Ford Mustang (2004 and earlier)

cdlrt

I saw the Mustang last night up close for the first time at the Wash DC Auto Show. The crowds really were ogling both of the demo cars. I was talking to several people who owned older Stangs and were on waiting lists for the new ones. A couple guys were waiting for the rag top edition. I'm an F-150 guy so not really in the market for a car right now, but based on what I saw last night, I'd buy one in a minute if I had extra change. By the way, a great selection of vintage Mustangs is on display at the Auto Show as well for anyone with interest.

john_324

Cool...I'm going tomorrow. I'm esp. interested in the vintage Mustang display...how many are there on display?

cdlrt

I"m thinking about 10 are on display from 65 through about 71 and everyone is showroom condition.

texas_ford_guy

not true. doesnt count against allocation. hasnt altered ours anyhow.

john_324

Now there's something to look forward to...the rest of the D.C. autoshow is usually pretty pedestrian, showcasing cars that are already avaiblable. But I'm excited to see the vintage 'Stangs...

 

Thanks for the info!

graphicguy

Have to believe that allocations won't really matter since Ford's car sales have dropped 5% from last year. That's on top of the previous year's drop off in car sales. To me, that points to Ford producing as many cars as they can to stem the slide in their car sales.

 

SUV sales are off, too. According to Ford, the only vehicles doing well are the F150s.

 

If the Mustang is as hot a seller as I'm sure Ford hopes it is (at least initially), then they'll crank out as many as they can to make up for the slide of all their other models.

kyleknicks

let's talk about the cars themselves..and not worry about how many cars or trucks Ford will sell..gosh

qbrozen

I think you're missing the train of thought here.

 

We are talking about the car itself. We're talking about its resale value. That's where all of this has stemmed from.

 

But, yes, I agree that we should stop discussing it since its pointless to argue about what may or may not happen. Until it does happen, there will just be no convincing folks to change their opinions.

Kirstie_H

A magazine reporter would love to find some folks who've pimped their own rides. He is particularly interested in people who've done this for the first time and were driven to do it, at least in part, from watching a tv show like Pimp My Ride, Overhaulin' or something similar. He is looking for average drivers who are just discovering that they can personalize their rides, and is not as interested in the traditional tuner crowd who've been doing this for years.

 

If you have a story to share, please send your name, daytime contact info and a line or two about your vehicle to jfallon@edmunds.com by Wednesday, January 5, 2005.

Thanks!

silver_bullet

The new issue of C&D has a short take on the V6. With the auto, they clocked 0-60 in 6.9 seconds - not shabby at all. I finally had a chance to drive the V6 auto back-to-back with the T5 manual, and I was surprised at how much better the auto felt. For my money, the V6 fills the bill, and looks better IMO (although I'll probably figure out some way of adding the GT grille with foglamps). Maybe I'm just getting old, but what is it with this "real men drive V8s" nonsense? Are people really that insecure?

graphicguy

Insecure? No!!!! Power-hungry....most definitely!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

scarletstang

I have test driven the V-6 more than once and loved it. It has a lot more get up than my 2002. I'm a thread's thickeness away from buying. Love the retro style and they got my weidveil blue color in finally. Anyone else out there buying or bought????

tayl0rd

Insecure? No!!!! Power-hungry....most definitely!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I second that!

tayl0rd

Yeah, I purchased one on New Year day.

Torch Red GT w/ every option (except the auto transmission).

nb2169

"Maybe I'm just getting old, but what is it with this "real men drive V8s" nonsense? Are people really that insecure? "

     I don't have a he-man attitude about V8's as opposed to V6's,and I really don't tromp on the gas alot, but there is not a sweeter sound than a V8 with a well tuned exhaust,IMHO. That is the only real reason I prefer and drive vehicles with a V8.(O.K., I gotta admit I like the idea of having that little extra snort of power every now and then!)lol

scarletstang

Was it a V6 or V8? How do you like so far? Anything you don't like?

scarletstang

Clap, Clap, Clap! My feelings exactly. The police don't know the difference when they stop to give you a ticket anyway . . . .

silver_bullet

Point taken about having the extra "go power" and a nicer engine sound, but really, it all depends on what you're coming out of. I've been driving a four cylinder compact pickup for the last four years, so a V-6 Mustang feels like a rocketship to me. Besides, at some point you need to decide exactly how much power you're willing to pay for in gas and insurance. A few years ago, I got to drive a friend's Viper - after that experience, EVERY other car felt slow

john_324

I have an '02 V8, and absolutely love it (and yeah, the sound is a big part of it). But I also seriously considered a V6 during my buying decision, and still think they're fine cars and are every bit "true" Mustangs.

 

In the end, I think, you remember cars for how much fun you had with them, not necessarily how fast they were (unless we're talking exotic-level stuff)...and V6 Mustangs are plenty of fun. In fact, bang-for-the-buck-wise, Mustangs of any type are at the top of the list.

 

The Mustang boards elsewhere on the net are filled with people who spend all their time trying to make their Mustangs faster; they'll spend huge sums of money (and more importantly time) pursuing the smallest gains in power. While some definitely enjoy the process for its own sake, I get the feeling alot of 'em need to really get some perspective about pursuit of power vs. pursuit of enjoyment...

Mr_Shiftright

I think the V8 mystique is because of what we all grew up with (most of us). The V8 sound is just so....American.

graphicguy

Shifty...couldn't agree with you more. Having had the torque of a V8 (not those OHC jobs, either) at your call has spoiled me for years while the U.S. lost it's "car indentity" for awhile.

 

MPG aside, there's nothing quite so visceral as having an OHV V8 under the bonnet.

 

While the Mustang currently has the V8 muscle car coupe market to itself (excluding the Corvette), with the advent of the Chrysler 300 Hemi (and soon the SRT version), the V8 Caddys and the continuation of the Lincoln mark with their V8s (LS and Town Car), I think the V8 is going through somewhat of a rennaisance in this country. I also expect that with technologies like "cylinder shutdown", more precise fuel delivery/combustion, that V8s are back and here to stay.

 

BTW, the first car I ever drove (at 15) was my Father's Chrsyler New Yorker with a 440 under the hood. That experience has stuck with me for a lot of years.

 

My older sister has a 65 Mustang with a 289 V8. While driving it feels akin to driving a Peterbilt when comparing it to driving something of more recent vintage, even that little V8 is a blast to drive.

john_324

Pontiac Bonneville is now available with a V8 (a Northstar)...though Pontiac doesn't say if it's rwd or fwd.

myob

The F150's aren't exactly selling like hotcakes, at least compared to what the production volume is, they have them selling for under invoice (w/ rebates) at the big cars direct website we all know about. And they're usually not the rock bottom lowest deal around.

 

Back to Mustangs, can anyone point me to where there are some pics of '05 mustangs with aftermarket wheels/tires? I find the stock wheels to be too skinny and the stance not wide enough. Some of the ones I saw in car mags looked better.

 

Also, how much handling/braking difference is there in a v6 and v8? I find the V6 power numbers perfectly suitable for a 3rd car.

akirby

V6 should handle slightly better than the V8 due to better weight distribution.

 

I have no idea where you got the idea that F series sales were down. December and 2004 total sales were both record setters. See for yourself:

 

http://media.ford.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=19754

kcflyer

When does Ford plan on offering a convertible version of the new Mustang? Sorry if this is redundant, Fist time on this board.

tayl0rd

I got the GT Premium and, so far, there's nothing I don't like. Well, I do find it difficult to find a comfortable seatback angle because of how the head restraints are tilted so far forward. Maybe for next year they can add a few notches to the seatback adjustment.

 

If I put the seat upright for more comfortable shifting, I feel like the head restraint is pushing my head forward. If I lean it back for a comfortable head position, I feel like I have to reach too far to shift. I just need to find a sweet spot. So far, every time I've gotten in it, I feel like I have to readjust the seat. And the seats sit low in the cockpit so I have to step up over the door sill to get out and have to be mindful not to kick the door panel or speaker cover.

 

These aren't complaints or dislikes, per se. I just have to get re-accustomed driving a sports car/sports coupe. It's been over two years since my last Mustang GT. I had a '99 and traded it for my '02 300M Special, which I still have.

 

I've been told that the back seats are really comfortable. My other half has sat back there and said they feel good. The salesman said the same thing when he was in the back. I haven't tried them yet.

 

A lot of previous gen Mustang owners aren't too fond of this one. I have to say that this one is WORLDS better than the previous. I'm not talking as far as speed, which it is also better in that regard. I'm talking about just the overall feel, comfort, interior design. It just feels so much better. We'll see how it feels after a few thousand miles. So far, I expect it to wear well.

akirby

It's being revealed next week at the Detroit Auto Show. Should hit showrooms early March. Pictures here: http://media.ford.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=19868

kcflyer

WOW!

 

I'm in love. This isn't a car, it's a time machine!

 

Thanks

nedc2

"V6 should handle slightly better than the V8 due to better weight distribution. "

 

I as talking to a Ford engineer at a Mustang ride& drive event who told me that when the new all aluminum Duratec 35 V6 is available, about 2 years hence, the weight distribution should be 50/50. That engine will also more HP and torque than the current V6, better mileage too. Maybe good things do come to those who wait.

dools

Just talked to a dealer at Mossy Ford in San Diego. He said that they should be taking orders for the convertible in Feb for delivery in May.

rayainsw

"Pontiac Bonneville is now available with a V8 (a Northstar)...though Pontiac doesn't say if it's rwd or fwd. "

 

It is FWD - as is the new Grand Prix V8 5.3L GXP.

 

- Ray

Waiting to drive - and hear that unique, heterodyne beat of a V8 . . .

john_324

Wow...fwd you say. Grand Prix V8 too. That's pretty cool that Pontiac is quietly slipping some musclecars in behind the GTO. Are there any torque-steer issues I wonder with that setup though...

 

Re an earlier comment about the previous-gen owners not liking the 2005, just give 'em time. They're a notoriously conservative crowd, and it takes them awhile to warm up to anything new. After all, these were the same folks who HATED the SN95 (previous gen Mustang) design when it came out, and mourned the demise of the Fox bodies for years. :-)

skeezix

Has anybody wondered why Ford didn't put a 6 speed manual in the new Mustang? The F-bodys had a 6 speed in 1993. I'm just wondering. I haven't seen a test in a magazine even mention it. After owning two cars with 6 speeds, I wouldn't want to go back to a 5 speed anything.

 

PS: After owning a 400+ horsepower car with a V8 that has gotten 32 MPG on the highway, I wouldn't ever want to go back to a 6 cylinder anything.

graphicguy

With as much torque the GT has, it is surprising they didn't include an extra gear. For the most part, I doubt anyone will complain, however. I've driven the GT 5-speed and it's a dandy....worlds ahead of the F-body manual trannys (which were heavy and bulky in comparson). Plus, I would think the extra gear in the GT would have had a negative cost impact.

 

Agree with you about the 6 cyl feelings. While I can see the appeal of someone wanting the Mustang look without the thrust/handling of the GT, for $25K it's hard to go wrong with the GT. You've got to enjoy the drive as much (or more) as the look.

 

I've had two test drives in the GT....one was in my sister's '05 GT and the other in a friend's GT. I'm amazed at what Ford did with the suspension (especially with the rear solid axle). It rides well while giving a good sense of road holding.

 

It won't make me forget what it's like to drive my RX8 (which is sublime), but if I ever decide to get back into a "muscle car", the Ford store will be my first stop.

john_324

Not really Mustang-related, but wow...what kind of V8-powered car did you have that had 400+ hp and got great gas mileage?

 

:-)

m1miata

V6 is said to have a better sound coming out of the pipes now. Will have to make note of this when doing a test drive some day. Would consider buying the 2005 in a V6. The new '05 is good effort in many a way. I am still thinking that the styling could be a little less retro, but what the heck. I am sure they have plans for making this look more and more like the show car. I like the old curved dash in black better than the new silver rectangular look. Still don't know why the speedometer and tach are not side-by-side style. Sure love that V8 sound. May consider an older GT or Cobra some day. Call me crazy, but I think the 1994 thru 98 styled 'Stangs were some of the best. At some angles, the '99 to '04 models look good, yet the flat sides take away from the cars overall great looks, I think. Still pretty neat. A Cobra would be nice, with the independate rear suspension. The shifter location so far forward on the previous models seemed to be a bit akward. I have not spent a lot of time with a stick Mustang, and have not tried the Cobra. Any input from those with a GT or better yet a Cobra on the quality of clutch, and shifting in these cars? I had a Stealth, and it was so-so, then I got a Miata and it is all too sweet and easy to shift. You get spoiled. I imagine insurance to be higher in a Cobra vs. a GT, even though I was thinking of say a '98.

celica20

I'm a long time toyota celica driver now intending to buy the mustang (no more celicas available and i rejected the mitsubishi eclipse after reading about it). I don't know if i should get the V6 premium or the GT(v8). I've driven V8's in the past and it is mega more powerful than the V6 or the 4cyl i drive. The dealer told me the V8 is not good in snow because of traction issues/weight. He suggests the V6but will order what i want. I like the V8 features otherwise. does it handle ok? i need an automatic since i can't drive manual, so shifting and playing "Fast and Furious' isn't an issue. I just want a good solid car with good resale and i've always wanted a Mustang since the 60's (yes, i'm not 20 any more LOL). Thanks.

skeezix

I still have a 2003 Z06. It now has 11,700 miles. The computer says total average fuel mileage is 26.1 with mostly highway miles. That 32.8 MPG was a max. My latest trip to Texas (1600 miles) averaged about 28.

 

I know the V6 Mustang is powerful. All I meant is for just a bit more, one could get more power and not sacrifice gas mileage too much. One doesn't buy even a V6 Mustang for gas mileage, but it is cool if good mileage comes along with the package.

 

All potential buyers, repeat after me, the GT is safer, the GT is safer, performance is good, performance is good.

m1miata

Traction control. Be sure it has it, if traction problems are foreseen. A V6 can spin you out with ease. You will sacrifice 3MPG on the use of an automatic. That 25MPG on the auto. V6 is closer to V8 MPG. Ford gas mileage seems to always be subpar to GM. One thing I can say for GM, is that the V6 engines of that company get great gas mileage. As for the Eclipse, the style is exciting and the new engines available may look promissing. Will the company last? Build quality has been below average in the past, but I am NOT saying the new lineup of cars is bad, as they have not had a chance to prove themselves. That said, Mitsu has stubled perhaps one too many a time. I has a Dodge Stealth, by Mitsu, and it was a fun and beautiful car. What I found is that the reliability was so-so, as in middle road, and that parts were too expensive. It was like they sell the car at a great price, and you pay later in repair parts. If I bought a Mustang new or fairly new, to keep insurance lower, I would buy the V6 stick. If I bought a V8 right now, I could only afford one used, and would likely go automatic, as the old sticks were no so slick.

lmx

you gotta get the v8,do you remember in 94 when the gt got out it only had 215hp...now with the new one theire starting with 300hp a big bump...but i'm sure that in a couple of years they will increase these number...v6 is an old technologie.

m1miata

Take a look at the torque numbers on the 215HP engine compared to the current engine. Yes, the current HP is more, but at a certain point, it no longer matters unless the car is to used on the race track. The new V6 has plenty HP and torque. Just compare it to the original 'Stang 1965 and even '66, which had plenty enough power to get tail happy. I had one with the 289 engine. For raw power on the cheap, you could buy a used Camaro SS. Now-a-days most cars have HP which exceeds the driving ability of most drivers. You want to keep within say using 75% of both in the way of a safety margin.

john_324

"Now-a-days most cars have HP which exceeds the driving ability of most drivers"

 

Amen to that...I think in terms of overall driving skill (not simply mashing the pedal), V6s are plenty robust engines for must people. Probably even me.

 

Though I will say that the high-rpm power allows me to keep competitive with better handling vehicles on the track (I pick up on the straights what I lose in the turns)...but this is not what the typical buyer uses his/her Mustang for. As you point out, it's all about TQ, not necessarily HP.

lmx

your right on one point the torque amount is really important it makes the car move from a standstill to let's say 60 miles per hour but even with the v6 you won't get as fast from o-60...my explanation is that the v8 will always get you more fun for the $ and access to the latest technology,how much fun can it be to control the car with the trottle and to feel that your engine will never get you down...

graphicguy

None....I can't keep my foot out of the powerband of any car to get decent MPG. That's just me, though.

graphicguy

My sister has a "cherry" '65 Stang with the 289 in it. While it's a beautiful car, it can't touch any more recent V8 Stang. Plus, when you drive it, the difference between it and any car made in the last 10 years is more closely akin to driving a John Deere tractor.

ichee marone

Why isn't there a moonroof option for this car?

ksuwildcat001

Ford doesn't want moonroof sales to hut convert sales. They haven't offered a factory sunroof in years.

m1miata

" Ford doesn't want moonroof sales to hut convert sales. They haven't offered a factory sunroof in years. "

 

And I may add that they do not have a roll bar in their convertible, so unless you add one, I would pass on the drop top version.

fdthird

And why exactly would you do that???

akirby

I thought it was because there wasn't enough room for a traditional moonroof.

 

I can't imagine that a moonroof would take sales away from convertibles.

 

BTW - what's the difference between a sunroof and moonroof? Is it just marketing hype?