Inconsiderate Drivers (share your stories, etc.)

roadburner

Odd way to do things when it is all about justice and safety, eh

Right. At one time California proposed charging court costs even if you were acquitted at trial. I don't know if the state actually followed through with that scheme.

tjc78

I still think Jersey had one of the best gigs going for tickets. Lets say you get pulled over for speeding. You go to court, and almost universally the procecutor comes over to you and asks if you would like to reduce it to a "no point violation". This charge was called "Failure to observe signal". Now, sounds great correct? Well, of course the fine with court costs was probably close to double what just paying the ticket would have been. No one complained, because it kept their license clean.

the_big_al

Arizona had (has) a similar ticket system. In a 55 zone, if you're caught speeding you can receive a no points "waste of resources" ticket. Which is something like $75 or so. Not exactly cheap, but still not an exorbitant amount and it keeps points off your record, officers out of court (and back on the streets to issue more tickets) and no court fees to pay...

In all honesty, this seems fair to me. It's not perpetrated as a "safety law" and you see it for what it is: revenue generation. I get irked when a citation issuing officer touts safety as the reason for the ticket when in reality there was nothing unsafe at all about the speeding violation. When a law states the fine is for revenue generation, it's a different story. Choose to go above this posted limit, you run the risk of paying to do so. Not... you choose to go above this posted limit, you are being unsafe thus this fine is being assessed. (Arizona has a maximum speed law that states a speed at which it deems unsafe and thus safety does come into play there, but the speed at which that applies is indeed high enough that anything faster really would be unsafe in any condition save for a straight wide freeway in broad daylight with no inclement weather or traffic.)

fintail

Wednesday winners: First off, black late model lease spec (read: basic) A4, driver I won't stereotype, in the office complex where I work, flying down the road, hit a speed bump so fast I am pretty sure the front bumper ended up hitting the ground. Shortly followed by an "active boomer" aged woman in a Venza weaving all over the place as she fiddled with her phone, likely a 3 generations old blackberry. Topped it off with an oblivious woman in a dirty ca. 03 Optima who would pace the car directly in front of her and in the other lane, camping out in their blind spot while holding up traffic behind her. She did this to an LR3 for about a mile. She'd also keep at least 1.5 car lengths between her and the car in front of her, even when stopped. Also had a death grip on the wheel.

tjc78

Worse thing I've seen recently was a blinged out 1st gen Navigator blocking both EZpass lanes on the NJTP trying to get to a cash lane.

Horn and appropriate salute applied.

loncray

I think I've figured it out - it's not that folks in Fintail's area of the country are particularly bad drivers, it's that he's got an Extra Strength Idiot Magnet installed in his car (they made Idiot Magnets bigger back when his car was made).

ruking1

I also think he might have a slightly unreasonable expectation ( probably because by all swags, he is at least a good driver). Just because he's ID them as "bad drivers" (there are better descriptions and possible stories) he expects they should actually do something about (changing) it.

As one redneck comedian on satellite TV has so aptly put it: "CAN'T Fix Stupid", as he drinks scotch and smokes cigars on stage.

fintail

That might be it, but ruking is probably closer - I have overly high expectations, and a critical eye. I need to accept that the brain-addled lowest common denominator who makes up such a huge amount of the motoring public, is prone to error and bad judgment - they don't take driving as seriously as they should. If only we had Euro-strict licensing standards.

hammerhead

I'm a pretty good driver, but I'm human & make the occasional mistake. Hopefully my driving is judged on the 99%.

slorenzen

Also, driving in Germany can SPOIL you!

When i've driven there, I loved how aware others were, and I also LOVED cruising along at 185 kph(car wouoldn't go any faster).

then I come back to Oregon...

stickguy

can't remember where (hope it wasn't you!) but I know that I recently saw that refered to as "the official state bird of NJ"

ruking1

we have the best (lowest) accident and fatality rates. This is according to the NHTSA own figures !!

Some would argue that it is mainly due to lower speed limits, but the fact of the matter it is totally not true ! The defacto speed limits are not that far apart. (it is actually app 88 mpg in Europe and 70 here. Another is that it is FAR safer on so called urban freeways than on so called RURAL highways.

So for our real to perceived "LAXED" licensing policies and procedures, we do have lower accident and fatality statistics. Indeed according the the NHTSA the figures at at THE absolute lowest since they started recording them. That is also with the TOTALLY enhanced (over days of old) data capture. Since a lot to most of us do not drive AMERICA, the site also has STATE breakdowns. Some states are "SAFER" than others. And so the stratifications are documented. Check the site out if folks are more curious.

fintail

I am sure you don't text and drive, pull in front of fast moving traffic, LLC, dawdle at lights, weave all over, etc. Everyone makes a mistake, but mistakes aren't equal.

tjc78

the official state bird of NJ

Its well needed in these parts at times.

Just got back from grabbing lunch, moron in the parking lot texting on an antique flip phone blocking the flow of traffic creeping toward his Caddy. He then procedes to take 5 minutes backing out of his spot.......still texting.

fintail

Lower than who? Italy? India? Nigeria? I am pretty sure the Autobahns have lower rates than our crumbling roads, indeed, speed limits have nothing to do with it. I'd rather cruise an interstate than a rural highway filled with obstacles and unskilled drivers, or a floor it and slam on the brakes suburban grind.

fintail

A dream vacation for me would be the keys to a nice rental car in Germany for a couple weeks. Just to drive around, experience it. There are dopes there too, but far fewer than here, and as you mention, situational awareness is in another universe.

ruking1

I did say Europe. However it is more like the continent. So autobahns are included. Europe as you know has slightly more passenger cars than us (270 M vs 258.8 (2009 figures) Driver and populations are similar. So it is more of a size equalization.

xrunner2

Shortly followed by an "active boomer" aged woman in a Venza weaving all over the place as she fiddled with her phone, likely a 3 generations old blackberry.

That is ignorant and disgusting. 3 generations old. How out of touch.

Seems like there are enough commercials on tv, magazine, newspaper ads that one would assume most everyone is well informed. Hopefully this "boomer woman's children and grandchildren, if she has them, are better informed and up-to-date. Let's hope that if she has grandchildren age 6 or older that they are not as backward as is she.

Recently, at a community event, I talked to a woman who said she is on SS and she showed me her new latest gen Iphone. She said her grandson gave it to her as a gift, but not the monthly service fee.

fintail

Europe is a lot more diverse than the USA. Even the most undeveloped places here pale in comparison to some backwards places on the continent, which by definition will have markedly higher casualty numbers - you find this even in Italy and Spain, not to mention the wild east. Hard comparison in some ways, but as you mention, not far off in others. I'd take the best of what they have over our best...but our worst over their worst.

fintail

Hopefully her kids tell her to put the brick down while she drives...or at worst be like one of those dopes who just jumped into 2004 and wears a bluetooth headset 20 hours a day...but they probably drive and yap/text too.

ruking1

Then really two fold better. First off, as I said better than Europes accident and fatality rate. Secondly our" BEST EVERY" absolutely lowest fatality and accident rate was achieve @ even higher speed limits and defacto speeds. Of course the NHTSA has political and (we hope) taxpayer bosses , so there has to be a few sacred cows to protect, i.e. "SPEED KILLS." Now I believe and hopefully most agree that inappropriate speed kills (they don't even get this in Pedestrian friendly San Francisco) like running @ any speed through a loaded crosswalk with the pedestrians having the right of way and being surprised you killed a score of people.

fintail

Another interesting stat would be first world Europe vs USA.

Speed doesn't kill. Speed makes money.

ruking1

Yes on both counts. But then you would have to cherry pick both first worlds.

Yes the math would indicate both assertions about speed to be true.

Here is a totally interesting but non related situation. For those that have ever taken off (more directly been) in a passenger plane taking off. It is absolute insanity to go 145+ mph on the ground with three hundred people+ in it. Think about it. They do not even make or have enough run away (if they can not get off the ground) to stop SAFELY !!!!! ???? Yet is is done EVERY DAY and THOUSANDS of times a day. ALL over the world. To boot it is considered one of the safest modes of transportation known.

fintail

No speed traps on runways? :shades:

Light rain today, even though it rains 400 days a year here (seriously), it brings out the idiots. Worst part was being stuck on a 40mph suburban arterial with two different but equally annoying simps. One was someone who looked like one of our nice H1B folks in a Civic, going about 28 in a 40, creating a little bottleneck as everyone went by. Other was an old suit in an early oughts Porsche Turbo cabrio who was trying to average about 55, weaving in and out. Funny thing, both of these speeds actually work for the negligently maintained (oh, I forgot, it's difficult work, so we should excuse the very well paid men who control it) traffic controls. But going the speed limit doesn't. Topped it off while jogging, I was in a crosswalk with a green walk signal, woman I won't describe in a late model Odyssey comes from behind me, turns left into the crosswalk, stops to let me cross - not noticing a 6'1" guy in a bright blue shirt until she is touching the crosswalk, so she is blocking both oncoming lanes. I stopped and let her go by rather than have her hold up traffic. I wonder what it costs to buy a license.

hammerhead

I wonder what it costs to buy a license.

Free. Bonus prize in the Cracker Jack box.

roadburner

I'm driving the MS3 in the left lane of a four lane urban road that squeezes down to two lanes(the road is clearly marked "Right Lane Ends- Merge Left"). A doofus in a new Cruze flies down the right lane to cut in front of those of us who have been driving in the left lane. His plan is thwarted by a slower car in front of him making a right turn. I pass the turning car just as it clears the right lane- so Cruze Boob guns it to get between me and the car in front of me. Problem is, the road is now @1.5 lanes wide. He blows the horn as if his predicament is my fault and pulls in behind me and flips me the bird. I ignore him; driving a Cruze is more punishment than I could ever heap on his head.

andres3

Right. At one time California proposed charging court costs even if you were acquitted at trial. I don't know if the state actually followed through with that scheme.

If they do that surely they see that they will be back slapped for civil lawsuits on the officers and/or prosecutors that brought forth the false accusation for those supposed "court" costs if you are acquitted.

andres3

There was a story on the news recently of several employees at the El Cajon, CA DMV office arrested on charges of fabricating and selling driver's licenses to people who didn't even quality, take the test, and/or pass any tests.

They said that to their knowledge no one with one of these fake licenses has killed or hurt anyone while using them. Probably mostly used to help illegal immigrants out, but still, El Cajon is quickly building a reputation for being more corrupt and criminal than the worst town in Mexico.

fintail

Wouldn't be a day here without morons. All this was within 30 minutes: First, an Escape runs a red light, close call with some old people in a 90s Cougar. Shockingly, no horn honks. Then I was in a supermarket parking lot, had a close call with a CTS driven by a demographic who likes Buicks (but not seniors, think about it) going the wrong way at a high rate. After I leave, I get beside a young woman in a trashed late 90s Passat going about 15 in a 30, as she is texting on the steering wheel hub. Then as I am heading home, someone similar to CTS driver, in a late model Lexus GX, freaks out in a turn lane, stops on green, holds up about 10 cars, because an oncoming car had a blinking yellow yield light and was waiting for her to go. I swear, money buys licenses. I soon passed her as once she turned she crawled, death grip on wheel, eyes straight ahead like a robot.

backy

I was turning left to enter a freeway this morning. Four-lane street with left turn lanes. I had the green light but not the turn arrow. Black Explorer is approaching in the left lane, so I wait. Then it slows down... and stops, right before the intersection. Then they turn right, onto the entrance ramp. No signal of course. Driver is a woman, looks to be 80-ish.

A good example of why behind-the-wheel tests should be required every few years beyond a certain age--70 maybe?

fintail

Legislators are afraid of voters, will never happen, unfortunately.

Not many dummies in my line of sight today, worst was a new driver in an Accent going 20-25 in a 35 and weaving all over the place..cars might belong in bike lanes in Bangalore, not so much here.

tjc78

Legislators are afraid of voters, will never happen, unfortunately

Yep, old people vote!

xrunner2

A good example of why behind-the-wheel tests should be required every few years beyond a certain age--70 maybe?

I would say 50, for men. For women, maybe 35. I see far more women than men driving carelessly, especially with regards to using cell phones as noted by them holding something to their heads. They blab, chatter more than men. Women drivers I see chatting on cell phone do not appear to be very old. Mostly in 30-50 bracket.

A day does not go by that I do not see multiple times women chatting, holding phone to head and incredibly making a turn with their vehicle with obviously only one hand on the steering wheel.

stever

And yet highway fatalities are at a 60 year low. (AZ Star)

ruking1

One can also check the NHTSA records, but I remember reading in passing that percentage and volume wise, more MEN get in accidents and fatalities than women. They also overwhelmingly are the ones who can be labeled "AGGRESSIVE" (aka unsafe, trolling for accidents etc.) Again this is in the context of THE ABSOLUTE BEST (LOWEST) fatality and accident rates since they have been measuring these things.

xrunner2

And yet highway fatalities are at a 60 year low.

So, is that attributable to "better" driving or: improvements in design of automobiles (structural, crush characteristics, air bags, belts, brakes, tires, suspension, stability, etc), improvements in design of roads, barriers, signs, etc, improvements in emergency response to crashes/accidents, improvements in hospital surgery other procedures to treat crash/accident victims.

ruking1

Since the rates are expressed per state 50 PLUS (I am sure the Obama references include a lot of weird places like DC and American Puerto Rico, American Samoa etc,

They are aggregated and normalized. So to say improvements in auto design, roads etc., etc. is much more complex to evaluate.

backy

Well, the idea of retesting as people get older is to make sure that someone is still mentally/physically competent to drive. NOT to retest someone because they occasionally drive in a inconsiderate/careless/idiotic fashion. I expect those folks will be on their best behavior during the road test. Might even put their cell phones away! :P

tjc78

I expect those folks will be on their best behavior during the road test. Might even put their cell phones away!

What they should do is test you cell phone in one hand, coffee in the other while fiddling with the radio. At some time during the test you should also have to either shave/apply makeup, and send/receive three text messages.

If you don't hit anything or cause a ten car pileup you pass! :shades:

fintail

And that's 100% because of safer cars and less miles being driven due to the new one worlder economy. It's going to be less than pretty out there when the boomers start getting really old but won't admit it.

Was out for a jog this morning, saw two honkers that made me laugh. First was the typical jerk in a big Suburban, honking at a Camry that wasn't moving at a green light. It couldn't, as the intersection was blocked due to a combination of stupid cross traffic and negligent traffic controls. Was the Camry supposed to t-bone the car blocking the road so the SUV driver could go through? When traffic finally moved, Suburban driver floors it and takes off down a side street. Second one involved a well kept woman in a RX rummaging through her purse in a turn lane at a red light. Light turns green, woman in a Mazda 3 behind her waits a sec then toots the horn, princess in the RX then gets all upset and starts waving her hands and making gestures. Should have started looking for your buy 10 get 1 free botox coupons before you started driving.

stever

Well, if you take Germany, you'll note that they require safety inspections every two years for passenger cars. Annually for heavier vehicles. So perhaps the cars in your area aren't as safe as you think they are? Washington just has emissions inspections, right?

Pennsylvania swears their safety inspection program saves lives and money. (PennLive)

Wiki says that 18 US states have a periodic safety inspection program. I've lived in six states and only one city had any sort of safety inspection. That was Chattanooga in the 70s and they dropped it shortly after I moved across the state.

That said, I'm not convinced from the limited experience I've had with the safety inspection program. Germany's could be a different ball of wax though, and could account for some of their good fatalities number.

stever

Men are more than twice as likely to die in a car crash than women

Found a link saying just that. Men drive more miles though. (crashstuff.com)

ruking1

Any good statistician would have corrected/normalized for that. Otherwise it is as you imply, misleading and mis characterizing. So given the post mortem (RIP) 73% by definition is a majority and overwhelmingly so.

So called "BETTER" EVIDENTLY really does not help the fatality statistics. In fact if men were/are " better" drivers, being a better driver works against men! Again IF true, being a mediocre to crappy driver works in FAVOR of women. It is however a teaser for follow up articles.

imidazol97

>Men are more than twice as likely to die in a car crash than women
... Men drive more miles though.

More men are killed in wars too.

This stuff gets into misuse of statistics. The data has to be analyzed to be sure apples are compared to apples--not what politicians do. One example of bad statistics is that women are paid less than men, but in most cases men have been on the job longer and have not had to take leaves to rear small children, e.g. But yet the faux statisticians will compare them. Same for highways and accidents.

ruking1

The war part is by design. When the military is 106 M/100 F (mirrors birth rate) and there are the same ratios in ALL sections of the services, then that will signal Congress is SERIOUS about equality. Till then, it's lip service. It has been lip service since before the country was founded. So for example it was by DESIGN that only (young) men were DRAFTED for military service in the Vietnam ERA. This is not to say that women did NOT volunteer.

LIke I have said about the data being normalized for traffic statistics....

fintail

When I say safer cars, I am more referring to engineering than safety inspections. While I believe that safety inspections are important (WA only has them for cars re-registered after salvage title and I think some from out of state also require it), vehicle design is more important. And simply, cars crash better now at high speeds than they did in the past.

Regarding the German comparison, there is something even more important than their stringent inspection tests - better trained drivers, and a more focused mentality about driving in general.

aghosh

So you can tell a person's visa status by looking at him for few seconds. Interesting. At least you have graduated from " dimuniitive Asians in Lexuses".

Can we just have inconsiderate driver stories without reference to how the offending driver looked like or their VISA statuses?

fintail

I can make an educated guess, yes. Perhaps if you lived in my neighborhood, you could too. Locals can back me up on it. Additionally, bad form to use quotation marks when not quoting verbatim, and if you don't like my form, you are free to see my name and skip to the next post...it will save you some ire or heartache

stever

Annoyed neighbors hoist speed demon's car into tree (MSNBC)

fintail

Yeah, that 20 year old Escort looks pretty hot. Ah Poland :confuse: ...maybe he accidentally hit a roadside stand full of wooden woodburning stoves and solar powered flashlights :shades: