Volvo XC90 SUV

pm96

I'm beginning to look around at new cars and I love the XC90, it's just bigger than what I need. I've hear rumors of a compact SUV (possibly called the XC50) coming as soon as next year. I was just wondering if anyone else has heard anything.

webpj

Yes, there is an XC50 in the works, smaller version of the XC90, rumors have it we will see it in 2004.

volvomax

Not a done deal yet.
Prob not till 2005

arun07

Hi,

I ordered a T6 in in by early August and it arrived yesterday at the dealer. I am planning to pick it up soon.

I see that volvo has increased the base price and I was asked to pay the new MSRP. I think the total increase is by a few hundred dollars.

Previously I saw some postings here which said if order was placed before Aug 26 then volvo honors the old prices.

Recently has anybody gone thru a similar experience?

Thanks
Anand

webpj

This is true, however, the dealer was suppose to provide you with a lock form before 9/1/2003. Ask why he did not. It is unscrupulous for him not to have locked your price when he had the chance to do so. I would make a huge stink and call Volvo NA! After all your already paying MSRP, its not like your getting a deal!

My thoughts & opinion

arun07

Thanks webpi for your response. I am going to be asking the dealer to honor the old price. If they refuse, I am going to call up volvo.

I will post my experience once I am done with the process.

Anand

triceratops5

I picked up my xc90 yesterday. We "ordered" about a month ago -- didn't really order, but agreed to take a vehicle in their delivery pipeline. Agreement was at MSRP. The sticker on the car reflected the new, higher MSRP (about $900), but I paid the lower, old price. Volvo Corp protected dealers that had signed customer contracts in hand (i.e., Volvo Corp ate the price increase on those vehicles). A couple weeks back I was asked to come in and actually sign my agreement so we could lock in the lower price. At delivery, I had to sign a document that goes back to Volvo Corp that indicated that I had actually received the lower price (evidence for Volvo Corp that the dealer didn't just pocket the difference).

triceratops5

New price looks like it was just under $700 more, not $900

arun07

Thanks triceratops5 and webpi and the previous poster who posted sometime back for the info about price increase. It really helped.

This forum is great in exchanging views on problems with car , also the good things, which helps new buyers.

The dealer agreed to honor the old price, but not before I got little upset.

I am picking up the car tomorrow, quite excited. will post how things go in couple of weeks.

Anand

webpj

~1% $350 - $500 depending on equipment, the $700-900 is too high

roofman

We picked up our XC90 Wednesday, I noticed the price increase on our paper work, the salesman indicated that they made up the difference of the price increase on our trade in, I really didn't believe him, but I felt a little trapped with our trade in. We have an order sheet from when we initiated the order which indicates the older price. This doesn't set well with me, I think it's about $500, but the point is we are already paying full price. I don't know if I have any recourse at this point or if I just got caught in the moment of picking up the new vehicle.

1sttimevolvo1

We ordered our XC90 in February and were expecting an 03'. We were told in late March-early April that it would be an 04' AND that the 04' price increase would be $500 or $600 dollars (can't remember which one - have to check my records). Our sales rep was aware of this as early as April. My comment is this: It seems the dealership would have already had the price increase taken care of, since people were ordering 04' models. Those of you having the problem ordered (I assume from the delivery dates) after we ordered ours (it arrived July 3, 2003). So if our dealer knew about it in April, then your dealer should have known it by then as well. I would want to make sure that they weren't double-dipping - writing up your p.o. with the already increased price on it, then telling you the price is going up and adding that to the already marked-up price. Of course, I don't know all of the facts of your individual purchases and am making assumptions about order dates and the like. Based on my experience with my sales rep, whom I was very pleased with, it sounds odd.

1sttimevolvo1

I don't peruse all the boards, I just wasn't aware that there was more than one price increase. That clears it up - knowing there was more than one increase.

triceratops5

9/1 price increase was definitely more than $300 to $500 on my vehicle. Old MSRP (my deal) was 41,790 for 2.5TAWD /Premium/Versatility/Climate/Metallic/Leather Shift Knob. New MSRP (sticker on window) was 42,625. So increase was actually $835. (Yes, if you're keeping track, both previous numbers that I posted -- $700 and $900 were incorrect). Perhaps the increase varied significantly by model.

uscpsycho

I'm about to pull the trigger on an XC90, 2.5T, AWD - like today! I have some questions that I'd like input on from the 'experts' here.

Two important concerns are economy and safety. Logic tells me that RSC and DTSC will be more effective in AWD. Is that the case? I'm not worried about off-road traction or poor weather drivability (I live in L.A.). If the safety features are as effective in FWD, then that is what I'll get. If AWD is safer under normal driving conditions I will get that. PLEASE ADVISE!

FM reception: Has this been addressed for '04 or is it still poor?

Security package + aftermarket tint: Since the radio antenna is in the windows, does tinting the security windows adversely affect the already weak FM reception?

Turbo cooldown: I've had two turbo-charged cars before, both required a cooldown period before you turned the ignition off. Is that also the case with the XC90?

Dolby stereo: Is there that much of a difference between the 8 speaker stereo and the 12 speaker Dolby stereo? I gave both a brief listen and did not hear much difference. Is the premium package worth the extra money? Seems to me both can use a subwoofer.

Speaking of subwoofers... If I have the 5-seater, can I easily have a subwoofer installed in the same place the factory subwoofer would be installed? Is an additional amp recommended, or can the built in stereo handle the sub?

Thank you!

uscpsycho

Yes, you read that right. XC90 v Cadillac Escalade.

I've read comparisons of the XC90 to LOTS of other cars. But right now Cadillac dealers are blowing out their '03 Escalades for the price of a well-equiped XC90.

I have my own reasons for preferring the XC90 (economy, crash compatibility and roll-over risk). But I'm curious to hear how you folks would weigh in on this. It's awfully tempting to throw logic aside and get the Escalade for over $10K off MSRP. Psychologically, it feels like you're getting so much more car for the same price. But my conscience seems to be screaming XC90! louder than my ego is screaming ESCALADE!

1sttimevolvo1

Regarding the RSC and DTSC, I don't know if those are offered as well with FWD, assuming they are offered, I think they would be beneficial, but I think it would be even more beneficial in AWD, since the RSC and DTSC is working to control 4 wheels instead of 2.

Regards to the FM reception: We have the Dolby surround premium sound package with the subwoofer.
The weaker FM stations weakness is pronounced in surround mode, which is generally true with most stereos I`ve owned that had surround or `stereo wide' capabilities. I don't know if this is true in the base stereo offered. This is only what I've noticed with the Dolby.

Regards to the turbo cooldown: Volvo recommends idling the engine for a minute or two for turbo cooldown IF you have just finished a particularly hard drive with high rpms. Normal driving (from what I recall of the owner's manual) is not a problem.

Dolby Stereo: We test drove two different models - one with the premium sound and one without. The Dolby surround to me had a fuller, richer sound quality (I might add neither tester was equipped with a subwwofer). It helps to take along some of your favorite cd's and test it that way vs. just the radio. In addition to the premium sound package, we purchased the subwoofer and it makes a big difference in the depth. Trucks and SUV's aren't known for their ability to provide bass depth, even with a good sound system. So many of my friends who have had SUV's nearly always bought an after-market subwoofer.

The subwoofer is not just one speaker, but a series of 4 speakers that are positioned in the side panels, I believe. When we prchased ours, they showed us the diagram for the subwoofer system. I expected one speaker in the floor, but that's not the case.
Volvomax, who regularly posts on this site, may be able to provide info regarding the subwoofer amp question.

Hope this helps and good luck on your decision!

uscpsycho

Is the "Dolby Surround" just a fancy name for DSP (digital signal processing)?

I mean, for true Dolby listening, don't you need dolby encoding on the source? How can you get Dolby Surround from FM or a CD if it wasn't encoded for Dolby Surround?

This is rather deceptive; if the premium sound package uses DSP then it is not Dolby surround. If it is true Dolby Surround, the sound quality is actually degraded if the source is not recorded with a Dolby Surround decoder in mind.

1sttimevolvo1

Dolby provides `Dolby Pro Logic II` to several auto manufacturers.

The following site provides info regarding your Dolby question. Whether the sound is `degraded' or not , I don't know. I just know that there was a difference in quality with the Dolby surround on vs. turned off. Again, I listen to cd's 90% of the time.

http://www.dolby.com/ht/co.br.0107.PLIIListenersGuide.htmlv

uscpsycho

Is the Dolby sound system compatible with Navigation? The Dolby center channel speaker seems to occupy the same spot on the dashboard as the navigation screen. Can you get them both or do you have to settle for one?

Also, can anyone please comment on how tinting the windows on a car equipped with the security package might affect FM reception?

Thanks!

rollie

The navigation and Dolby Prologic Surround options are compatible on all Volvos. The nav display and Dolby center channel share a housing (and when the nav speaks it uses the driver's corner speakers and a smaller non-Dolby speaker in the center channel housing as I recall - I'll have to check our cars to reconfirm.)

Thanks.

-rollie
rdollie@att.net

khanhvn

RSC and DTSC work by controling the 4 brakes, so they should work the same for both AWD and FWD. In emergency situations, you usually decelerate, not accelerate, so RSC and DTSC in FWD should work equally well. AWD may help in such situation like when you want to accelerate to pass another car in wet road condition.

My FWD XC90 (I live in CA too) does have RSC and DTSC. It also has a button to de/activate DTSC.

volvomax

RSC and DSTC have nothing to do with the drive system, so they function equally as well in FWD and AWD.

FM reception, make sure the tint you use has a minimum of metal content!

Turbo cool down, only really applies to highway driving for an extened period of time, or racing!

The Dolby is a true Pro logic II system. The is an encoder.
In fact, Volvo recommends NOT using the Dolby setting on your stereo if your reception is poor.

The sub is a self contained unit, so I don't know about a separate amp. The Audiomax system does have a separate amp though.
We haven't tried to dealer install the sub, but I don't see whay you couldn't if you have a 5 seater.
You will need a Vadis software download for the stereo though.
Good Luck!

As for the Escalade, its a re-badged Tahoe, to me it symbolizes all the excess of the SUV market.
Yes you can get on for the price of the XC90, but the XC90 will be more economical and have much better resale.
Remember, once a bargain ALWAYS a bargain.

1sttimevolvo1

Thanks for the catch on the RSC and the DSTC. I made assumptions (wrong) based on four wheel control.

Volvomax, did Volvo make a change on the XC90 with regards to the subwoofer? When ours arrived the salesrep had not expected the subwoofer configuration that it was equipped with. I believe he was expecting a centrally-located (one speaker) subwoofer in the rear. Was there a change from the 03' to 04' model?

bigeddy

uscpsycho: "Two important concerns are economy and safety... I'm not worried about off-road traction or poor weather drivability (I live in L.A.). If the safety features are as effective in FWD, then that is what I'll get. If AWD is safer under normal driving conditions I will get that. PLEASE ADVISE!"

Based on what you've said, FWD is the obvious choice. It's lighter, cheaper and less to go wrong. That translates into better handling, fuel economy and cost. That said, I prefer AWD for the bad weather and bad roads where I live.

The many audio questions are hard to answer. Sound quality is so subjective. The premium system sounds better to me and FM reception seems on a par with other cars I've owned.

The nav system is a whole other topic. It works well but the DVD drive is in a poor location. You would need to use it a lot to justify the cost.

1sttimevolvo1

For less than the cost of the Nav system you should be able to outfit a palm pc with similar software.

uscpsycho

If you go to http://www.xc90.com/benefits/safety.shtml and click on "advanced traction control" it appears that the ability to regulate power between front/rear tires is a key feature of DSTC.

How can the vehicle control systems work as effectively on FWD as AWD? If you have a situation where the front wheels are losing traction, wouldn't an AWD model apply power to the rear wheels while reducing power to the front?

Whereas in this situation, a FWD model would be powerless to correct the situation until the front wheels were able to regain traction.

Am I missing something?

khanhvn

From what I understand, DSTC has 2 parts: (1) Stability Control and (2) Traction Control.

(1) is to keep the car in the intended path. It involves controlling the brakes so it works equally well in both FWD and AWD. It's a great safety feature and can reduce crashes by up to 35%:

http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2003-08-06-rollover_x.htm

The web site also has a good explanation about how stability control works (click on "interactive graphic on the top right)

(2) is about maintaining maximum traction and involves both the brakes and the power train. It helps when you want to speed up in slippery conditions and is more about performance than safety. In this case AWD is definitely better than FWD.

In short, if you just need the safety aspect of DSTC, FWD should be enough. If you want performance on slippery road/off-road, get AWD.

uscpsycho

Khanhvn - You've answered my question, but I draw a completely different conclusion than you do.

You say: It helps when you WANT to speed up in slippery conditions and is more about performance than safety... If you want performance on slippery road/off-road, get AWD.

I say, in an emergency situation, you may very well NEED to speed up in slippery conditions. It's not hard to think of an emergency situation that would require acceleration instead of braking. Therefore, it seems to me that AWD is the safer option. Better performance is icing on the cake.

A previous poster said that FWD offered better performance and better gas mileage. Seems to me that performance is better with AWD and according to Volvo's website, gas mileage is the same on both AWD and FWD versions of the 5 cylinder.

I feel like I've finally got a handle on this. Any differing opinions?

khanhvn

Yes, with AWD you can accelerate faster in slippery conds, so it may help in certain emergency conditions. But following the same line, a bigger engine may be even a better safety feature because it helps accelerate in general conditions, not just slippery

uscpsycho

I don't mean to beat a dead horse. But if you have to make an emergency manuver in FWD and lose traction in front, you may spin or go sideways.

With AWD at least you have a chance of maintaining some control in the back wheels, right? I've never driven anything but RWD cars, so perhaps I'm over-estimating the ability of AWD.

With respect to the bigger engine, I would agree that in some cases a bigger engine is safer, but I don't think there's enough difference between the XC90 5 and 6 cylinder engines to make one more safer than the other in a split-second emergency situation. After all, 0-60 there's only a .5 second difference, so over a span of 50-100 feet the difference is probably negligible.

sbcooke

I don't think it makes a difference FWD or AWD because in most situations like that you will be breaking and the ABS and RSC will be in contol. Unless you are somehow in an emergency situation where you need to stomp on the gas to get out of something? When then even FWD might be better at pulling you out of it, depending on the details.

1sttimevolvo1

It would probably be safe to say that by this point we're micro-analyzing it.......but fun non-the-less.

shadowchaser

with so much attn to the stereo, maybe someone can tell me what REG stands for. Does volvo have a consumer site that answers such questions?

shadowchaser

This is an update on an older post. I love my xc90 but there are some problems that should be brought out. Careful...everytime people like me post critiques like this, defensive volvo owners go nuts and excoriate me. Take these criticisms for what they are worth...my opinion...suggestions for improvement.

I have the 2.5 AWD and it is fairly sluggish. Maybe it is the turbolag. It is anything but nimble. I get into my honda odyssey and I feel like I am in a BMW! You get used to the lumbering starts but when you get in another car, it reminds you how sluggish the XC90 is.

The key fob. NoToo big, the little ring come off, and the key always opens in my pocket.

The headlight switch design...well it sucks. It is "automatic" but you have to remember to have it in one position during the day and another at night to be able to use the high beams. In the horizontal position the regular lights come on at night...great-it is automatic...except you can't lock the high beams!!! What is the purpose of this? Who remembers to turn the knob? It is just silly.

Fog lights. Hard to get to buttons...confusing which is the back and which is the front.

No chirp or option of chirp on door lock. Have to turn around to see if it is locked...not safe in the parking lot.

Autowiper switch should be a button like the back wiper button. There is no way to know whether it is on except to push down on the switch to the next setting to see where it is....defeats the purpose.

Lumbar support hard to get to. You have to twist around to get to it so you can't sit in the seat the way you normally would. Needs to be electric or in a better place.

Cruise control on button is in a bad place. Gets pushed down inadvertantly where it is.

Volvo nameplate on steering wheel can be sharp. If you hit the horn hard withe the steerring wheel truned upside down (going around a turn) you will slice your palm....I did.

Hand hold bars in a bad place. They are right over the door in my other car and much more useful...maybe it is because of the side airbag....donn't know.

Middle booster nice but narrow. Can't really put 3 adults across middle like in Acura.

No delayed functioning of the windows. When you turn the car off, you can't put up the windows.

Dash design. The rubber spaces for pens on either end of the shift area are magnets for dirt and dust. It looks and feels unattractive. There is no good place for coins. Can;t see the lights on the ac. Need clock on radio display.

Navigation. There should be a mute. In order to mute the system you have to go through long menus. Whatever it was on the radio you wanted to hear is long over. This is a problem for thos of us that listen to talk and news stations. Often I set it from home and don't need the directions until I get closer to my destination....but there it is truning down the radio.

Heating/Air conditioning. It really isn't clear how to work this....when to put it on auto or when it is on manual. Since it doesn't read out the internal temperature, knowing where to set the temp dial is hard....When I want it a bit colder, I don't know where to set it cause I don't know what temperature it already thinks it is.

Probs with my car.....I had spring probs with my emerg brake and the back seat mechanism was defective. The button fell off the seat adjustment.

Good car...needs some improvement given the price.

quijote1

I agree with you completely. I picked up my 2004 xc90 t6 last July and have had it in the shop twice. First reason was to get the ebrake spring replaced. It stuck and I had smoke coming out of the rear tires. Second reason was the geartronic transmission got stuck and went into limp mode. The tech found a ground wire that was attached after the car chassis had been painted preventing a solid ground. Now the brakes can't stop squeaking every time I make a left turn. It's frustrating and I is not right for me to have to keep coming back to the dealer.
Volvo should address these mistakes since I see them re-occurring for other owners as well.

Your right on the money as far as the grab being in the wrong position.

akabubba1

I have had my XC90 now for 3 months and 4200 miles. Great driving compared to my 2002 Explorer LTD and much better gas mileage (19.4 avg).

Love the subwoofer. If you love music, you must get it installed at the dealer - just ask my 19 year-old.

Is there a kit for woodgrain dash kit available that matches factory colors ?

shadowchaser

Yes!!! I meant to put it in my post that I was surprised the dash was so plain...but glad it didn't have cheap looking plastic like the MDX. The plastic woodgrain that the xc90 does have is much better. There are 2 kits out there....I only know the name of 1---the one I bought. Sherwood. You can get it from richardson's volvo in TX which is always a good source of volvo products.... but I got mine from someone on ebay (the name is in previous posts...you'll have to look). It looks great. I paid ony 120 dollars or so. Highly recommended. Plenty of posts on it.

happyvolvo

Hi,

Earlier this week we took delivery of our '04 T6 w/premium, climate, subwoofer, and bi-xenons. It's our fourth Volvo and a fabulous car, but I'm a little confused by the headlights. Although the light is whiter in color, the low beams only go out about 30 feet ahead of the vehicle. The high beams only raise the beam but don't brighten it. Going down hills with low beams on is disconcerting because the beam length shortens even more, and high beams don't improve it much. We live in a hilly area so this is a major concern. In reading some of the earlier posts, I can't find any comments about how they should work, or how they should be aimed. I noticed that the inboard lights don't go on as I would expect when the high beams are on. Dealer says these are part of the daytime running light system, and the elevated beam is the only high beam. Any comments or advice will be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

happyvolvo

P.S. To shadowchaser: I think the assist grips are placed so someone in a wheelchair can reach them. On your advice, I'll be sure not to lean on the horn while executing a turn.

e350v10

I just read in the 9-29-03 Autoweek that "The XC90 gets a rather hasty update next year and a V8 in '05 (possibly made by SHO supplier Yamaha)."

Any truth to this Volvomax, ANT14 or any other expert?

I just ordered a T-6 and don't want it to be outdated immediately!

bigeddy

1sttimevolvo1: "For less than the cost of the Nav system you should be able to outfit a palm pc with similar software."

Although the Palm solution has certain appeal it has nowhere near the integration and ease of use. If you use the nav system much, safety alone probably argues for the Volvo system. Convenience is a second reason.

shadowchaser

interesting post.

My hand is healed....but it was a nasty cut. Someone stopped short in front of me and I hit the horn with the palm of my hand and it was instant slice. I wonder what would happen if the airbag went off. Would I get the Volvo logo imprinted on my forehead?

bigeddy

happyvolvo: "... I can't find any comments about how they should work, or how they should be aimed. I noticed that the inboard lights don't go on as I would expect when the high beams are on. Dealer says these are part of the daytime running light system, and the elevated beam is the only high beam."

There is much discussion and photos of the bi-xenon lighting system on "unnamed forums" which I'm not allowed to mention here. I'll try an all-too-brief summary.

The inboard lights are halogens and, in U.S. models, provide the daytime running lights. The outboard lights are the bi-xenons that are used at night and for high beams; indeed, they rotate up to illuminate farther ahead in high-beam mode. You can only "flash-to-pass" with the bi-xenons in the daytime setting (light switch at 9 o'clock). The illumination qualities of bi-xenons are very different from halogens and are superior in theory.

Different opinions on the bi-xenons. Some people love 'em, others hate 'em. I like them. There seem to be a lot of factors at play including personal perception, proper aiming, Volvo's application, and understanding how they work. To add to the confusion, European XC90's are programmed differently. Read the manual, give yourself time to get use to them, look at other discussions, and decide for yourself.

wsag26

Not that I'm going to buy one, but will anyone tell me any complaints, or problems with the SUV. Tell me, if you currently own one, which other vehicles you were looking at when you decided to buy the XC.

See you later,
wsag

michaelzz

Hello Everyone,

Well my car came in after 12 long weeks without the bi-xenons. I can't change the facts, so now I'm faced with "Are they really better? and "How do they compare to the standard lights?" Please let me know your experiences and fast. The dealer had the nerve to tell me if I don't want it they already have a new buyer. Thanks very much!

volvomax

Is coming. Cars are being tested in AZ as we speak.
V8 sourced from Yamaha, displacement 4.5L.
Figure 300 hp for starters, also a new 5speed gearbox will go with it.

jginnyc

I'm planning to buy an XC90 sometime in the next month or so. I believe that if I was to find someone else with a similar interest in an XC90 and we both went into a dealer we could negotiate a better price than if we each went in alone. Benefits to the dealer are obvious.

Anyone interested in this approach? Any comments on the viability? I live in the NY tri-state area and would be willing to speak with anyone who is interested.

thanks
jginnyc@aol.com

tidester

Technically, you're talking about a group buy and that conflicts with the Town Hall rules.

Let's keep it at the theoretical level on the boards and only address whether it makes sense.

tidester, host

bigeddy

michaelzz: "Well my car came in after 12 long weeks without the bi-xenons. I can't change the facts, so now I'm faced with "Are they really better? and "How do they compare to the standard lights?" Please let me know your experiences and fast."

Interesting situation. Well, I like 'em but the feeling is not universal among owners. They are bright white with a sharply defined area. Some people prefer the more gradual cutoff of halogens. Light perception is fairly subjective, so your best bet is to compare the 2 systems at night on different cars. If the dealer has a bi-xenon equipped XC90, park it next to yours and see which you like. If no XC90 is available, compare XC70s.

jginnyc

No intent to have a conflict with the rules. But the viability of this approach would be interesting to me.

Thanks