
Maynard is right. There's plenty left to talk about with these two fine models without getting into a fire fight over every little thing. Let's do it.
Where would you like to begin?
Onelucky7 - Any good stories/experiences with your VUE? Maybe a rousing tale of off-road bravado will find us a topic to discuss. How about the largest item you've fit into your VUE. The longest trip? The worst weather? The folks on the Forester board were just talking about the stinkiest thing they've left in their Soobs (hey, it was entertaining).
I don't have much to add other than that (what, no flame bait?)
Oh, never mind. Inside joke
I went to the new owners workshop this evening. It was very informative.
I think one of the most unique and nifty features that I have found useful for putting long items like rakes or boards in the Vue, is that front folding flat seat.
I also want to relay a quick story of a recent experience with Saturn . . . I got a phone call yesterday from Spring Hill. The lady on the other end told me they had received the letter I sent (After I bought my Saturn, I had such a good experience, that I sent a letter to the President in Spring Hill). She told me that they were pleased that I had such a wonderful experience and they wanted me to know that they would share my compliments with the local dealership and the salesman would receive a "pat on the back" type of award. We had a very pleasant conversation. An I have actually sent two letters to Spring Hill, the first one talking about my great experience buying the Vue (That's the one she called about)and the second making suggestions for later Vue models (or telling them my likes and dislikes). In both instances, they have sent me an extensive response via email from a live person rather than a form letter. And the first one, they called me about.
One thing that no other company can beat is the way that Saturn goes above and beyond to please it's customers. These examples above were no exception. And I could give a few more if you need them.
A generalization to say the least.
I'm very happy with my dealer. Good service isn't exclusive to Saturn. But with Saturn you pay for it.
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Steve
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