Ford Freestyle - Taurus X

canadiangal

My son did show me the pilot, but i dont like the looks. They are too soft. I also know about the increase on drag if i where to add ground clearance. I alos know aabout the disadavantages of having larger tires. But the fuel econamy will still be better than that of my ex's f-150, and so will the handling. So I realize that I am giving up a little bit. I am willing to risk it. I would also check with the dealer to see if it would void my warranty before i put on too many modifications.

thank you for your concern( if u were concerned that is)
canadiangal

ps. thank you for answering my questions about the fuel economy question, i didn't know that there were canadian gallons and US gallons. As for my not speeking in english i am sorry, it is probably a typing error or differences in the use of vocabulary, and the spelling of words.

newdriver2

Where did you measure the Freestyle for 5.1 inch. I want a high ground clearance because my car always have trouble in winter

canadiangal

Last week the official ford website said that it had 5.1 inches of ground clearance. But now they changed it and it says that it is 8 inches at the rear axel.

figueroafamily

I went to a Ford dealer to pick up our Windstar for warranty work. The received a Freebie SEL in Pueblo Gold/Beige Clad. A salesgal was very eager to show me how great that Freebie is. Got my wife seated in, etc. She began asking for how old is our car. She turned away when I told her about our Freebie.

Anyway, I didn't wanted to leave a sour note, so I gave a couple of Freebie selling points. Like the tailgate seat & the ANT14's gas-brake-gas test. She appreciated that, as she saw or touched a Freebie for the first time today. Sounds unbelievable, but I left it like that.

I have a question. You can get the third row on tailgate mode. However, the manual says don't use it. To me, that implies either or both of:
* some part of the seat can't endure weight between the (3rd row) back seat anchor and the body frame (bottom of trunk interface).
* the back of the seat touching those may be permanently marked or deformed due to weight.

Does anyone know why? Is there a weight limit to it?

Sam

ANT14

I'll use another example, that might give you an idea...

2 Years ago Ford was sued because someone with an Explorer Sport, had 3 passenger's sitting in the rear seat. If anyone has sat inside an Explorer Sport (Sport, for 2 door) you would understand that the rear seat was designed for just 2 passenger's, not 3, mentioned this on the manual, and is evident by having 2 seat belts available, not 3.

Yet, this person sued Ford because you can actually sit 3 people in that vehicle...unsafely of course, since a 3rd sealtbelt isn't offered, since it wasn't DESIGNED to hold 3 people.

Now about the tailgate bench, just picture how many people will suddenly have a stupid moment, and actually drive with that bench, and tailgate open. It's the same reason we have so many sticker's on SUV sun visors reminding people "HEY it's an SUV, NOT a sports car, this might tip!!"

ranger2001xlt

Why didn't ford put Variable Valve Timing in this engine? They already have done it in their Mazdas and Lincolns. Right now the dealers are asking close to full price for this car and I have a hard time paying that with an engine technology that is not in par with current Japanese (or even Korean) models.

How much would if of cost for the manufacturer to add this to the engine? $100 maybe? I know the Lincolns require unleaded fuel with variable valve timing but they could of gotten better horsepower, fuel economy and emissions at a small price. And I would bet that it could of been done with regular gas.

figueroafamily

Thanks, ANT14.

OK, it's not a structural (would break) issue, but idiot-warning.

I can easily imagine Fraternity kids doing that, until a bump on the road throws them out and straight into a following MACK truck.

In short, tailgate's good on PARK, while enjoying a park.

Sam

figueroafamily

Variable-timing 30's name is Duratec 35, due in a couple of years. It'll will be to the Freebie what the Rolls-Royce Merlin was to the P-51 Mustang.

History Buff Note
-----------------
World War 2's original P-51 Mustang had a decent engine, but faltered when compared to the German competition. Once they put the famous Merlin engine, it had plentiful power to go and do anything. The rest is history.
-----------------

I think ANT14 ballparked the price around $300-400. His guesstimate on fuel was about 1 MPG difference. (ANT14, feel free to correct me.)

Sam

ANT14

"Why didn't ford put Variable Valve Timing in this engine? They already have done it in their Mazdas and Lincolns"

We've spoken about many pages ago if you wish to go back a bit.

Mazda designed their on heads, which is why it allows it's 3.0L to acheive 220HP, but unfortunately it produces lower torque, at higher RPM.

Lincoln/Jag has the same 3.0L with 232-240HP from it's 3.0L but again, it produces it at higher RPM than the garden variety 3.0L. And requires premium gas, not something many customer's would have wanted.

ranger2001xlt

OK, Ford would of needed to mess with Mazda's heads a little to get the torque back up to 200 ft/lbs. And is higher RPM a downfall since the CVT is used and it revs up high during acceleration anyway.

I agree it would add extra cost, (what maybe $300 per vehicle) but I took the Freestyle for a ride, and found that it lacked power when my family of 5 plus the salesman were all in the vehicle. I think the extra 10-20 HP from VVT (variable valve technology) would of made a difference.

I did look for varable and valve and did not find too much on the search about this subject, sorry for the recap.

Other than the engine, I like to car. The price is right and I love the Haldex. A friend of mine had a Volvo and it was a great car in the snow.

But that engine...

fsmmcsi

Why didn't Ford simply put, or offer, a blower (supercharger) on the 3.0 engines. GM has had great success using blowers on the 3.8 V6 for 14 years. Just a little pressure would yield 50 more HP and that or more foot pounds of torque. Of course, ANT14, you are correct, premium costs 9% to 10% more than regular, so some people might think that is a big deal.

ANT14

Yes, the blower GM uses requires premium fuel as well. I believe it's an Eaton Supercharger If I remember correctly.

Blower's isn't something I would recommend Ford to do. Granted, Volvo makes some very reliable turbo's for example, but let's think of WHO will be driving these vehicles. We actually have some beasts out there that will not take care of these vehicles as they should, and just imagine the warranty costs that would entail.

I myself am one of those beasts. I rev to redline right after a cold start speeding to the first stop sign. Let the oil run 2 life cycles over when I should have changed it, etc. Although I'm abit more responsible in blaming myself if I contribute to damaging the vehicle. While the majority of other's will take it to the dealership and whine and lie they babied their vehicles.

Hence, sometimes you don't want to complicate a vehicles maintenence/assembly/systems too much, depending upon the market and demographics you are targeting.

You can pull it off on an Aston Martin, and make it complex and techinical because it affect only a few hundred buyer's, who might naturally take prestine care of their vehicle, than a garden variety Ford labeled vehicle though.

johnclineii

...not to mention that expected warranty costs are factored into pricing, and people are NOT going to pay the kind of prices that would result on a Freestyle with turbo. (due to the anticipated customer abuse of which ANT so wisely writes)

ANT14

Actually before I go off on another bunny trail. Much of it had to do with customer's. Here's an extreme example of something i faced a few years ago. I drove a friends, grandmother's car we had to use as an emergency. It was a 3 month old LaSabre.

Within the 10 minute drive, I noticed 3 things broken and she didn't even know about them because A) She was almost deaf, accessories (such as the power sunroof) she never used. My comment to her was , "Of Course Buick has some good reliability ratings, if the majority of their customer's are at an age where they can hardly hear if something is wrong, chances are they won't report it".

Say, unlike the typical Mustang buyer who will probably obsess over every detail of the car.

Who would you buy a car from? The little old lady with the Buick, or anything I touch... hehe...

fsmmcsi

Please remember that a Turbocharger is lubricated with engine oil, while a supercharger is not. Turbocharged cars do need more frequent oil changes - I changed the oil in my '84 Sunbird every 2,000 miles, and it was running strong when I sold it at 160,000 miles. Many of the supercharged GM cars are Buicks and Pontiacs driven by older people. They require no special maintenance, and as I said above, premium fuel is only 10% or less more expensive than regular.

By the way, I still need to drive a Montego on rough roads, but I have now driven a FWD six speed Montego and an CVT AWD Five Hundred, and both were quite nice. Unless I am unpleasantly surprised uring a longer test drive, I will order a Montego with all options but the sun roof. My folding telescoping ladder (55" x 22") fit cross-wise in the Montego trunk with no difficulty, and laid flat on the floor, leaving plenty of room for other things. To me, a sedan with a big trunk is far nicer than a wagon, as the things which rattle or might fly about during a quick stop are in a separate compartment, yet the seats fold when I need to carry something longer. If you don't need the third row of seats, the sedans weigh less and cost less.

Popular Mechanics has a sketch on the upcoming Mercury version of the Freestyle wagon - see page 38 of the November issue.

ranger2001xlt

One more thing about the future Duratec with VVT. From this internet article, it appears the fuel efficiency increase of this technology will be at least 10%.

http://www.conway.com/ssinsider/bbdeal/bd030721.htm

Of course, I don't believe everything I read either. It doesn't make sense that the engine could have 245 horsepower and get an extra 2 miles per gallon city. I wonder if that is premium gas?

subarktika

I was on a road trip over the weekend and the alternator on my 2000 Excursion went out. While waiting for it to be repaired I went over to the dealer's showroom and noticed that they had a FS Limited. I wanted cargo area dimensions, but nobody seemed to have a tape measure. Can someone who has purchased one or has access to one take some measurements? I'd like the cargo floor length behind front seats, second seat, and third seat. I've also wondered about the console with the second row bucket seats. What happens to it when the seats are folded down? Does it stick up higher? My local dealer has yet too receive any, but I notice they have two listed on their inventory online, so I imagine they will be arriving soon. BTW, the one I looked at had all options, including the Reverse Sensing System and DVD player. Thanks.
Carol

gmginsfo

Stopped by a local Ford dealer and looked at the Freebie and 500 today and was pretty impressed. I liked the high driver's seating position on both cars and the good visibility all around. The salesman even gave me his "official" talking points booklet on the car, which actually doesn't tell that much. (Memo to FoMoCo: don't dumb down your sales force - or reduce my stock earnings! - by printing such trash! >:( .)

Since I bicycle a lot and rarely, if ever, have enough folks on board to fill up a rear row of seats, is it possible to remove the rear seats on the Freebie, thereby saving some weight and adding some cargo space? I can't imagine this'd be a problem. That's make the 2nd row captain's chairs an especially sensible option.

Add me to the chorus calling for a larger engine, turboed, supered or bigger-sixed! Whatever happened to the V-8? And can we see some creativity (read, SIZE!) in the sunroof department, please.

explorerx4

edmunds has it here. look up the freestyle under new vehicles and find specs.

explorerx4

the fold flat 3rd seat are precicely becasue people disliked removing the 3 row bench in prior minvans\suv's. count me among those. i always try to keep the 3rd seat open in my explorer because it's quieter that way.

subarktika

I see head, shoulder, hip and leg room as well as cu. ft. cargo capacity (which I already knew), but not the cargo floor lengths. Please give me a link that has the cargo floor information if it's here or elsewhere. I haven't been able to find it.

pappy55

I hate dragging seats in and out of vehicles and I love the way the Freestyle's fold, but they waste a LOT of cargo space just to look flat and pretty. It looks like they are attached to a large rod that is fixed in the sides which facilitates the slick folding action. It would be a great touch to make them somehow removeable for those rare trips when you do need the space (holidays). But for everyday use, I think Ford did a great job on the 3rd row seats.

As far as engine choice goes, if you want a V-8, go look at an Explorer. The point of the FS is car-based economy and functionality, not necessarily brute force. I'll take 27+ mpg with the 3.0 over a V-8 offering any day.

brightness04

I don't know why some people, especially women, including my own wife, are so concerned about this image thing. She absolutely refused to get a minivan when in fact, minivan would have been by far the most cost-effective people/dog/stuff mover all around. Sometimes I feel like screaming: you can never get away from "mommymobile" because, duh, you are a member of the soccermom demographic, and whatever you drive will become a "mommymobile" before the warranty is up. I mean, seriously, wasn't the minivan invented just to skirt around the stigma associated with station wagons?

For what it's worth, Toyota Highlander gives 7.4" ground clearance. All those light SUVs and haf-breeds will be perceived as "mommymobile" too shortly if not already.

kjnorman

"All those light SUVs and haf-breeds will be perceived as "mommymobile" too shortly if not already."

I guess that is why my wife is loathed to give up her Audi A4 Avant, even though it is too small for us, because she does not look like a soccer mom...

Consequently, I am now looking at leasing an Audi Allroad or 2004/5 A6 Avant. Though more expensive cars than the Freestyle, with higher residuals residuals than the Freestyle it may prove to be about the same - though I am still investigating.

Kerry

joey2brix

Funny how the Ford website says the Freebie goes from $26K-32K, but when I do a inventory search of my local dealer, the six he's got are all 34K MSRP! I can think of a few better cars tha I can pick up for that kind of money. Wise up Ford, you're financial problems are not over yet.

johnclineii

It's a little early in the day to rush to that judgment. And perhaps your dealer ordered expensive vehicles due to the demographics of his/her area, or because buyers in the area expect to find vehicles equipped to that level...

andyman73

My local dealer had one, only one, and it was marked at 28,900. It was the SE model. I don't know if it sold, yet.

explorerx4

you are correct, i don't see the cargo floor lengths anywhere. it's pretty easy to find out with a tape measure(a lot easier than cubic feet!).

ANT14

"but when I do a inventory search of my local dealer, the six he's got are all 34K MSRP"

Dealerships are independent from manufacturer's. Manufacturer Suggested Retail Price is one thing, but a dealerships is another. Up to the buyer to shop, like they would at any store.

figueroafamily

A $34K MSRP sounds like a LIM with all options, especially the $1,000 DVD.

My LIM didn't had the DVD or rear sensor, and the MSRP was about $33K.

BTW, the dealer-installed rear sensor doesn't work. I did reverse up to one feet from our Windstar, with zero warning beeps.

Sam

figueroafamily

I'll get my trusty tape measure to work ASAP. Hopefully, before I leave to FL (family commitment).

Sam

buckwheat

Freestyle suppliers:

http://www.supplierbusiness.com/home/index.php?option=content&amp- ;task=view&id=84&Itemid=2

mark_in_nh

Per my carpenter's ruler:
Rear opening height: 30.5"
Bottom of rear opening: 40"
Mid-height width of RR opening: 45"
Top of rear opening: 33"

Usable width of inside RR cargo area: 43"
Usable length of RR cargo area,3rd row flat: 48"
Usable length of RR cargo area, both rows flat: 80"

I ordered one two weeks ago. Internal space provisions are outstanding, handling is VG, and
it doesn't suck gas. I've been waiting years for a worthy successor to my '92 Volvo wagon and this
is it.

mark_in_nh

Clarification:
Usable width of inside RR cargo area: 43"
is a floor width measurement between the wheel
wells (contours are not humped so there are no
well humps per se).

beach15

The Freestyle, in my opinion, is very well priced. Compare it to a Pacific, which I also really like, that tops out over $40k and you'll see what I mean. Plus, the Freestyle has more room.

canadiangal

hey sam, have u taken your freestyle on any rough roads or long trips?when u make sure that u give us all the details, ok.

thnx
canadiangal

johnclineii

u asked earlier why people asked u why some of think that u write in language that is hard for us to understand ok.

The u is part of it. Internet abbreviations used in IM's are VERY hard to read in long form from many different posters with all different writing styles and ways of conveying things.

Please spell out the words, like "u."

It's MUCH easier for us to read

Captilization also helps!

john cline ii, just trying to help

canadiangal

OK, I will try to remember that. Thank you.

Guess what happened up here in Canada. It snowed!
I wish I had a freestyle to drive it in, but our local dealer just got the 2005 focus. So I'm not expecting a Freestyle until the end of the month.

johnclineii

Snow already! Wow! I am taking my Ford Five Hundred AWD out for a trip as soon as I get through posting this, but there ain't no snow in West Virginia yet. Hard rain expected tomorrow, but no snow!

Wow again! I hope you get to see a Freestyle soon!

bob17

Ordered my Freestyle SEL AWD in May. It was delivered last week. Drove it 400 miles this weekend to watch the Ducks beat the Wildcats. Previously owned a 98 Dodge Caravan SE AWD. Drivingwise the Freestyle is very good. Rides and corners very well. Extremely quiet. Very solid. The 3.0 is very adequate. The Freestyle accelerates better than the Dodge which had a 3.8. The CVT is as advertised, very smooth. Passing is nice, no delay for the downshift. Drove on some very wet roads, traction was outstanding. Got about 25 mpg overall. Can't wait to get it on snow.

Interior-not as big as our old Caravan, but about as big as a Sienna.

On the downside-the seats need armrests (we got 2nd row buckets, don't want the 2nd row console). Also the interior is somewhat cheap. particularly the doors. Ford could definitely do a better job here.

One question-the traction control has a switch on the dashboard to turn it off. When do you turn it off? Does traction control affect mpg?

subarktika

Thanks for the measurements. That's exactly what I wanted. Our local dealer has finally received one, but it is missing a plastic part, so they won't let anyone examine it or open the interior. They do have a Montego which I drove and it seemed very nice.

stever

Welcome to Edmunds, Bob. Please keep us posted as you break the Freestyle in - any difficulty getting used to the CVT tranny style?

Steve, Host

ANT14

"When do you turn it off? Does traction control affect mpg?"

Not at all. It just retards engine torque when slip is detected.

samnoe

You turn it off if you get stuck in snow or mud, and want to get out of it. If traction control is engaged, it will cut engine power. But you shouldn't need that since you got AWD.

BTW, the AWD also gets traction control? I thought it's for the FWD only?

almasy

I got to measure the cargo area yesterday and the numbers are 43" wide between the wheel wells, 72" long from inside tailgate to back of the front seat and 32" high opening at the tailgate. (lots of cargo room)
The vehicle is bigger than it looks in pictures.
It's pretty long and wide, and the entry height (seat) is just a tad lower than my MPV. Looks real nice with the 18" wheels and big tires.

figueroafamily

I haven't yet. Worst case, I'll go to FL for CHRISTmas on it. I thought of visiting my friends in Boston for whale watching, yet it's iffy at best.

So far, I did 70-75 today in a highway from EWR (Newark Liberty Airport) to my wife's work place, as she entered at noon today. Just made it. Freebie was smooth as silk, and responded very well.

Although the Duratec 35 would make it compete in the critic's eyes with the Maximas (0-60 wise), the current engine is more than sufficient for our needs. People who buy Freebies don't have 0-60 as the deciding factor. As the VW Bug ad said, "0-60? Yes."

I love seeing the RPMs drop as I accelerate. It's a rather unique thing.

Sam

ANT14

I've also have been staring at the RPM's while driving, have had some close calls because of it. Ironically, in my car I would always watch the tach to see redline, before softening the gas... Now with CVT's, there's no reason to even look, but fun to watch either way.

canadiangal

I wounder if Boston would have any snow yet? We have nearly two inches already, and its still coming down! I'm expecting lots and lots of snow this year, because it rained for the whole months of July and August. Sometimes we would have huge down pours, so big that in 15 minutes, there would be 8 inches of water! We easinly got three-four feet of rain this year. I hope that translates into lots of snow. Hope you guys get lots of snow aswell, I would love to see how the freestyle handles very wet slippery sonditions.

canadiangal

ps. Dont drive to early in the morning, especially before the salting trucks salt the roads. I wouldn't want to hear about a brand-new Freestyle rolling into the ditch.

cminchik1

I have been looking for an "adverse weather" station wagon since my first Explorer in '93. I don't want "low range", I don't go off road (I am not going to scratch that new paint job!). I had a Tahoe (14 miles mpg) with plenty of room. I traded roominess for mpg & went to a 6 cylinder Outback VDC. Great car, great adverse weather station wagon, but small interior. Then I test drove a Freestyle. Everything I wanted in a car was there: luxury options, AWD (not 4WD), optimal transmission (CVT), 106 cu ft of passenger space (bigger than my Tahoe), 47 cu ft of space behind the 2nd seats (Tahoe was 50 something), seating for 6 (if needed), & 24 mpg. I am 6'3", 260 lbs and I found it roomy for me! As to this "small" engine, when I test drove it under a variety of situations, I found it always in the right gear optimally using the engine's torque superbly. It accelerated as fast as my Subaru VDC (which is quick...0 - 60 in 8 seconds). The CVT did exactly what it was supposed to do: extract max performance from a capable powerplant. All of this for the low thirties loaded. So I ordered one. It is due in early November. I will keep you posted as to my impressions. Until then don't knock the performance until you drive one. This is one great car...or SUV... or station wagon. You choose.

johnclineii

(...and it comes in a sedan version, too! The Five Hundred/Montego. Yes, I know 95 percent of readers here know that...this is for that other five percent!)