I don't think most brake tappers are doing it do disengage cruise though. I see that stunt pulled usually in moderate traffic volume situations - where nobody would use cruise. These people don't have the ability and spatial awareness to modulate speed without a brake tap. They only understand two inputs - brake and gas. These are the same people who will slam on the brakes on an icy road, slide off, and be mystified about what happened, or will distractedly overcook it into a turn, panic and let off, spin and crash, and not understand.
If that is true (I truly do not know why, as I tested it on my anecdotal side), when you get the FARS, click here on the "MAP features" on top of the screen.
Ya, but that's a static PDF file, right? I was looking for the map that I could zoom in on and look at wrecks. Or maybe I just need to make another pot of coffee?
What I'm complaining about is brake lights that signify a significant loss of speed and for no apparent reason.
First, there is not a "significant loss of speed" involved here. Second, this is not a case of someone braking for no reason, when someone is close enough to be affected. In heavy traffic, when a tap on the brakes might be an issue, cruise wouldn't be engaged in the first place... unless that's something you do?
1) Braking on the freeway when no one is within a mile in front of you in your lane.
What if there's no one behind you, either? (If a tree falls in the forest...) Anyway, there's many legitimate reasons to touch the brakes while on the freeway... e.g., disengage cruise to prepare to exit; realizing you're going too fast for conditions (especially when your radar detector bleeps at you--right?); avoiding an idiot who isn't yet in your lane but will be REAL soon; etc.
If there isn't anyone in front or in back, it doesn't matter.
And those 'legitimate' reasons aren't legitimate at all.
If you want to disengage your cruise control, press the dang 'cancel' button! For heaven's sake, if you have a mile of empty road before the next car, braking ISN'T needed. Which leads to the second point.
If you are going too fast, TAKE YOUR FOOT OFF THE GAS and coast to the slower speed!
And if there is an idiot in your lane a mile away, you have the time to slow down or move over. If you can't do that in a mile on an empty highway, you need to give up driving as you are a hazard to life and limb.
More like someone who can't operate a car via anything but sharp throttle and brake inputs. The same lesser mortals you see flooring it from a light, and then slamming on the brakes on red. Where there is any traffic volume present, I would wager a substantial amount of gold that cruise is virtually never the reason.
I'd agree, a cruise control brake light shutoff has never forced me to alter my inputs sharply.
Usually it is braking for another reason or non-reason that I find inconsiderate.
I suppose if there's a hundred cars in front of me, all reacting swiftly to brake lights and slamming the brakes (even though the front car barely slowed down, if at all), that would make me have to face the domino effect of slowed down vehicles, and slow down myself, but it's unlikely you have that many terrible mindless lemmings on the road.
'18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
Come to the Seattle area. 405 around Renton is notorious for the situation you describe. Traffic will crawl for a mile for no reason other than a couple "drivers" randomly wanted to slow down.
More like someone who can't operate a car via anything but sharp throttle and brake inputs. The same lesser mortals you see flooring it from a light, and then slamming on the brakes on red.
Since I never do that, but have been known to touch the brake pedal to disengage cruise when I know I have to slow down anyway, I'd say your assertion is flawed.
And I would wager you are not using cruise with any volume of traffic around you, so I assert that your assumption of my assertion is defective. The context is brake tapping impacting other vehicles. If you're cruising on a fairly open road and have to tap the brakes to disengage cruise instead of using a smoother method, there's no problem. Tapping brakes with traffic behind (or using cruise in any moderate or above traffic volume) is the problem.
If you're cruising on a fairly open road and have to tap the brakes to disengage cruise instead of using a smoother method, there's no problem.
Smoother? Tapping the brakes to disengage cruise keeps both hands firmly planted on the wheel. Disengaging cruise with your hand does not. You wouldn't advocate unsafe driving practices, would you? We know how much you hate it when drivers don't have both hands properly placed on the wheel.
If you want to disengage your cruise control, press the dang 'cancel' button! For heaven's sake, if you have a mile of empty road before the next car, braking ISN'T needed. Which leads to the second point.
Not everyone HAS a cancel button! My Saturn in the mid-'90s didn't, but I still had a sneaky way to disengage w/o brake lights. I'd just lightly tap the clutch, because that had a really sensitive cruise switch. Can't remember if it's the Caravan or the Expedition that I have to drive sometimes at work, but one of those STILL doesn't have a cancel button, and I'm turning the cruise control off and on way too much because I hate tapping the brake to disengage.
But my point remains... not everyone has a cancel button.
If you are going too fast, TAKE YOUR FOOT OFF THE GAS and coast to the slower speed!
Agreed 100 percent. But a lot of people will see someone in front of them and hope they will intimidate them into going faster, or something... then you see them climbing all over the brakes to avoid rear-ending them.
Smoother. Tapping the brakes is the clumsiest way to disengage cruise. And randomly hitting the brakes with any volume of traffic behind you is inconsiderate.
I've never said anything about having both hands on the wheel, I've only commented on bad hand positioning, especially idiotic underhand stuff (often seen by people holding phone/drink/food), and freaked-out deathgrips often practiced by the timid who shouldn't be driving at all. I can disengage cruise on my car with the quick flick of a hand. But I am at least a notch above the lowest common denominator we all should supposedly embrace and coddle.
I would agree. Indeed, what is wrong with hitting the button, the button one hits to engage it !? Activating the brake lights (like most folks don't know it does) to disengage the CC is damn inconsiderate.
You are both missing something here. This was not just about disengaging cruise. It was about disengaging cruise in the process of exiting the freeway. Since exit ramps can be as slow as 15-20 mph, braking will be involved... unless you advocate disengaging cruise while still far off from the exit ramp, meaning you are slowing down while in the traffic lane thus risking impeding traffic.
So if you're going to brake anyway, why not take one action vs. two?
Actually, the original context was hitting the brakes for no reason. We've all seen it. Whether or not we want to admit it often shows a lack of driving ability is another question.
If one is exiting, as in the far right or exit lane, sure, tap away.
You are both missing something here. This was not just about disengaging cruise. It was about disengaging cruise in the process of exiting the freeway. Since exit ramps can be as slow as 15-20 mph, braking will be involved... unless you advocate disengaging cruise while still far off from the exit ramp, meaning you are slowing down while in the traffic lane thus risking impeding traffic.
This makes no sense at all.
If you are exiting a freeway, you flick the cruise control off with enough distance before entering the off ramp. That results in a minor slowdown equal to what happens with a normal, non-cruise control exit (ie: no more than 1-2 seconds prior to entering the off-ramp). You don't break in the main highway lanes prior to entering an off-ramp.
Depends on the freeway and the traffic conditions.
One example is where an onramp enters the freeway and the merge lane is the same one you need to get on to take the nearby exit ramp; often you have to brake to adjust your speed to the traffic that's trying to merge into your lane while you are trying to merge into theirs. It's really an issue when you are one of the few people trying to get off on a downtown exit when everyone else is trying to bug out at the end of a workday.
Well I think YOU are missing something. Most freeway off ramps are designed in such a way as to be exited WITHOUT braking !! Since you insist on making the exception the rule , it is no wonder than the exceptions indeed become the rule. :lemon: Now this is not to rule out the so called "defective" designed off and on ramps.
Exactly. There are many different conditions. Some people must never encounter the kinds of exit ramps we have in the Midwest, which include cloverleafs and other exit ramps that are shared with entrance ramps.
If one turns off cruise (which is not a good idea if you are entering another freeway with intent to use cruise there) 1-2 seconds before entering one of those kinds of exit ramps, you're begging for either a collision or hitting the ramp at too high a speed.
Now, if this is near downtown at the end of a workday, odds are you shouldn't be using cruise in the first place.
But all this consternation about the suggestion that tapping the brakes to deactivate cruise in some situations is either inconsiderate or dangerous is... a head-scratcher. Maybe these folks need to go out East for a few days, where there's some REAL problems.
Had a number of morons on the road this afternoon.
The first one was in a brand-new Jaguar who decided that the best speed to take one highway's off-ramp, one that merges onto another highway - no less, at 15mph. Then, only after merging onto the new highway at that self-same speed, did he leisurely accelerate from 15 to 50 mph.
Which caused a cavalcade of cars (more than 5 at one time) changing lanes to avoid rear-ending the rat b@st@rd.
Then, when exiting that highway to merge onto yet another one (on a very gentle ramp - posted speed limit of 50), the nice SUV driver found his driving skills unable to cope, so he slowed down to 25mph. Obviously, that was the limit of his driving skills!
And lastly, when merging from that highway onto the last highway I need to get home... taking a left lane exit, no less, the ever-so-pleasant driver at the head of a 40-car line thought it appropriate to drive at 50mph on a highway with a posted speed limit of 65.
I ended up passing all but the very first car in the middle lane (to ease your concerns, the second car's left half-a-football field's length of empty space between him and the lead slowpoke).
Unfortunately, that lead car also thought it very appropriate to take that off-ramp (posted limit 50) at 30mph. And that exit/on-ramp merged onto a highway's far-left, passing lane. So, yet again... I'm merging onto a highway behind a fool that will not speed up to the rate of traffic on the highway they are merging onto.
But then, after slowly accelerating to 55 mph in the left-hand lane of yet another highway whose posted limit was 65mph... the driver decides to move right (yaay!). However, as soon as he gets over to the rightmost lane, he then guns the engine and catapults away at over 70mph.
My thoughts on that were: "Why the @#$% couldn't that driver go 70 in the passing lane?!?"
If one turns off cruise (which is not a good idea if you are entering another freeway with intent to use cruise there) 1-2 seconds before entering one of those kinds of exit ramps, you're begging for either a collision or hitting the ramp at too high a speed.
Again, this doesn't make sense.
You get into the off-ramp lane while coasting... AND THEN BRAKE. You don't brake first, then get into the off-ramp. That just slows down traffic and creates a potential for a rear-end collision.
Some people are having a tough time grasping the idea of context. The brake tapping complaints were originally explained away by claiming some use that method to disengage cruise control. But the brake tapping was complained about because it is an annoyance in traffic, where nobody uses cruise anyway. The cruise control slant is at best a red herring.
If you are using cruise in significant traffic environments, and then canceling it via a brake tap, you are probably both inconsiderate and dangerous.
Just be a little more considerate as a driver yourself and share the road. All of this angst about other people's psychological motivation for tapping their brake lights on is funny in that it's being taken as an example of someone's being inconsiderate. I wonder what Dr. Phil would say?
If everyone would just be consider and not try to race their way to the exit, all this emotional projection onto the other drivers is just wasting bandwidth.
There's a 15 mph exit ramp not far from me. Very very sharp curve. I like using it when I go on test drives... the road it leads to is good for testing also. Sure, you'd probably try to take it at 50 in your supercar. This is Minnesnowta however, not California. It was 25 this morning. (Water freezes at... what temperature?) A very short ramp also, coming off a 65 mph posted freeway. Yeah, that's one you'd want to touch the brakes for to slow down before entering... just deactivating cruise would put you into the guard rail, or tie up traffic behind you because you have to kill the cruise too far before the ramp.
Try driving on someone else's roads for awhile, before passing judgment.
Why does sharing the road only have to do with making way for slowpokes? Seems like sharing is a one way street.
I don't recall the "psychological motivation" of brake tappers being discussed. Dr. Phil...his pseudo-psychobabble doesn't rank very high among many when it comes to cred :shades:
Randomly tapping brakes speaks of inability to me, and is inconsiderate.
You get into the off-ramp lane while coasting... AND THEN BRAKE. You don't brake first, then get into the off-ramp. That just slows down traffic and creates a potential for a rear-end collision.
Around Louisville, they do coast until they hit the decel lane (which are often quite short). Only problem is they seem to coast for a half a mile!
I've often found myself as the "inconsiderate" because I'll keep my speed at 65-70 and pass a whole line of cars, then get a little aggressive getting in the last couple hundred yards to exit, because I really don't want to coast all the way down to 45-50 for the last half mile.
Roadburner, it's that long sweeping left-hander on the Snyder before the LaGrange Road exit.
Now if the compression was happening because people had to slow down for a 25-30mph cloverleaf ramp, I'd cut these drivers a little more slack and fall in line sooner... like I do for the very outdated 64/Snyder interchange.
Same here, it was my old exit. Capital Beltway inner loop, Georgina Avenue north. It's a virtual hairpin, and off camber to make matters worse.
I'm not even sure the tallest vehicles can manage 15mph.
The worst part is they repaved the exit yet it remains off camber. That turn almost needs banking. They removed some of the curbing probably to prevent "tripping" cars and making them roll over there.
It's exit 31A, label is in green. What the image doesn't show is your car leans to the outside on that ramp. Note the long run-off, which is used often.
The funny thing is there is a white car on that ramp that appears to be understeering and struggling to stay within the lines!
Minnesnowta has Summers too, does it not? Are there seasons up there?
25 degree temperatures would make my summer tires inappropriate for conditions. If I were to crash, it would be driver error in not driving on proper equipment (in this case proper tires), and not speeding that would be the cause of the accident on that very sharp curve. :P
'18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
The funny thing is there is a white car on that ramp that appears to be understeering and struggling to stay within the lines!
Hard to say if it's understeering or not without being there. The driver might just be making a very late apex possible by staying on the outside and then shoot out at high speed onto the straight-away by maximizing his exit speed.
That lane is very wide. I wouldn't call it extremely sharp. You could easily fit two average cars going side-by-side on that exit ramp; it's so wide!
'18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
Hey I think I'm gonna be in your neck of the woods next week (Vienna, VA).
Maybe I'll take the rental car over to that 31A exit and test my fate as I'll be in town on business (so I'll test my fate at the end of the workday; just in case. Hahaha.
I could do 10 runs and report my fastest speed here.
'18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
>had a phone in one hand and a coffee in the other (aka the Seattle turn)
Early morning had a C280 in a purplish darker red pull out in front of me from a nursing home. I expected it to be the elderly relative who had visited their spouse or loved one and couldn't speed near the limit on the boulevard. After the person slowed down more with their burned out taillamp, I passed on the right. I found a blond, older but not elderly, lady eating some kind of bar or brownie as I passed.
I tried to analyze why she didn't speed up to the speed limit of 35 and why she tapped her brake light to just harrass me behind her. I just assumed she was an overworked nurse or administrator. Worse she stayed in the left lane of the boulevard her whole distance and turned left at the light a mile away.
Tight short exits usually imply more dense development, tract housing or commercial anyway.
Red herring alert!
But just so you know, this exit was NOT in a dense area--actually in a wilderness area near a river. Meaning lots of condensation on those cold clear mornings... yes, on road surfaces too.
Ever see those signs ala "Bridges ice before roads"? Applies to elevated ramps, too.
Want to nit-pick this some more about an exit you've never seen, or should we move on?
Comments
First, there is not a "significant loss of speed" involved here. Second, this is not a case of someone braking for no reason, when someone is close enough to be affected. In heavy traffic, when a tap on the brakes might be an issue, cruise wouldn't be engaged in the first place... unless that's something you do?
I guess we have another driver who uses cruise in heavy traffic?
What if there's no one behind you, either? (If a tree falls in the forest...) Anyway, there's many legitimate reasons to touch the brakes while on the freeway... e.g., disengage cruise to prepare to exit; realizing you're going too fast for conditions (especially when your radar detector bleeps at you--right?); avoiding an idiot who isn't yet in your lane but will be REAL soon; etc.
If there isn't anyone in front or in back, it doesn't matter.
And those 'legitimate' reasons aren't legitimate at all.
If you want to disengage your cruise control, press the dang 'cancel' button! For heaven's sake, if you have a mile of empty road before the next car, braking ISN'T needed. Which leads to the second point.
If you are going too fast, TAKE YOUR FOOT OFF THE GAS and coast to the slower speed!
And if there is an idiot in your lane a mile away, you have the time to slow down or move over. If you can't do that in a mile on an empty highway, you need to give up driving as you are a hazard to life and limb.
:mad: :mad: :mad:
Exactly. Much ado about nothing, IMO. Way too much angst over whether someone touches a brake pedal when there's no inconvenience to anyone.
Usually it is braking for another reason or non-reason that I find inconsiderate.
I suppose if there's a hundred cars in front of me, all reacting swiftly to brake lights and slamming the brakes (even though the front car barely slowed down, if at all), that would make me have to face the domino effect of slowed down vehicles, and slow down myself, but it's unlikely you have that many terrible mindless lemmings on the road.
Since I never do that, but have been known to touch the brake pedal to disengage cruise when I know I have to slow down anyway, I'd say your assertion is flawed.
Smoother? Tapping the brakes to disengage cruise keeps both hands firmly planted on the wheel. Disengaging cruise with your hand does not. You wouldn't advocate unsafe driving practices, would you? We know how much you hate it when drivers don't have both hands properly placed on the wheel.
Not everyone HAS a cancel button! My Saturn in the mid-'90s didn't, but I still had a sneaky way to disengage w/o brake lights. I'd just lightly tap the clutch, because that had a really sensitive cruise switch. Can't remember if it's the Caravan or the Expedition that I have to drive sometimes at work, but one of those STILL doesn't have a cancel button, and I'm turning the cruise control off and on way too much because I hate tapping the brake to disengage.
But my point remains... not everyone has a cancel button.
If you are going too fast, TAKE YOUR FOOT OFF THE GAS and coast to the slower speed!
Agreed 100 percent. But a lot of people will see someone in front of them and hope they will intimidate them into going faster, or something... then you see them climbing all over the brakes to avoid rear-ending them.
"It's awfully hard to dispute this in court," Wojas said.
Sounds like more lazy law enforcement to me!
I've never said anything about having both hands on the wheel, I've only commented on bad hand positioning, especially idiotic underhand stuff (often seen by people holding phone/drink/food), and freaked-out deathgrips often practiced by the timid who shouldn't be driving at all. I can disengage cruise on my car with the quick flick of a hand. But I am at least a notch above the lowest common denominator we all should supposedly embrace and coddle.
So if you're going to brake anyway, why not take one action vs. two?
In this case, it is not a "random tapping", it is a legitimate maneuver, and as such is probably beyond the topic of this conversation?
If one is exiting, as in the far right or exit lane, sure, tap away.
This makes no sense at all.
If you are exiting a freeway, you flick the cruise control off with enough distance before entering the off ramp. That results in a minor slowdown equal to what happens with a normal, non-cruise control exit (ie: no more than 1-2 seconds prior to entering the off-ramp). You don't break in the main highway lanes prior to entering an off-ramp.
That's a recipe for a rear-end collision.
:mad:
One example is where an onramp enters the freeway and the merge lane is the same one you need to get on to take the nearby exit ramp; often you have to brake to adjust your speed to the traffic that's trying to merge into your lane while you are trying to merge into theirs. It's really an issue when you are one of the few people trying to get off on a downtown exit when everyone else is trying to bug out at the end of a workday.
If one turns off cruise (which is not a good idea if you are entering another freeway with intent to use cruise there) 1-2 seconds before entering one of those kinds of exit ramps, you're begging for either a collision or hitting the ramp at too high a speed.
Now, if this is near downtown at the end of a workday, odds are you shouldn't be using cruise in the first place.
But all this consternation about the suggestion that tapping the brakes to deactivate cruise in some situations is either inconsiderate or dangerous is... a head-scratcher. Maybe these folks need to go out East for a few days, where there's some REAL problems.
The first one was in a brand-new Jaguar who decided that the best speed to take one highway's off-ramp, one that merges onto another highway - no less, at 15mph. Then, only after merging onto the new highway at that self-same speed, did he leisurely accelerate from 15 to 50 mph.
Which caused a cavalcade of cars (more than 5 at one time) changing lanes to avoid rear-ending the rat b@st@rd.
Then, when exiting that highway to merge onto yet another one (on a very gentle ramp - posted speed limit of 50), the nice SUV driver found his driving skills unable to cope, so he slowed down to 25mph. Obviously, that was the limit of his driving skills!
And lastly, when merging from that highway onto the last highway I need to get home... taking a left lane exit, no less, the ever-so-pleasant driver at the head of a 40-car line thought it appropriate to drive at 50mph on a highway with a posted speed limit of 65.
I ended up passing all but the very first car in the middle lane (to ease your concerns, the second car's left half-a-football field's length of empty space between him and the lead slowpoke).
Unfortunately, that lead car also thought it very appropriate to take that off-ramp (posted limit 50) at 30mph. And that exit/on-ramp merged onto a highway's far-left, passing lane. So, yet again... I'm merging onto a highway behind a fool that will not speed up to the rate of traffic on the highway they are merging onto.
But then, after slowly accelerating to 55 mph in the left-hand lane of yet another highway whose posted limit was 65mph... the driver decides to move right (yaay!). However, as soon as he gets over to the rightmost lane, he then guns the engine and catapults away at over 70mph.
My thoughts on that were: "Why the @#$% couldn't that driver go 70 in the passing lane?!?"
Again, this doesn't make sense.
You get into the off-ramp lane while coasting... AND THEN BRAKE. You don't brake first, then get into the off-ramp. That just slows down traffic and creates a potential for a rear-end collision.
Guy at the end deserves capital punishment. Jag driver probably does too - makes one wonder where the money comes from.
Some people are having a tough time grasping the idea of context. The brake tapping complaints were originally explained away by claiming some use that method to disengage cruise control. But the brake tapping was complained about because it is an annoyance in traffic, where nobody uses cruise anyway. The cruise control slant is at best a red herring.
If you are using cruise in significant traffic environments, and then canceling it via a brake tap, you are probably both inconsiderate and dangerous.
If everyone would just be consider and not try to race their way to the exit, all this emotional projection onto the other drivers is just wasting bandwidth.
Courtesy. Share the road.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Try driving on someone else's roads for awhile, before passing judgment.
Was it damp and 25, or clear and dry at 25? Water can't freeze if it's not there...
I don't recall the "psychological motivation" of brake tappers being discussed. Dr. Phil...his pseudo-psychobabble doesn't rank very high among many when it comes to cred :shades:
Randomly tapping brakes speaks of inability to me, and is inconsiderate.
Around Louisville, they do coast until they hit the decel lane (which are often quite short). Only problem is they seem to coast for a half a mile!
I've often found myself as the "inconsiderate" because I'll keep my speed at 65-70 and pass a whole line of cars, then get a little aggressive getting in the last couple hundred yards to exit, because I really don't want to coast all the way down to 45-50 for the last half mile.
Roadburner, it's that long sweeping left-hander on the Snyder before the LaGrange Road exit.
Now if the compression was happening because people had to slow down for a 25-30mph cloverleaf ramp, I'd cut these drivers a little more slack and fall in line sooner... like I do for the very outdated 64/Snyder interchange.
Same here, it was my old exit. Capital Beltway inner loop, Georgina Avenue north. It's a virtual hairpin, and off camber to make matters worse.
I'm not even sure the tallest vehicles can manage 15mph.
The worst part is they repaved the exit yet it remains off camber. That turn almost needs banking. They removed some of the curbing probably to prevent "tripping" cars and making them roll over there.
http://goo.gl/maps/ZddYw
It's exit 31A, label is in green. What the image doesn't show is your car leans to the outside on that ramp. Note the long run-off, which is used often.
The funny thing is there is a white car on that ramp that appears to be understeering and struggling to stay within the lines!
Clear morning with lots of condensation... you figure the rest out.
Minnesnowta has Summers too, does it not? Are there seasons up there?
25 degree temperatures would make my summer tires inappropriate for conditions. If I were to crash, it would be driver error in not driving on proper equipment (in this case proper tires), and not speeding that would be the cause of the accident on that very sharp curve. :P
Hard to say if it's understeering or not without being there. The driver might just be making a very late apex possible by staying on the outside and then shoot out at high speed onto the straight-away by maximizing his exit speed.
That lane is very wide. I wouldn't call it extremely sharp. You could easily fit two average cars going side-by-side on that exit ramp; it's so wide!
Condensation on cars or roads? Not always hand in hand.
Maybe I'll take the rental car over to that 31A exit and test my fate as I'll be in town on business (so I'll test my fate at the end of the workday; just in case. Hahaha.
I could do 10 runs and report my fastest speed here.
I remember visiting Seattle many many years ago and noticing there were a lot of Starbucks coffee shops around. Nowadays, the whole US is like that.
Early morning had a C280 in a purplish darker red pull out in front of me from a nursing home. I expected it to be the elderly relative who had visited their spouse or loved one and couldn't speed near the limit on the boulevard. After the person slowed down more with their burned out taillamp, I passed on the right. I found a blond, older but not elderly, lady eating some kind of bar or brownie as I passed.
I tried to analyze why she didn't speed up to the speed limit of 35 and why she tapped her brake light to just harrass me behind her. I just assumed she was an overworked nurse or administrator. Worse she stayed in the left lane of the boulevard her whole distance and turned left at the light a mile away.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Yeah, but the shoulder has loose gravel and debris, so if you use it you're really skidding off.
Undertaking is often the only way out. Eating and driving should be treated like yapping and driving.
Sure, it's just not summer all year as in SoCal. We can have ice 6-7 months out of the year even in the southern half of the state.
Red herring alert!
But just so you know, this exit was NOT in a dense area--actually in a wilderness area near a river. Meaning lots of condensation on those cold clear mornings... yes, on road surfaces too.
Ever see those signs ala "Bridges ice before roads"? Applies to elevated ramps, too.
Want to nit-pick this some more about an exit you've never seen, or should we move on?