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Comments
They'll easily sell their entire production capacity to their dealers, and dealers will sell their vehicles at MSRP or higher for quite some time.
So what's to gain by taking that risk? Probably not higher MSRP and hence higher invoice, because that would put it into MDX territory.
That got me to thinking (yes, I unerstand that's dangerous). On what vehicles has Honda taken a risk? The S2000? CR-X? Civic Del Sol? 1st Generation CR-V? The styling on those vehicles was more unusual or innovative. Perhaps necessary to enter into a new market segment.
While in some ways the Pilot represents a new segment for Honda, it's not as new as any of the above examples. With the Pilot positioned between the already successful CR-V and MDX, Honda saw less need for risk. Looks like the market will confirm that judgment.
Also on the subject of styling and risk, I actually liked the look of the Isuzu Vehicross, but not enough to buy one.
Pontiac took some risk with the Aztek. I seem to remember some good pre-release reviews, but haven't read anything favorable post release.
Just think the interest Honda dealers will be making on your deposit for 8 months and then they will charge you thousands above MSRP!
Best of Luck
A few observations from the list ...
1) No mention of transmission/steering coolers with the tow hitch, which is necessary for the MDX to tow. I wonder if the Pilot has those built in, or doesn't need them, or are they simply missing from that accessories list? Then again, Acura doesn't even sell the hitch without the coolers now that they're required. Could be that the Pilot is a better deal than the MDX as far as towing goes.
2) Some small, expected differences between the Pilot and MDX show up -- fog lights and an electrochromatic rear view mirror are accessories for the Pilot (standard on the MDX). They alone won't account for making the Pilot less expensive but it all adds up.
3) So the rear seat entertainment system is available both as a factory option, and as an add-on accessory? Is that so you can add it to a Pilot EX with Nav (can't order a Pilot with both)?
4) While Honda tends to package their vehicles packed with standard equipment and eliminates the endless list of options, that seems to result in more stuff being dealer-installed accessories. Unfortunately that's proven to be a problem when the vehicle is hot. From what some would-be MDX buyers have reported, some greedy dealerships are forcing overpriced accessories as part of the purchase. E.g. perhaps they'll sell at MSRP but then they turn around and charge a huge amount for a package of wheel locks, mud flaps, and the cargo tray as a "protection package." Or even when the accessories aren't forced, the dealership charges quite a bit on the accessory itself, and/or the installation of such.
That said, there are plenty of places on the Internet where you can buy accessories at a discount (e.g. www.hondacuraworld.com, which has good prices and great service, and a lot of MDX owners have bought accessories from).
When the MDX was first released, Acura had the base part price up (labor not included) on their website. Curiously, within several days, the prices were heavily revised upward. There was a lot of speculation that it was done because dealers were charging heavily padded prices.
JM2C
"The system, which offers consumers better handling and fuel economy, improved security, and more flexibility than passive, mechanical four-wheel drive systems, debuted in late 2000 on the award-winning Acura MDX."
It controls all 4 wheels independently and only delivers power to the rear when required. So, it sounds like the Pilot will operate in front wheel drive mode most of the time, unlike some full-time 4WD systems.
http://www.prnewswire.com/cgi-bin/stories.pl?ACCT=popmech_auto.story&STORY=/www/story/01-17-2002/0001650158&EDATE=THU+Jan+17+2002,+10:39+AM
The article was from the hardcopy and you are probably correct regarding date that information was collected. Only time will tell.
Redlenses
Should i wait for the Pilot or go ahead and buy the MDX? I'm afraid that i will regret buying the MDX. Will Acura/Honda make a distinction between the 2? Maybe have a huge gap in price between them to separate them into two different classes? I heard the Pilot will be wider. Any good sites with closeup pics of the Pilot? I'm confused. Thanks in advance.
P.S: I'm afraid that if i wait also, the Pilot won't be much of a savings because of demand and added options. Also, MDX will most likely increase in price for 2003 as they add on more features, improvements, etc.
I have a deposit with the MDX. I test drove the MDX and it was great. The 3.5L 240hp engine is strong enough. But I heard from motorweek that they will use a 3.8L V-6 engineer same as the TL on the 2003 one. The price is about $40K (a gouging by the Acura Dealers). Acura dealers have been request deposits from $400 to $1000 lately in the SF Bay Area.
The Pilot styling is not so great. But is the styling important... that's the question.
It's looks like a bigger CR-V like (agreeing with some posting here). I think the pricing will be:
LX: $25,700
EX: $29,800
Leather adds: $3000
Nav adds: $3000
But the Pilot will likely have quality issues for at least a year since it is new. Little things are more likely to go wrong that the big stuff since it is basically a MDX clone.
Why Honda?? I have an 96' Accord with 128K miles and it's still happy. I had my first engine light go on at 127.7K miles
I test drove the Highlander V-4. No power at all.
You have to register to read the article, but it lists a few details regarding dimensions.
http://www.nytimes.com/2002/01/20/automobiles/20PILO.html
"Although it has the same wheelbase as the MDX, the Pilot is a little taller and wider, and consequently the interior is larger. It has a maximum cargo volume of about 90 cubic feet behind the front seats, compared with 81.5 for the MDX."
I found a link to pics of the Honda Pilot.
http://www.edmunds.com/news/autoshows/articles/48583/page007.html
If I was looking for an Expedition size, I would have gotten something else.
I doubt Honda will do a lot for the 2003 mdx except the new TL engine. But 0-60 speeds will not be much faster since it also probably weights more. 240hp vs. 260hp. Well maybe 0.4 secs faster.
This should be a very nice addition to the line...being that we are having a difficult time unloading the Passport and CR-V's are taking TOO LONG to get here.
Jerry
If I was looking for an Expedition size, I would have gotten something else.
I doubt Honda will do a lot for the 2003 mdx except the new TL engine. But 0-60 speeds will not be much faster since it also probably weights more. 240hp vs. 260hp. Well maybe 0.4 secs faster.
So what if it looks like a super-sized CR-V. That's fine with me. I figure the Pilot is what anyone outgrowing the CR-V wants or anyone that finds the CR-V too small to begin with. Just look at it this way. When you buy a pair of jeans, the same style comes in different sizes. You just need to find the pair that fits you. I don't think this analogy is too far off. ;-)
Hey, does anyone think the Pilot will have color-matching mud flaps?
Parking in the SF Bay Area will be kinda tough.
I think Honda cloned the CR-V and expanded it.
Something like Civic and Accord kind of styling.
Nothing too interesting. Should probably be near Oddesey pricing plus $1K to $2K.
The rest of the Bay Area, like at my house on the peninsula, it'll park just fine.
Same goes for the Expedition/Explorer. At least they made the Escape attractive.
A 7/8 Grand Cherokee would be nice, too.
On a related note, I noticed that even 2002 Camrys shipped from Japan have fixed mirrors. Always thought that folding mirrors was a must to maximize vehicles loaded on the ship from Japan. I'd like to see all offering at least the driver's side mirror as folding.
Pilot--90
Explorer--88
Highlander--81
Escalade--105
Navigator--109
LEXUS LX470--90 (pilot has as much as the lx470!!!!
ML320---???no info
I feel this will put much pressure on the ML320 MDX, Highlander, Rx300 etc.
Wow as big as the lx470 and bigger than the EXplorer.
However, when you get within 5 cu.ft. of each other the shape of the cargo area becomes just as important. In this case, cargo-wars would probably still go to the Pilot. Based on what we've seen with the MDX, it should have a resonably regular shape to the cargo area.
Not bad..
Odyssey sales surpass the Windstar, getting close to the T&C, but nowhere near the Caravan.