I am no expert on this.. But less than 500 bucks over invoice seems to be a good deal to me (for a BMW) ..Who is the dealer? I may lease one from them at this price if they agree to use the BMWFS numbers that Car_man provided.
The dealer is likely to not cut you as good a deal if you are ordering a car without the sunroof. If you back out, he basically has a car he can't sell. Which is something to keep in mind, if you are concerned about resale. You can sell a 3-series without leather, but without the sunroof will be tough. Other than that, its just a lot of doodads.. The only other thing that stands out to me is the lack of wood trim. If you are getting the sand or natural brown leather, I think the titanium trim would look out of place. The biggest item, other than the sunroof, would be the power seats.
Thanks for the information. I just got a quote from a dealer (without premium package but I will probaly go with the pp) : 3 year lease 10,000 per year 330-automatic 474.90 a month
Due at signing: $3,487.75 which includes: Security Taxes Sales Tax Motor Vehicle fees Any thoughts?
I haven't really been following the leases on 3-series.. One thing I can tell you is that you can probably get 12K miles per year for just about $12 more per month. If you think you might need more miles, moving from 10K to 12K per year is the cheapest jump you can make.
I'm not sure how they handle sales tax on leases where you live. Do you have to pay it all up front? Your out of pocket seems a little high, but maybe thats because of the taxes.
Try out Carman on the "Lease questions, ask here" board in Finance section. Make sure you give him the MSRP of the car you are interested in, with the rest of your lease details, and he can give you an idea of what you should be looking at.
Do you have any idea what sales price they are basing the lease on? In other words, you want to negotiate the selling price of the car, the same way you would if you were buying it.
When you use the TMV calculator for a used car, it offers to check the value of a CPO vehicle -- there's a link you have to click on at the end, if I remember correctly.
One of the HOSTs, Car_man, is always telling people in the Lease Questions discussion to go to the Real-World Trade-In Values discussion where a Town Hall member (not a HOST), Terry, gives, well, real-world trade-in values. Try posting there.
I am looking at buying a 04 325i with the following: auto, metallic paint with leatherette, sport pkg and power seats. I know this car will have to be ordered but the best price I have received from a dealer is $955 over invoice. Does that seem like a good deal??
It could be a good deal. It all depends on the dealer's definition of invoice. Find out the MSRP, and the exact number OTD, before taxes. Then come back and ask again. It sounds like a great deal for a car that has to be ordered, and that the dealer might have trouble selling on his lot if you back out (no premium pkg or leather).
I come across a 323i Wagon 2000 with 22k mikes selling for $15k. The seller told me that the reason for the low proce is that the car is a restore salvaged(stolen and recovered). Any thoughts on this.
kyfdx, I see your name all over the place here. You seem to be the resident experience. Thanks for the response. The OTD price on that car, tax, license and all other fees is 34075. If I did the numbers right the invoice is 30245 according to cars.com and edmunds.
p.s. just curious on your bio page. You remarked that your bmw will be like a honda. What do you mean by that?
Not that expert, but just finished researching buying a 325i for a year before I did it, and a good memory for what people post on these boards. If your invoice is $30245, then I'm assuming an MSRP of right around $33,000? According to your previous post, that leaves a purchase price of $31,000? That leaves about $3K for fees and taxes. I'm not sure what taxes are like where you live. If at least $2500 of that is going to the government and not to the dealer, then I'd say you have a pretty good deal, if all my other assumptions are correct.
As far as my comment about the BMW being as reliable as my Honda, that was a weak attempt at humor.. I really don't expect it to be. Just hoping.
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What is a realistic price to pay a dealer for the above car? It has a list price of over 36 thousand and has step, premium, sport and cold weather package. The dealer will sell for $34,000.
Seems high to me in that they were selling below invoice back in November and December. What is a fair price(cash) to pay for this car? Thanks.
>It sounds like a great deal for a car that has to be ordered, and that the dealer >might have trouble selling on his lot if you back out
Hmmm... As I've posted previously, my sister has ordered a 325xi. The dealer requested/mandated a $1000 deposit. So if the car is hard to sell, shouldn't the forfeited deposit more than make up for the loan interest that accrues while the car sits on the lot?
No one has ever tried to keep a deposit. It might be different in some places, but most dealers see it as a psychological tool to get you to commit. Not that they wouldn't tell you its non-refundable. I've just never seen that to be the case.
Here in the dead of winter a dealer has ofered to sell me a 325 cic convertible for $500 over invoice. He includes in invoice, however, a $360 advertising charge. To me the offer is really $860 over dealer invoive. Query should I try and fight the $360 advertising charge or just accept an $860 over invoice price?
A dealer quoted me a '04 330CI at $45,520 which is $500 off of MSRP. This would be an ordered car with the following options: - Performance Package (ZHP) - Nav System - Xenon Lights - Heated Seats - Moonroof
Can't I get a better deal than this? I'm from Central New Jersey.
If you are pricing the car at a certain amount over invoice then that is legitimate. The advertising charge is put on the dealer's invoice and he has to pay it. I would still consider it $500 over. Is that a 2004 325CI convertible? Seems like a great price either way.
Oooohhhhh.... I hate to make comments after you have already bought the car, you should just enjoy it now.. But, here goes. If you bought it for $1K under invoice, that is very good, as I think the 325xi only had a $1500 incentive on it. That would be $500 over cost. They did mark up the cost of the extended maintenance a little. The retail price is $999 to extend it to 6yr/100K.
I wouldn't consider the car a demo with only 145 miles on it..even though those probably were demo miles. That seems like an insignificant amount. Does the car already have an in-service date? Or did it start from the day you took delivery?
And, just for my personal curiousity... Did the car come with leather and sunroof, but no premium package? What was the MSRP?
The salesperson told me that the incentive was only $1000 on the 325xi and it was the last 2003 325 they had in their inventory.
How do I verify the in-service date? I think the warranty started from early 2003.
That's right. It doesn't have the PP, hence no power seats etc. I think the MSRP was 34,000+, don't recall the exact figures.
Was planning on getting a '04 325i as I didn't need the 4wd capability. But went with the '03 to capture the discount so to speak. Guess I'll be wasting more gas on my daily commute.
Call any BMW service department. Give them the VIN# and they can give you the in-service date. Your warranty should run for 4yr/50k from that date. Ask them when the warranty expires. If it is 51 months from the in-service date, then they did indeed put your car in the demo/service loaner program. I am fairly certain that the incentive increased to $1500 in October, but no matter. If it is in the demo/service loaner program it will also have the warranty mileage bumped out to 55K. Unless you bought it CPO. Then it would have 6yr/100K to match the maintenance program you purchased.
I wonder why they had the car for almost a year, and it only has 145 miles on it, though..
I wouldn't worry about not having premium package.. It sounds like you are planning on keeping the car for awhile. I doubt the gas mileage will be much different for the 325xi vx the 325i, either. Enjoy your car. My wife has had hers for about six weeks now, and I can't keep the smile off my face when I drive it. We have the sport pkg, and I already had to buy a set of winter tires. At least you won't have that expense.
I got a quote on the 330xi with premium package, heated seats, leather and automatic and it came in at just under $40,000. Does anyone have any thoughts on whether to lease or buy--I have a ten year old 325 automatic--it only has 38,000 miles so I don't use the car, at least not now, for long commutes.
Any thoughts on who is giving low interest rate car loans?
If you are only driving 4000 miles per year, it doesn't make much sense to lease. My credit union offers 3.9% on new car loans up to 60 months... up to 72 months if the loan is over $35K. If you have financing lined up at a certain rate, before you ask the dealer, they will sometimes beat it with a better rate.
I have been following this forum for a while and thanks to car_man and others at this forum I learned a lot of useful info. I was considering Volvo 60 AWD and BMW 325 xi for 36 month/15K lease. At the end I decided to go with BMW. However, I am not particularly proud of the following lease deal but could not do better after several weeks of talking to dealers, visiting the dealers and sending/receiving e-mails.I live in NY.
2004 325xi (MSRP 37545) Auto Premium package Cold weather package Leather Metallic Mats are included 36 Month/15K
$800 bank fee $500 Sec deposit $470/Month $350 disposition fee (when you return the car-this came up at the last minute )
bank fee+sec deposit+taxes+first month +DMV fees are due at signing.
Does that include tax? That seems like a good deal. $470 for a loaded 325xi with nothing down but fees and deposit w/15k per year.
My old rule of thumb, when interest rates were a little higher was $15/mo for every thousand of MSRP. That was a fair deal for 36mo/45k leases. Your lease is about $12.50 per thousand. Thats a good deal for the middle of the model year.
>I am not particularly proud of the following lease deal but could not do better >after several weeks of talking to dealers, visiting the dealers and sending/ >receiving e-mails.
Actually, that's what you're supposed to do to get the best deal you can. So I can't imagine how you could have done better.
By the way, the salesman with whom my sister has been dealing in her lease of a 325xi (which is on order) said that even though NY state is supposed to refund you your "unused" portion of the sales tax in the event the car is stolen or totalled, it's all but impossible to get it from the state. So you should lump the sales tax into the capitalized cost. Of course, a salesman has a vested interest in getting the lessee to capitalize as much as possible.
eelade: Maybe you should try some of the dealers in Northern NJ to get a better price. You can definitely do better than $500 off sticker. Where in Central Jersey are you? I hear the BMW dealership in Princeton is awful to deal with.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
nyccarguy: I'm in Marlboro. King BMW was dealer that only gave me $500 off MSRP. Been exchanging e-mails with OpenRoad BMW and they gave me $1,000 off MSRP. May be able to swing another 200 - 300 more off. How this sound? Where in Northern NJ you think I can get a better deal and how much over invoice or below MSRP you think? Thanks much!
Maybe you'll have success with dealers like: Prestige or Park Avenue BMW. You should shoot for about $1000 over invoice. These guys want to sell you a car just as much as you want to buy one. Don't seem too eager (it is hard after you've driven a 330Ci I imagine).
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
What are the tire pressure settings you have on your car? I have 34 all around right now, and trying to find the optimal levels that will give me the best gas mileage. The sticker by the driver's door is not very clear on this. There are two sets of numbers. I guess one is the recommended, and the other being the absolute max? Also notice pressure on the front tires is lower than the rears. Thanks as always!
I don't have an xi, I have a 325i with sport package.. The recommended inflation (in manual and on door jamb is 30psi/front and 35psi/rear for my model.. That is what I use and am very happy with the ride/handling balance of that set-up. I would go with what is on the door jamb of your car(not the maximum!).
The reason I say leasing at 4K miles doesn't make sense, is that usually the lowest lease mileage they will write is 10K/year. You are paying for depreciation you aren't using.
Thanks very much. I don't have a credit union. I will chck around at the banks-if anyone knows of low car interest rates either from a national bank or NYCity regional, please let me know.
The best place to start is at your own bank, where you have your checking account.. I was just checking online. eloan.com has 4.29% for 60 month new car loans. So, that is a good barometer. Also, just ask the dealer. Let them know you can get 4.3% and ask them if they can beat it. If they can, take them up on it. It always seems to make the deal easier when the dealer arranges the financing, unless you are paying cash.
I haven't seen anything cheaper than the 3.9% my credit union offers (not counting special auto manufacturer supported rates), so anything between 3.9% and 4.3% would be a good deal, without much variation in payment within those two numbers.
That dealership is great to deal with. Even though I could have gotten more off somehwere else, the fact that:
1. They are 5 minutes away from the house, and 2. I like their service dept, and 3. I like their sales staff. Even my cynical wife who hates car salesman, really likes my sales person, and 4. I give them high marks as a dealership.
Now I have to add as a p.s. I don't visit them often, in fact almost never. I don't visit any BMW dealership or service center, as the car to date just requires it's yearly checkups. In fact, I was at the dealer a couple of weeks ago with my wife to check out the X3. We took an X3 3L out for a drive and I got the chance to flog it, in an empty parking lot of hard packed snow and ice. Then I sat down with my sales rep, who found my old paperwork in 3 minutes, we built a car, but he suggested I wait until Sept or Oct, as I wouldn't get delivery until after February.
But my feeling is, should I need them, they are there for me, close to the house and have a clean BMW loaner fleet, when you bring your car in.
IMO and my wifes, sometimes the best price isn't always "best".
Hello, I just would like to ask for an advice... I am planning to buy used BMW 3 coupe, most probably 318i, 1997-1998, around 60-90k miles. Can get one of these for 10k or less. Would like to use the car in weekends - for fun drive only , as a second car. But still probably I will pass 25k miles per year. Any experience about known issues with this particular model and estimated maintenance cost would be greatly appreciated. And is there any driving difference between 318i and 323i? Should I look for another model? Thanks in advance.
Comments
I am no expert on this.. But less than 500 bucks over invoice seems to be a good deal to me (for a BMW) ..Who is the dealer? I may lease one from them at this price if they agree to use the BMWFS numbers that Car_man provided.
regards,
kyfdx
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Who is the dealer in Westchester?
Thanks-
regards,
kyfdx
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Thanks for the information. I just got a quote from a dealer (without premium package but I will probaly go with the pp) :
3 year lease 10,000 per year
330-automatic
474.90 a month
Due at signing:
$3,487.75 which includes:
Security
Taxes
Sales Tax
Motor Vehicle fees
Any thoughts?
I'm not sure how they handle sales tax on leases where you live. Do you have to pay it all up front? Your out of pocket seems a little high, but maybe thats because of the taxes.
Try out Carman on the "Lease questions, ask here" board in Finance section. Make sure you give him the MSRP of the car you are interested in, with the rest of your lease details, and he can give you an idea of what you should be looking at.
Do you have any idea what sales price they are basing the lease on? In other words, you want to negotiate the selling price of the car, the same way you would if you were buying it.
regards,
kyfdx
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When you use the TMV calculator for a used car, it offers to check the value of a CPO vehicle -- there's a link you have to click on at the end, if I remember correctly.
One of the HOSTs, Car_man, is always telling people in the Lease Questions discussion to go to the Real-World Trade-In Values discussion where a Town Hall member (not a HOST), Terry, gives, well, real-world trade-in values. Try posting there.
regards,
kyfdx
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p.s. just curious on your bio page. You remarked that your bmw will be like a honda. What do you mean by that?
Thanks again
As far as my comment about the BMW being as reliable as my Honda, that was a weak attempt at humor.. I really don't expect it to be. Just hoping.
regards,
kyfdx
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Seems high to me in that they were selling below invoice back in November and December. What is a fair price(cash) to pay for this car? Thanks.
>It sounds like a great deal for a car that has to be ordered, and that the dealer
>might have trouble selling on his lot if you back out
Hmmm... As I've posted previously, my sister has ordered a 325xi. The dealer requested/mandated a $1000 deposit. So if the car is hard to sell, shouldn't the forfeited deposit more than make up for the loan interest that accrues while the car sits on the lot?
regards,
kyfdx
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Demo/exec vehicle (145 miles on odometer)
Orient Blue Metallic
Leather
STEPTRONIC 5-Speed Automatic Transmission
Moonroof
Xenon headlights
Heated frontseats
invoice was roughly $31,800
paid $30,800
Also extended the full maintainance program to 100k miles for $1,150
I live in the San Francisco area.
What are your thoughts on the prices I paid, kyfdx?
- Performance Package (ZHP)
- Nav System
- Xenon Lights
- Heated Seats
- Moonroof
Can't I get a better deal than this? I'm from Central New Jersey.
regards,
kyfdx
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I wouldn't consider the car a demo with only 145 miles on it..even though those probably were demo miles. That seems like an insignificant amount. Does the car already have an in-service date? Or did it start from the day you took delivery?
And, just for my personal curiousity... Did the car come with leather and sunroof, but no premium package? What was the MSRP?
regards,
kyfdx
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The salesperson told me that the incentive was only $1000 on the 325xi and it was the last 2003 325 they had in their inventory.
How do I verify the in-service date? I think the warranty started from early 2003.
That's right. It doesn't have the PP, hence no power seats etc. I think the MSRP was 34,000+, don't recall the exact figures.
Was planning on getting a '04 325i as I didn't need the 4wd capability. But went with the '03 to capture the discount so to speak. Guess I'll be wasting more gas on my daily commute.
I wonder why they had the car for almost a year, and it only has 145 miles on it, though..
I wouldn't worry about not having premium package.. It sounds like you are planning on keeping the car for awhile. I doubt the gas mileage will be much different for the 325xi vx the 325i, either. Enjoy your car. My wife has had hers for about six weeks now, and I can't keep the smile off my face when I drive it. We have the sport pkg, and I already had to buy a set of winter tires. At least you won't have that expense.
regards,
kyfdx
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Any thoughts on who is giving low interest rate car loans?
regards,
kyfdx
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2004 325xi (MSRP 37545)
Auto
Premium package
Cold weather package
Leather
Metallic
Mats are included
36 Month/15K
$800 bank fee
$500 Sec deposit
$470/Month
$350 disposition fee (when you return the car-this came up at the last minute )
bank fee+sec deposit+taxes+first month +DMV fees are due at signing.
Good luck to all.
My old rule of thumb, when interest rates were a little higher was $15/mo for every thousand of MSRP. That was a fair deal for 36mo/45k leases. Your lease is about $12.50 per thousand. Thats a good deal for the middle of the model year.
regards,
kyfdx
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Taxes are paid upfront.. So $470 does not include tax..
>If you are only driving 4000 miles per year, it doesn't make much sense to lease.
Why, is the depreciation on a, say, three-year-old car with just 12K miles on it so much less than one with 30K or 36K miles?
>I am not particularly proud of the following lease deal but could not do better
>after several weeks of talking to dealers, visiting the dealers and sending/
>receiving e-mails.
Actually, that's what you're supposed to do to get the best deal you can. So I can't imagine how you could have done better.
By the way, the salesman with whom my sister has been dealing in her lease of a 325xi (which is on order) said that even though NY state is supposed to refund you your "unused" portion of the sales tax in the event the car is stolen or totalled, it's all but impossible to get it from the state. So you should lump the sales tax into the capitalized cost. Of course, a salesman has a vested interest in getting the lessee to capitalize as much as possible.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
regards,
kyfdx
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regards,
kyfdx
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Thanks very much. I don't have a credit union. I will chck around at the banks-if anyone knows of low car interest rates either from a national bank or NYCity regional, please let me know.
Thanks
I haven't seen anything cheaper than the 3.9% my credit union offers (not counting special auto manufacturer supported rates), so anything between 3.9% and 4.3% would be a good deal, without much variation in payment within those two numbers.
regards,
kyfdx
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1. They are 5 minutes away from the house, and
2. I like their service dept, and
3. I like their sales staff. Even my cynical wife who hates car salesman, really likes my sales person, and
4. I give them high marks as a dealership.
Now I have to add as a p.s. I don't visit them often, in fact almost never. I don't visit any BMW dealership or service center, as the car to date just requires it's yearly checkups. In fact, I was at the dealer a couple of weeks ago with my wife to check out the X3. We took an X3 3L out for a drive and I got the chance to flog it, in an empty parking lot of hard packed snow and ice. Then I sat down with my sales rep, who found my old paperwork in 3 minutes, we built a car, but he suggested I wait until Sept or Oct, as I wouldn't get delivery until after February.
But my feeling is, should I need them, they are there for me, close to the house and have a clean BMW loaner fleet, when you bring your car in.
IMO and my wifes, sometimes the best price isn't always "best".
I just would like to ask for an advice...
I am planning to buy used BMW 3 coupe, most probably 318i, 1997-1998, around 60-90k miles. Can get one of these for 10k or less. Would like to use the car in weekends - for fun drive only , as a second car. But still probably I will pass 25k miles per year.
Any experience about known issues with this particular model and estimated maintenance cost would be greatly appreciated.
And is there any driving difference between 318i and 323i? Should I look for another model? Thanks in advance.