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Comments
Tell you what. I'll pay the dealer's asking price of $19,000 (which he has generously reduced from $21,000) for the Sport Disc wheels if he throws the car in for free. Now, that's an offer he can't refuse ;-)
What is it about these Sport Disc wheels that appeals to me so much? As I said before, take these wheels off this car and it's a real yawner in terms of it's visual appeal. Still, with only 44,000 original miles, it'd be a nice car to have. But, only at a reasonable price.
I'm curious as to how much a nice set of these wheels would cost. Is it possible a set could cost as much as $1,000? This would partially explain/justify a strong price for this car.
Gentlemen, your thoughts?
A rare wheel (not just a wheelcover) could easily cost $1000 for four, something like the Pontiac Rally Is optional on early GTOs.
I've heard stories how mechanics ruined these sport discs trying to pry them off not knowing they were bolted to the wheel underneath. Probably why they quit making them.
I check Hemmings and couldn't find them. I think these Olds Sport Discs are fairly rare.
If memory serves the Rivi spinner has four(?) prongs cast into the back side. Each prong goes through a slit in the wheel. I think the end of each prong is threaded so the wheelcover can be secured to the wheel with a nut on each prong. However it's done, they're on there good. I found this out the hard way.
If that's what the Olds spinner is like it still doesn't sound like anything special but I could be wrong. Rare, but not necessarily valuable except to a handful of people. I honestly can't see anyone paying a grand for any Olds covers even if they were gold plated.
Call a local shop that specializes in old hubcaps. Most of the online sources deal only in newer wheelcovers. Or call my man Mr. Hub Cap & Wheels at (408) 294-4304. He'll know but call quick, he's not getting any younger.
Personally, I don't think the demise of Olds will result in a "run" on folks buying old Oldsmobiles in the hope that their values will skyrocket.
On the hand, if I had a choice, between an Olds 98 and a Buick Electra (both in the 1965-66 vintage) and assuming both were in nice condition, similar color appeal, etc., would there be much incentive/motivation to give the nod to the Olds based purely on it's defunct status?
The desirable Oldsmobiles will stay desirable and the also-rans will continue to also-run. Just like Packard and Hudson and all the rest of the orphans.
I could see it negatively affecting values. Olds has that loser orphan image now. Some people find that intoxicating but not many.
So, you're saying it could be a month or two (wink, wink) before the market catches up to the $19,000 asking price of this '65 Olds 98 convertible?
Cars from the period where Oldsmobile was still a winner, it shouldn't make a difference. Now that 4-year old Intrigue? That's a different story! Maybe I could get a good deal on a first-gen Aurora now? ;-)
If only Olds would die more quickly and less publicly.
I'm just wondering out loud how secure an already marginal nameplate like Olds is. Again, I'm talking about run-of-the-mill sedans like the very clean '62 Dynamic 88 two-door hardtop I saw today, not something hot like a W-30.
Now an Olds is what might be called a mid-range collectible, a car without either positive or negative connotations to the vast majority of old car buyers. It's rarely a buyer's first choice but it's an okay alternative to the more sought-after and expensive makes because no one's going to laugh if you bring one home--and that's basically the bottom line with a lot of these cars.
What I'm suggesting (and only time will tell) is that perhaps the fact that Olds was still a going concern is what kept it elevated above bottom-rung '60s collectibles like say, Studebaker, Corvair and the BOP compacts. Cars that people point at and laugh (and I've had more than my share of these cars).
If I'm seeing it in these terms then maybe other people are too, and it wouldn't take too many of us to soften values--the pool of buyers for Olds was pretty small already.
On the other hand, there are always the hopeless optimists who see this as a bonanza for Olds values, but I can guarantee that these are sellers not buyers.
With regard to appeal, I don't think Oldsmobile is any worse or better than a Buick, any non-SS Chevrolet and most Pontiacs (unless, of course the PMD example has a 4 speed, tri-power or the letters GTO on the body).
Well, if Olds start to sell for Corvair prices you heard it here first.
Well, I don't see this ridiculous $19,000 asking price dropping dramatically anytime soon. Certainly not down to Corvair territory. But, he may lower it slightly before too long only because it's been awhile since it's initial "price reduction" - yeah right, like no one saw that coming.
I suppose if it were faultless beyond belief it might be worth $12,000. I suspect it is not that faultless and so is worth about $10,000.
The point is, it's STILL a 1965 Oldsmobile '98 convertible, original or restored or whatever. About the only thing that could elevate out of it being a 1965 Oldsmobile 98 would be some kind of celebrity status. Otherwise it has to be worth what a '65 Oldsmobile 98 is worth. It's not a GTO and it's not a Chevrolet SS, and for the kind of money he's asking you start running into the price range of much more desireable cars.
Actually, celebrity status is very tricky. People do get sucked into buying a "celebrity car" only to find out that without the star's name on the registration or without photos of them driving the exact car, the market really doesn't care about the Pontiac station wagon used by Frank Sinatra's gardener in 1973.
It looks like the unthinkable happened. That '65 Olds 98 convertible at Duffy's sold. This weekend, I was actually thinking about calling up there to re-inquire about this car, but realistically figured we were just too far apart on price.
Well, I'm actually kind of glad it sold. Now, I can let go of the delusion that Duffy's would actually consider selling this car for a price commensurate with its market demand. Looks like he finally found that needle in the haystack.
However, I am curious as to what this car sold for. Short of calling up there and asking, does anyone have any ideas as to how I can find out what this car sold for?
At that price, the car surely wasn't purchased for speculation &/or a quick resale.
In any event, given the new owner's investment, if it does show up again, the asking price won't be any bargain then either.
Of course, to be fair, I haven't seen the car, so maybe it was the world's best and could be worth $15K. Seems impossible, but I've eaten my hat before on these deals---not often, but now and then there's a surprise in the marketplace.
Regardless of what the man paid, that does not set a new price for '65 Olds 98 convertibles.
Back in the good ol' days...before cheap consumer goods become icons...an SS or Z/28 or Boss 302 or whatever was a deal because you got a handling package/strong rearend/HD trans/etc...it was cheaper to buy a car with a 12 bolt than to install one.
At the very least, it makes sense to improve things that are hidden...Pertronix systems, better shocks, urethane suspension parts and the like.
I suppose a big difference in approach is whether you use older cars for your exclusive driver or as a weekend-only kind of thing.
Personally, I think it's worth the risk because in the case of your car the originality is not such a big factor in value, because everybody knows what a '62 Impala is supposed to look like from the factory.
Nowadays car shows are starting to do a good thing...have a special class only for original cars, so that they don't have to compete (and lose to) over-restored ones.
I don't know whether I'm disappointed because this car was available and that I theoretically had a fair shot at it (just like everyone else) and didn't take the bait - as outrageously, high-priced as it was.
Or, I could be disappointed that I didn't feel I could realistically afford to pay their asking price.
My plan was to wait until late January (figuring Duffy's would know that anyone with Xmas bonus money would've already tried by then) and approach them again in the $10,000 to $12,000 range - hoping that he was tired of playing the waiting game. Of course, my plan was dependent on no one coming along that REALLY wanted this car. Thus, I rolled the dice and lost - sort of. But, this would only be true if Duffy's would have agreed to relinquish their high hopes for a killing on this car which he probably wouldn't have agreed to do.
So, whether I could've done anything about, I don't know. But, I am sorry this one got away. This car may not have had mass appeal, but for some reason I really liked it.
The steering will work as it did in 1962...just fine.
Micky Mouse it up enough and it won't be a '62 Impala anymore. It'll look the same but the "improvements" will make it something it was never intended to be.
Now...if he intends to drive it everyday at freeway speeds, that might be another story although it would do that task quite well too.
You just can't drive one of these like a modern car. You can't tailgate someone at 75 MPH or take a off ramp at 20 MPH higher than the posted speed.
And the people who own and drive these cars are well aware of this and drive accordingly.
Or at least they better!
Personally, I think that 1960's cars should be driven (and beaten up) as daily drivers, not garage queens or some sort of parade car. A few judicious improvements can make all the difference. It's kind of sad to see all the faster cars be putted around down to a Sonic or In and Out Burger for cruise 'nite' in whatever town.
While I'm thinking about it...about the only place I see muscle cars anymore is at local car shows. Just the place to hear distorted fifties music and see too damn many fuzzy dice, Cobra replicas, and wives who bear a more than passing resemblance to the Michelin Man.
I don't care about radiator hose clamps being "correct" or the color of the windshield washer fluid.
I was only trying to point out that a '62 Impala is a perfectly drivable car as equipped from the factory. There is nothing wrong with the Powerglide or the braking system or anything else.
The 327 engines were great engines. They don't need to be yanked out and replaced with a "better" 350.
I like to remember old cars as they were, not as someone else thinks they should be "upgraded" to.
And, again, they do need to be driven in a manner that takes into consideration their shortcomings as compared to modern cars.
I see no reason to feel reluctant about modifying mass-produced 1960s cars, if it is done tastefully and with genetic material. If it's a very rare model, perhaps not (putting a 350 in an original fuelie '57 chevy---nah!) but for 99% of all 60s cars, I agree---they should be driven, modified, banged up, raced and enjoyed to the fullest. Most of these cars look rather silly all dressed up with no place to go. Every museum who wants a 62 Impala has one, so the rest can be risked in the big bad world, no problem.
My beloved '62 Impala SS 327/300 had no trouble stopping, steering or cornering.
The drum brakes were non-power and had no trouble safely stopping that big Chevy.
Of course, a modern set of disks would be better and much more fade resistant but at least, in my case, I wouldn't need them.
I would remember what I was driving and would drive accordingly.
And I wouldn't feel unsafe nor would I baby the car. I just wouldn't drive it like I do my modern cars.
I'm no stickler for total originality but I hate to see something Mickey Moused up too.
Other opinions will vary but that's mine for what it's worth.
On the other hand, I can see how someone who regularly takes their family in the car for long cruises might want the benefits of sharper suspension and better brakes. Or someone who wants a sleeper.
It always bothered me when I heard that GM intermediates, even with muscular engines, came with 9.5" drums standard!
Mopar intermediates had the 12"(?) drums off the fullsizers as standard. So did the first SS 396 that came out in '65 but that was a low-production high-option car. Gran Sport had the 9" drums but in finned aluminum, a Buick tradition since 1958. Sintered metallic linings were an option on most cars except those with aluminum drums; the hard linings would have demolished the drums. I remember seeing high-mileage metallic linings that were still in great shape but had worn out the iron drums. The downside was that metallic linings took extra pedal effort and were reluctant to stop until they warmed up. Apparently that first stop in the morning was exciting.
My guess would be that most fullsizers had drums in the 12" range but I'll check my shop manuals when I get home.
My '79 Newport had 10" drums on the back, so evidently some of the intermediates had 10". My '79 NYer and '89 Gran Fury have 11" drums on back. I'm sure there was a 12" drum in there somewhere, though!
Since the front brakes do most of the work, I really don't see that big of a deal what's in the back, as long as it works.