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Inconsiderate Drivers (share your stories, etc.)

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  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,934
    Insurance claims departments always err on the conservative side of DV

    When you say they err on the conservative side, the conservative side for who? That could be interpreted both ways. Conservative as in they pay enough so that no one can argue the DV claim should be for more, or conservative in that they don't ever want to overpay a DV claim?
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    In DC he'd also be shaving at the same time.

    TRUE STORY: an XC90 drove right in to the fender of my NA Miata like she wanted to drive over me. Said she never saw me. Mind you we were crawling forward at 0-5 mph so she had all the time in the world to look.

    Bright white car, recently repaint from the previous minivan that also tried to drive over my fender.

    I was on my 3rd fender already when I sold it. :D
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    Of course she didn't see you. She was a busy "supermom" with a hectic schedule ahead of her. Don't pay attention to the hired help, doesn't count.

    I can drive the fintail and have people pull out in front of me like I wasn't there. It's not that they don't see, they don't look. Slowly but surely driving in the US will become as it is in Brazil or Russia, only without the manual driving skill, and the tolerated bribery to get one out of small jams.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    will become as it is in Brazil

    No way, man!

    In Brazil they SEE you, they just don't care! LOL

    Or they make it a point to out-race you to an open slot.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    Hmm...I see the fatality rate in Brazil is about 50% higher than here, guess that explains it. And the US is more than double that of Germany. Speed kills!
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,934
    Speed kills!

    They just celebrated the grand opening of the 41 miles stretch of interstate in TX that has newly minted 85 MPH speed limits.

    I'm expecting the news reports of carnage, spilled blood, and twisted metal to be coming in daily now according to some posters here.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Fatality numbers would be heavily skewed due to the fact that 99.9999999999% of the cars on Brazilian roads are B-segment or smaller.

    The other 0.00000000001% are the old trucks that run in to them and kill them.

    Did I get the right number of zeros? :D
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Had to deal with 2nd hand smoke from a guy sitting in traffic in front of me, smoking away.

    I backed off and left a gap, then people start honking.

    Top down that's just one of the things you have to deal with.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    Or that people just drive insanely. Probably with better skills than here though.

    For the smoker...oh the sacrifices endured by the convertible driver.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Both - insane driving in econoboxes.

    Life is rough I tell ya!
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited October 2012
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,689
    People started honking? I haven't had that happen. More often what happens when I leave reasonable gaps in heavy traffic is other drivers backfill it from other lanes. It's not as if it gets them anywhere, but they seem to feel better about it! Eh, no biggie - I'm just doing my part! :P
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    DC, it sometimes has a tinge of northeaster jerkiness, I think.

    I don't see tons of reasonable gaps here - everyone is either 1" off the bumper in front of them, or 10 car lengths behind.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    Those debunk a lot of myths, eh
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited October 2012
    Well, yes, you and I both joke about the "SPEED" kills mantra. Germany for a "country" where a 45 passenger bus can go 55 mph, while a passenger vehicle along side pushes 80 mph (defacto autobahn limits) pass to 155+ mph does NOT explain the much lower fatality rates over the US figures: as " GOOD" as ours ARE !!

    One of the things I take away from the comparisons are that we might "FEEL" safer with 65 mph speed limits, but the much higher fatality RATES show purposeful higher (German) speeds to be REALLY safer. Flame suit on and activated. ;)
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,934
    The low speed limit pushers in this country will continue to make excuses and provide bogus reasons for the discrepancies in safety statistics.

    They simply believe in false logic; that's all there is to it.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    DC, it sometimes has a tinge of northeaster jerkiness, I think.

    I'd agree with that. Not as bad as NY, where cabbies will lean over and bang on cars, and horns wear out.

    DC gets only a little snow and freezing ice, also, so people here never really learn to drive in foul weather, either.
  • victor23victor23 Member Posts: 201
    driving in the US will become as it is in Brazil or Russia

    It is not always easy to interpret statistics by country. It is the same like homicides and gun laws: in some countries with weapons bans they are way lower than here, while in others countries with even the stricter bans they are much higher. Too many other factors are at interplay. Also, I am not sure that small cars are inherently more dangerous if all cars on the road are small; the relative size is what matters.

    I cannot attest too much about the most recent driving trends in Brazil and Russia, I can only say how it used to be. Very important factors contributing to fatalities there are mostly old and very old vehicles lacking safety features (typically one driver's airbag or none), lacking proper maintenance, and mostly very poor roads (save for a few freeways). As concerns driving, the most notable differences are: in both countries (as opposed to the USA) driving is still a privilege, not a universal right, so the drivers are typically more competent, but more aggressive too. They are probably less "inconsiderate" on average, but when they are, it is on purpose, and not because of lack of attention. In Russia, an aggressive driving style attests to your prowess and overall human worthiness. In Brazil, not so much, but is still a coolness factor. In this country, even a bit spirited driving is typically perceived like a character flaw and a possible sign of some "personal problems".

    There are, of course, big differences also between big-city driving (more tense and aggressive, but people usually adhere to most basic rules, if only for their own safety), and rural driving (in Russia, too many rural drivers are just plain drunk) or, FTM, suffocating suburban and smaller-city driving in this country. Well, there is also a complete mess which defies any classification, like, say, in India, but not in Brazil or Russia.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    edited October 2012
    Which is maybe why newbies from India are often kind of clueless when they drive here - maybe they are just scared of cars from the mess at home. Being first generation motorists hurts too.

    Certainly safe cars are a factor. Also likely even less training than here, a more corrupt law enforcement system, and a general "anything goes" attitude that applies to most other aspects of life as well.

    This video reminds me of ateixera mentioning the small cars in Brazil - the big old tank crashes better than the tin cans:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jfato_55w8
  • victor23victor23 Member Posts: 201
    Would agree with everything but less training. Well, at least in the past, in both countries (Brazil, Russia) most drivers had to attend some driver's school, to pass tests (technical/car construction and function in Russia; traffic laws (multiple choice) and driving test in both countries, pretty similar to USA, but also included backing into the parking slot), and to pass a medical exam. Often formality, to be sure, but still much more comprehensive than a quick vision test here. Medical exam must be retaken ~every 5 years or even more ofter for seniors.

    Some basic emergency handling was taught in Russia (but regrettably not required at testing); foul weather was common though. In Brazil, I questioned the qualifications of many driving instructors who typically taught leaving the car in gear at traffic lights (with the clutch disengaged, naturally). I think, they took inspiration from their North American colleagues, but kept forgetting the difference between automatic and manual transmission.

    And yes, small bribing often made a part of the whole experience in Russia, no matter your skills and training.
  • bobw3bobw3 Member Posts: 2,989
    They just celebrated the grand opening of the 41 miles stretch of interstate in TX that has newly minted 85 MPH speed limits.

    WOW GREAT!!! Now I'll drive that 41 miles 4 minutes faster then if I was going 75mph!!

    ...and if you filled German roads with average American drivers then I'll bet the accident rates would go through the roof!
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Actually those folks would be more than happy to take your monies, and probably would have no issues if you went 55 mph, albeit in the slow lane.

    The same would be true for those American drivers wanting to go 55 mph on German Autobahn's.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Except that everyone else will be going 95.
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 18,339
    I really think you need to start a blog or magazine that appeals to appliance operators like yourself. May I suggest some potential titles?

    How about:

    Piddlers and Pods?
    Trundling in Toasters?
    Pious in my Prius?
    Righteous Right Laners?
    Slow but Superior?

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
    Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
    Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Works !
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    That's what I was getting at, bribery. I suspect it works a lot easier there than here. Although seriously, it must exist here too - how does some of this stuff get on the road otherwise?

    Backing into a spot? Some seem to think that's the inferior way :shades:

    Saw a few idiots today. First was the worst - got behind an early Mazda 6 that was driving normal for awhile, but eventually got to 5 under the limit on a wide open road, weaving all over and hugging the fog line. Dark tinted windows of course, but I suspect phone yapping. As the guy rides that right line, I flash my lights, and he straightens out, but doesn't speed up. Road ahead widens, so I move past, and he (little poster child for roid rage) rolls down his window and yells a I go by. Didn't get a chance to see, as I got to a whopping 10 over for a few seconds, and was past him like he was parked. Then saw a fancy new F150 4x4 urban cowboy special, commercial tax dodger plates, weaving in and out of traffic without once using a signal. I wonder what kind of small businesses uses that as a write off.

    Noticed something annoying today - people can't make u-turns. A Focus hopping a curb made me start observing others (lots of permitted u-turns in my town). Some go insanely slow, others seem afraid to turn the wheel fully, others cut in front of oncoming traffic.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,676
    Tailgaters & LLD's:

    The Associated Press

    GARY, Ind. —
    Indiana State Police have a new tool to determine whether drivers are tailgating and should get a ticket.

    Laser speed guns used by troopers can capture the time elapsed between the back bumper of one vehicle and the front bumper of the one behind it. The guns also take an accurate image of the license plate and driver's face.

    Two of the guns, which cost $5,500 apiece, have been deployed along the Borman Expressway, the Post-Tribune reported (http://bit.ly/S0d8SX ).

    Sgt. Ann Wojas said every Indiana State Police district will eventually receive one of the guns.

    Anyone traveling within 2 seconds of the nearest vehicle is considered too close and can be ticketed. Wojas said the fine for following too closely is about $140, including court costs.

    State police say the guns remove the need for troopers to make judgment calls about what's too close.

    "It's awfully hard to dispute this in court," Wojas said.

    Troopers can use the gun on an overpass or more along a shoulder of the road.

    "I catch them before they get to me," Master Trooper Russell Hayes said. "I have the evidence right here," pointing to his laser gun. "It's definitely been helping."

    Sgt. Wanda Clay, a trooper in the commercial vehicle enforcement division, said police already had the speed gun technology, but that she got the idea to mesh it with the software to detect tailgaters because she was frustrated by having to investigate many accidents involving truckers.

    "We're tired of coming out here, we've got so many, so I'm the spark of this project."

    Clay said the project's goal is to remind motorists of the dangers of tailgating.

    "We have the tools now," she said.

    http://www.daytondailynews.com/ap/ap/indiana/troopers-target-tailgaters-with-new- -laser-guns/nSpyy/

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    edited October 2012
    Interesting, as was mentioned, truckers seem especially skilled at following insanely close. I guess if the area has solved other issues and is enforcing them all. Two seconds at highway speeds doesn't sound unreasonable, without extenuating circumstances.
  • ronsteveronsteve Member Posts: 1,234
    Two seconds at highway speeds doesn't sound unreasonable, without extenuating circumstances.

    On the surface, it's not unreasonable. It's what we were taught in driver's ed. BUT... some states, including NC seem to have given up on it. There the manual says "1 car length per 10 mph" which is roughly 1 second.

    Two seconds at highway speed is almost 200 feet, which is rarely seen with any kind of traffic volume. I bet those cameras are worn out within about two days from taking pictures non-stop!
    2015 Acura RDX AWD / 2021 VW TIguan SE 4Motion
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    edited October 2012
    Good point. Following distances change with traffic volumes. Put 200 feet between cars during heavy hours here, and cars would stretch from Portland to Blaine. I'd also like to assume the Ohio plan is for roads and conditions 60mph and more.

    I wouldn't expect law enforcement or public sector planners to think of every detail, however.

    Proportionally, I see much greater tailgating issues from trucks vs cars, maybe the enforcement should be specific.
  • bobw3bobw3 Member Posts: 2,989
    edited October 2012
    Slow but Superior?

    That one sounds pretty good ;)

    Maybe we should change the name of this forum to some of these titles:

    Whining Speeders?
    Fast and Impatient?
    What Doesn't Everyone Drive Just Like Me?
    This Lane Is My Lane?
    Why Is Everyone Trying to Slow Me Down?
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Those are good, but you forgot one:

    It's Never My Fault!

    :)
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited October 2012
    The guy that first came up with "My way or the highway" was badly misquoted; that "or" should be "on".
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,934
    1) Braking on the freeway when no one is within a mile in front of you in your lane.

    2) Driving 10 or more below the speed limit.

    3) Failing to Signal.

    4) Taking up and impeding 2 lanes at the same time for more than a couple seconds when changing lanes or failing to make up your mind about which lane to be in.

    5) Accelerating like a snail in the left lane from a red light; so that the Prius or Big Rig in the right lane is smoking you to the next intersection.

    6) Middle lane camping going under the speed limit.

    7) CHP vehicles which stay on the freeway too long and create a bottleneck because no one has the courage to pass them; further proof if everyone drove the speed limit or less we'd have 10 times worse traffic congestion.

    8) Not looking when you change lanes and impeding traffic by doing so.

    9) Passing at a snails pace (+1 MPH over the vehicle you are overtaking).

    10) Not looking or paying attention when the light turns green to move forward within 2 seconds.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    edited October 2012
    That's a pretty good list, except for the first two...

    1) Braking on the freeway when no one is within a mile in front of you in your lane.

    What if there's no one behind you, either? (If a tree falls in the forest...) Anyway, there's many legitimate reasons to touch the brakes while on the freeway... e.g., disengage cruise to prepare to exit; realizing you're going too fast for conditions (especially when your radar detector bleeps at you--right?); avoiding an idiot who isn't yet in your lane but will be REAL soon; etc.

    2) Driving 10 or more below the speed limit.

    Then it would follow that driving 10 or more OVER the speed limit is also inconsiderate? :P

    Again, there's many legitimate reasons for driving under the speed limit, including "driving according to conditions." Just keep right when doing so and it's not inconsiderate.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    edited October 2012
    Also not looking before pulling into traffic, or expecting others to slow for you.

    The brake tappers amuse me. I don't buy the disengaging cruise idea either - shouldn't be using cruise in any kind of traffic volumes, and I anyway disengage mine the way I engaged it, by moving the lever. Braking to turn it off is clumsy and ugly.

    Today I got behind a Prius that would brake for turns in the road. Not corners, just changes in direction. Those things must feel roly-poly. Cruising on I-5 between Seattle and Tacoma, idiots always randomly tap their brakes. Keep that wild Camry under control!

    Other suggested names for this thread:

    "Speed Kills"
    "Speed Kills"
    "Speed Kills"
    "Lane Discipline Is An Un-American Socialist Communist Conspiracy"
    "Speed Kills"
    "Speed Kills"
    "Share The Road, Bow To My Slowness"
    "Speed Kills"
    "Speed Kills"
    "Speed Kills"
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 18,339
    You nailed it- although "Dweebs That Dawdle" also has a certain poetic certitude about it...

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
    Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
    Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • xrunner2xrunner2 Member Posts: 3,062
    That is a good list. Of course number 7 would cover police everywhere. Could add some more criteria such as drivers on cell phones or texting.
  • hammerheadhammerhead Member Posts: 907
    I don't have a 'cancel' button on the DW's car - brake tapping to disengage cruise is better than having to completely turn it off, then back on. I'd lose the 'resume' speed as well.

    Fin, I gotta say, your friends & neighbors on the wet side seemed to be behaving themselves this weekend - very few LLC's, minimal dawdlers, and only a couple full stops on 405 (I still don't get how or why THAT happens!)
    I'm not a big fan of left-lane off ramps, though. I-5 around Paine Field is just plain nuts. Is that Boeing's fault?
  • bobw3bobw3 Member Posts: 2,989
    "although "Dweebs That Dawdle" also has a certain poetic certitude about it... "

    Seems like "Dweebs That Speed" rhymes better :P
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    Even on a 1980s MB, the last speed is kept in memory even when the system is turned off. Guess that's what I get for assuming all cars are like that. I still don't buy brake tapping being explained by disengaging cruise - these timid idiots on the road here going 58 in a 60 in moderate traffic aren't using cruise. They are simply afraid of hitting that speed limit wall, or are slowing down for turns (not corners) in the road.

    405 is a disaster. It has two big things stacked against it - needs twice as many lanes from before the 167 interchange through at least Bothell, and many of those who venture onto it are unfit to drive more than 50mph - so they go 45. Then the timid idiot going 47 will get in the left lane - and the backups begin.

    There are a few left lane exits in Seattle itself, too. I try not to drive there. Could be Boeing, in the Everett case.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    Fun clueless driver this morning. Woman I won't stereotype in a Lexus LS is in a turn lane, moderate traffic in the 2 lanes to her right. She suddenly decides she doesn't want to turn - so she just blindly veers into the straight lane. She cuts off a Jetta, who hits the brakes and lays on the horn at the same time. Lexus then accelerates hard, goes up to next intersection, gets into the turn lane late without a signal, and flies through the turn. I 'd explain it to being oblivious, then woke up by the horn, then a panic accidental flooring. Was pretty close to a crash, as the roads were wet.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    I still don't buy brake tapping being explained by disengaging cruise...

    There was a list, this was just one example of where braking while on a freeway when no one within a mile in front of you is not inconsiderate.

    Even though you would never think of touching your brakes while the car is on cruise control, how is it inconsiderate to do so? Recall I said it's when you're going to exit. So you're going to have to slow down anyway.
  • hammerheadhammerhead Member Posts: 907
    Like I said, in my Suburban, I can either tap the brake, or turn the system off. One retains the speed in the 'resume' memory, the other does not. In my Subaru, I have both - 'cancel' function or brake tap. Resume speed retained in both cases. And I don't worry a bit about the brake light flash - if it's an issue with the folks behind me, they were probably following too close anyway. Serves 'em right. :shades:
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,934
    It's not the flash of brake lights that bothers me, it's the slowing down of braking. You can disengage the cruise control while tapping the breaks and not lose more than 0.10 MPH of speed, easily, and repeatedly.

    What I'm complaining about is brake lights that signify a significant loss of speed and for no apparent reason. A radar reading would be apparent to those with radar detectors :)
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • hammerheadhammerhead Member Posts: 907
    I barely tap the brake pedal - not enough to cause braking, just kicks me in to coast mode. Done right, as far as timing and spacing, shouldn't affect traffic flow. Those that stomp brakes are inconsiderate.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,429
    It creates slowdowns behind you - others will hit their brakes in reaction (if they aren't playing with a phone/nursing a drink/etc). You claim a list, but I see only two other tenuous reasons mentioned, neither of which really apply to the complaint. Randomly hitting brakes is bad driving. What you said is irrelevant, the OP's hypothetical situation was the context.

    If I'm going to have to slow down anyway, might as well just go 40 down the interstate. Sadly, that would make some here positively giddy with joy.
  • bobw3bobw3 Member Posts: 2,989
    I agree that its a bad idea to hit brake lights on the highway just to disengage the cruise control for the very reason mentioned...people see brake lights on the highway in front of them and instintively react by slowing down causing a wave of unnecessary slowing down behind them. Just hit the cancel button and if you want to resume cruise control just set it again...it's just a couple of clicks with the fingers.
  • hammerheadhammerhead Member Posts: 907
    If there is that much of a knee-jerk reaction to a split-second flash of brake lights, so be it.
    If I'm slowing down for traffic in front of me, then the slowing down behind me is NOT unnecessary.
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