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Honda Element



  • ropedartropedart Posts: 163 suggest that the Honda Stream may come in 2004. This 7 seven seater car would be a great addition to the Element. The Odyssey is too much van for my wife. I can see Honda bringing it in to compete with the Toyota Scion line of stuff. I think the C pillar needs work though-too much like a cartoon C.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    The Element attracts the attention of anyone walking by it. It doesn't matter if they are interested in buying one or not. You might be shopping for the S2000, but you'd have to poke your head inside an Element.

    OTOH, the Pilot's appeal isn't in the styling. Only those folks interested in SUVs are going to bother with it.

    I have doubts that the Stream's 7-seater configuration will meet US safety standards. Given the way that the first gen Ody was received, I don't see the Stream making a big impact on their marketing folks.
  • moonkatmoonkat Posts: 265
    I thought the Element was the US version of the Stream...:-)
    Roomy, utilitarian, with 106" wheelbase.
  • What Honda should bring over is the Civic 5-door. Now that's a good looking car and would compete well with the Focus SVT, Matrix, Protege5 and scion stuff. Of course it would have to have the Si engine...(dreaming...)

  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Yeah, the Si is nice. but very small. Or maybe the competitors are just much bigger now?

    I like the Stream, it's very space efficient.

  • diploiddiploid Posts: 2,286
    Yes - bring over that Civic 5-door! It would be real nice if they dropped in the RSX's base engine. Ford is rumored to drop a more powerful Zetec into its Focus lineup.
  • jfigueroa1jfigueroa1 Posts: 209
    what about the 5 doors civic with the prelude eng?
    200hp should be good.
    what happen to that eng?
    and why it is not use in the element or cv-r?
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    Eww, smog! =) The 2.2 was not a clean engine by today's standards. It was also a high revver with less low end torque. That torque is the stuff that is needed to get these heavier models moving from a standstill.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Yeah, rumore has it Ford will go from 2.0l to 2.3l for the Focus. They have to drop that lame base engine, though. It's 2002, fer heaven's sake.

    Still, their current level of quality control does not even come close to meeting my standards. A Focus ZTW wagon might have met our needs but I didn't even consider it.

    Civics could use a little more displacement, and I hope Honda dots the Is and crosses the Ts a little better. CR had the new one at 10% more problems than average, after a lifetime of earning straight As.

    CR-V was Honda's best student, though, so I bet the Element will score well.

  • diploiddiploid Posts: 2,286
    I just wonder how they're going to keep the Element's price at a starting line of 16K? Manual, windows that need to be cranked, and no A/C?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    My guess is that'll be 2WD and not have ABS, keyless, cruise, or a CD player. I do expect it'll have PW/PL, A/C, and AM/FM/cassette.

    The base CR-V only comes in automatic, but maybe the Element will have a 5 speed, which is cheaper.

  • moonkatmoonkat Posts: 265
    Judging by the recent Pilot prices, Element $16K to 21K will be more like $16.9 for LX, and $22 for EX AWD....=}
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    Ditto on the prices.
  • ropedartropedart Posts: 163
    Like the CRV, we in Canada will not get the base model with 2WD. That's a shame since I consider the Honda 4WD lame. The front 2WD is good enough for me.
  • moonkatmoonkat Posts: 265
    No problem bro..
    I will gladly sponsor you here in the USofA to pay US$ for an AWD Element...=)

    Jeff in muddyland
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Pilot's still a good value, though. $29k and change for an EX, add just leather and you're at about $30k. $775 for a 7/100 warranty, and you're still below the MSRP for an Explorer XLT 4x4.

  • moonkatmoonkat Posts: 265
    I hope it's still a good value at EX-L MSRP of $30,520 plus $460 delivery = $30,980.

    And where can I get 7/100 warranty for $775?
  • moonkatmoonkat Posts: 265
    I was reading a Matrix XR review and wondering about Element rivals...

    Apparantly called "crossover" vehicles: "meaning... part sedan, part station wagon and part sport-utility vehicle"
  • diploiddiploid Posts: 2,286
    moonkat- I believe the 7/100 warranty is the optional extended warranty from Honda.
  • moonkatmoonkat Posts: 265
    From Honda it's more like $1200. $775 sounds like a bargain.
  • moonkatmoonkat Posts: 265
    Another Element rival: Land Rover Freelander

    Mainly for the shape and appearance in silver with blocky dark fender trim.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    The Element doesn't really have any natural predators. It's in a class of it's own. I think that the competition will be anything that is about funky styling, low cost, and utility. Probably in that order. These are the vehicles that I see as competitors:

    PT Cruiser - Gobs of style, fairly low price, and decent utility for such a small vehicle. The lack of 4WD won't matter to these buyers as much as the styling. The Element provides "younger" styling and more utility.

    The Aztek - Most people who buy an Aztek needed a minivan, but didn't want the stigma. What they get is a vehicle with great utility at a warehouse-sale price. Buyers simply trade the mommy look for the freakish look. The Element provides a less freakish and more funky alternative at the expense of some utility.

    The Matrix - A bargain import-lovers car that provides unique styling and some utility. While one is sport oriented and the other is utility minded, both provide a "fun" image without losing sight of utility.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    The Wrangler - A serious off-roader that people buy because it's a cheap rag-top and has tons of character. Many people will give up the Jeep's obvious off-road superiority for some of the space and civility of the Element. They still get to keep the character.
  • moonkatmoonkat Posts: 265
    You're an Ad Copywriter, yes?

    "trade the mommy look for the freakish look"...great line, but watch out for "lito".

    I hesitate characterizing or otherwise passing judgement on aesthetics; it's so subjective, though I like to think I have good taste. One man's Element is another's Aztec.

    I'm going to make an effort to see the Element in person the next time it is within reach; and with a tape measure and a camcorder. Wherever that is.
  • dralstldralstl Posts: 7
    The inside pictures show a pull out screen and indicates it can be used for game playing. Do you think it will also have either (or both) a GPS Navigation use or an internet access use? I would be willing to pay for this if it is an add on option as it is in some vehicles.
  • dralstldralstl Posts: 7
    ..... the final configuration for the Element? If it is to be in the showrooms this December, how far in advance will brochures and/or online information be available? I am like a kid again, waiting for Christmas. Seven months is too long for me to wait.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    Moonkat - I'm one of those people who liked the Aztek concept. They bungled it with the production model.

    I agree that the styling of the Element will be a love/hate affair. I love it, my wife hates it. It won't have the near-universal appeal of something like the PT Cruiser. But I think it will work well with the demographic they are trying to sell to.
  • moonkatmoonkat Posts: 265
    I regret that you have a wait for your Christmas present....savor it.

    Some of us are also waiting on the new Pilot which is being sold beginning with a June 3rd roll-out, and brochures/info is still not complete. Models and prices were broadcast on the web last week, but colors/interior colors are not absolute. Prices were nearly 5% higher than originally announced.

    I suspect it will be similar with the Element. Info & pictures will trickle out as Ohio production begins maybe Sep, Oct for an early December roll-out. Before then Honda will also be rolling-out the 03 Accord in the Fall with auto show preview in mid-June. There is also a new 03 MDX (well, at least the new 3.8L motor) to intro.....

    You might want to visit an auto show which previews the production Element. I'm planning on that....should've made the effort to visit NYIAS.

    As for options at this early stage, you might take a look at the College Hills Honda site 03 Accord models/options page for a hint at what may be offered in Element. Apparently Honda will offer NAV on all the 03 Accords, but that may be academic. My Pilot dealer said that NAV & RES options were not available in the June build dates - (and fine with me). (Oh, and by the way, get used to terms like "build date", "allocation", and "MSRP"...=)
  • moonkatmoonkat Posts: 265
    I guess I'm more of a like-dislike kinda guy. The original Aztek, I disliked (not hated), and the 02 I consider more attractive. I guess I don't invest as much emotion in the vehicles I see (or drive).

    The PT Cruiser is photogenic. I originally liked the design, until I saw one in person, and realized that it was only about 3/4 the size I perceived (that word again) it to be. Thereafter I discounted it as not being a serious vehicle.

    The Element is appealing visually and functionally, and I suspect will be even more attractive in person. I already have a feel for the scale of the vehicle at 70-72" tall, and larger than a CR-V. Also, the hints from folks like juice (I recall) who have seen it live, and called it "superb" reinforce my expectations.

    This from a guy who is buying a Pilot sight unseen and for entirely functional reasons. By the way is that you (6'-1") in the Pilot Spy photos at
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    Yep. That's me. But don't tell anyone. ;-)

    I actually think that the '02 Aztek looks worse. The half-painted front bumper gives it a storming-the-beaches-of-Normandy appearance. It looks like a military landing vehicle. Instead of having a big blunt snout, it now has an upturned lower lip. Like a bulldog. The spoiler just makes me laugh.

    OTOH, the Element is a more integrated design. The front matches the sides, which matches the look of the back, etc.. In this respect, I think it has better styling than the CR-V, which looks kinda random. The Element looks like the function it serves. The Pilot does, too.
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