Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/25 for details.
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/25 for details.
Options
Comments
btw, there's an interesting Lowrance thread over in the Yukon discussion. One quote:
"For a device intended for road navigation, the details shown of all the creeks on the lakes we use are amazing. I'm also impressed by the way Lowrance make available for free, downloadable software updates including updated POI info."
csprick, "2007 Chevrolet Tahoe and GMC Yukon" #2707, 22 Aug 2007 12:49 pm
The standard stereo head unit in some Scions can be replaced with a different dealer-installed stereo with nav and just a few other cars are like that. It isn't common at all.
It still isn't as nice a factory because it doesn't have the gyros and integration with the wheels/odometer that allow it to continue "tracking" it tunnels without any satellite signal. Not that satellite navigation in tunnels is a super-useful feature in everyday driving, (I have never had to make turns or change streets while in a tunnel) but still nice to have.
If you don't have all the functionality of a factory installed unit, you might as well save the money and gain the portability of the portable units.
It wouldn't be hard to do the portable nav integration I mentioned earlier. If it was flush mounted rather than recessed in a cubby, there would be no size or shape constraints. Without the sliding door to hide it in a cubby, you would just have to pull it off and toss it in the console or glove compartment if you have theft concerns when parking on the street.
A USB jack could neatly handle charging, routing the audio to a speaker and would also serve as a mount for a lightweight unit.
If they wanted to be really cheap and low tech, they could even do a little fold down platform on the dash with standard DC power port and analog line-in jack.
It would probably be sold as at a profit as a $100 option (or better standard) even in low priced economy cars that don't offer factory navi as an option.
In fact, the whole industry seems to be moving away from standard sized double-DIN dash openings, and going to proprietary, oddly shaped openings.
Mark
I'd highly recommend considering only those models of after-market systems that speak street names using Text To Speech (TTS). That way you'll hear "Turn left onto South Main Street in 500 feet" instead of " Turn left in 500 feet".
There's a lot of good info here: http://tinyurl.com/yed9d2
The only disadvantage is it is too big to fit in a shirt pocket.
My 1993 is double-DIN. It's actually very slightly bigger, about an extra half inch I had to cover up.
Any how, I have a Garmin c320 and a c340, and we've been happy with them.
I'm a bit afraid to use them in the Miata because I don't lock it (thieves will just slash the top) and I'm not crazy about having to carry it around with me all the time. Get the Nuvi if you will do that.
I'm not that interested in buying a NAV system, but am curious about them. I might try out the NAV function on my Verizon Wireless phone sometime. About $10/month or $2.99 for one day.
I hope you have health insurance that covers laser eye surgery. Whenever I've looked at a GPS system on a phone, or even some of the smaller screen portable systems, I get a headache. We have factory systems in all of our cars: 911 (5.8"), MDX (8"), TL (9") and I would have a tough time going to anything smaller, at least for use in a car.
That fits fine on a cell phone screen and even better on a larger smartphone screen.
With well-done voice directions, you really should be able to turn the screen OFF and still get where you need to go.
You do not need to see a map of the US or even the local neighborhood to get directions.
The big screens have a lot of superfluous videogame-like eye candy
that's fun to look at, but an unnecessary distraction when you only need simple point to point directions.
Voice directions alone would not be my preference. The map display on my systems allows me to circuit around bad traffic, double check my location in unfamiliar areas, track our progress, etc. In the case of two out of three of our systems (911 and MDX) there is a directional display in the dash as well as on the nav screen. Without the visual confirmation, the voice commands can sometimes be hard to interpret, especially in 5,6,7 corner intersections we have in the DC area. I find it less distracting to glance at the well placed GPS screen than strain to see street name signs from 100 yards away.
We went on a trip to the Finger Lakes over Labor Day and I can assure you, we never would have seen some spectacular sites and scenery off tiny side roads, had it not been for the the ease and ability to use MDX system/screen to see where we were going and how to get back to the main roads. We put 200 miles on the odometer in random exploration that we never would have figured out from paper maps or voiced directions. We didn't even know where we were going until we made some of the turns. That's not something you can do with a cell phone.
P.S. That image you posted looks unlike anything in our 2 Acuras and Porsche. My guess is GM or Ford? They have taken cockpit ergonomics to such a low without such silliness, so it only seems logical that they would screw up GPS systems as well.
I agree. Having a map to look at has so many advantages over voice-only. As noted, there are many more reasons for a navigation system than just following directions.
P.S. I'm not sure what you like better about the former MDX than the new one? We had our 2005 in for a 37,500 mile service last week and the 2007 we got as a loaner is superior in handling and braking. If they only put a 6-speed manual transmission in it, my wife and I would go for one tomorrow. Still not a fan of Acura's slushy automatic transmissions.
I'm sure you can dial down the level of detail, and turn off the 3D maps.
On my Garmin I prefer 2D maps, and Direction-is-up orientation, whatever they call that.
My 2004 Honda Accord navigation system, and therefore the Acura ones too, are made by Alpine, using NAVTEQ mapping data.
https://store.alpine-usa.com/Hondadvdsales/naviorder.php
https://store.alpine-usa.com/Acuradvdsales/naviorder.php
http://www.navteq.com/
Most newer Audis/VWs and Chryslers are very easily Retrofitted.
Many Mercedes-Benzes are also very easy to retrofit, most of the newer cars all come with the monitor, it's not difficult at all to upgrade to Nav.
Heck, the BMWs are about as involved as it gets and it took a lot less than a day to sort out my 740iL.
It's been a couple of years since I played with a Mercedes Nav system and I thought back then that it was OK, but lacked the ease of use of the Acura. As I recall, it didn't have a touch screen and, as with my Porsche, you had to use a little wheel and scroll through the alphabet to input a destination. Time consuming.
IMO, the Acura "joystick" which allows you to scroll across maps and point and click on a destination is a great function. The Porsche is pitifully lacking in this area, and you have to go through a couple of menus and their wacky phone keys to even attempt it. Of course, driving the 911 is a slightly more impressive experience than driving the TL, so their priorities are different.
P.S. What is the fuel economy of the ML320CDI? Is it as impressive as my marketing director's E320 CDI? She gets 35-37+/- on the highway, at least 25-28+ in mixed/city.
Thanks.
You may be able to buy a buy a bunch of parts and find a dealer willing to retrofit those cars, but Scion and maybe one or two other brands are all that officially support this by listing it as a dealer-installed accessory.
A built-in dock for a portable system would still be best especially for people who are buying an average or lower than average priced typical car and don't want to put thousands of dollars retrofitting something that will return next to nothing at resale a few years later.
The dock would make it easier to use a portable nav in the 90% of new cars that do not offer factory nav at all. In 5 years it could be as common to have a nav docking station as it is to have an AUX input on a new car today.
It would be so cheap and easy for the manufacturers to put the dock (with at least power and ideally both power and audio input) somewhere on the dash and it would at once eliminate the need for suction cup mounts and any "messy wires" showing.
They would have to work with the portable nav manufactures to develop a dock standard, but I'm sure Garmin, Magellan and TomTom would all be willing to work with auto manufacturers so they could sell more of their devices.
There is also another way this could be done, but would not be as cheap and low tech as a simple dock, but very slick.
Bluetooth integration with a compatible stereo. You would have a bluetooth portable nav system that would could put in a console cubby to charge and the stereo would become the nav display, controls and audio source. You would never have to touch the portable unit again.
I think there are some previous posts in this thread that you may want to read. Also, there is a specific Accord navigation thread that should have some answers for you: Accord Navigation
I use my navigation system all the time to find places, even locally. My daughter plays sports so we are always traveling to a school or gym somewhere in the area. I may have a rough idea where the place is but not exactly. When we want to get something to eat, we can punch up the restaurants and find something close.
I'm a map nut and find it very nice to have a "map" open in front of me all the time. It's cool to be driving on the freeway and realize that there is a lake or something just over the hill that I never knew was there. I can even scroll with the joystick to see what is just off the screen... or zoom out to get a bigger picture.
I also use it for places I've been before. Even if I know how to get somewhere on a long trip, I'll punch in the address (I can save it in the address book) so that I have a constant reminder of the miles and time remaining listed on the screen. I also find that I never miss an exit or a turn this way.... I have been daydreaming once or twice and lost track of where I was. :sick:
With addresses saved, I can easily find a place if I'm coming from another direction. I know how to get to my parents' house but they live in another town now. I've been on the road coming from a different location and realized I wasn't sure how to get to their house. I just get their saved address and find my way. The system also has a "Go Home" feature that finds your house the same way.
This is getting long... go read the other posts in the other threads to see how we use it.
As for voice commands, it takes a while to get used to but it works fairly well. It helps if you know the word designations for the letters (a=apple, etc.) I use if for many things now... it also works for AC, radio controls, etc.
Looks like someone is afraid of their AWD competitor, so they're not listed!
That might be common practice because my friend's Acura excludes BMW dealers.
I say this practice is LAME. What if your spouse drops off a car for service, and you need to go pick her up?
You wrote "We would like to travel so it would be nice to have. I like the points of interest habitat mentioned."
That's the beauty of non-OEM portable navigation systems. The Garmin nüvi 350 that we use on my wife's car's dashboard, slips into my shirt pocket when I fly out of town and use rental cars. It contains 6,000,000 to 7,000,000 points of interest (POI) in addition to the mapping program for all of North America, Hawaii and Puerto Rico.
http://tinyurl.com/22zwkg
http://tinyurl.com/3a4g67
$2000 is so ridiculous. It is the same as car manufactures wanting around $1500 or more for DVD rear entertainments systems with either one or two small flip down LCD screens with audio piped through the stereo or some wireless headsets.
You can get a 50" plasma screen for your home now for $1500.
And, no it does not cost more to make the LCD screens smaller to fit in a vehicle.
Nav systems and DVD rear entertainments systems are examples of options that cost the new car buyer a lot of money, but return very little of the extra money in higher resale value and the main reason is because it was overpriced to begin with.
If one car manufacturer stopped trying to price gouge and offered factory navigation for an extra $500 upgrade over the standard stereo system, they would have a huge competetive edge.
How much extra would you pay for one of the early 6" LCD screens that plays VHS tapes? Probably nothing.
Aftermarket 7" in-dash GPS systems start at about $700-800. For $1200-1500 you can get full featured ones with hard drives and more.
Hopefully the OE prices will drop from the $2200 or so they command nowadays. :sick:
I have an older Garmin Handheld CS60 - which is fine if you can devote your attention to the smaller handheld - but when my wife saw a 'huge built-in' Honda NAV screen + Voice recog. she wanted it.....
However 2k+ for a NAV system with 3 year old maps vs a new Nuvi 680 unit that includes real time updates for $640 was a no-brainer. Even my wife likes the Nuvi and I'm more comfortable with their update procedures, cost and the inclusion of bluetooth.
As for usefullness - I used my older CS60 constantly - and we now use the Nuvi as well. We travel 11 months out of the year for softball on the east coast - it's wonderful to not have to download maps each and every time- and the traffic update feature has saved us a few times. High marks for Nuvi's UI/ease of use and the savings from a built-in Honda/Alpine unit.
I was actually talking about in-dash double-DIN sized aftermarket units, though, in my post.
Sienna had a double DIN sized stereo from 2004-2005. In 2006 they changed that, but you can still buy a surround for not much money for the 07-08 models, and go double DIN.
Panasonic and Eclipse make them, for instance, and those are the full 6.5-7" size.
I did what you did, though, and went portable. Today I think I might spring $500 for the 4.3" sized Nuvi someone here got. I should have been more patient and ordered over the web.
A double-din system would be slightly less likely to be stolen because they fit fewer vehicles, but factory stereos are rarely stolen when they only fit one car model.
Aftermarket cars stereos are one of the most common theft items short of a purse left sitting on the front seat.
We used the unit to track down where my sister in law grew up, landmarks,just about anything and everything. The resort we stayed at near Budapest was in the hills, so some of the roads were little 2 lane roads that if I didn't have the Nuvi we would definitely have been lost. One smart thing I did before going was to purchase the detailed maps of Hungary from an authorized company that Garmin referred. The main roads came on the unit, but no detail as I needed so I made the investment.
Two other features were used on the unit as well. The currency converter (how much is 35000 Forints or 10 Euros in US $$) and the measurement converter.
All in all, i would definitely recommend the unit to anyone traveling around North America and Europe. And,as Blane mentioned, the unit slips into a shirt or pants pocket!
Mark
The image is simulated to give you an idea of what it might look like. It's possible it will use Google Maps or Apple's own new map interface.
It would be great if it used Google's database to access POI information over the air instead of relying on static out of date POIs saved on the device.
Who knows? Maybe you will be able sync POI and map updates from your computer with iTunes.
It will eliminate the major complaint of "tiny" screen of most cell-phone based GPS nav systems.
No theft issues from portable GPS systems left in your car since you take it with you everywhere you go which also makes it handy for using as a pedestrian.
Plug it in and pipe the navigation voice instructions and iTunes music through your car stereo.
Would you buy it?
Your asked "Would you buy it?"
Answer: NO.
(Excerpted from a David Pogue column.)
Can it be used with anything but Cingular/at&t? –No.
Is it reasonably priced? -No.
Is it an “unlocked” phone, so I can use it with a carrier other than Cingular/at&t? –No.
Will there be a non-Cingular/at&t version? –Not within the first two years.
Can I put a T-Mobile (or ANY other international brand of) SIM card in it instead of Cingular/at&t? –No.
But what if I keep asking? Then will it be available beyond Cingular/at&t? –No.
Can it run Mac OS X programs? –No.
Can I add new programs to it? –No. Apple wants to control the look and feel and behavior of every aspect of the phone.
Does it run programs from Palm, Symbian, Windows? –No.
Does it connect to iChat? –No.
Does it have games? –No.
Is it ambidextrous? –No.
Does it have GPS? –No.
Voice recognition? Voice dialing? Voice memos? –No.
Does it get onto the HSDPA (3G) high-speed Internet network that Cingular/at&t has rolled out in a few cities? –No.
Does the Web browser support Flash or Java? –No.
Can you change the battery yourself? –No. You’ll have to send the phone in to Apple for battery replacement.
Can it open Word and Excel documents? –No.
Are there any speed-dial keys? -No.
Can I make a call while driving a car? –Not as easily as on a regular cellphone with programmed speed-dial keys.
Does the camera record video? –No.
Is there a Verizon version? –NO.
Will it sync with Outlook? –No.
Won’t the screen get smudgy? –It does.
Want a few dozen more reasons?
Several of those features will be added on the new version and if you already have or plan move to AT&T, others are moot.
Obviously GPS will be included and 3G is also coming.
They will not announce features or release date in advance, but it would make sense that many of the most wanted features will be added in a redesigned version in 2008.
There is a 5 year exclusivity deal with AT&T and if it there was a Verizon version, many of those features listed would be turned off/crippled by Verizon (as is their common practice).
The idea a phone/GPS in this form factor looks good. Maybe Garmin and a phone manufacturer like Motorola or Nokia will partner and make a copycat big touchschreen phone.
If you eliminate the "only works on AT&T and Cingular" complaint there are about 3 left.
Every screen smudges. Duh. That's lame.
The price just dropped significantly.
I'm not sure I even understand the ambidextrous question. The interface is so simple you can easily use it with either hand, or a stylus. The stylus would also keep the screen clean.
Change the battery - same criticism came with the iPod came out, yet aftermarket vendors offer tham and instructions were easily found on the internet. This is just plain wrong. I'm certain someone will come out with replacement batteries.
That's like saying you have to go back to an authorized car dealer to change your oil. Pure stupidity.
Who needs speed dial when the interface is better? You have to change the way you think.
Sounds like David got up on the wrong side of the bed. Funny thing is I'm not even an iPhone fan.
For me, the deal killer is that you cannot use it as a laptop modem, like I can with my BlackBerry. I get free internet anywhere I have a GPRS signal, at speeds of 110kbps. Not that fast, but a whole lot faster than dial-up and totally free.
We own a 2nd property and get a good signal there, so I don't have to pay for a land line there. No phone, no internet, all free with my BBerry. :shades:
Re "Change the battery - same criticism came with the iPod came out, yet aftermarket vendors offer tham and instructions were easily found on the internet. This is just plain wrong. I'm certain someone will come out with replacement batteries."
It's worse than that. Apparently the iPhone battery is of some complex molded to the phone's innards nature. No way any independent manufacturer would bother. By the way, when a battery does need replacement, you will have to mail the phone to Apple and be without it for a week. Apparently they plan to give you a loaner though.
I'll stick with a dedicated navigation system and a separate dedicated instrument to use for making and receiving phone calls (my cellular phone) without the power-draining bells and whistles.
In my home country, Brazil, did you know that the average person replaces his/her cell phone 3 times per year?
Talk about gadget crazy.
Battery life is just not an issue for them.
As for the differences between the 370 and 770 it appears the main differences are: 770 is bigger screen with higher resolution; it stores up to 10 routes; has MSN Direct; and has FM transmitter for directions and music to come over your car stereo. They both have the same maps. If I had to choose between the 2 I would go for the 370 since it will fit in a shirt pocket, and it is approximately $400 less.
Mark