Subaru Crew Problems & Solutions

ateixeira

Resetting the ECU clears the memory and so yes, it would forget how the last owner drove. Though that data sort of fades the more you drive it. Still, get a clean slate.

Throttle body service can be done by a shop, it's not expensive. Just include it in the 30k, should add less than $100 to the total bill.

Bonus - the 626 was quicker than ever after they cleaned the throttle body.

-juice

ateixeira

Buff it with...?

Rubbing compound? Or start with wax first?

Can I use solvents, or might that damage the clear coat?

Body shop - good idea. He just doesn't want to go through insurance, his deductible would probably cover it anyway.

-juice

subearu

claying the affected areas? That works for overspray doesn't it? Could be worth a try, definately safer than sanding or other chemicals.

-Brian

ateixeira

I'll try it, gotta get a clay bar. My dad is spending a week in New Mexico, so it would be a nice surprise to have it fixed by then.

-juice

lark6

Try the clay bar and detailing spray before you try anything else. Be gentle and if it doesn't work, seek professional help (for the car, that is). If you aren't ready to do that you could try a gentle polishing compund like Meguiar's Swril Mark Remover 2.0 or 3M's Perfect-It Swirl Mark Remover for dark colored cars.

I'm trying to deal with what looks like acid rain spots on the hood and fenders of my Forester. I finally got to wash and wax it last weekend after two late snowstorms and a couple of weeks in long-term airport parking and was dismayed to find the damage there.

Good luck,
Ed

ateixeira

My dad needs professional help.

Actually, he was pretty calm about it, just disappointed.

-juice

jimmyp1

Was the airport parking structure fairly new by any chance? My mother-in-law's Acura TL Type S just sustained $1,000.00+ worht of paint damage after parking in a newly constructed parking garage at her office. The office paid for it all. Something in newly finished concrete I suppose. Good luck with it.

Jim

locke2c

the best time to buff it would've been before the paint fully cured, so within 24 hours.

it's still possible to get it out now but not nearly as easy without messing up the car's normal finish.

so this is a note for all others if this ever happens to you-- get it into a body shop THAT DAY if at all possible. I had a friend who had silver paint on his driver's side windows and doors and it came right out. $100 at a good body shop, quick phone call to the manager to set it up on short notice.

-Colin

ateixeira

Too late for that. My dad did go out there shortly after it happened with a damp rag and it would not come off. It won't be that easy.

I think he said it happened on Monday at around 3pm. I didn't see until Tuesday, just before taking him to the air port.

-juice

lark6

Jim: No, open-air parking outside the airport grounds. It'd be nice to have someone pick up the tab but I can't specifically point fingers to any person, place or event. The car was so grimy before and after parking that I can't attribute it to something that happened while parked.

Not my usual car care scenario but I've been traveling a heck of a lot for work this year.

Ed

obone2

obone2

Ooops. Sorry about message 1157. My 2 year old got hold of the keyboard for a minute.

Thanks again. I'll give the ECR and throttle body cleaning a shot and let you guys know how it went.

-4paws-

hondafriek

The paint that was sprayed on is likely laquer paint, way to tell put a little laquer thinner on a rag and try to rub the paint off.

 If it does come off it is laquer and you can use laquer thinner to remove it, this is what a body shop wiil do.

The clear coat on modern cars is urathane and laquer thinners will not cause it any harm providing you use common sense and do not drench the paint with it.

I have used this method many times to remove overspray and also on cars that had been vandalised like your dads.

  Cheers Pat.

kens

juice,

I was catching up with my posts and I read about your dad's car. I'm really sorry to hear about what happened.

I think there's already been lots of good advice here. I personally don't know what to do. I would have tried the clay bar first. Next, I would call body shops and see if they could provide any tips. You never know -- sometimes shops will dispense info for free.

Ken

c_hunter

When I was a kid, I accidentally painted the hood of my Dad's 1975 red VW Rabbit while spraying my bike with silver paint. Regular wax took it right out, no fuss (cleaned the car within a few hours of the incident). And, I learned not to paint my bike on a windy day....

Craig

ateixeira

Cool, I even have lacquer thinner. I'll try a light touch first, see if it helps.

Thanks guys. I'll share pics when I get to my dad's car. We have 3 days of rain in the forecast right now.

-juice

psg

Probably beating a dead horse but I'll throw in my $0.02. I once used silicone aerosol lubricant (I think it was Gunk) to remove paint from a Ford SHO. My wife was backing out of her parking spot at work and heard a loud pop. Somehow (or someone placed) a can of red spray paint under her front right tire. It exploded and made a mess of the fender, wheel well, and tire of her silver car. When I got home, shortly after it happened, I figured I needed a solvent that would remove the spray paint (which hadn't cured) and not hurt the car's finish. At the time, it didn't seem like I had much to loose so I experimented and managed to stumble on the right solvent, Gunk. (I bet it was the carrier and not the silicone). The Gunk also worked wonders on a vinyl kitchen floor after my son spilled some Mazda black touch up paint on it, but that's another story.

Kids, ya got to love them, 'cause ya can't eat them.

Phil

ateixeira

Thanks for all the suggestions and the sympathy, guys.

-juice

forestergump

Did anyone else see the recall issued on the 2000 through 2003 Legacy, Outback and Baja? It's posted at:

http://www.media.subaru.com

I tried to start a new thread on it, but for some reason couldn't

-Bob

bat1161

Bob,

Thanks for the heads up on the recall. It made me do a search at the nhtsa site and came up with several service bulletins for a 2000 Outback. Should I worry about any of them? The one I am most concerned about is:

 Make : SUBARU
Service Bulletin Num : WXW80
Component: ENGINE AND ENGINE COOLING:EXHAUST SYSTEM:EMISSION CONTROL
Summary:
 SOME VEHICLES MAY EXPERIENCE FRONT OXYGEN AIR / FUEL (A/F) SENSOR ELEMENT CRACKING. *TT

Thanks,
Mark

ateixeira

If that happens you'll get a CEL right away, so you must not have the problem.

-juice

tfoshbone

In the used subie market (95-97) what is the preferred engine or least problematic 2.2 or 2.5? I'm looking to buy first subie and am doing a little homework first. any help will be appreciated. thanks tom

nippononly

had already been in use at that point for more than five years in the Legacy - great engine.

But if what you want is a Legacy Outback from 96-97, you will only have one choice, the 2.5

ateixeira

Same year, I'd have to say the 2.2l for reliability. It's the same block, so by default it's more robust with less displacement and power.

-juice

newcar4newfam

FWIW, I have to agree that the 2.2l is an incredibly reliable engine. I bought a '92 used Legacy with the 2.2l and have never had a problem.

Barkley

dcm61

'96 Legacy Outback w/ manual transmission has 2.2L; w/ automatic transmission has 2.5L

DaveM

[Deleted User]

Juice: Any update on your father's paint finish?

I need to give due accolades to the service department at Larry H. Miller Subaru in Sandy, Utah. I took my Legacy to them last Thursday for the 30,000-mile service and to look into heavy clutch chatter.

When they pulled the transmission, it was apparant that at least the clutch disk and flywheel would need to be replaced.

Subaru resisted covering the clutch under warranty, but a little work from my service advisor turned things in my favor. In the end, Subaru paid to have the flywheel, clutch disk, throwout bearing, pressure plate, and clips replaced under warranty. The vehicle is performing like new again.

Just for fun, after the repairs were done, I called a different Salt Lake Subaru dealer service department and described the problem I was having. They said they had seen similar problems before, and they would NOT cover it under warranty and they would charge at least $1,000 for the work. They went to a LOT of effort to blame the problem on driving style. Apparantly Subaru owners are just plain hard on their cars unlike other makes.

<sarcasm>Yeah, right.</sarcasm>

-Ty

fibber2

Can anybody verify the numbering of cylinders on the H4 engine (ej-25) for me?

A local mechanic states that of the several blown head gaskets he has worked on lately, all were #4.

Several on this board have reported 'left rear' (I assume that means drivers side??). Do we have a data match?

Steve

ateixeira

Not yet. I'm picking him up Tuesday so I'll probably take some supplies with me.

I need to take a day or two off, in fact you just reminded me.

Anybody in Utah, take note of that dealer service dept.

-juice

dcm61

If you're standing in front of the car facing the engine it's:

 Passenger Driver
             3--|--4
             1--|--2
             FRONT

BTW, I have two #4 spark plug wires on my '03 Outback; no #2. I've seen many '03 H4's at auto shows with the same set up.

Hopefully this isn't a bad omen that #4 cylinder head gasket will blow. :-(

DaveM

locke2c

I blew a headgasket near #4 in a (slightly) modified EJ25 a year and a half ago. Pics here: http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4292183933

See pics #19 & 20. You can click on them in the album for a larger version.

-Colin

nygreg

#4 for me (left rear - driver's side).

Greg

nygreg

thanks for the info. Little story and all. Can you explain why you need to compress the tensioner vertically? Thanks

Greg

outback_97

Good to see another Utah poster. I haven't used LHM's service dept. but will definitely consider them. My extended service contract (third party) ran out so I'm no longer stuck with the dealer I've been using, which hasn't always been satisfactory. Thanks for the info.

HG: I think nearly all have been near #4 cylinder, from what I've read.

utahsteve

locke2c

Greg,

the timing belt tensioner is a piston in a viscous fluid. it must be compressed in a vertical orientation and slowly over 3 minutes with no more than 66lb/ft of force applied at any time... or otherwise, you'll blow the seals.

now why subaru chose to use such a device, difficult to reset and prone to failure, I have no idea.

-Colin

hondafriek

Colin, as well as using a difficult device to tension the timing belt, could you explain why Subaru chose such an oddball positive offset on their wheels.

  Makes it damned awkward when one is looking for aftermarket, the most common ofset seems to be +40mm.

 Cheers Pat.

locke2c

oh that one's easy.

the higher the positive offset, tucking the tires further under the fenders, the closer the center of the contact patch is to the suspension pivot on a macpherson strut suspension.

this does two key things:

1) significantly reduces load on wheel bearings

2) improves suspension geometry, especially ackerman.

although some of you subaru fans, especially SVX owners past & present, might be thinking that FHI didn't have #1 figured out all that well. I suspect what happened there was that the load was low enough they under-speced the wheel bearings just a bit. finally fixed in 2002 with the WRX's new bearing design and filtered down to all models now.

-Colin

hondafriek

As usual, a very clearly defined explanation, still makes it hard to find a good selection of aftermarket wheels though especially in 16".

  Cheers Pat.

nygreg

Still don't understand why it has to be compressed vertically. The viscous fluid and piston should not care what orientation they are in when being compressed. I think I am missing something (wouldn't be the first time).

Greg

paisan

My guess is that it had to do with the installation of the bearings, not the bearings themselves. I have almost 90K miles on my '92 SVX and tracked it 4x so far, no wheel bearing problems to report as of yet.

-mike

fibber2

Nice job on the photo documentation. I posted the question here to help clarify the cyl position, and as a way of getting to a broader audience, as you and others probably don't regularly haunt the OBW board. A close friend just had gasket failure (presumed, not torn down yet) on his '99 OBW @ 70k miles.

We both know a good foreign repair shop in the area, and after speaking with him got the info on cyl 4. He felt that some of the failures were so slight, that it might be possible to just retorque the head if you catch it early enough. But the teflon looks to be too far gone on yours to have made that trick work. BTW, his wife drives a '00 OBW, so he is a Subi fan.

Steve

ateixeira

Bearings were prone to failure on the 98-02 Foresters and 98-01 Imprezas. Maybe a few others. But I don't think Legacys had that problem often.

-juice

locke2c

Steve that's a remarkably bad idea and that technician needs his knuckles rapped for it.

NEVER loosen the head bolts on any engine, but especially an all-aluminum one, without replacing the head gasket. They make a one-time seal and it's folly to ever try to re-use one in any way... it will fail. They are $26 each, a pittance compared to the labor invested. The only reason any person would ever consider such a thing is if they were trying to make the car "good enough" to trade or sell and delay the issue for a bit to be someone else's headache. Not my cup of tea!

The head torquing procedure on the EJ series engine is brutal. Torque bolts in a particular sequence to such a value, back off 180 degrees in particular order, torque to a higher value in order, then turn an additional 90 degrees in order.

-Colin

kens

Colin -- great explanation on the wheel offset.

Ken

subearu

Colin talking about the torque sequence procedure (or ritual LOL). Labor is 9/10ths the work, eh?

Intriguing. So, is it just the driver side retaining heat more or a poor flow of coolant on the driver side of the H4 that causes this? Or just a bad batch of gasket materials?

-Brian

fibber2

I should fill in the rest of what was said on the subject for continuity sake, but your point is well taken. Remember that I got this second hand. My friend John contacted him - I have yet to speak to him directly on the issue.

It is this mechanics observation that the bolts on cyl 4 seem to loosen up with time, resulting in gasket failure. While it could be a gasket materials or installation issue, it seems strange to be so consistently the same cyl. To me this suggests some excessive temp cycling in this quadrant over the others. Perhaps coolant flow patterns and port sizing results in a higher temp at this corner of the block/head. Whether the bolts are receding into the head, gasket shrinks, etc is not know, but these bolts seem to be loose.

So it was suggested that maybe the failure could be prevented by doing a pre-emptive head torque. This doesn't seem too out of line as my last Datsun had head retorque as a maintenance item along with valve adjustment. He also wondered if a retorque at the first sign of seepage might keep it running, but I agree, this advice might have been in conjunction with trading the car in - FAST!

Steve

kens

The 2.2 is a nice engine. I drove a Legacy L sedan (98 I believe) loaner with the 2.2 and thought that it performed quite well.

The Impreza and OBS also use the 2.2 during this period.

I would avoid the 96 OB with the 2.5L engine since it requires premium fuel and generates 155 HP. The following year, the 2.5 got bumped to 165HP and lowered it's fuel requirement to regular.

Ken

ateixeira

I remember that procedure, too. I think learning the Tango to an expert level is easier. ;-)

-juice

fibber2

SoA told John that they could not help him with the blown HG at 70k, so he had the car flatbedded from the Subi dealer to George's foreign repair shop for a teardown. Without doing much of an investigation, the dealer was pushing for a full engine replacement at $4300, and John just wasn't going to go to that extreme without an independent investigation.

Steve

outback_97

I have some links to information that may be useful for your friend and his blown head gasket. Email me: outback_97 at hotmail dot com if you'd like, and I'll send them to you.

utahsteve