Honda Pilot 2003 through 2005

Spyponder

my point exactly

anonymous02

"Not surprised. Much like Trail Blazer versus Suburban, or Explorer versus Expedition."

I wish the trialballser was as good looking as the suburban. Better yet, make the tb. and sub. look like bigger and smaller tahoes!!!

I'd rather see Ford make the older cousins look more like the escapade. The expiditeron looks semi ok, but I don't like the exploder's looks at all.

Keep it simple. Honda, keep it up.

anonymous02

"...but as far as tires go, since this vehicle is not meant to be a serious off roader, it will likely wear 235 rubber (same as MDX) on 16 inch rims (as in base MDX). The tire selection would be for road use as well."

But, I have seen CRVs with 235/75R15 tires, and it wasn't bad, just underpowered. I'd imagine this could be upgraded pretty easy.

Again, not for hardcore offroading, but to gain basic clearance. You wouldn't believe the places a Civic or Jetta can go on 14 inch tires!!!!

:-)

anonymous02

Is the 3rd row optional or required?

I'd prefer: front bench, back bench, no third row.

Boy, that MB-G sure is UGLY. I don't know about boring, but U-G-L-Y!!!!

(I almost spelled it MGB!)

Spyponder

I agree, but I would still give me left, um, arm to own one. It's what is inside that counts.

stangelj

spartanman2, is the print article different than the link nofeer posted on the MT article? The on-line edition does not mention a price range.

http://www.motortrend.com/jan02/pilot/pilot_f.html

robertsmx, what makes you think there will be a 2WD version of the Pilot? Nothing has been mentioned about that in any article or press release. I'm 99.9% sure it will only come in AWD.

anonymous02, I recall the Pilot will take a 4' X 6' sheet of plywood, not 4X8 like the Odyssey can.

diploid

It's basically a 2wd system the majority of the time (assuming that you don't get snow all year).

stever

In case you missed it, our review and a video clip are available - check out the Helpful Links toolbar on the left.

Steve
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diploid

On that new editorial survey was that there isn't enough in depth photos (read: cars.com) of the vehicle's interior when Edmunds does a review.

The same applies to the Pilot video - I would've loved to see more of the 3rd row seat (and a lot more of the interior as well). Seeing the Pilot stroll through dirt roads for a few minutes gets relatively boring.

BTW Steve- did Edmunds make that video or was it supplied by Honda? My criticism obviously wouldn't apply if Honda made the video.

stever

I'll ask around - I assume it's "our" video with some "stock" footage.

Meanwhile, to give feedback regarding Edmunds.com reviews and video, please click the Feedback Form and the Video Survey and, finally, the Editorial Survey.

That should hold you while you forget what question you asked :-)

Steve
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robertsmx

what makes you think there will be a 2WD version of the Pilot? Nothing has been mentioned about that in any article or press release.
Just a guess. Almost everybody does it, and it is a good way to keep a low starting price.

rsholland

if there's a 2WD version of the Pilot. If you want 2WD, buy an Odyssey.

Bob

guyf

Check this site for a detailed and technical description of the Santa Fe AWD system.

http://www.hmaservice.com/webtech/iindex.asp?id=394880398#_394880398

rsholland

and relating to the discussion on 4WD vs AWD, I believe the Santa Fe markets their AWD system as "4WD." I know Toyota does that with the Highlander and Rav4. Both these vehicles drivetrains are referred to as "4WD" by Toyota, not AWD, even though by most accepted definitions of AWD—that's what they are.

Again, it's just marketing...

Bob

ticktock4321

"If you want 2WD, buy an Odyssey"

Maybe someone doesn't want that style of vehicle. Plenty of people buy 2WD versions of SUVs. Honda sells quite a few FWD CR-Vs. I don't see why they shouldn't offer a 2WD version of the Pilot.

canadiancl

you have a valid point. But Bob was just expressing his opinion also (albeit in a more emphatic and dramatic fashion).

sbcooke

I don't think there would be much benefit in a 2wd version. Since it is FWD based, I don't think removing the rear component (drive train, differential, etc.) would change change performance for the better, or "cheaper" I guess. Usually, in old style 4wd, the purpose of 2wd model was to reduce price and operating costs, this due to the fact that the center differential, front axle, diffential, drive shaft, etc. added a lot of weight, and took a lot away from performance, and increased gas mileage.

With primarily FWD to begin with, a much less robust (I didn't say much less capable) drive train, removing the rear portion, I don't think would offer enough savings to make it worthwhile. Also, old style 4wd would offer different suspensions, etc. to make them more like cars in the 2wd version. With the MDX and/or pilot, you are getting the car like ride already, decent gas mileage, so I don't think there is much of a benefit to removing the AWD system.

Also, with the CRV, I believe there is a different production line, i.e. based off a 2wd car with a longer production history, so getting a 2wd version to market may be easier? With these 3, odyssey, Pilot, MDX (I know they could use the odyssey platform) they are so behind in production, adding a new version may not be possible at this point?

robertsmx

albeit in a more emphatic and dramatic fashion.
Thats me.

Thinking a little more about it, and dramatically speaking (again), Honda may not offer 2WD because the production would be limited to, about 70K units in the first year? But since the drivetrain is shared between Odyssey and MDX, and Pilot jumps in as well, with Pilot taking over the Odyssey production line, what would it take to produce 2WD version and price it about a grand over Odyssey LX? AWD may add $1500-2000 to that, followed by leather/RES for about $2K or leather/NAV for about $3K. That gives a range of $6K in options between a 2WD base ($26K) and fully loaded w/NAV ($32K). If they don't offer 2WD, pricing may start from $28K.

sbcooke
Pilot and MDX share platform with Odyssey. The platform is actually a modified version of Honda's global mid-size platform (Accord, CL, TL). The modification as far as I know is primarily in the front suspension setup (struts compared to double wishbones) and some minor structural differences.

rsholland

Just pointing the fact that the Pilot and Odyssey are kissing cousins. I think Honda's take will be much the same as mine. If you want 2WD, we have the Odyssey for you to choose from too.

I think having a 2WD Odyssey and 2WD Pilot is just redundant.

Bob

stangelj

If Honda is going to offer a 2WD version of the Pilot, they would have said so somewhere in all the press releases and interviews we've all been reading. It won't happen, at least for 03 model. Not that I'm saying it would be a bad idea...

stangelj

Boy, that sure looked like a 4 X 8 sheet of plywood they loaded in on the Edmunds Pilot video. I thought it would only hold 4 X 6, maybe that was the MDX...

stever

The word is that Edmunds creates the videos using footage supplied by the manufacturers. So while the manufactures may handle certain video sequences, they're basically our work. Hope this helps.

Steve
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diploid

More things for me to complain about.

stange - What surprised me was that in the video, when they show the men loading in the plywood, the cabin didn't look as wide as it did in the photos.

stever

Well heck, I can get plywood flat in my Quest, so I'd expect at least as much width in the Pilot (I also carried 3 sheets of 1/2" sheetrock that was 4'x12' long last week ).

No, the rear hatch didn't quite close all the way.

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canadiancl

I would much rather see Honda offer a third-seat delete option.

varmit

You don't mind that the floor wouldn't be flat?

rsholland

could be a hidden storage space with a cover. That's what Ford does with the new Explorer sans third seat. The floor is still flat.

Bob

robertsmx

That is a good point. But deleting third row seat may not bring enough savings.

I know Honda didn't mention 2WD model, but did they mention everything about Pilot? Probably not. But it makes sense for Honda to keep Pilot AWD model throughout, with the limit on volume they would make.

redlenses

I must say I was disappointed in the Pilot video also. I do think that plywood was 4x6 foot not a 4x8. If we can believe that the interior size is identical to the MDX then only a 4x6 could fit. The only other possibility is that the front row seats were moved forward and the seat backs rotated forward. All we need is Honda to release real interior specifications to backup their superior size claims. What are they waiting for!

Is their any Edmunds staff that participated in the making or support of this video that has first hand knowledge of additional information this forum is seeking? Please speak up!

Cheers

bostnwhalr

People who complain about the Pilot's styling are missing the point. A "stylish" SUV is an oxymoron. For the most part, an SUV as a box to put stuff (ie kids, dogs, gear, surfboards, junk) inside and be able to travel a greater range of roads and not-so-roads. If you want style, get an X5. There's an example of SUV style over SUV substance (cargo room). Better yet, wait for the Porsche Cayenne. You'll be the hit of the subdivision.

Plywood. The MDX can carry a piece of 4x8 plywood with the hatch open. If you want to carry plywood with the hatch closed, get an Odyssey. However, you'll beatup the interior with wood splinters unless you use a tarp. Of course, if you're that worried about carrying plywood, might I suggest a pickup truck? Much easier to load and unload.

Townhall. I love this place and laugh at it too. It's fun and annoying to see where these topics go. 91' Stanza. Arguing the styling of an SUV. Details you'll find nowhere else along with nitpicky comments on a vehicle that no one has driven or even sat in. Gotta love it!

carstuff3

I think the Pilot is one of the best looking vehicles I have seen from Honda. I much prefer it over the styling of the MDX. However styling is a matter of personal taste. I have owned Hondas since I started driving in 1986, Not because of the way they looked but because of all the Honda virtues. I really like the classic angular styling of the Pilot. Even though Red is not one of my favorite colors, I think it will look even better from behind when the tail lights do not blend in.

I would expect that the model choices will be very similar to the Odyssey, i.e. LX, EX, EX-L. If you add about $1,200 for AWD to the Odyssey prices you should get where the Pilot will be priced. $1,200 is what Honda changes for AWD on the CR-V. I know it is a different system but this should be a good ball park figure.

I have never owned an SUV, but this maybe my first. This vehicle will fly off the lots for a few years. I will be willing to pay fair market value for the vehicle, which I believe will be MSRP. I can live with that. For comparison an Explorer XLT with 4WD, Rear A/C, and 3rd seat has a Invoice price of $27,036. That is after a $2,000 rebate. Given my estimated MSRP for a Pilot LX of $25,890. Seems like a deal even at MSRP.

stlgasman

I was hoping that the Pilot would be longer than the MDX, but March Motor Trend says it will be 2 inches shorter. Bummer. The leg room on the MDX is terrible. I was hoping for more with the Pilot.

canadiancl

and have "class-leading" cargo space.

varmit

Maybe it's taller.

will4271

From looking at the pictures, it is really hard to tell.

Also looking at the back window area compared to the MDX, it seemed longer. Maybe they are taking space from the front and 2nd row seats for cargo?

First of all, I think Edmunds video wasn't bad at all. But I wish they show more pictures. I hope that they will do that test drive soon. But the info is good

As for styling, I think it matters for some. SUV is still an image thing. Otherwise, we'll be driving the Odyssey (some think this styling is unique too).

But the Pilot has to be more flat compared to the MDX since they are selling them at a higher price. What you pay is what you get.

I don't think Honda wants to rob Acura dealers to pay Honda dealers.

ticktock4321

about the 2WD. I used to think I had an idea what Honda would do, but lately they have been suprising me. Which brings me to (slightly OT); I just read they will be releasing in the next year or two a Civic 5 dr H/B and RSX Type R. So in a period of a couple of years they will have given us the RSX, new CR-V, Civic Si, Hybrid Civic, Pilot, New Accord, Civic 5 H/B, RSX Type R, Changes to CL and TL and others I'm sure I am missing. Not bad for what used to be a fairly conservative company.

indierockmom

Sorry if this has been hashed already -- but what's the general consensus on how the Pilot and Explorer might differ? In the market and in desperate need of a new car. Happy with the new Explorer (and especially some deals currently available) but wondering if we should wait for the Pilot, mainly because of what I suspect will be an easier vehicle to drive (for a kind of SUV novice/mom). By the by, this is the info I got from a local dealer:
"LX (base model)... cloth interior, power all around, AC
EX (middle).....cloth interior, power moonroof, digital climate control, remote entry, alloy wheels.
EX-L (upper) Adds include leather, heated seats, full power driver's seat.
EX-L RES This is as previous but with a DVD based Rear Entertainment system.
EX-L Navi Just like the EX-L but with a navigational system.

The EX-L Navi will be the most expensive at probably around the 31,000 range.

Other than the base, the others will be around $26-30k.

I am guessing but the first ones to arrive will probably be the EX and EX-L models."

varmit

Well, it's all speculation until the Pilot is released, but here is what I would *guess*.

In favor of the Pilot:

Better ride quality
Better crash safety
Better fuel efficiency
Better emissions
Slightly better cargo area
Better interior quality

In favor of the Ford:

Better towing ability
Lower price (with incentives running the way they are now)
Better dealership experience (statistically speaking)

p.s. Thanks for the information on pricing. That break down (LX, EX, EX-L) is exactly the same way that Honda sells the CR-V up in Canada.

rsholland

due to having a low range, should also be better off road. I'm guessing that it will also handle heavy payloads better, especially if you get the V8.

Bob

legoego

An explorer off road? Who are we kidding

rsholland

It'll be better than the Pilot off road.

Besides the part-time 4-low, it has a part-time 4-high and an on-demand auto 4WD. The part-time 4-high—unlike the Pilot's locking 4WD, operates in all 5 forward gears, whereas the Pilot will operate only in 1st and 2nd.

Don't be so quick to jump on the Explorer.

Bob

canadiancl

But nobody buying an Explorer would have any intention of going off-road. These things are strictly all-weather wagons for the suburban crowd.

rsholland

I've been off road a number of times with mine, with no problems whatsoever ever.

For those who question the need (or desire) of a Low Range, I can tell you for a fact that I would never have made it up a very soft sand dune pathway up in the community of Carova Beach (4x4 accessible only) on North Carolina's Outer Banks without it.

Bob

ateixeira

Not true, I see lots of Explorers used for surf fishing. Probably the most common SUV, actually. Only GM pickups appear in bigger numbers at the beach.

You should have seen the look on their faces when they saw me in my Forester! Priceless! :oO

-juice

shaq2kobe

that you won't be able to have the rear entertainment and navi in the Honda Pilot? or is it all speculation?

j_walker

Anyone know if moonroof will be available with the Rear Entertainment System?

indierockmom

wow, thanks for the input! not planning on towing anything, but want/need 4wd for sometimes messy northern New England weather and beach driving, so the Pilot pretty much looks right on for us. but I am thinking that exterior and interior size will be comparable -- do most of you agree? that's what i really like about the Explorer anyway, and can't think of another vehicle that compares. so before I plunk down the $500 deposit, do i need to worry about 1st year honda performance? thanks AGAIN for all this great info... PS: this is our first purchase of NEW car so I hope you can appreciate my anxiety.

rsholland

have only seen pictures of the Pilot. So that's what we're going by. Until it hits the streets, and we've sat in, or driven one; we're pretty much in the same position as you. We just don't know yet...

Bob

stlgasman

Does anybody know for sure that a moonroof is going to be offered? The Odyssey doesn't have one. It will interfere with the DVD entertainment system. I bet one will not be a factory option.

bengelking

Are dealers taking deposits yet on the Pilot? Fully refundable if you don't like it? What are people seeing out there?