I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

lemko

...going north on Roosevelt Blvd. in Philly - a Lincoln Blackwood pickup.

andys120

with the rare Aercoupe slanted back glass, seen at a local high-end used car specialist looking very clean and straight in shiny black. Impressive, and I don't even like Montes.

boomchek

I forgot about it till I visited our dealership compound today (where we store new cars, and beater trade ins that society, and the wholesalers, rejected).

This Sterling was traded in 6 months ago and it's still sitting there. British body, with an Acura powertrain. These luxury cars from the 80's and 90's (except MB, Beemer) seem like regular run of the mill cars when compared equipment wise to any mid priced cars today. Just nothing special about them.

fintail

What's an immaculate Sterling worth today, maybe 2K?

Today I saw a Mustang I am not sure about. It was a 67 or 68 Coupe...I heard it so I looked out my window, but I only caught the tail going off into the distance. It had taillights that looked wider than normal, and it seemed to have different trim. Some kind of special car?

boomchek

The one on our lot is not running anymore. We paid $500CDN for it.

Offtopic question for you Fintail: On that same wholesale lot is a 1983 MB 380SEL sedan. I was going to buy it for my parents as a gift, but on the way to AirCare (smog check) it started blowing white smoke so I figure the head gasket is gone. The body is in decent shape as it has no rust, and no dents, and interior looks worn but there are no rips. Is it worth picking it up for $500 or even $1000CDN and either fixing it or doing an engine swap? Or is that too much trouble for such an old Benz? I believe the motor has about 220000kms on it, tranny was rebuilt recently.
Thanks

fintail

If you can get it for free and do the work yourself, and you like the car...maybe. Otherwise, it would probably be better to get a nice original car. You should be able to get a very nice earlier 126 like that for 5-6K CDN. If you have a shop do an overhaul or a swap, you're going to be in at least 3K right there. Also, the 380 engine isn't the quickest...not as fast as a V8 would promise, and it isn't the easiest to maintain. I am sure my 6cyl 126 could walk away from it - official 0-60 is ahead by a full second.

I'd look at the car, too. Those engines are not known for blowing head gaskets (rather, they break timing chains), it might be a lesser issue. These cars were the absolute kings of the world in terms of luxoboats 20-25 years ago, and can take a lot of abuse.

FTR, I paid about 7K US for my car over 3 years ago, and most money I have put into it has been voluntary upgrades rather than real repairs. My car also looks better than most cars with 10K miles on them, if I do say so myself.

andre1969

I drove my convertible to work, and got out late, when the temps were finally starting to cool down a bit, so I decided to take the long way home. I checked my fuel log, and found out the last time I filled up was back in September of '04! And I'd only driven about 150 miles in that time! So I figure that if I've got this car, I might as well enjoy it...heck, it's not too far around the corner that it'll be time to put it up for the winter!

Anyway, I passed a Chevy Monza, a car I haven't seen in years. This seemed to be an older one. It had round headlights, but was the hatchback with the Ferrari-esque roofline. And I'm not saying that to be funny...they actually did try to ape Ferrari with the Monza roofline. I forget which Ferrari it is, now. Now I know most of the notchback coupes and wagons had round headlights, but just about all the hatchbacks I've seen had the rectangular quad headlights. This car was a brownish/burgundy color (sun was setting, so I couldn't really pinpoint the exact color) and it looked to be in great shape.

Otherwise, that's about it...haven't seen much of anything of excitement to report on.

lemko

...beautiful red 1964 Ford Galaxie 500 convertible with white top and interior. The license plate read "SHAG."

andys120

Today I saw a Mustang I am not sure about. It was a 67 or 68 Coupe...I heard it so I looked out my window, but I only caught the tail going off into the distance. It had taillights that looked wider than normal, and it seemed to have different trim. Some kind of special car?

Sounds like the Shelby version (GT-350 or GT-500)

fintail

Did they make a Shelby notchback? This car wasn't a fastback

I want to say it was the 'California Special' model, but I haven't seen one of those in some time.

Mr_Shiftright

I agree with fintail, that V-8 engine is a dog....sucks gas and is bog slow. The 6 cylinder is much better, as is the engine they put in the 560 series.

There's no upside to a 380SEL with a bad head gasket...it's a car nobody really wants, fixed up or not. You can see that immediately in the resale values.

au94

you're probably right fintail. The Cal Special used the same sequential tail lights the Shelby did. I believe there was also a Highland Edition that was sold in Colorado. These were trim packages mostly, both exterior with the taillights and badges and pony interior

andre1969

look anything like this?

fintail

That's very much like what it was. I wish it would have signalled, as I think sequential signals are very cool

About that 380SEL....I found a nice 82 380SE for sale in Seattle...2 owners, decent miles, nice condition, for $2800. If you want one, get a nice one like that. The resale thing is true, too. A genuinely nice sound 6cyl or 420/560 V8 car will run you at least twice the price of that 380.

Mr_Shiftright

The 560 is the one you want, in terms of an engine, or the 6 cylinder better yet.

explorerx4

i saw 2 cobra's. one was definitely a big block. i was a couple vehicles behind it but turned off the radio so i could listen to it.
also saw a red yugo 'gvl' (luxury?). i knew that because although the badge was gone, it left a black impression on the paint. scary looking thing, although not too rusty.

andys120

Sadly Big Block Cobra sightings are almost unheard of outside of Shelby meets and museums. Chances are you saw a replica, of which there are many and some are entirely convincing. A Polish company is turning out replica aluminum bodies to replace the more common fiberglas replica bodywork.

I don't think anyone's doing replica Yugos. :P

chuck1959

I do believe the GVL was the top of the line Yugo. Here's a funny story...When they first came out I went to the Yugo dealer which was also a popular Ford dealer. The salesman came out and I said I'd like to test drive a Yugo. So he got the keys to a blue one. It was a hot day so I turned on the A/C and all hell; broke loose! The A/C compressor squealed loudly then a huge CLUNK and the A/C belt broke and took out the other belts as well. There was shreaded rubber flying everywhere! Then the salesman said wow! Then he said I guess I need to get another set of keys and car so we can continue the test drive! We looked at each other and started laughing. Actually the salesman said well you can see what a piece of crap these Yugos are. He told me the day before he started a test drive and an engine blew just as they turned out the drive way! 2 months latter that dealer quit selling Yugos and sent the inventory to the auto auction.

fintail

I recall a Yugo GVX too...the "hot" one

A family friend bought a Yugo when they were new...transmission failure in 6 weeks, perpetual electrical issues that rendered the car undriveable caused a buyback

Mr_Shiftright

That Polish company used to build MIG fighters, so the cars look pretty darn good.

One easy way (usually) to spot a replica is look underneath at the frame. Originals have tubular frames.

explorerx4

i'm glad when i can make a post that generates some traffic. in ct, there is a least one company that build cobra replica's, but it does not detract from my listening enjoyment. a real bb cobra is not out of the question where i live. lrp is not far away.

Mr_Shiftright

Well basically the real Cobras were kit cars to begin with, so aside from the metal bodywork of the British AC, building your own out of various Ford and aftermarket parts is not very different from what Shelby did originally. The Cobra kit cars are actually one of the very few replicas that can approximate the fun and feel of the originals, and for 1/10th the price. The kits do vary widely in quality, though.

ghulet

....if that actually was an '82 380SE, doesn't that mean it was a gray market car? The 380SE was only sold in the U.S. in '84-85, IIRC. Of course, that could mean it has the Euro-spec 380 engine (which has ~218hp as opposed to the U.S. 155hp). I don't imagine it's too easy to get parts or service for an '80s gray market car any more, though.

fintail

You're right, the 380SE didn't come to the US market til 84. Maybe the car boomcheck is seeing is grey market, or maybe it's a SEL. I am not sure if Canada got the car at a different time, but I doubt it.

Thanks to the internet, you can get parts for any of those cars, and your local MB stealer will rip you a new one and order just about anything, too. You'd scare your local dealer service crew to death with a grey market freak, but an independent could probably handle it.

Speaking of that...on the back lot of the MB dealer, where the serviced cars sit, there was an immaculate looking Euro 500SEL... a pre-86 model. It had the Euro hubcaps and small bumpers. That design is still handsome.

andys120

It was my day to spot vintage sports cars. First I spotted an early 911(901) wearing canary yellow, I always loved the small bumper 911s from the 60s.

The we spotted a slightly ratty Healey 3000/mk III and a pristine RHD MG-TC in pale yellow like the one Shifty posted in the Mystery Car topic.

It being a big day for yellow sports cars, I spotted a replica 427Cobra in bright yellow that illustrated how not to finish off a Big Block replica. It had a brightly chromed roll bar (real racers use black ones), low profile tires that didn't fill those big wheel wells and white upholstery with big headrests that protruded way above the rear deckline, then there was that yellow paint!

fintail

"made by Rootes" might not be the best line to use to sell your car

Another Rootes lovely...can't be many of these left

Shifty-mobile

Kind of a cute thing

"Conversation piece" = "yard art/planter"...this is the Hindustan they still make (I think) in India

Probably one of the best of these left....but nobody cares

If you're a Pontiac fan and have too much money

Now this is a Pontiac

I like it, but wouldn't do it in red

Elegance

Now here's a high end machine...I think the non-traditional body hinders value, though

"book v for this car $7500" - yeah, if it's mint...

Cool fintail ad from the same one who had a video of another car earlier. This car, being a FI car with auto, is very much like mine. This link has a video, so if you use dialup, watch out.

Project fintail worth saving. Lots of fintails on ebay right now...sometimes there isn't a one

I think this car is related to Christine, when Arnie found her

The original Dart, a design freakshow. Look at that steering wheel

A few cosmetic fixes and this could go to a Mopar show

One for Andre

If I was a limo person, I would much rather be driven around in this than some gaudy new one. Caddy had class.

I'd rather have one of these than most new models...and I even like the color

What some people will do to a perfectly good car. Nice if you wear a white fedora, I guess

One for Lemko

It's a chopped and lowered Nissan Armada! No, wait...

Anyone want a mint last-of-the-Pacers?

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Mr_Shiftright

Ah, good spotting. Oh, you don't have to say RHD and TC...they are all RHD.

fintail with miss in one cylinder----that's a burned valve for sure....not a big deal, it could be fixed in an afternoon, but his starting bid is too high, hence 0 bids. When will these people learn to start at $100 and put a reserve on it?

andys120

I forgot to mention I also saw a late 356(B or C) Porsche coupe, white and all straight and clean (restored?), even my wife dug that one.

Fin, I'd rather ride in that '47 Cadillac than any new limo too. It has more style and panache and it's a lot easier to get in and out of . I find modern stretch limos absurd, they're like riding in a tunnel.

fintail

Yeah, that burnt valve fintail isn't doing it right. If you could pick up that car for 1000-1500, put maybe another 1000-1500 in it to get it all roadworthy, I think you could do OK. Maybe not a huge profit, but you'd have a good looking good driving old car.

Do the wealthy still ride in limos, or is that a 70s and 80s cliche?

Speaking of that 380SE/SEL, here's one in my neighborhood. Much better off to buy something like this than fix up a non-runner. This shot also explains why these cars need Euro lights

Mr_Shiftright

The wealthy don't ride in limos of their own, they rent them to go to the airport. Stretch limos aren't a sign of wealth, they are reallly more like a bus with better seats and without a drunk shouting about flying saucers.

fintail

How about SWB limos, like the old factory-built Caddys that seemed popular in the late 70s/early 80s or RR Phantoms or MB 600 etc? I guess a Maybach 62 is a SWB limo in a way, too.

I read a good opinion about stretch limos once...someone said they are the poor mans interpretation of the rich mans world. I think that fits.

And on that note, yesterday I saw a stretched PT Cruiser. It was awful, just like the stretched H2s. There should be a visual pollution statute that outlaws these things.

andys120

I'm not sure how a stretched PT Cruiser would be any more aesthetically challenged that a Town Car or DeVille stretch.

Now a stretched H2 is really a silly idea, but not that much sillier than trying to use any H2 to carry passengers.

fintail

It was out of proportion. Tall and narrow and long. Looked like it would snap in half if it cornered too hard.

If a H2 isn't gaudy enough...the stretch is worse. I saw a couple in Vegas, and see them here in Seattle too, I guess a group of poserfied suits loves them, as they are always driven by middle aged men and their trophy wives. Some have commercial plates too, which is nice...just the vehicle to traverse the gated entry to your 8000 sq ft McMansion.

I saw a couple obscure cars today...a nice what I would guess was a 67 Camaro convert, a 76 Eldo at a car dealer that had something like 100 miles on it, a 58 Edsel convert, a red 64 Impala SS, and a china blue W116.

ghulet

...is that like a 450SEL? I saw one yesterday, in the standard issue manganese (sp?) brown with palomino interior, I think it was a 6.9; hot car in its day, and this one was nice and had Euro front lights, unfortunately also had the eight-hole wheels and those damn chrome wheelwell trim things again! Still, it's kind of a car with no real upside any more: not too good looking what with the ugly federalized bumpers, probably a pain to fix, and about as fast as an Accord V6 but uses three times as much gas. If I were to buy an old (pre 126) Mercedes, I'd just get a 68-72 SE/SEL. A lot better looking and about the same price.

fintail

Yep, a 116 is a 70s S-class, 450SEL and its brothers. The bumpers on the DOT spec cars are quite horrid, and with 8 hole wheels and those rust covering/causing wheel trims...blech.

Virtually no upside on a 116, yes. The 108/109 cars (the ones that preceeded the 116) are worth much more, but still very little. A mint 108/109 V8 car shouldn't bring more than 10K, with a 6.3 at twice that, but with Ferrari-like maintenance/

jrosasmc

If you're still around here go to Ebay and type in "1985 Mercedes," as I just did five minutes ago. There you will find an '85 190E 2.3 with, believe it or not, 20k original miles. (Yes, 20k miles!) The ad says it is a one-owner car in FL- it even has the original factory Becker cassette stereo, which I've heard is just plain horrid.

It's worth taking a look at.

jrosasmc

By the way who in the world would want an '85 190E?

Mr_Shiftright

You're getting $20K for old 6.3s?...tell me where, there's a fortune to be made! :P In California, $10K if you're lucky to find a buyer. Maybe a low miles show car restored to mint...$15,000. Serious money pits and no upside.

A 2.3 with 20,000 miles? Geez, who would know how to price that, since nobody wanted them when they were new. Now if it were a 2.3 16V, different story entirely.

fintail

I am talking about a concours car. I think one could get 20, especially if it isn't tobacco brown

I just looked at that 190...apart from being the sad 2.3, it shows the dangers of a Floriduh car. That car has obviously been stored outside for many years, and so many other low mileage cars from there are the same way. Look at the wheels on it, the finish is ruined. The interior also looks aged, and I am sure if the car was a darker color, the paint would be faded.

Here it is

My 126 has the 500-button Becker Grand Prix...I just listen to the radio, it works well enough.

boomchek

The benz in our yard is a 380SEL, and it actually has euro headlights, and the late 80's/early 90's benz wheels, so it looks more modern than the one in the picture back there.

That's why it's looks tempt me, but I think I'll just let it sit there

Speaking of Porsches, I also saw a 356 coupe in ivory white today, in excellent shape. Driven by an elderly lady too!

Mr_Shiftright

Hmmm....I don't think so fintail...the 6.3 star is fading. I've seen too many fail to sell even at $15K at auction. Reason? The maintenance costs are astronomical (hard to believe the prices they charge, really--your eyes would bulge) and the word is out. Why pay Gullwing repair costs for a 4-door? Market is really $10K-$12K and that's all the money right now. You might pick off $20K for a low miles original survivor sold in Germany, but I doubt it here. My two cents anyway.

I think the Benz 6 cylinder sedans will hold better value than the 4s or 8s as time goes on. The 8s maintenance costs are just too punishing. This is also why the V-8 SLs aren't holding value like the earlier 280SLs.

fintail

Well, if that 380SEL has Euro lights and other Euro parts, it could always be parted out.

Maybe you should have it inspected by someone honest and competent (not easy to find in MB repair) and see what the smoke problem really is. I think there a number of minor things that can cause smoke.

My 6.3 reference is a perfect car, not just a nice car. I've seen drivers at $7500 and nobody would touch them. I know normal cars aren't worth a lot more than their smaller counterparts.

My idea on the V8 SLs is that they look like big 70s pigs compared to the relatively elegant 60s models, especially with those retarded DOT bumpers. They are common and it is easy to find trashy ones for a few grand. Even a beater W113 will run you more. They will never be worth a lot...even the late 560SLs are still depreciating.

michaellno

While walking our dogs on Saturday morning in our development, there was a house that had not one, but two, AMC Javelins parked in front. One red, one blue, both looked to be about a 3 on the 1 to 5 scale.

Also saw a BMW 1-series .. I didn't look close enough to see what kind of plates were on it. I didn't think those were available here in the US yet.

andys120

Can we assume that values for the later 6.9 version of the S-Class aren't so hot either. I wonder how much values of the 6.3 and 6.9 are hurt by the fact that they're cosmeticaly identical to the six and smaller V8 cars, you have to look for the badge, at least I do.

jaserb

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Alfa-Romeo-1949-Alfa-Romeo-6C-2500-Pininfarina-1949-Alfa-Ro- meo-6C-2500-SuperSport-Pininfarina-Cabriol_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ5356QQitemZ456732220- 0QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

If I had a spare quarter mil lying around...Shifty, what's your take on the buy-it-now price? I know the older 6c2300s and such can easily reach the 7 figure range, especially if they have any racing history.

I actually like these better than the pre-war cars. This is really the last of the "big money" Alfas, before they started mass producing with the 1900 series and later the Giuliettas. Absolutely beautiful.

-Jason

fintail

A 6.9 is worth far less than a 6.3, and is just as fun to maintain. You'll also find regular LWB V8 cars rebadged as a 6.9, so it's buyer beware with those things.

It's been a long time since I've seen the movie...but isn't there an Alfa like that in The Godfather?

andys120

The Alfa in The Godfather (I assume you're taking about the car Michael's bride is blown up in) was a black Touring coupe, probably a 2500 although it could also have been a Maserati A6, also a Touring Coupe.

Gosh, I hope they didn't actually blow up either.

Alfa 2500 coupe

MaseratiA6

explorerx4

probably from the late 60' early 70's. front end looked like a lotus (kind of round, folding headlights), but the rest of the car looked like a triumph stag(one of which i also happened to see not too long ago). had a hardtop and a bunch of scca and other stickers on it.

Mr_Shiftright

The Alfa 6C 2500 "buy it now price" is market correct retail. I've never seen a 6C 2300 sell for more than a 2500 but the 8C oh my yes, into the millions. Also, a Zagato bodied 6C 1750 would be worth a lot.

This Alfa on eBay needs a good look-over before purchase and really needs good documentation. Sounds like it's an okay car but there's lots of funny business going on with old, valuable Italian cars. If someone finds a bare chassis and a VIN #, and someone else finds the body and engine in another part of the world, before you know it you have two cars with the same VIN, ---one with a re-created body and engine and and the other with a re-created chassis . Which one is real? Many a law suit has been filed to find out.

That's right, a 6.9 will sell for less, maybe $9,000 for a #2 car and a 6.3 has actually dropped even further to a "one-star" rating and a value of $12,000 for a #2 car. These cars are dying, both of them, and may go down even further. I would predict they could be at $7,500--8,000 in a few years (adjusted for inflation of course).

ghulet

....given the cost to keep one on the road (repair costs AND gas) and the fact that just in the last five years, fairly run-of-the-mill new sedans (Accord V6s, Altimas, Chrysler 300s) now have similar performance without the old-car drama.