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Comments
In most cases, it's the gas cap not tight enough, or a bad O2 sensor. Simple stuff they can fix easily.
-juice
If you are hearing a "CLUNK" at low speeds when going over small bumps, that is probably the "steering rack" which has been reported on these boards as "normal". I DO hear this from time to time but this is definitely a low level "clunk".
she received the recall for the front springs on her '98 Legacy L Wagon.
Yes, I was aware of the recall over a month ago through the Subaru
on-line message boards I belong to. They was not sure it would effect L
wagons or if it extended down south as far as New York.
The problem seems to be that SOA (Subaru of America) spec.ed out a
coating for the front coil springs that was not corrosion resistant
enough. In New England and apparently NY. where road salt can wreck
havoc on the under body of vehicles, they have had concerns that if the
spring rusted enough it could break, resulting in a puncture of a front
tire! This would be a lawsuit ready to happen for Subaru, if someone
lost control while this occurred and crashed!
The problem is this, the recall only entails installing a shield on the
spring. This shield prevents a broken spring from puncturing the tire,
it does NOT prevent or rectify the corrosion problem with the front
springs. Seems GM might be using some of there "dirty" money fingers at
Subaru to boost profits and reduce Quality
I did hear that one owner in New Hampshire brought his Subaru in for the
recall in the Tech. and he looked at the springs and they were BADLY
corroded. The dealer agreed to both replace the front springs with the
new improved version AND install the recall shields! This is the
situation I would like to see for you. If there is a known problem with
these springs we don't just want a temporary solution that we will have
to deal with 2 years down the road. We want the problem rectified the
way it was suppose to be from the factory!! Wilton Subaru is a good
dealer they should help you, and concur with you on this one. If they
do not, let me know and I will let the list know about this one.
Joel - Brewster? I'm in Mahopac! Cool. Hey, you mention Wilton Subaru - would you recommend their service? I'm trying to find a good service dept for some of the work I can't do or for any warranty suff.
Greg
The big family in town back then was De Spain
Cheers Pat.
1. Remember to turn off the air conditioning but keep the fan running to "dry" things out before you park your Subie and shut off the engine. This should help reduce the chances your system will develop the "smell".
2. Buy a can of spray Lysol. Open all the vehicles windows. Turn your air conditioning system on with the fan on high speed making sure the system is not on recirc. Open the hood and locate the HVAC air intake plenum right below the windshield. Spray the Lysol into that air intake. The Lysol will kill the bacteria eliminating the "smell". Leave your windows open and allow the car to "air out" the Lysol smell. (It will be pretty strong in there!) Please remember to not spray your vehicle paint. I do not know if Lysol will harm your paint but I have always protected the paint on the vehicle while doing the Lysol procedure. I have never had a problem with it and I have used this procedure several times and it has worked everytime.
Thanks,
Scott
-Frank P.
Good luck,
Ed
Mine has 42k miles and has never burned a drop of oil. I've never added any.
-juice
-mike
I checked underhood a little bit after I asked around and simply tried a bottle of fuel system cleaner. (36k miles, outside possibility.) What I also should have done is reset the ECU because that's all I did last night and the problem is gone-- poof.
It's so nice to be able to accelerate without a big hole in the powerband from 4,000-4,800 rpm. If it comes back, I'm going to look at the MAF and knock sensor first.
-Colin
-juice
This really seems ridiculous. I am sorry to hear about the Trooper with the same problem. How can you expect 200k from an engine like this. All of my previous, and one current, Toyotas barely burned oil at post 200k.
And the fact that I hear of Forester's with no such problems tells me it is certainly the Valves. This according to the fact that they tell me the compression is within spec.
Has anyone used legal counsel for such a problem?
-Frank P.
There are quite a few upstaters there.
Julie - I've heard the same thing about "acceptable oil consumption". I have two Subarus 2.2L & 2.5L and neither burns a drop of oil. Both close to 60,000 miles.
Tell the dealer you want to set up an appointment with the District Service Operations Manager. Also get a case # from SoA.
Dennis
In my uninformed opinion, one quart of oil per 2,000 miles on a 30,000 mile, MY00 Forester (or any Subaru) seems high.
First, use mrdetailer's advice of the additive and UV light to check for leaks. If the dealer won't do this, try another (if feasible). Merely witching dealers solved some service woes.
Second, though within SoA's specs, ask a customer service rep (CSR) to open a case (ask for the case number). If asked, you're opening the case to track what may become a warranty issue.
You can open a case for anything -- it's how Subaru tracks issues (actual and perceived). I was unhappy with a dealer's service and opened a case. SoA provides the dealer with my feedback, the dealer can adjust their procedures accordingly, and SoA can monitor customer satisfaction with the dealer (bad dealers loose their franchises).
I would give SoA another chance on solving the problem. If you're not satisfied with the CSR's response, politely ask to speak to a supervisor. The key is to remove emotion from the transaction, focus on the facts, and jointly develop a solution (easier said than done). SoA wants to be your partner, not your adversary, even it doesn't seem that way now.
..Mike
..Mike
I have to say I thought they would be more consumer savvy. I talked to my brother-in-law who works as the head manager for the paint dept. at Ford in Chicago. He said Ford would bend over backwards to keep a cumstomer. He said they would probably even fix the Forester in hopes of a new client. (who knows if this would ever happen, but his point was clear to me)
by the way, thanks to all who have helped so far,this is very important to me.
It has 65,000 miles and the asking price is $15,000 CND seems like a hell of a good price to me.
Regarding the oil consumption question ongoing at the minute this is my first subaru, always owned Honda,s and even at very high milages none of them ever burned oil,2,000 miles to a quart is a lot of oil to burn and is entirely unacceptable.
Cheers Pat.
Maybe the thing to do is to ask an independent mechanic to look at it. They could even do a compression test to see what kind of shape the piston rings are in.
Ford is worse, from my experience.
-juice
I mention this because my wife manages customer service for a mutual fund and I've heard many stories how reps didn't handle a call well. Once she finds out, she tries to make amends.
..Mike
..Mike
I have found that the most effective way as a caller is to be very, very polite. If they say they can't do a certain thing, ask them what they can do. They may be able to open a "Customer Says" file, just to register the complaint, for example. Then, if you get a nasty oil leak at 61k miles, just out of warranty, there was a recorded history and you get to say "I told you so", and it's covered.
-juice
There is no leakage whatsoever. I have carefully looked. I have removed the plastic cover more times than I can count now. I am actually quite a good mechanic. I have done everything on my cars in the past and could fix the Subaru with no problem. But, I will not pay for this fix which is covered by warranty and is on such a new auto. The problem is with the valves. The cylinder heads have to come off. Then you would have to check the valve guides and valve seals. They actually have to be checked for play and can be measured. I don't own a set of shop manuals yet. They are so expensive and with this ongoing situation damned if I will now. But there are specs. for these parts. They simply have to be checked. Subaru, at least at Liberty Subaru in Oradell, NJ where we bought the car has not done this. They tried to tell me that they were going to replace the cylinder head on one side because they saw oil on the spark plug threads. I told them that I had checked the plugs and when reinstalling them had put a few drops of motor oil on each plug's threads. This is actually standard procedure. The guy at Subaru said I did not need to do that and that it was something that used to be done on old engines. He said that newer alumiunum heads would not need it. He is actually wrong about this. It is alum. engines that would benefit more from this precaution. My Toyota and Mazda shop manuals specify this action and are dealer with similar alum. head engines.
But all of this is moot. And the dealership did not even say "well, let's clean em off and check for oil again." Because they know it means nothing.
At this point, they started in with the subaru policy of 1 quart per 1000 miles being acceptable limits.
That is where we are now.
Scott
For the plugs you should actually use an anti-sieze compound, so the dealer is wrong.
Do a compression test, it's cheap and fairly easy. See if the rings are sealing well, if not you'll also lose power and efficiency. How is your gas mileage?
-juice
No prob.
I would like to do my own compression test. The thing is this: w/o a shop manual for the car, I am a little worried about doing the test in a way that may cause a computer problem such as an incorrect reading error. A lot of times these cars have a few things which they require done, such as jumping certain electrical leads, in order to disconnect the plugs and do the test. Do you have knowledge regarding this. I just don't want to take any chance voided some warranty clause. Although I feel the warranty is basically meaningless.
Scott
Scott
When my Forester was new, it didn't burn a drop of oil, but lately, I've noticed that I do need to top off between changes. Hmmmm...
Ken
My brother, who will buy nothing but Fords, goes to a dealer 40 miles from home and pays a premium for his new ones because he says that the service at the two nearer dealers is incompetent and unaccommodating.
Ross
Started by removing the interior and covering the entire floor with plastic then bolted everything in on top of it, as well as keeping the carpet good it keeps that stinking damp smell out of the car, you also get no corroded wiring or flooring.
Now a lot of people would say this is overkill but for me it is time well spent, also installed an engine block heater and lastly had underneath and inside the rockers and doors sprayed with a no drip oil.
I know Juice, I know I can just hear you saying that Subaru,s do not need rustproofing but believe me after having lived through 28 Ottawa winters, cars here need all the help they can get, several months of temperatures of 30 below centigrade as well as countless thousands of tons of salt dumped on the roads, it is a very hostile environment for cars.
They have had to close underground garages here the road salt had literally eaten them away and made them very unstable, I intend to keep the Titan for ten years and barring any accidents to him or an invitation from the grim reaper for me in ten years time he will look pretty much as he does now, I take pretty good care of my cars.
Cheers Pat.
Chrysler was responsible for getting me buying Japanese and I have never looked back, I suppose you can always getting something positive out of a negative situation.
Cheers Pat.
My wife mentioned to the owner of the dealership that they were losing a customer in us and that we were seriously considering a WRX before this hassle and that we could not anymore. It was interesting that they told her: good luck, we wouldn't even be able to get one in for him, they are selling so fast. Now, I know they are selling well. But, this kind of attitude from them seems very telling and I will share it with SOA when I speak with them again.
Scott
I'd like to know from any of you what you've either paid or might need to pay in your areas for that kind of repair. Possibly this is just typical Silicon Valley--pricing.
Also, should all the wheel bearings be done at the same time? What do you think?
Dennis
I would only replace the one in question. Stay vigilant as to the same noise (problem). It is probably not normal for a wheel bearing to wear out this soon. I have had Toyotas go til 220k before I junked them and they had origial wheel bearings. I must say that almost everything I come across while dealing with my 2000 forester seems sub-par to the quality of previous Toyotas I have had so it wouldn't surprise me if Subaru's wheel bearing are not up to the same mileage. The fact that subarus are awd should make no difference. As to the price tag of the repair, it seems high but I have always replaced parts myself and realize labor costs are quite high.
Scott
-mike
I haven't had experience with Liberty, but I've heard they have a good reputation.
I was having clutch problems for over 25,000 miles. My former dealer in Rahway did everything under the sun except take the tranny apart. After the warranty expired they finally opend it up and tried to charge me $1200 for a new clutch, and $800 for a new flywheel if I didn't get it resurfaced soon (it's actually under the powertrain warranty). I opened up a case and met with the North Jersey District Service Manager (great guy btw). Told him about all of the lies, misdiagnoses, etc. Everything was taken care of. The Dealer Service Manager and Advisor are no longer there. Coincidence? :-p
I've tried 4 Sube dealers within about 20 minutes, but none can compare to Flemington. It's twice as far (maybe 3-4x for you) but it's well worth it. The prices are much lower than I was paying and the service and tech knowledge is outstanding. The techs interact with the customers and don't mind questions and letting you take a peek and what they're doing. They're open Saturdays and do more than just oil changes.
I'm going in for my 60k service Monday and I'll pick their brains about oil consumption. Oh and get this. While I was in the middle of my battle with the other dealer, we had taken my wife's OB to Flemington for service. I was picking a tech's brain about the problems with my car. They had never seen it but told me EXACTLY what the problem was.
A few months later, I met the world famous paisan there (from this board).
Sorry for being so long-winded. :-)
Good luck,
Dennis
-mike
You may want to try i-club.com, try a topic search for compression tests. Maybe someone there has done one. You can pull the negative battery terminal for half hour if you need to reset a CEL.
Pat: with all the salt in winter, and such low temps, you can't keep the undercarriage clean, so the preventative stuff you're doing is a good idea.
Dennis: wheel bearings are a common problem, though it's usually due to a bad installatin (usually they are badly over-torqued). Just make sure the new one is torqued to specification. I doubt it will affect more than one.
-juice
Thanks for your advice. Where is Flemington?
I am running into a few people on line who are telling me that flat 4 of 6s just plain burn oil due to their design and that it is no problem. I wonder why most every Subaru owner, with the same type engines as mine, tell me thy do not experience oil loss?
As a matter of fact, when my wife first took the car to Liberty Subaru with the complaint, they told her point-blank that it was not normal for a subaru. Now, when faced with hard diagnostic work and possible $ layout, they are citing the 1 quart per 1000 benchmark as being what they follow. They are saying they cannot fix it because they see no problem, but they have not really even looked for the problem correctly. They should pull the valve cylinder heads and inspect the valves, valve guides. But this is admittedly a tedious job. I hope to hear for SOA today or tomorrow. I plan on getting the head of customer complaints information. I believe they will not put me in touch via the phone, so I will send a certified letter laying out the history of this problem. What else can you do?....
Scott
p.s. I have always been the guy people come to for advice on cars. I am a musician and virtually all the people I come into contact with need advice on cars, I wonder if Subaru realizes just how damaging a thing like this can be? Not to say that they will go under, but I cannot imagine a company with a policy like this for customer service will make it in the long term.
My dad had an Olds Custom Cruiser wagon in the 80s that burned oil like you would not believe. It kept running though, for years and years.
What about trying synthetic? A different viscosity?
-juice
The 1Q/1000miles is what any company will quote you if backed against a wall.
-mike
Scott
Scott - you probably checked this, but, any oil in the coolant or coolant in oil? Hang in there, SOA should take care of you.
Greg