In March, we asked several local dealers for price quotes. We went to the dealer who gave us the lowest quote, offered about $500 less, and they lapped it up like a bear at a honey pot.
Heheh... well, priceless the divide I was afraid of. When thinking about it I understand where Thene comes from. The internet does basiaclly have one shot to get you interested. But thats what makes me think it isn't the lowest. When you buy online what point do you actually talk to a person or have they made it completely electronic?
$500 would always be greatly appreciated. DId you compare that final price to online prices as well?
Oh yeah, I looked carefully at the prices people claimed they wre paying on the Prices Paid DG.
We were looking for a Honda Accord, and people claimed they were paying $600 or $1000 under invoice. Based on our past experience, we thought those prices were incredibly low.
The dealer offered invoice in an Email, and we went there and offered about $500 less. I say "about" because I am guessing at the prices of the options we wanted.
Wow, car shopping sure is more fun then it used to be!
i wouldn't say thats the norm, but i also can't speak for the rest of the dealers out there. i know in my case, i give my absolute best price i can. if it comes down to $100 bucks or so, we may be able to bend a little more to make the deal, but usually my price is better than what most people who walk in the door get.
again, thats me here at my dealership - abc motors down the way may do it differently.
Internet makes a lot of things more fun. Well, if internet prices are so bottom dollar, did that drive down dealership prices at all? Know what I mean. WHy no influx of online buying or is there one that dealerships are having a tough time responding to?
some people still like the old school way of buying a car (and still feel they can get their best deal that way). some dealers dont respond to emails because people are expecting a price, and they know that its a number that will only get shopped. there are lots of reasons why - besides, you still have to buy a car from a person anyways - still go fill out paperwork, still take delivery...its one of those things. not everyone likes doing everything the same way ;-)
After you have gone to a couple dealerships and done the test drives with a salesman, how do you get the pricing over the internet from the same dealer without "screwing" the saleman who helped with the test drive?
Can you tell the internet manager who originally helped you so they get any commissions/credit?
Just go back to your first salesperson instead of trying to go around him/her.
You won't get a better deal from an "Internet Manager".
It is nice that you would ask. A lot of times, people try to go around their salesperson thinking, for some reason, that there is a super special deal for them if them mention the internet.
I agree with isellhondas... Once you make contact at the dealership, you should pretty much stick with that contact, unless they have done something to make you not want to.. (in that case, go to the sales manager or somewhere else).
Really... you probably won't do any better with the internet manager at that store, than you will with that salesperson.. The internet is great for weeding out places that just aren't competitive on price, but it isn't likely to get you a better price at any one specific store..
agree with both isell and kyfdx. if you have made a contact with someone at a store, you stick with them unless they have been unprofessional or rude. at that point, you do have a right to go to someone else for service. chances are, if you play your cards right, you'll get the same deal as you would on the internet, maybe even better!
.... **You won't get a better deal from an "Internet Manager"**....
Bingo......!
They report to the same person, they get approval from the same guy and the "Internet Manager" doesn't have any magic wand or special powers and doesn't have any direct line with the owner .... all deals get looked at real closely by the same management team .................
Thene, is the private address in your profile correct? I sent an e-mail to the public one listed, and it bounced Please contact me with a valid e-mail - it's my host name @edmunds.com
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I'm still trying to decide between 2 different cars/models. I haven't test drove an Acura yet and there is only one Acura place in RI. Well luckilly there's one in MA about the same amount of distance from me anyway.I had emailed both places about test diving and gave them details on what I was looking for in a car. I asked if they had any of the model I wanted in stock, and whether or not I had to make an appointment or could I just go down there.
Inskip gets back to me and tells me they have a number of the model I want in stock and just said "hopefully you can come down here and test drive" and to call, email or just go down there. I decided to try just going down there at about 10am about a week later. They only had 1 used one and it was a stick, couldn't test drive that. So after going all that way I figured maybe they have some more cars somewhere else.. I walked around the parking lot for about 10 minutes with my mom looking at cars, figured someone would come around. No. So my mom went inside just to ask that one question. There's a group of 3 guys standing in front of a door just bullshitting and laughing with eachother. Nobody said anything to her, she stood there. So she finally just excused herself and asked if there was anyone available that she could ask about a car.. They told her "uh well we're all kind of busy right now, could you come back later?" :surprise: :surprise:
LOL!. Wow. Since when do you go to a dealer and actually have a problem finding a salesman? I probably should've stuck to email.
The 2nd Dealer - First Acura in MA. I've only dealt with via Email. I emailed them just asking what they had in stock and if I could make an appointment to test drive..etc I got sent back an obviously automated email with my name added. None of my questions were asked, it was just telling me what a great dealership they were, they're glad to welcome me as a customer, how great their certified program and warranty is. 5 days later I get another email saying "we had not emailed long ago.." (We emailed? :confuse: ) and only asked when I was going down there and if I needed directions..or wanted to handle everything over the phone. Why couldn't he simply be more specific and answer my questions? If he would've said something like "please call to make a test driving appt" or to just go down there..... Sure. But too vague. Since Inskip was so rude, I'll probably go down to this place just to check out it out for the hell of it. Maybe I'll have better luck with them and actually get a salesman.
Majestic Honda in RI was great dealing with in person. I had searched this board before and seemed a few people had good experiences dealing with their internet service. I think I went though carsdirect just to get a quote and I didn't get anything but automated responses telling me to call. Then I tried again a month later with a different email and questions..lol And not a reply. Maybe it wasn't detailed enough, I just told them the car I want,my price range and options I want and my mistake was probably asking what the lowest monthly payments could be. lol But the salesman had no problem telling me what that was based on my credit rating without pulling it. If I do get a Honda, I'd definitely go with that guy again.
... ** decided to try just going down there at about 10am about a week later** ...
Your getting ready to make the second most important decision of your life, and your emailing people for information.?? ..
You need to drive the vehicles first... would you email a dentist.? or a house painter.? .... *Pick-up a phone*, get a name, make an appointment and get over it .. for all the time you just spent posting, you could have driven the vehicles and seen whether you liked one or both and probably made your deal already ......
"You need to drive the vehicles first... would you email a dentist.? or a house painter.? .... *Pick-up a phone*, get a name, make an appointment and get over it .. for all the time you just spent posting, you could have driven the vehicles and seen whether you liked one or both and probably made your deal already ...... "
Terry makes a good point. Strangely enough, I bought both of our last two cars over the internet--or at least made the arrangements to come in to buy, but in both cases I had driven the model before and in both cases I bought used.
The first was through autotader.com. in 2000: a 1992 Toyota MR2 and it was 150 miles away in a different state. I did follow-up the email with two phone conversations, drove the car and it was exactly as advertised so I made the offer and still have it.
The second was more convoluted and started with an attempt to get a specific set of options on a brand new (2004) Toyota Rav4. At first there was nothing available equipped the way we wanted so we elected to drive 220 miles to Dallas to get the only one with most of the options. We agreed upon a price with the internet salesman, but double checked before we got on the interstate. Good thing, because someone else had already put a deposit down.
I tried contacting dealers in OKC and Tulsa to see if they'd be interested in ordering one, but no one ever returned any of the emails--maybe they thought I was the proverbial 15 year old toying with them. So I ordered one through my local dealer. 5 1/2 months later they say sorry we just won't be able to get one this year, but you can re-order and perhaps get one in 05. According to our salesman the main hitch was getting the side airbags option.
So I check autotrader.com and find a really nice 02 Rav4 with AWD (also hard to find in OK, but helpful visiting family in MI in the winter). The car had only 20K on the clock and was being sold by a Lexus dealership. We didn't get any response from their internet salesman, but followed it up with a couple of phone calls. It looked and drove as new and was $10K less than a similarly equipped new one (but no side airbags).
I guess my first point is that the internet does serve a purpose in helping narrow the field of possibilities for the buyer, particularly when you have to drive some distance to even look at a car. This is much more fruitful, however, if you have driven similar cars/models in advance. My second point is that the internet has worked much better for me with used vehicles--maybe because much more info seems to be included about the specific car/truck/suv. My third and final point is that if you are really interested in a specific car or model it really pays to follow-up with a phone call or two to cut through any confusion.
So does anyone have any thoughts about the use of the internet when buying new vs. used? Of course if I had more choices I'd much prefer to develop a relationship with someone like isellhondas or Terry, and have made such a connection with a local Toyota salesman. I will buy from him in a heartbeat if our next vehicle is a Toyota. IMO no new technological innovation trumps a salesperson you like and trust.
Many immigrants, including myself, prefer to communicate in written form, particularly using e-mail. I even would say, that practically all educated immigrants from countries using other languages than English prefer written form to spoken.
Spoken English is much more embarrassing for not native speaker. It takes much time to find right wording, especially not in everyday context. You look silly and during all the conversation feel that you are wasting time of your listener. Even if he manage to understand your accent, bad wording and sentence constructs. It is even more difficult to understand the spoken English: continuous speech not divided to separate words, skipped consonants, jargon words, etc., not to mention different accents: regional, black, and yes, foreign accents of immigrants from different countries.
Even after living in US for 9 years and being citizen for 3 years, I still encounter problems with spoken English time to time. And never sure if, or rather when, will encounter it. On the other hand, when I immigrated, I already could read in English not much worse than now. One-two unknown words on a full page of NY Times, except in fashion and sports departments. Well, I do not understand fashion even in my native Russian.
Phone is even worse in this respect than face-to-face conversation. It is much more difficult to understand speech on phone, and you cannot help with gestures.
I didn't think it was a big deal just asking about test driving. I've driven the Honda before, not the Acura. I know dealerships are different in their testdriving, some let you do it when you show up others need an appointment. On the Honda website it lets you make an appointment for testdriving by filling out a form.. Acura had no info on their website so I figured I'd email them and hopefully get a simple answer. They just said "hopefully you can come down", So by that, I figured I didn't need an appointment and testdriving wasn't a big deal. They replied to my email Saturday afternoon and I went down Friday morning..so 5 days later not counting the weekened.
The other place I don't even know the area its in, so I didn't want to go down there for nothing to testdrive like I did with Inskip. I might be going down there next week and I'll definitely call and ask first.
The Honda if they had anything in stock with what I wanted, I would've forgoten about the Acura and just had done the deal over the internet.
Last week we had dinner with our son, his girlfriend, and her family. Her brother, age 24, does the internet sales for a BMW dealership, and said he sold 24 cars last month.
He said their dealership is part of a much larger group of dealers, and the policy for the entire group is to give specific prices over the internet. If a person contacts them over the internet and asks for a price, he will give them a price.
He said they believe that if they did not give a price, they would definitely lose the customer. If they give a price, they at least have a chance to get the customer into their store.
Maybe that's the way the world is moving. My guess is that some independent dealers may resist giving out prices over the internet, but the big chains of dealers realize the world has changed and buyers want prices handed to them on a silver platter.
By the way, the dinner with her family was very enjoyable and we think her relationship with our son has some very good possibilities. We are on cloud ten.
glad to hear you had a wonderful dinner with your son and his girlfriend and family! Her brother is right - if you don't give out a price, you dont get anyone coming in. sure, there is a possibility they will take that number to other dealers, but if you dont give them anything - then you have definitely lost them. I mean, as a consumer, if you are emailing a dealer, you are expecting a number right? any dealer who doesn't give one doesnt get a second thought...
its tough to tell the guys here that that is how it is...i am only 25, but everyone else here is more old school with regards to sales - the internet is a tough sell to those who've been advertising solely in print...
btw, we are a small 2 brand family owned dealership in the middle of nowhere CT. if we don't offer price over the net, what else do we have!
....**its tough to tell the guys here that that is how it is... I am only 25, but everyone else here is more old school with regards to sales - the internet is a tough sell to those who've been advertising solely in print... btw, ......... >>we are a small 2 brand family owned dealership in the middle of nowhere CT. if we don't offer price over the net, what else do we have!** ...
=======================
You just answered your own question and didn't even know it ...
This isn't a "old" "new" school thing .. it's market penetration and floor traffic, plain and simple ...... if you're 10/12 miles away from the competitors or the main drag, or in your words "in the middle of nowhere" then you need every source you can get your hands on, because your floor traffic can't keep the lights on ...
That said, for the dealers that get 20/30 email requests a day, they need someone to "qualify" the requests .. does he have a trade.? what other models are they looking at.? how far is the distance.? .. stuff like that .... but in your situation, I would be doing the same ........................
the closest major highway is 25 minutes from here...no one really drives this way on the way to anywhere...which is why i say we are out of the way. you have to purposefully decide you are going to come out to where we are...doesnt quite help that much with floor traffic...
and we average maybe 80-100 people walking through a month in our store (we have another franchise next door that has been here longer that sees a few more people)...but small to say the least!
I DISAGREE!! I bought my last truck via the internet and saved $1000s. Granted, I could have driven 90 miles to dicker w the salesman for an hour and a half, but I got a better deal a bit further away versus my local dealer. Also, I've found an internet special for $3000 off, which the dealer sales rep didn't even know about. Seems to be a disconnect between departments. Found the same at a second dealership who I called this AM. They DO have special internet deals that the rest of the reps don't seem to know anything about.
We plan to negotiate over the Internet for our next car for several reasons. Here’s our dilemma, though. When do we test drive the car? Based on research, we’ve narrowed down to two choices. However, we have to test drive these, and really check them out – ride in all the seats, see if it works with the kids, drive under different conditions, etc. In short – a very extensive test drive (we keep our cars 10+ years, so it has to be the right choice for us). I am sure the floor salesman would remember us – would we be obligated to deal with him at that point?
Any suggestions on the timing of requesting quotes via Internet and test-driving to even pick which car we want?
...if you test drive at a dealership and then make a deal at the same dealership, tell the internet salesperson that you dealt with another salesperson first, so they can get part of the deal anyway.
First of all, you need to know the salesperson that takes what it sounds like will be HOURS with you, answering questions, doing a creative test drive etc works on STRAIGHT COMMISSION. Unless the salesperson is a jerk, going around him/her in an attempt to save money is not a very nice thing to do.
And, it's doubtful you would save any money. Being an "Internet" customer doesn't empower a person toward a better deal.
I would simply ask your salesperson if any special deals are offered that he/she could offer you as well.
Or, if you want, just call the internet guy and set up an appointment for your "entensive" test drive etc and just deal solely with that person.
I would send emails to the dealers who sell these two vehicles and ask them for their best price. once you have found the one dealer from each brand that has given you a great deal, go in to test drive with the internet manager who sent you the quote. that way, you aren't stepping on peoples toes. if you go test drive first, then request a quote, you've worked with two salespeople, and it's not so fair to the first person who helped you to now have to split a deal. I would also let the dealers know that you are looking at a competing brand, and have not completely determined that their product is your final choice as of yet. Let them know you will be driving both vehicles before making any decisions. if you are honest and up front with them, you should have an easy time working a deal that makes you happy!
Thank-you for your kind, helpful advice. They both sound like ways that we could make an informed decision without being in situations were we would be uncomfortable. I appreciate that you took the time to reply.
i am an internet manager, and i like to give advice that will make the process as easy for you as possible, as well as making it easy for the internet manager. an easy deal is almost always a pleasant one! and who doesnt want a pleasant car purchasing experience?
I think most stores would ask the customer if they have been there before or if they have already worked with another salesperson. That's what we do. If we find out that is the case, the internet person simply hands the customer back to the salesperson who worked with them in the first place.
That's how things should work. If the other salesperson is busy or unavailable, the internet person takes over and it's a split deal. Nothing wrong with that.
the internet departmenat can provide "special" internet pricing to the first salesperson so the shopper won't think they aren't being treated in the same manner as a regular internet shopper.
I just get annoyed sometimes when I've spent hours with a customer answering questions, driving multiple cars etc on a busy Saturday only to have them try to back door me by going through the internet department.
Heck, I can be an "Internet Manager" or a "Fleet Manager" anytime a person wants me to be one...just ask!
Just to clarify, we are not trying to go through the internet to save money. We greatly dislike having to sit in a room or at a desk and negotiate. If I was trying to "back door" a salesman, I wouldn't have tried asking for alternatives – I am (as most people are) fully aware that salesmen work on commission. We are intelligent and nice people and prefer to be treated that way, thank-you.
However, this is obviously a growing problem that car dealers will have to address, not just for internet sales, but for other non-direct buying methods, like using a broker or buying service (Costco, BJ’s, to name a few).
I apologize if my postings sounded harsh. I'm sure they did and that wasn't my intent. I suppose I get jaded and I hope you can understand that.
It sounds like you have had "typical" dealer bad experiences and I fully understand. I'm originally from So. Calif and I've had simialr experiences myself.
Now that I understand your motives I do have a suggestion.
Simply ask your friends and neighbors for a referral. If you see a new car at the grocery store with the temp tags on it, ask the owner how their experience was.
They will usually be happy to tell you both good and bad.
Avoid the stores that advertise using full page "screamer" ads. If you see a line of salespeople standing on the sidewalk, keep driving!
Look for family owned stores that hire and RETAIN long term salespeople. You won't find many of these places.
I would like to think this isn't a "growing problem". I would like to think things are getting better.
We had a great experience with salesman when we bought our 2000 Buick Regal. No haggling. I brought my printouts and named price. He found the car we wanted in another dealership, and we agreed to pay $250 more for the service. We signed papers, paid deposit, and everybody was happy.
The subsequent experience with the dealership was very bad. The finance guy cheated us, and service advisers treated me as trash. However, we really like the salesman.
Four years later, in November 2004, my wife and I decided to replace our second car. It gave us too much troubles, too expensive, and too often. We like our Regal and decided to by another one. My wife was afraid of used cars and wanted to buy car new, while 2004 model Buick Regals still were available. I looked on Internet and found only 7 copies in 200 miles radius from our home, all in different states. Why not let our friendly salesman to earn a bit for bringing one of them in our town to sell it us through his dealership? We were ready to pay reasonable money for the service.
I brought my printouts to dealership, the salesman found the same cars in his network (we compared VINs). He received more information than I. For example, that the car we like most was already 450 days old, was used as demo, and had about 6000 miles on odometer.
My wife and I like the car, and we expected a good deal. Dealers do not like to sell cars for less than invoice, even demo with high mileage. However, it was reasonable to buy an extended warranty for car that was used, and we expected a good discount for the warranty. Near invoice, not list.
Than we started discussing price. The salesman went in other room and returned with his calculations. He switched very fast to the bottom line, "great price!". Well, it accounted for great GM rebates, and great points on my GM card. Otherwise it was a list price. Zero dealer discounts. BTW, such calculations are easy to do in head.
I showed the salesman my numbers and calculations. In reality I offered two prices: for car only, or for car with GM extended warranty. I was open to discussing my numbers, item by item. However, he told me that this is too complicated, that my bottom line is way too low, and that his numbers are firm. Well, no deal, and we left reluctantly. Than the salesman went to parking lot after us, and told that he have to feed his kids, and can offer $1000 less. We felt sorry for him...
I believe that either the salesman, or his manager decided that we desperately want the specific car, and will pay any price, or at least the full list price.
The same evening I sent e-mail to New York dealer who had the car we wanted, with my price. The same I offered before. His internet manager/salesman responded the next day. Turned to be that the car had 800 miles more on odometer than we thought. However, his price was $400 ---less--- that what we offered in the e-mail.
We drove to New York City, test-drove the car, and decided to buy it. Several days later we drove to NYC again, signed all papers, and returned in the new car. The final price was exactly what I offered, because our local dealer was ready to pay $400 more for trade-in.
The final price was $4000 less than what our local dealer told is his firm price. Or $3000 less what he offered because he needs to feed his kids.
We would be happy to pay instead several hundred dollars for the service. The NYC dealer is in 105 or 110 miles from our home. We had to cross twice from Connecticut to Staten Island and back in NYC traffic. We wasted two days.
However, $4000 / $3000 was a good price for our troubles.
By the way, the New York dealership paid for extended warranty by two coupons he had from GM.
Resume: even a long serving salesman can be great first time, and be bad the next time.
Sounds like they thought they had you by being the only game in town, so they tried to milk you. And for a Regal, which is a nice car but that's being discontinued next year. If you can't get a Regal for near invoice, I don't know what you can!
As part of its employee benefits, my employer offers its employees the use of the American Transportation Marketing Group's National Corporate Pricing Program. Through ATG's website, you are directed to local dealers. The program gives you a certificate that promises to offer savings of $50 to $1200 below the dealer's "best and most competitive price offered to the general public."
Has anyone had experience using this type of service. I wonder if it's really a good deal or could I get a better deal on my own?
$50 to $1200 below the dealer's "best and most competitive price offered to the general public."
I can almost guarantee you could do better on your own. The statement above is vaguer than Clinton on the witness stand. It basically says "we'll give you $50 off any number we care to make up".
We did make internet contact with one salesman we liked, who treated us nicely online. We went in one night when he was not busy and was able to get a lot of information. We were very upfront with him that we were not buying anytime soon - by the end of the year. He said that was fine, he would take as much time with us as we wanted, that he knew we'd decide on him and his car in the end and he'd get our money eventually (said in a very nice, funny way). And you know - he's right. We are now seriously thinking of buying two cars from that dealership - one this year, and one next.
the nice thing about finding a great dealer is that your next purchase will be that much easier when you decide to make that purchase. you'll feel comfortable with your salesperson, and they know you better as well.
sometimes that relationship is worth the additional $200 you might spend there!
Comments
$500 would always be greatly appreciated. DId you compare that final price to online prices as well?
We were looking for a Honda Accord, and people claimed they were paying $600 or $1000 under invoice. Based on our past experience, we thought those prices were incredibly low.
The dealer offered invoice in an Email, and we went there and offered about $500 less. I say "about" because I am guessing at the prices of the options we wanted.
Wow, car shopping sure is more fun then it used to be!
i wouldn't say thats the norm, but i also can't speak for the rest of the dealers out there. i know in my case, i give my absolute best price i can. if it comes down to $100 bucks or so, we may be able to bend a little more to make the deal, but usually my price is better than what most people who walk in the door get.
again, thats me here at my dealership - abc motors down the way may do it differently.
-thene
-thene
Can you tell the internet manager who originally helped you so they get any commissions/credit?
Just trying to be fair.
Thanks for your help.
You won't get a better deal from an "Internet Manager".
It is nice that you would ask. A lot of times, people try to go around their salesperson thinking, for some reason, that there is a super special deal for them if them mention the internet.
Really... you probably won't do any better with the internet manager at that store, than you will with that salesperson.. The internet is great for weeding out places that just aren't competitive on price, but it isn't likely to get you a better price at any one specific store..
regards,
kyfdx
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good luck with your purchase!
-thene
Bingo......!
They report to the same person, they get approval from the same guy and the "Internet Manager" doesn't have any magic wand or special powers and doesn't have any direct line with the owner .... all deals get looked at real closely by the same management team .................
Terry.
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However, from my experience, you will get a straight answer.
Try asking a salesman for a good out-the-door on a certain car. If you get a price, I doubt it will be any good.
When I asked for OTD prices over the internet, I got some good ones.
i fixed it! i forgot the number at the end. try now!
-thene
bob - how do you know they were all good? After all, you only bought at one place.
I had read about other people buying Accords for $1000 under invoice and one guy in our area claimed he got one for $600 under invoice.
I thought the dealers giving an OTD price of invoice with no Doc fee was not bad. That's why I called these prices "good ones".
We went to one of the dealers, offered about $500 under invoice, and they took it.
You know, buying cars is pretty easy. I wonder if it just as easy to be a salesman.
but i will admit, it is a great feeling to deliver a car to someone who is excited and happy about their purchase. that makes it worthwhile!
-thene
Inskip gets back to me and tells me they have a number of the model I want in stock and just said "hopefully you can come down here and test drive" and to call, email or just go down there. I decided to try just going down there at about 10am about a week later. They only had 1 used one and it was a stick, couldn't test drive that. So after going all that way I figured maybe they have some more cars somewhere else.. I walked around the parking lot for about 10 minutes with my mom looking at cars, figured someone would come around. No. So my mom went inside just to ask that one question. There's a group of 3 guys standing in front of a door just bullshitting and laughing with eachother. Nobody said anything to her, she stood there. So she finally just excused herself and asked if there was anyone available that she could ask about a car.. They told her "uh well we're all kind of busy right now, could you come back later?" :surprise: :surprise:
LOL!. Wow. Since when do you go to a dealer and actually have a problem finding a salesman? I probably should've stuck to email.
The 2nd Dealer - First Acura in MA. I've only dealt with via Email. I emailed them just asking what they had in stock and if I could make an appointment to test drive..etc I got sent back an obviously automated email with my name added. None of my questions were asked, it was just telling me what a great dealership they were, they're glad to welcome me as a customer, how great their certified program and warranty is. 5 days later I get another email saying "we had not emailed long ago.." (We emailed? :confuse: ) and only asked when I was going down there and if I needed directions..or wanted to handle everything over the phone. Why couldn't he simply be more specific and answer my questions? If he would've said something like "please call to make a test driving appt" or to just go down there..... Sure. But too vague. Since Inskip was so rude, I'll probably go down to this place just to check out it out for the hell of it. Maybe I'll have better luck with them and actually get a salesman.
Majestic Honda in RI was great dealing with in person. I had searched this board before and seemed a few people had good experiences dealing with their internet service. I think I went though carsdirect just to get a quote and I didn't get anything but automated responses telling me to call. Then I tried again a month later with a different email and questions..lol And not a reply. Maybe it wasn't detailed enough, I just told them the car I want,my price range and options I want and my mistake was probably asking what the lowest monthly payments could be. lol But the salesman had no problem telling me what that was based on my credit rating without pulling it. If I do get a Honda, I'd definitely go with that guy again.
Your getting ready to make the second most important decision of your life, and your emailing people for information.?? ..
You need to drive the vehicles first... would you email a dentist.? or a house painter.? .... *Pick-up a phone*, get a name, make an appointment and get over it .. for all the time you just spent posting, you could have driven the vehicles and seen whether you liked one or both and probably made your deal already ......
Terry.
Terry makes a good point. Strangely enough, I bought both of our last two cars over the internet--or at least made the arrangements to come in to buy, but in both cases I had driven the model before and in both cases I bought used.
The first was through autotader.com. in 2000: a 1992 Toyota MR2 and it was 150 miles away in a different state. I did follow-up the email with two phone conversations, drove the car and it was exactly as advertised so I made the offer and still have it.
The second was more convoluted and started with an attempt to get a specific set of options on a brand new (2004) Toyota Rav4. At first there was nothing available equipped the way we wanted so we elected to drive 220 miles to Dallas to get the only one with most of the options. We agreed upon a price with the internet salesman, but double checked before we got on the interstate. Good thing, because someone else had already put a deposit down.
I tried contacting dealers in OKC and Tulsa to see if they'd be interested in ordering one, but no one ever returned any of the emails--maybe they thought I was the proverbial 15 year old toying with them. So I ordered one through my local dealer. 5 1/2 months later they say sorry we just won't be able to get one this year, but you can re-order and perhaps get one in 05. According to our salesman the main hitch was getting the side airbags option.
So I check autotrader.com and find a really nice 02 Rav4 with AWD (also hard to find in OK, but helpful visiting family in MI in the winter). The car had only 20K on the clock and was being sold by a Lexus dealership. We didn't get any response from their internet salesman, but followed it up with a couple of phone calls. It looked and drove as new and was $10K less than a similarly equipped new one (but no side airbags).
I guess my first point is that the internet does serve a purpose in helping narrow the field of possibilities for the buyer, particularly when you have to drive some distance to even look at a car. This is much more fruitful, however, if you have driven similar cars/models in advance. My second point is that the internet has worked much better for me with used vehicles--maybe because much more info seems to be included about the specific car/truck/suv. My third and final point is that if you are really interested in a specific car or model it really pays to follow-up with a phone call or two to cut through any confusion.
So does anyone have any thoughts about the use of the internet when buying new vs. used? Of course if I had more choices I'd much prefer to develop a relationship with someone like isellhondas or Terry, and have made such a connection with a local Toyota salesman. I will buy from him in a heartbeat if our next vehicle is a Toyota. IMO no new technological innovation trumps a salesperson you like and trust.
Gogiboy
Spoken English is much more embarrassing for not native speaker. It takes much time to find right wording, especially not in everyday context. You look silly and during all the conversation feel that you are wasting time of your listener. Even if he manage to understand your accent, bad wording and sentence constructs. It is even more difficult to understand the spoken English: continuous speech not divided to separate words, skipped consonants, jargon words, etc., not to mention different accents: regional, black, and yes, foreign accents of immigrants from different countries.
Even after living in US for 9 years and being citizen for 3 years, I still encounter problems with spoken English time to time. And never sure if, or rather when, will encounter it. On the other hand, when I immigrated, I already could read in English not much worse than now. One-two unknown words on a full page of NY Times, except in fashion and sports departments. Well, I do not understand fashion even in my native Russian.
Phone is even worse in this respect than face-to-face conversation. It is much more difficult to understand speech on phone, and you cannot help with gestures.
The other place I don't even know the area its in, so I didn't want to go down there for nothing to testdrive like I did with Inskip. I might be going down there next week and I'll definitely call and ask first.
The Honda if they had anything in stock with what I wanted, I would've forgoten about the Acura and just had done the deal over the internet.
He said their dealership is part of a much larger group of dealers, and the policy for the entire group is to give specific prices over the internet. If a person contacts them over the internet and asks for a price, he will give them a price.
He said they believe that if they did not give a price, they would definitely lose the customer. If they give a price, they at least have a chance to get the customer into their store.
Maybe that's the way the world is moving. My guess is that some independent dealers may resist giving out prices over the internet, but the big chains of dealers realize the world has changed and buyers want prices handed to them on a silver platter.
By the way, the dinner with her family was very enjoyable and we think her relationship with our son has some very good possibilities. We are on cloud ten.
glad to hear you had a wonderful dinner with your son and his girlfriend and family! Her brother is right - if you don't give out a price, you dont get anyone coming in. sure, there is a possibility they will take that number to other dealers, but if you dont give them anything - then you have definitely lost them. I mean, as a consumer, if you are emailing a dealer, you are expecting a number right? any dealer who doesn't give one doesnt get a second thought...
its tough to tell the guys here that that is how it is...i am only 25, but everyone else here is more old school with regards to sales - the internet is a tough sell to those who've been advertising solely in print...
btw, we are a small 2 brand family owned dealership in the middle of nowhere CT. if we don't offer price over the net, what else do we have!
-thene
btw, ......... >>we are a small 2 brand family owned dealership in the middle of nowhere CT. if we don't offer price over the net, what else do we have!** ...
=======================
You just answered your own question and didn't even know it ...
This isn't a "old" "new" school thing .. it's market penetration and floor traffic, plain and simple ...... if you're 10/12 miles away from the competitors or the main drag, or in your words "in the middle of nowhere" then you need every source you can get your hands on, because your floor traffic can't keep the lights on ...
That said, for the dealers that get 20/30 email requests a day, they need someone to "qualify" the requests .. does he have a trade.? what other models are they looking at.? how far is the distance.? .. stuff like that .... but in your situation, I would be doing the same ........................
Terry.
BTW, wWere, I'm from MA & NY...
the closest major highway is 25 minutes from here...no one really drives this way on the way to anywhere...which is why i say we are out of the way. you have to purposefully decide you are going to come out to where we are...doesnt quite help that much with floor traffic...
and we average maybe 80-100 people walking through a month in our store (we have another franchise next door that has been here longer that sees a few more people)...but small to say the least!
-thene :-)
And Dorothy and Toto will be coming back from Kansas in no time ....l.o.l......
Terry.
Any suggestions on the timing of requesting quotes via Internet and test-driving to even pick which car we want?
And, it's doubtful you would save any money. Being an "Internet" customer doesn't empower a person toward a better deal.
I would simply ask your salesperson if any special deals are offered that he/she could offer you as well.
Or, if you want, just call the internet guy and set up an appointment for your "entensive" test drive etc and just deal solely with that person.
Or, if you want, just call the internet guy and set up an appointment for your "entensive" test drive etc and just deal solely with that person
good luck!
-thene
Thank-you for your kind, helpful advice. They both sound like ways that we could make an informed decision without being in situations were we would be uncomfortable. I appreciate that you took the time to reply.
i am an internet manager, and i like to give advice that will make the process as easy for you as possible, as well as making it easy for the internet manager. an easy deal is almost always a pleasant one! and who doesnt want a pleasant car purchasing experience?
good luck!
-thene
That's how things should work. If the other salesperson is busy or unavailable, the internet person takes over and it's a split deal. Nothing wrong with that.
the internet departmenat can provide "special" internet pricing to the first salesperson so the shopper won't think they aren't being treated in the same manner as a regular internet shopper.
I just get annoyed sometimes when I've spent hours with a customer answering questions, driving multiple cars etc on a busy Saturday only to have them try to back door me by going through the internet department.
Heck, I can be an "Internet Manager" or a "Fleet Manager" anytime a person wants me to be one...just ask!
However, this is obviously a growing problem that car dealers will have to address, not just for internet sales, but for other non-direct buying methods, like using a broker or buying service (Costco, BJ’s, to name a few).
It sounds like you have had "typical" dealer bad experiences and I fully understand. I'm originally from So. Calif and I've had simialr experiences myself.
Now that I understand your motives I do have a suggestion.
Simply ask your friends and neighbors for a referral. If you see a new car at the grocery store with the temp tags on it, ask the owner how their experience was.
They will usually be happy to tell you both good and bad.
Avoid the stores that advertise using full page "screamer" ads. If you see a line of salespeople standing on the sidewalk, keep driving!
Look for family owned stores that hire and RETAIN long term salespeople. You won't find many of these places.
I would like to think this isn't a "growing problem". I would like to think things are getting better.
Good luck...it doesn't have to be hard.
Join the club. I hate to megotiate too. When we buy a car, we make an out-the-door offer and wait to see if it accepted.
If they accept, we buy the car. Otherwise, we leave. Simple as that.
We had a great experience with salesman when we bought our 2000 Buick Regal. No haggling. I brought my printouts and named price. He found the car we wanted in another dealership, and we agreed to pay $250 more for the service. We signed papers, paid deposit, and everybody was happy.
The subsequent experience with the dealership was very bad. The finance guy cheated us, and service advisers treated me as trash. However, we really like the salesman.
Four years later, in November 2004, my wife and I decided to replace our second car. It gave us too much troubles, too expensive, and too often. We like our Regal and decided to by another one. My wife was afraid of used cars and wanted to buy car new, while 2004 model Buick Regals still were available. I looked on Internet and found only 7 copies in 200 miles radius from our home, all in different states. Why not let our friendly salesman to earn a bit for bringing one of them in our town to sell it us through his dealership? We were ready to pay reasonable money for the service.
I brought my printouts to dealership, the salesman found the same cars in his network (we compared VINs). He received more information than I. For example, that the car we like most was already 450 days old, was used as demo, and had about 6000 miles on odometer.
My wife and I like the car, and we expected a good deal. Dealers do not like to sell cars for less than invoice, even demo with high mileage. However, it was reasonable to buy an extended warranty for car that was used, and we expected a good discount for the warranty. Near invoice, not list.
Than we started discussing price. The salesman went in other room and returned with his calculations. He switched very fast to the bottom line, "great price!". Well, it accounted for great GM rebates, and great points on my GM card. Otherwise it was a list price. Zero dealer discounts. BTW, such calculations are easy to do in head.
I showed the salesman my numbers and calculations. In reality I offered two prices: for car only, or for car with GM extended warranty. I was open to discussing my numbers, item by item. However, he told me that this is too complicated, that my bottom line is way too low, and that his numbers are firm. Well, no deal, and we left reluctantly. Than the salesman went to parking lot after us, and told that he have to feed his kids, and can offer $1000 less. We felt sorry for him...
I believe that either the salesman, or his manager decided that we desperately want the specific car, and will pay any price, or at least the full list price.
The same evening I sent e-mail to New York dealer who had the car we wanted, with my price. The same I offered before. His internet manager/salesman responded the next day. Turned to be that the car had 800 miles more on odometer than we thought. However, his price was $400 ---less--- that what we offered in the e-mail.
We drove to New York City, test-drove the car, and decided to buy it. Several days later we drove to NYC again, signed all papers, and returned in the new car. The final price was exactly what I offered, because our local dealer was ready to pay $400 more for trade-in.
The final price was $4000 less than what our local dealer told is his firm price. Or $3000 less what he offered because he needs to feed his kids.
We would be happy to pay instead several hundred dollars for the service. The NYC dealer is in 105 or 110 miles from our home. We had to cross twice from Connecticut to Staten Island and back in NYC traffic. We wasted two days.
However, $4000 / $3000 was a good price for our troubles.
By the way, the New York dealership paid for extended warranty by two coupons he had from GM.
Resume: even a long serving salesman can be great first time, and be bad the next time.
Someone should share that with your salesman.
" I have to feed my kids"...that's just pathetic.
Exactly. Even more a demo car with 6800 miles of NYC traffic. Generally in good shape, but with several small chips on rear bumper and elsewhere...
Through ATG's website, you are directed to local dealers. The program gives you a certificate that promises to offer savings of $50 to $1200 below the dealer's "best and most competitive price offered to the general public."
Has anyone had experience using this type of service. I wonder if it's really a good deal or could I get a better deal on my own?
I can almost guarantee you could do better on your own. The statement above is vaguer than Clinton on the witness stand. It basically says "we'll give you $50 off any number we care to make up".
We did make internet contact with one salesman we liked, who treated us nicely online. We went in one night when he was not busy and was able to get a lot of information. We were very upfront with him that we were not buying anytime soon - by the end of the year. He said that was fine, he would take as much time with us as we wanted, that he knew we'd decide on him and his car in the end and he'd get our money eventually (said in a very nice, funny way). And you know - he's right. We are now seriously thinking of buying two cars from that dealership - one this year, and one next.
sometimes that relationship is worth the additional $200 you might spend there!
-thene
Choice 1: Spend $200 more to have a friendly salesman and then come home to have a can of pork and beans for dinner.
Choice 2: Buy the car for $200 less at another dealer, give the salesman the can of pork and beans, and then go out with my wife for a nice dinner.