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Ford Ranger vs Toyota Tacoma



  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    just put the suspension lift on this morning, took 2 people 2 hours. new coils and struts upfront, add-a-leaf in the back. It's now 37" from ground to the fender flare, and I imagine liftline (groudn to frame) is now at least 16".
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    just fyi......after i jacked my torsion bars up a smidge on both my two ZR2's and my ranger, which both had the equivalent of 31's on it (the ZR2 actually came with 31x10.5's on it), im anal and measured my distance from ground to middle of fender flare bottom(basically to make the truck level).....36" exactly on all trucks. so either your lift didn't do much or you need taller tires.

    also, i would expect your lift level to be higher since my jeep liberty is 13" from ground to frame.

    anywho- what kind of tires are you getting? the goodyear MT/R tire that they put on rubicon's would look tough on your truck. or even some mud bfg's. pro comp's are neat as well.
  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    God I love not having to do that to get lift. I guess its a special bond between domestic trucks, torsion bars. You say you don't like lifts, yet used this method to lift your trucks? ewww. Anyways, have a good Turkey week!
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    It was a 2" lift in the front and .5" lift in the rear, so it all evened out. frame to ground is now 16.75-17" (used to be 14.5 upfront, 15.5 in the back....go figure. All these numbers don't add up very well), ground to top of fender flare is 37".
    I could have put 3" lift on it, but decided against it (now I'm thinking I should have gone that route and just drop the diff 1", so that CV axle angle is not bad as to wear out the boots in no time...on well, that will be the next stage, I suppose)
    This is still with 31s.
    As far as tires go, I'm going next with 32s (so I don't have to regear), probably BFG MT KMs.
  • Hi Scorpio !
    Congrats on the lift. I think you'll really like the OME setup. I have several friends with this setup and I'm going with the OME suspension real soon. I thought I might comment that my 2000 extra cad TRD 4x4 measures 36" exactly to the center of the wheel well. I believe that OME881's & N91 combo should give 2.25 - 2.5 at first and should settle to 2.0". You may want to double check and make sure the spring shop didn't put the bottom spring cup/retainer upside down. This is a common mistake and by installing the cup side up it reduces the amount of lift achieved. Just a note !! Of course TTORA is the place for Info!
    Have a good turkey day !! Jeff
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    Jeff Sharpe, by any chance?

    I did the spring compression myself, and cup is sitting correct. I'm happy with the lift upfront, because before it was at 34.75-35 and now is 37. There are few factors going into this, mainly the tires. They got 20k (although they are BFG ATs), and I usually run 30psi in them, so they compress somewhat.
    I'm a TTORA TX member :)
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    you're right i don't like lift kits.

    the reason i jacked my trucks up like this was to make the truck **LEVEL**. if you look at most trucks, take a look at your TRD 2-wheeler while you're walking out to get in it after class, it has a rake. i like my 4x4's to sit relatively level, it looks better. you can't do this (coils), nor should you since you won't be climbing over any boulders or huge ruts with no t/c. don't quietly slam domestics, when the new Level II FX4 looks as mean as it does and has the hardware to back it up.

    check out this article:

  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    but torsion bars are cheap, and its wrong for folks to call Tacomas cheap when blatant evidence such as this suggests otherwise. Besides, just the other day I stated that my favorite truck on the road was a F-150 Supercrew FX4, can't get much more domestic.

    And you can level out coilover suspensions, its called a spacer, or you can buy adjustable coilovers.

    By the way, I saw a 60 year old woman climb behind the wheel of a Liberty Renegade after a basketball game Monday nite. Boy did that thing look tough. There are tons of Liberties driven by students here as well, I have yet to see a male drive a single one of them. Even the 4Xs are driven by sorortiy girls. I wasn't gonna say any of this as things have been cool lately, but you had to go and slam my truck, but I am not mad, I guess you have gotten me used to it. As of yet, I have yet to see any females, 20 or 65, driving a prerunner.

    And how many deep ruts or boulders have you climbed over with 30 inch tires. I bet I could take those obstacles as well as you could anyway. Then again some stuff is a big deal to senior citizen mobiles.

    By the way, the truck in the article is pretty bada**, but I think I already read the article. Do you know of any place that talks about additions made for stepping up to "level 2"?
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    It seems you did not see the "Buy American, Buy Toyota" sticker posted on the national board :)
  • Car & Driver compared it to the Land Rover Freelander in their January 2002 issue. It took a backseat to the Freelander which outperformed it off road and on. The Liberty's extra 623lbs (!!!) caused

    1. 209ft braking distance from 70mph
    2. 10 seconds to get to 60mph

    I wonder how those numbers compare to my Tacoma, hehe! The testers also complained the Liberty's seats were uncomfortable and the ride was "head-tossing on any surface.

    I looked at a Liberty in a parking lot the other day. I was surprised to see how the gas tank was positioned so low and exposed. And the shock brackets on the rear axle extend below the axle further than any other vehicle I've seen (even the Ranger's, by far).
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    I'm quite concerned about the 10-second Taco will beat that in a heartbeat, maybe CnD screwed up somehow.

    As far as ride goes...well, Freelander has both IFS and IRS, so that might make some difference.

    However, I'll give Liberty credit because it's most expensive model is $23k vs. $31k for Freelander. You can do a LOT with a vehicle for 8 grand extra.
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    sad- what do you call slamming your truck? by stating the truth about it? can you not accept the fact that it isn't a 4x4? how did i slam your truck? by saying that you wouldn't be crawling over any boulders because of having no t/c? well, will you? i wouldn't think so. it was your choice to buy a, what i call (sorry, excuse me for saying this, but it's how i see them), "fake 4x4". i don't like them, i think they're real overpriced considering you could've gotten a ranger just like i had for easily what you gave for your TRD pre-runner. you bought it, accept what it is. and you do realize your dream truck F150 FX4 is torsion barred don't you? kind of contradictory dont you think? do you even know how they work?
    as for the 60-year old woman in the renegade- good for her. she chose a nice vehicle. just because it doesn't have a bed doesn't mean it won't work for ya or won't off-road. i happen to like the liberty, it is a very well put together vehicle. as for her's, it was probably 2wd, and i don't particularly care for the renegades. i like the more plain sport versions (like we have) with few amenities other than cd, the usual power features, and 4x4.
    btw, those people that you "DON'T" see driving two-wheel-drive pre-runners are probably driving four-wheel-drive liberty's. hehe

    pluto- as for the article you are talking about, it's online at click on the comparison link, and then go to suv/trucks and choose "canyon cubs". i can't poste the url because of edmunds crappy settings.

    seems you fail to mention how they praise the liberty's stout build quality and four-wheel-drive features. as for losing to the land-rover in the areas mentioned- ill gladly accept that. every category they diss the jeep in favor for the land-rover are gripes that the everyday commuter would complain about (uncomfortable seats, bouncy ride, etc). ill take my low ratio transfer case, solid rear axle, more powerful and torquey engine, and just an overall heavier duty vehicle any day over that escape like land-rover (i know, you'd buy the land-rover, figures).
    and also, fyi- this shock mount thing you got going on is absurd. they mount the shocks where they do to provide the suspension with long travel shocks while trying to provide a smooth ride. this is a short wheelbase vehicle so it is going to ride a little rough. also, it is a truck based suv, not a car like the land rover and escape so it rides like a truck. i've yet to hear of anyone complaing of the mounts for rear shocks on any ranger or liberty. and gas tank; where do you want it? after measuring mine from floor to bottom of tank, it's 14.5 inches. how high you want it? at least the sheetmetal on the liberty doesn't sport exterior spot-weld marks all over like all tacomas.
    what about what c/d said of the liberty chassis that had no detectable flexing? how about how they say that the liberty was built for rock crawling? quite opposite to what you've said about it in the past, or even what 'sad' likes to categorize it as. ill quote him "senior citizen mobile". lmao

    thx for the heads up on the article though, that was one i hadn't read.

    olt, did you check the latest consumers digest or reports? whatever one you read. they gave the liberty recommendations. i know in your mind that matters somehow. i could care less.
  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Pennsylvania Furnace, PAPosts: 9,281
    Let's not get into this nonsense again... tone it down please... BEFORE it gets out of hand.

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  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    wouldn't know, but I climb thru muddy skidder (a loggin machine) ruts without spinning a tire while me bud's Z71 has to back up and try again every time.

    If you have never ridden in one of these trucks, don't dog its OR capabilities, cuz it has em. This is the only reason I say that you "slam" my truck, which doesn't bother me by the way -- b/c you make false statements about it. Then again I guess ignorance is bliss for people such as yourself.

    And at one time didn't you say that you liked highspeed offroading more than crawling over stuff, cuz I definitely remember this statement. Why is mud and rocks all of a sudden the most important off road feat? Oh I know, cuz it helps you to manipulate your story so that your senior citizen mobile sounds tougher than the wig scratching, denture brushing, grocery getting dog that it is. How many miles did you put on it while going shopping today? I bet you played havock on those nasty curbs that get in the way, just like real off roading huh.

    Whew, Im spent. No more talking about Liberties for me after that, so mods don't worry. Its the straight and narrow from now on. On topic stuff only. Tbunder, I know how worthless that was and rest assured that I feel quite ignorant after writing it, so just lay off. Hehe, get a Ranger so we can argue this for real. Liberties aren't worth fighting for - now go fill it up with gifts and tie a tree to the top or something. Happy holidays, and all of this is tongue in cheek all the way. I know your interests man and you know mine - its just that we both know how to yank each others chains at the same time!
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    you are too nice of a guy.
    big news- im getting a lift for my jeep., or rocky road outfitters offer a 2.5 inch lift, and then i plan on going after some 245/75 yokohama geolander at's or wild country radial TXR tires for it. the kit is less than $200 and fits like a glove.

    visit this link to view a liberty with this lift. granted this lib has 265/75 tires, but they rub im assuming. i will only go with 245's, or a 30.8 inch tall tire. this will look perfect with the height gained by the lift. i understand this lift isn't a true suspension lift, but it's all that's available for the KJ right now. with longer shocks, it will ensure longer travel for the suspension. bilstein has some on the way so i've heard.

    sad-, you're a nice guy and i will admit i love the tacoma truck, just not as much as the ranger, but always remember- im the one with dana axles and the very low crawling t/c. although i will also admit i think the tacoma is cheap in nature. the sheetmetal seems very thin compared to rangers. as far as getting a ranger, i won't buy one until they change them. after i get the lib the way i want it, i very honestly see a new '03 or '04 Camry SE in my future. i need a new car, and with a 5-spd manual and the balsy little 4-banger it should be fun while barely breaking $20,000 cash. that's my future.
  • the Tacoma is cheap in nature, and that's fine - you're entitled to your own opinions. But if your opinion was fact, why then does the Tacoma blow away the Ranger when it comes to resale value? Cheap things usually don't command higher prices, especially when used.

    It's just too easy to dismiss your opinions and "facts" when they're never fact-based.

    BTW, it's good to know you're considering a four cylinder Camry - a car that gets to 60mph much quicker than your 10 second Jeep. It's not safe driving a car that can't get out of its own way (or stop for that matter)!
  • rfruthrfruth Posts: 630
    Whats everyone think of a diesel powered Liberty - the hybrid P/U appeals to me !
  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    You have excellent taste in tires. Those yokohamas, IMO, are the sweetest looking tire anywhere! I have read that they don't wear very well, but that is not too important.

    And I would bet money that you are a pretty nice guy too. Do they make camry's with a manual now? I like max's and altimas a little better.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    Lots of hype, but essentially all they have are spacer lifts. In TTORA, there are few guys who make and sell them for $130 for 3" setup.

    There seems to be a lot of hype on the site, but there's one catch: those spacers aren't that good for your coils and ride. They stiffen the ride, sag the coil, and with stock strut assembly, you lose downtravel. Also, make sure your CV boots upfront are fine and fins aren't rubbing, otherwise you'll tear through them in a heartbeat. Also, with that lift, you can kiss warranty goodbye on front CVs and driveshaft.

    Spacers are a cheap way to lift the truck. I wonder if ARB sells any coil setups for Liberty, like they do for Tacomas (Old Man Emu coils, superb lift, all new coils and struts. I bought the front setup for $320 with shipping and just sold my stock setup for $170 on 2" of lift real cheap, for the quality it provides).
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    It's funny that Chrysler could not "build a business case" for hybrids. Toyota and Honda have done that and are already working on hybrids. I guess Chrysler will be playing catch-up few years down the road again.
    As far as diesel goes: we'll see how many grandmas and sorority chix buy them :)
    Wrangler with a diesel would be killer. Liberty with diesel is a waste of diesel.
  • rfruthrfruth Posts: 630
    Chrysler & Ford are behind Honda n Toyota but if they play their cards right (low sulfer diesel would be a good move if they can sell Washington on it) look out ! GM might even realize its the 21 st century ...
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    about rockyroad lift, the 'over the top' lift they offer uses spacers yes, but they aren't internally inserted into the coil. this lift has steel spacers that bolt to the strut assembly itself, in essence lifting the shock assembly as well as the vehicle. and most jeep dealers honor warranty issues with lifts 2.5 inches or smaller. shoot, some even sell lifted liberty's off their lots.

    and fwiw, i have seen a few camry's today and realized i don't want one. i think i need a truck....period. ill wait on the new ranger or tacoma.

    pluto- if you read the c/d article, you'll see that the jeep they test is a limited, which is a lot heavier than sport models. also, they mention that their test vehicle was new and the engine was tight as i can vouch. my jeep is not near as as quick as the loner i had (15000 miles) when i had my fuel pump replaced. mine now has 3500 miles and is still as tight as it was then. trust me, it will run hard. it feels like a V8 when you punch it. but of course you wouldn't be used to all that power and torque with your wimpy 190 horses and 220 lf/ft. besides, i really didn't buy my jeep to drag race to 60 mph. we actually use our t/c up here in iowa.
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    here's that website i forgot to insert friday night.

  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    I wouldn't trust outside dealer on "Yes, we'll warranty it". Toyota also sells lifted Tacos when they are done by an authorised company, but they will void warranty on parts directly affected.
    Why should company have to cover CV boots leaking every month because owner had a 3" lift put on? Toyota dealer charges $250 to reboot one side (I know because day before I was supposed to have lift installed I tore a CV boot, but it was fixed under warranty), it's a decent amount of work no matter which vehicle you do it at, and covering this under warranty would be bad business.
    People installing lifts should be aware of consequences.

    This is hilarious....."if feels like a V8", and all you have is 210/235 engine. I never knew 20hp/15lb-ft made THAT much difference :) Oh yes, especially with a vehicle that's what.....600 lbs heavier?
    People with V8s must be missing out on the great V6 from Jeep. Haha.
  • put 600 pounds of modifications into my truck to get another 15 lb/ft of torque at 800rpms higher, I could have V8 performance too!

    I think we all know a serious off-roader would prefer losing 600lbs than gaining 15 lb/ft of torque. Even the ones in Iowa who use their t/c.
  • Well I certainly enjoy my newest Ranger. The Edge model certainly has some ride height to it, and the 3.0l v6 in the regular cab, manual transmission, and 4.10 rear gear certainly makes it easy to accelerate. However the 4.10 gears do make it not as MPG friendly. 20MPG on my first tank with about 220 Miles highway, and 50 or so miles in the city. First gear is pretty short, but I would definitely like it if I had a load. 6 Disc changer was used on the trip to oklahoma where I got a chance to experiment with the Ranger off-road. Nothing too big, as I really didn't buy this truck for offroading (4x2) but I was impressed with a half hour venture into the fields and hills.

    Already installed black side bars, and had the windows tinted. Truck looks mean in all black. Will soon be adding a security system and locking tonnau cover to make up for the lack of extended cab.

    Overall very pleased, and proud owner of my 2003 Ranger. Pros: Comfy seat, commanding ride height, powerful motor, off-road ability, sharp looks(Edge Plus is the way to go), smooth highway ride, lack of wind noise (vs. a 2001 Honda Accord!!), 6 disc CD, and also that new truck smell.
    Cons: Gas milage not impressive(75MPH = 3000 RPM) , first gear made for towing, not stoplights, high beams disable foglights, Fuel guage a little conservative(my 16.5Gal tank shows "empty" and the warning light comes on with 3+ gal. still in the tank) can't think of anything more.
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    glad to hear you like your truck. i also liked my 6 cd changer in my ranger. did you know that the '03's have thicker glass in all the windows now? also, do you have a shortbed or a longbed?
  • I have the 6 foot bed, so that should be the shortbed. Just the perfect size to lie down in, and I fit if I take my shoes off. I don't think any other truck could give me so much for a little over 14 grand total price.
  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    there is a way around the fog lights and high beams issue. Check around, good luck.
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    but has anyone laid eyes on the new FX4 level II rangers? i know ive said this before, but this is one seriously tough truck. and i say this with an open mind about makes. i saw five today at charles gabus ford in des moines. three blue ones about the color of my blue ranger, and a black and bright red one. the red one was the coolest i though. i hope they make this model for another year. i want one bad. it's stance is to die for. the alcoa wheels make me salivate all over myself. and the interior is downright awesome. ok, im done.

    as far as the libby lift- doing the rocky road OTT lift. and probably some 245/75 BFG muds with blackwalls out. this lift has been proven to be built very heavy duty, and has none of the issues scorpio has tried to scare me off with. it doesn't use internal spacers up front, it has external (as in the spacers aren't a plastic poly piece inserted inside the coil to lengthen it)steel bolt on ones that go over the top of the strut/shock assembly. and with longer shocks in the rear, it provides more articulation and travel. it truly is a bolt on and go lift as i've been told by many who have it. all that is needed is an alignment. after i get it, i will post some pics somehow.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    just telling you how it is.
    Spacers that TTORA guys make are heavy duty too (not plastic poly piece inserted inside the coil to -->COMPRESS<-- it, but a steel one), but what I posted was the list of issues that goes with having coil compressed by a spacer. Now, if you are putting an external spacer on, you'll not damage the coil, but beware of the warranty because your CVs and rear driveshaft will probably no longer be covered, unless you have it installed by the dealer.
  • You may recall my CD player and one of my amplifiers was stolen last month. The detective who took my police report asked if I had any VIN numbers to the equipment stolen as the Pawn shops now have a tracking system strickly for this purpose. So if you happen to have any aftermarket equipment, make sure you write down the model numbers and VIN #'s incase yours is stolen too. Unfortunately I did not have the VIN number, only the receipts when I purchased the stolen items.

    Luckily my parents cleaned out my old closet at their house and I found the VIN number to the my Alpine CDA-7941 CD Player on the original box. I'll be calling the detective back and hopefully will be able to find my CD player and those who stole it from me. Anyway, just passing this on to help anybody else who may meet the same unfortunate event...

    Still enjoying the new Ranger though. Will be upgrading the speakers maybe next spring, but after the security system and tonnau cover is installed. Anybody have any experience with a good security system? I'm looking at the one shown in Crutchfield.
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    good advice. i also had stereo equip. stolen out of my S10 ZR2 back in feb. of '98. of course, after that i installed an alarm. i found a code alarm out of crutchfield. it worked good. no falses. also, bulldog makes a good one. i had one of those earlier in another vehicle. both came from crutchfield.

    anxiously awaiting the new ranger and tacoma. later
  • kbtoyskbtoys Posts: 62
    Well if you want the best of the best get a DEI(viper, python, cliford) alarm but they are hard to come by if you wanted to install it yourself. I assume you want to install it yourself if you are looking at the alarms in crutchfield. To me I think crutchfield is overpriced so I would shop around on the net in other places for alarms. One thing you should get from crutchfield is quick connects for your truck. The are like wiring harness for you alarm so you don't have to splice into your car wires. Let me know you have any questions
  • It looks like my Dealership will give the best deal. They will install a security system and power door locks for $250. I also have a 10% off coupon. I trust Ford the most with the installation too.
  • Getting the security system installed, power door lock actuators for keyless entry, and wheel locks for 250 plus tax. Nothing but good things to say for Bankston Ford in Frisco Tx.

    Anybody with a 6 disc-in dash changer, and 4 speakers wire in a subwoofer? I have a 250W 10" subwoofer from my old ride, and a MTX 250W Amp. I doubt the ford player will have RCA outs, but maybe I could use the rear speaker cable to drive the high level inputs on my amp? Maybe I should just buy a crossover control... Anyways it looks like I have 4 6x8" speakers to work with, until I replace 'em...
  • kbtoyskbtoys Posts: 62
    So you want to use the factory radio to power your 4 speakers and hook up an amp to power you sub? Well what I think you would have to do is tap into your rear speaker wires as inputs into your amp like you said. If you plan on using an amp to power all your speakers you could get a line in converter(I thinks that is what they are called) to change your speaker wires over to RCA's. No matter what it is not going to sound as good as it would if you just where to replace the factory with an after market one, but I can also see why you would not want to do that being that theifs look for after market stereo's. Tuff call.

    Also what are wheel locks?
  • My concerns exactly KBToys. I wasn't away of the converters, but I would try the high level (speaker line in) first. And you got it, my major concern with sticking with the retail unit is theft. I'm not looking for alot more power as I am mostly listening to talk stations. But on road trips, the ability to crank up the volume a little would be nice. However that is all in the future, for now I'm just seeing the best way to use what I have on hand now (the amp and subwoofer from my last truck).

    Wheel locks are just the special lug nuts that require a key to unbolt. Just another step to keep my Ranger intact.

    edit: Windows already tinted to the darkest legal limit... :)
  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    too so that the thieves can't see in unless the light is just right. The $80 I spent for my window tinting (alot, I know) was well worth it. I would have given em $100 if thats what it cost.

    All this audio talk has got me wanting to spend some money. Im thinkin of Pioneer's DEH-P7400 CD/MP3 player and 4 Infinity References Speakers. Or maybe a Panasonic home theater system for around $300. I could hook up my laptop to it and listen to allll my mp3s. I doubt it will happen, maybe this summer.
  • kbtoyskbtoys Posts: 62
    This place is dead. Is everybody wraped up in the hussel and bussel of christmas? Anyway it seems rummors might be true. It sounds that the tacoma will get the new 4.0 V6. Cool well I plan on going to the Detroit auto show next month and am sure they will have it there. Knowing me I will be taking plenty of pics while I am there of all the new cars and trucks and will post them.
  • 2k1trd2k1trd Posts: 301
    Yeah i'm syked for the new Taco and would love to see one.I'm sure the new 4.0 will be used since the new Runner is getting it also.Please post pics if you happen to see one.
  • scape2scape2 Posts: 4,124
    the last I heard was Ford was not planning on updating the Ranger anytime soon.. This means with the new Chev colorado/GM, along with the new Tacoma coming soon the Ranger is going to be buried. Heck, even Nissan is already planning on a new Frontier in the next 2 years..
    Has anyone heard to the contrary??
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    They've been pushing it off over and over again. I guess Ford is too busy doing "restructuring" trying to figure out why they are losing money.
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    they may keep delaying it, but it still keeps on outselling all other trucks in it's class. even with the other's updates, the ranger will outsell them. mark my word. the only thing the ranger doesn't offer that the others do is a crew cab. this is sad, as i'd have one right now. but don't think ford doesn't have the plans laid out for a new ranger. they aren't ones to sit aside as the others introduce new vehicles. the new F150 will probably be unveiled in january, and then later, maybe fall of '03 the new ranger will come out. i have seen spy shots of the new f150 at, this is their bread and butter vehicle, the ranger just fills a segment.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    According to the latest sale data, Tacoma overtook S10 and is now #2 for this year.
    The way Ranger has been losing ground in sales (down to 12K from 16K from last year), it's not going to be long before Tacoma overtakes it. And you can bet new Taco with 4.0L engine is not going to help Ranger sales.
    I think tbunder proclaimed few months ago that Tacoma would never take S10.
  • The 4.0 in the 4-Runner is a bigger six cylinder with more punch because the 3.4 Taco engine was anemic in that "Tundra" sized 4-Runner. Think about it. The Tundras with that size motor sold as well as screen doors on submarines.

    And the Tundras in '04 look like they may be sizing up to a fuller-sized truck. Seems to me that Toyota would do well to beef up their horsepower on the V-8s and offer a sport-stick shift on the Tundras. Better keep an eye on the Hemi in that Dakota RT as a measuring stick. I was around to see the muscle cars explode out of the introduction of the Mustang. The pickups are in their heyday now and look like they will be into the muscle in the next two years et al Ford Lighting; Dakota Hemi; Chev SSR.

  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    You are thinking about a sequoia, which didn't sell well in the 3.4 engine configuration. Whats your point. The 3.4L 4-runner was a tad underpowered but far from anemic. And before the days of the 3.5L Pathfinder and the like, the 4-runner engine power competed well with competitors.

    What information have you seen on the 04 tundra?
    IMO, toyota never should have marketed the tundra against the true 1/2 tons trucks. The 4.7L absolutely blows away comparably sized v8s from the competitors and for that reason folks should see it as a large mid-sized truck. Thats the way I see it.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    Just for kicks, went to look for the "Toyota will never take #2 or #1": msg #155 in this thread.

    Quote from tbunder: "scorp- it's still third hat in sales. it will never be #1. or #2. take that to the bank."

    Looks like it's about to be #2 for this year. Ouch. That's got to hurt. Which bank would it be? Run by Simpson graduates?

  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    2002 4Runner was still the same 4Runner as before, with 3.4L engine but tweaked exaust so it was rated at 183hp only.
    It's interesting that 183hp is nowdays called "anemic". I guess there was a time when 150hp engines were the top of the line, but still.....3.4L is now 8 years old. And new 4.0L just might hang around for a while.

    Here's my reason for why Tacoma WILL get a new engine: torque. This is the same reason 4Runner is sold with 2 engine: if you want higher hp and lower torque, you buy a V6. If you want higher torque, you buy a V8.
    With Tacoma being offered with 4.0L (although I am having trouble imagining which engine would be offered as an alternative...3.4?) it's not going to cannibalize the Tundra market, b/c engine is not going to be strong enough to tow as much as Tundra.
  • I typed a long message, and this screwy forum code junked it.

    PHP forums software is free and it works like a charm. Someone needs to re-evaluate their programmic staff salary.

    Well maybe tomorrow I'll get back to it. But in summary, the 03 Ranger is doing great. Seems my Edge model has a 92 MPH govenor on it. Time to look into a chip....
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