Subaru Crew: Suggestions for Subaru

joybell

In this day and age, with worldwide on-line sales, it should be possible to buy Subaru accessories on-line that are not available in North America. Last year I bought an expensive hand made saddle from a small saddlery in Australia, so I should be able to buy that cargo liner on-line from a dealer in Japan.

ateixeira

SoA could offer more of those accessories, we do get a lot of request for stuff that is N/A here in the US.

SPT needs to expand, be more like TRD or even Mopar. Compare the catalogs, SPT's is almost insignificant in size.

-juice

joybell

Since I am of Swiss orgin, I decided to visit the website of a Swiss Subaru dealer:
http://www.garage-kaestli.ch/
where I find that not only do they have Foresters colour I originally wanted (Red outside, gray inside), they have the better engine (2L) with a dual range tranny! And, guess what? THEY HAVE THE CARGO LINER ALL THE WAY UP THE BACK OF THE BACK SEATS.

dcm61

Please put the power backrest recliner on all cars equipped with power seats. A power recliner would be welcome even on the non-powered seats.

At minimum, use a variable rotary adjustment instead of a step adjustment. There's nothing worse than the comfortable spot being in between 2 fixed steps.

DaveM

locke2c

Get used to one of those two steps, Dave. Hard to imagine not being able to adjust to one of them given a bit of time...

Oh and Subaru: please always offer manual seats and no leather in the highest output powertrain option. The current Forester XT 5 speed is perfect.

-Colin

jfl

Colin,
How about a 6 speed MT? 8~)
Jim

rsholland

2.0 better than 2.5? Only if gas mileage is your main reason for saying so. The dual-range tranny is available with the 2.5 Forester. Check Subaru's Australian web site; and yes, I wish we had it here, so that I will agree with you on.

Bob

joybell

I wasn't thinking performance or fuel economy. I was thinking reliability which, to me, matters most of all.

joybell

Just curious. How is the decision made that we don't want dual trannies but do want cruise control, that we don't want cargo liners but do want plush carpeting, that people who like red cars like beige interiors.....and so on. Is it because Americans like to drive livingrooms? ;-)

rsholland

What makes you think the 2.0 is more reliable than the 2.5? I've seen no evidence of that. In fact, except for the WRX, I don't ever recall North America ever getting a 2.0 engine. 1.8 and 2.2, yes, but not 2.0.

Bob

joybell

but I'm not sure for how long. As far as I know, it is only the 2.5L engine that has the problems (head gaskets). BTW, the Americans put up with a lot more problems than the Europeans are willing to, because Europeans (especially the Swiss) expect quality (have most probably never owned an American made Ford).

rsholland

Yeah, it's been available all over the world except here. That's not exactly comparing apples-to-apples. Who knows what other kinds of problems overseas Subie have had. Just because some (not all, but some) 2.5s have had head gasket problems, doesn't mean it's an unreliable engine. To the best of my knowledge, that issue has been addressed and rectified. I'd be very surprised if your new Forester will be afflicted somewhere down the road with head gasket problems.

Bob

rsholland

BTW, the Americans put up with a lot more problems than the Europeans are willing to, because Europeans (especially the Swiss) expect quality (have most probably never owned an American made Ford).

My experience with European cars has been miserable. Every one has been an absolute dog. If you plan to buy a BMWs, Mercedes, etc., expect to have problems. These boards are full of horror stories about European brands. That's the kind of quality Europeans expect, and demand? No thank you.

Bob

dcm61

I'm all for manual seats. I'd prefer a nice adjustable manual seat over power, but if you're going to force a power seat on people, make it full power.

DaveM

hypov

<<but if you're going to force a power seat on people, make it full power. >>

As in ejection seats ;-)

-Dave

jfl

is usually decided by the "big" boys. They set the standard, if you don't meet the standard your market share drops. As most people develop their "short list" of possible cars to buy, if you don't have similar features, you're not on the list. Remember that Subaru tried to enter the mainstream in the early '90s and suffered greatly.

Subaru has a good niche. Good enough that the big boys are now looking to muscle in.

My $0.02.

Jim

bluesubie

I've been complaining about this as well, especially for accessories.

I have Euro/Oz OEM headlight and foglight covers on my Rex. A friend of mine picked them up for me while he was in England. I also have Prodrive P1 wheels (option in the UK, aftermarket N. America).

There are some UK dealers that will ship to the U.S. Try Ace Kensington for starters.

-Dennis

ateixeira

I'm with Colin, KIS: Keep is Simple. One less thing to break. Delete the climate control while you're at it, on my beloved XT that is.

More and more I think that Subaru could benefit by expanding SPT substantially. Lots of this stuff that people ask for, such as Navigation systems and HIDs, ought to be sold by them.

Don't build these luxuries into the price of the cars, especially the good performers. They add weight, cost, and complexity that some of us simply don't want.

-juice

hypov

No compliants 'bout having to be sold Navi Sys and/or HIDs as aftermarket, etc... Just need them to incorporate into their design for placement(s) of such items.

-Dave

joybell

ignorance is bliss. If it wasn't for the internet we would never see what others get with their Subarus. I just don't want Subaru to put too much "luxury" into their vehicles and sacrifice practicality to save money or weight. Take the cargo liner in the Forester, for example. There is a person on another board who is asking if his bike will fit into the cargo area with the back seats down. Yes, it does, and to back this up there is a nice photo on the Subaru Japan website showing just such a load. Now the bike is nice and clean, and on a rubber liner, but the bike won't stay that way if it is used. Imagine having to load the muddy tires right up against the back of the back seats, if there is no liner as in the American 2003s. The bike owner's wife (if she is the one who has to clean it, as is usually the case) will be not too happy. So it is not just me loading dirty cargo, but the average SUVer does it as well. And the Forester is Subaru's SUV.

paisan

You could say the same thing about every single SUV sold in the US, none of them come with bed-liners. If you want a bed liner, why not buy a PU + cap?

-mike

p0926

Monica- I agree it's a shame that Subaru made the cargo liner an option instead of standard and it would be great if they offered one that fit the back with the seats down (I use an old sheet except for wet loads when I use a tarp). However, I'm not going to fault Subaru since there are plenty of other SUVs out there which don't come with cargo liners (that's why there's all those ads in car magazines for aftermarket liners). However, I'm going to have to disagree with your comment about the wife being the one who has to clean the vehicle. It's been my observation that it's usually the man who has the primary responsiblity to maintain the family vehicle (inside and out). Maybe we should start a poll in the Subaru cleaning topic?

-Frank P.

ateixeira

Because, mike, we ride mountain bikes but we also have kids. )

That liner is a good idea, plain and simple. Who doesn't get the occasional bags of mulch or potting soil from Home Depot?

Frank: good idea, let's do a poll.

-juice

kens

I'd pay extra for that liner if it were available! There have been numerous times when I've wished I had protection on the backside of the rear seats when I'm carrying around stuff.

Ken

ateixeira

I would too, of course that could be yet another SPT item.

I'll admit it was cool to see it was standard back in 1998!

-juice

hypov

How about SoA create an Outpost in my.subaru.com where i.e. Subaru UK, Australia, etc. can offer products available in their market to us here in the Americas [with usual SoA disclaimer ;-)]. Orders can be placed directly [not through SoA for purpose of separation] with the respective vendor at the risk and responsibility of the buyer.
What y'all think of the idea?

-Dave

p0926

subkid

those things are very easy to get and fit in DIY version. Just visit your local HomeDepot/Revy/Rona/Canadian Tire/WallMart outlet to get some ideas.

Way less expensive and, you can make them to your liking and needs.

K

ateixeira

While that's true, there is nothing like a custom fit. That goes for floor mats, cargo mats, etc.

-juice

bat1161

Dave-

A "one stop shop" for Subie items is a nice idea.

Mark

joybell

Missed having a cargo liner yet again today. I took a wheelchair-bound friend out for a drive and lunch. Her chair, even when folded and with the leg extensions off, did not fit without the back seats down. And it rained....the wheels were dirty, and the back of the back seats are dirty yet again. As to the post with the coment that "other" SUVs don't offer cargo liners covering up the back of the back seats either so why should Subaru, I don't feel that is a just explanation for Subaru's oversight, intentional or not. Subaru is unique and has always offered a little more than the "others". I guess I expected to get the liners or at least have them as an option.

paisan

You don't want to pay a lot, yet you want quirky items in your car. I just have to shake my head and wonder.

-mike

joybell

and my old Loyale wagon was way more practical, though I admit not as fun to drive as the Forester.

joybell

for what you don't want or don't need? And then not get what you do need?

paisan

Want, most other people don't want stripped down cars. So basically the market is too small for what you want. The beauty of capitalism at it's best!

You would probably be a lot happier with a $9K 2wd ford ranger long-bed! No radio, no AC, 5MT, etc.

-mike

p0926

Monica- I agree with Mike (school of etiquette not withstanding), buyer demographics and economies of scale just won't support an ala Carte type ordering system.

-Frank P.

ladywclass

isn't this SUGGESTIONS for Subaru? And joybell is making her SUGGESTIONS .. just as you make YOUR SUGGESTIONS ...
There IS a segment of the population who would LOVE what Joybell is describing .. and after all ... there are things that you guys ask for sometimes that I also "shake my head in wonder" about ...
(can't we all just 'get along' ... lol)

p0926

Good point Brenda and you're right; there are plenty of suggestions that we don't stand a chance of ever seeing. However, Monica didn't just make a suggestion but also asked "why" Subaru couldn't offer certain features. Mike (in his inimitable way) and I were just answering her question. And I hope you don't think we're picking on Monica because she's a female, I've also tried to explain to Bob why low-range gearing or increased towing capacity aren't SOA priorities (not that he listens mind you) :-)

-Frank P.

ateixeira

What, so now paisan asking for 800 ft-lbs of torque at zero rpm is unreasonable? And Bob wanting to tow 18,000 lbs with a compact SUV not possible? And me wanting 72 mpg from a fast roadster that seats 7 comfortably is crazy? LOL

Point taken, Brenda.

The Cross Lander arrives this fall as a true back-to-basics SUV, what the XTerra was meant to be IMHO. Let's see how it sells. 4WD 4l V6 with low range for $17.8k MSRP. All the refinement of a truck designed several decades ago, though.

Let's see how it sells. If it's a huge hit, perhaps Subaru could re-examine the possibility of a back-to-basics Forester, at least offer a hose-out interior or something.

-juice

p0926

"perhaps Subaru could re-examine the possibility of a back-to-basics Forester, at least offer a hose-out interior or something."

Not a chance. Like it or not, Subaru is moving up-market. Even the current base model (X) comes better equipped than some other manufacturer's higher-end models.

-Frank P.

joybell

FHI's plans for Subaru, or SOA for the North American market? Front wheel drive Imprezas still exist in Japan. Is the "upmarket" move here SOA's doing?

ateixeira

Probably both SoA and HQ. Look at the new Legacy's content level.

I think moving too far upmarket would not be wise, VW fell on its face and had to cancel the W8 Passat, and they have literally 10 times the resources that Subaru does.

Nothing wrong with the status quo, IMHO, content levels are a bit above average but not extravagant, so are real-world prices. Why do you think they just had a record month in sales?

-juice

jfl

SOA needs to remain focused and not spread themselves too thin. FHI is not big enough to challenge the big 5 head-to head.

In fact SOA needs to strengthen themselves within their niche. Most of the competition are introducing AWD cars...a direct attack on Subaru's territory.

Jim

joybell

Subaru should offer what the others don't.

p0926

Subaru should offer what the others don't.

They use to when they were the only ones with AWD standard on every model. Now with every Tom, Dick and Harry auto maufacturer coming out with thier own AWD models, Subaru's AWD niche is fast dissappearing.

-Frank P.

paisan

Will fail, since spare parts will be very few and far between.

-mike

paisan

Are you willing to pay say $1000 less on your car and have it totally stripped down? That's my point here, my point is that you aren't going to save a lot of money by producing a low-volume, low-tech, low-buck car.

For instance, my dealer NEVER carried the TS, model because it was a waste of money. For slightly more $ you could get the Outback Sport which had significantly more features than the TS.

Every differentiation from the "mainstream" trim level of a vehicle costs exponentially more to make, and it doesn't matter if it's a differentiation down or up, it still costs boatloads of $ to retool, etc.

Let's take your roll-up window scenario...

Currently the same motors for the windows are found in EVERY SINGLE subaru produced. So mister FHI goes to the producer of the parts and says "Hey we need 500,000 window motors, and you get OEM parts contract to boot afterward" He'll get them at a pretty good price. Now he goes to the company making the cranks and says hey we need 10,000 cranks for our crankup windows, the crank manufacturer is not going to sell them for much less than the company selling the 500K window motors. That's just the beginning, FHI then needs to keep 2 sets of inventor for those motors and cranks. They have to train the factory workers how to install 2 differnt type of window systems, and most importantly since each car is not built based on a customer order, they need to anticipate what the split of power windows/crank windows will be. Now you do this for say 5-10 items, and you see the nitemare produced for a company like subaru which isn't a major car manufacturer.

-mike

jfl

Wow mike, written like a production and inventory control professional!

Now just add additional engineering to design and specify the second part, the need to inventory two parts at the dealer rather than one...lots of bucks for a NON-feature. (Perceived by the general public as a negative.)

The very first Honda Accord IIRC three colors and manual or auto. Period.

Jim

paisan

Being a small business owner, and working on wallstreet as my day job, you pick up stuff about costs

-mike

rsholland

FHI, Subaru's parent company's long-term plans are to make Subaru into a "premium" brand. They've said so publicly a number of times. The bare-bones Subaru you long for just won't happen. Even if it does happen, it will be a very minor model (as are the current FWD Japanese-spec models), and it won't happen here in North America. If that's the kind of vehicle you want, you'll have to look to another brand.

See the first paragraph in the following link:

http://www.autointell.com/asian_companies/subaru-motor/subaru-cor- p/subaru-corporate-01.htm

Bob