A little bit of common sense- I would think that if the GPS told me to turn right, it is either right before, or after the tracks, not on to them.
We go to a little B&B in Spring Lake that the turn off is right after NJ Transit Train tracks so I can understand the confusion a tiny bit, but come on!
Manipulating in-dash navi's software is more rumor than fact. I did research on it when trying to improve an Acura TL's navi and most results (at best) were just cheap "script kiddie" tricks passed along that don't really do anything.... As time passes, I'm sure there will be more developing for modifying in-dash navi's. If anybody has any info on MAJOR mods on an Acura TL's Alpine system, I'd love to know.... more detail in the mapping would be fantastic, but I doubt it exists.
I just called my mom to rehear the family story about the time my father drove his sister to Alexandria from S. Mississippi one weekend shortly after WWII, He wound up turning onto what he thought was a downtown street in Birmingham in broad daylight. Luckily there weren't any trains around.
Family history also holds that he got stuck going round and round Dupont Circle a few times trying to get out of the District on that same trip.
Note the article merely said the GPS told him to turn right, that's false, the GPS would have said something like "turn right in 300 feet on Main Street".
I remember my rental in Vegas had nav, not the OEM unit but some weird model offered by Hertz...I preferred to leave it off and just find my own way, but a passenger had to play with it...it wanted me to turn left into a barrier dividing a road...must have been built after the nav was last updated.
Oh, I am not excusing him, he's certainly 100% at fault, but I can see it being a factor....there are a lot of 'fresh off the boat' (not meant with much malice) drivers as I call them here...and I could see it happenig to them too.
POI's in both factory and portable nav systems have stale and static POI databases that are often out of date on the day of release and continue to get worse and worse each day after. They should allow updating over either something like XM satellite, FM radio data broadcast or a cell phone internet connection so when you search for the nearest restaurants, and other POI, you are getting what's there now, not what was there a year or two ago. I have tried some cell phone based nav services like Telenav that keeps the POI database on their server, but they do not seem to update their database all frequently , so those can also have POI listings that are quite old and incomplete. It would be great if Google Maps offered a full turn by turn nav system and offered their local listings service to nav makers.
You can get live traffic from XM and Traffic Message Channel, so why not live search from Google or Microsoft?
I haven't heard of any other nav system with dynamic POIs, but this has to be the future. Updating the POI database on a DVD every year or every other year is very inadequate the way businesses and especially restaurants come and go.
They could actually take this further and tie it to GOOG411
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cN0q8SvlQAk so you can search by voice and and have the address sent to your phone and then beamed to the nav via bluetooth. To make it even easier, so you don't even have to say your location, your location info could be sent via bluetooth to your cell phone, then over the internet to Google. They just need to be a bit more innovative and tie these already-existing technologies together.
It looks good, but I'd like to see one of the more mainstream brands like Garmin make a similar device. This makes more sense than only having a static database that's partially out of date the first day it hits the shelves.
You would have to use it a lot to justify $10 -$13 per month for just POI service. The coverage is quite limited in much of the USA. I wonder who they are using for cellular Internet service.
It includes updating the maps too, so you never have buy updated maps. For people who don't have a data plan $10-$13 a month is cheaper than adding a data plan to their phone contract, however, I already have a data plan I use for e-mail and web, so I wish it could use my existing connection I'm already paying for and Dash lowers the fees. I probably won't use them because I'm already paying $19.99 for data and I don't want to pay another $10-$13 for another connection just for a GPS.
I just got a Garmin update for $75. So it's $75 about every 18 months, or $60/year, so $5 a month.
$10-13/month is a bit high, but I might consider it. Especially if it includes every GPS unit in your household (we own 2).
FWIW, the maps aren't as bad as you make them sound. Roads don't change that often. I guess new housing developments pop up, but even then, you'll find most places you need, and can find the nearest intersection if it's a brand new house not yet mapped on your unit.
Updating the maps and POIs only once every 18 months isn't very good. I certainly hope they update much more often than Garmin release updates. $60 a year when you are not even getting an update once year. If Dash updates constatly or even every 6 months instead of every 18 months then the $5 comparison doesn't work since you would be getting more updates. The POIs would updated daily since they are live from Yahoo!.
"Updating the maps and POIs only once every 18 months isn't very good."
I do not agree. When I updated my 2004 Accord's 2003 maps to the latest version in December, I found very few noticeable differences in my everyday driving in the metropolitan NY / NJ area. Sure, there are many other changes for other geographical areas on the DVD, but most people won't find much of a difference unless they are in newly built neighborhoods.
"...The POIs would updated daily since they are live from Yahoo!"
I again do not agree. Anything that Yahoo!, or any other service, might be carrying would have to be based upon VERIFIED updates that the mapping companies (NAVTEQ or TeleAtlas) publish and sell to the services. That doesn't happen without the mapping companies' crews driving on the actual streets. That process takes years since there are small numbers of fully equipped crews available and millions of miles of roads to be driven.
It is separate from the map data. There is no way the mapping service is going to drive around and verify the Yahoo! POI address data or it would be too slow to update and would be pointless to be a "live" service. The point of it is that you connect live to Yahoo!'s servers and get up to the minute data, not old data that has been archived by the map service. The phone numbers will be included in the POIs so you can call to verify the address before driving to the location if you wish.
Well, I just loaded the Map Update 2008 for my Garmin.
I did add a new street for a friend's house that had just been built, new development. But that was the only address out of my 100 or so Favorites that needed updating.
I'll have to see how the POIs are, if they're more accurate. The v8 maps were poor between the Chesapeake Bay Bridge to the east coast. Some McDonalds were missing that had been there for years, decades even. Specifically the one on Rt. 13 and 404 in Deleware.
The City Select v8 was also missing two Shell stations on my way to the beach from the capital area. One just east of the Bay Bridge, and another on Rt. 113 near 404.
In fact let me try to find them and I'll post again shortly...
The Thompson Creek Shell just east of Rt. 50 is there. Cool. Score one for 2008 maps.
The McDonalds at the intersection of Rt. 404 and Rt. 13 in Deleware is not there.
WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU CITY NAVIGATOR NORTH AMERICA NT 2008?!
Sheesh, that McDonalds has been there for DECADES! Literally. Decades. It's right next to an Amoco and a Royal Farms. The Amoco is not listed either. :sick:
Looking further, the McDonald's just south of the intersection of Rt. 404 and Rt. 113 is also MIA.
Do the map folks have something against McDonald's? Are they owned by Wendy's?
I can't think of a more visible point-of-interest.
So out of the 4 things it could not find before, in v8 of the maps, it fixed 2 but still misses 2 others.
We have 2 units, and a friend expressed an interest in maybe buying one of our used ones.
If I do that, I would buy the 200W instead of buying map updates for the old one. It would cost me $200 instead of $75, but I'd end up with a bigger screen. Plus whatever my friend agrees to pay for the used one.
So, how is the 200W? It would replace a StreetPilot c320.
I just bought one last week and I really like it this far. However, it is my first nav unit, so I really have nothing to compare it to. From the bit of research that I did, and my own experience, it is sometimes slow to acquire satellites.
It also does not come with an A/C charger and the only mount provided is a windshield suction cup. It also does not "speak" street names, just turn left in 200 feet sort of thing. But the name of the street is on the display and I haven't found that to be a problem. Also, no Canada maps... but I have no plans to go there any time soon.
It has a pedestrian mode and a GPS mode (enter coordinates), but I have not yet used either.
I don't think I've ever used the AC charger. So don't care about that. I use the car charger.
I use the suction cup now, so that's fine.
Satellite acquisition is likely the same on the c3xx series. I think only the c5xx got the new, quicker technology for that.
No street names, hmm. My c340 has that, but technically I'm replacing the c320, which also does not speak street names. So it's still an upgrade on the screen size, plus new maps.
OK, what do they mean by "regional" for the maps? Is it not pre-loaded with the whole country? The 250W says "Yes" for preloaded maps, the 200W says "Yes (regional)"? What's the difference?
From the Garmin site: "This stylish navigator and travel companion comes with preloaded maps for the lower 48 states, Hawaii and Puerto Rico or regional coverage in other areas."
Suction mounts are OK because you can just buy one of these weighted platforms and suction the GPS to it instead of the windshield. It works great and doesn't slide around,
WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU CITY NAVIGATOR NORTH AMERICA NT 2008?!
Have you ever sent corrections to the people that do the mapping and POI? I have sent corrections to the people on the Big Island that put out the Map Books. They used them on the next printing. They did thank me, but did not send a complimentary updated book. Some things can slip through the cracks and not get caught unless they know about them. Who knows you may get a free update for letting them know.
What surprises me is how long those places have been there, and still nothing fixed. Google Maps and Mapquest have them, for instance, and those are free!
Update: I need more info. It won't take Rt. 13 and Rt. 404, Deleware. I'm sure those roads have local names that I don't know.
Next time I drive by those places I'll save them and capture the latitude and longitude, so I can give them enough detail.
I'm tracking the shipment with UPS and it's already arrived locally, should come in the UPS truck today. Can't wait to try it out.
I've been suffering from a bit of GPS withdrawal. I sold my c320 before I got its replacement, so I've been Nav-less. It's funny how used to having one you become.
I'm hoping the bigger screen helps since it'll go in my big Sienna. The unit is farther away than it was when I had it in my Forester. I'm hoping the sound quality is as good, so that's one concern.
My 200W sounds fine to me. I usually leave the volume set at 70% in my Tacoma. I'm sure that your Sienna is quieter unless you crank up the tunes or your kids play their DVDs at high volumes.
Your Sienna probably has a more steeply raked windshield than an old Tacoma, so your unit will be farther away if mounted on the lower portion. Some vehicles would be an impossible reach: think the old GM "dustbuster" minivans. :P
So true! Try cleaning those windows on a dustbuster. We rented one.
I actually use the provided disk with the two-side tape, so mine is mounted just above the stereo. It was the only flat surface on that dash, yet the position is pretty good and doesn't block the forward view at all because it's low.
It's still farther away from my eyes, but the bigger screen should help.
It's a cell phone with locally stored maps so it can route you without cell coverage, but you still have access to Google POIs when you do have coverage. Plays MP3, has 3G data, camera, WIFI, bluetooth etc. etc.
Should I register it and download updates? More "car" designs?
Where's the Australian English voice? Does it not have it?
Quick impressions so far, pro:
* screen is huge * screen is bright, great contrast, love it! * worked perfectly right out of the box * incredible for the $199 price (free shipping) * arrow replaced by a car icon * lighter, smaller, thinner, even the dock base is smaller
con:
* sound is tinny, volume is loud enough, but it sounds tinny * more layers on the menu: where to, POI, food (added one step) * no Australian English pre-loaded * to undock, you have to manually remove the charger plug * a bit harder to adjust the volume while in use
Can I add languages? It has Brazilian Portuguese, so that's strange.
The speaker is on the back, plus it looks like it's not stereo, so I know what people meant by the sound not being as good. The c series has 2 speakers and they're on the sides, so it sounds better, without a doubt. This is OK: I can still hear it loud and clear, just the sound quality gets a C+ instead of a A- for the c series.
The layers on the menu are OK, I suppose, given it has more features, like a photo slideshow. I'm sure a lot more, which I will explore soon. Any "you gotta see this" items for me to check out?
Overall, I'm happy. You can see where they cut costs to reach a price point, but the only thing I'll ever notice is the drop in sound quality. I'm hoping the Australian lass fixed that somewhat.
Comments
We go to a little B&B in Spring Lake that the turn off is right after NJ Transit Train tracks so I can understand the confusion a tiny bit, but come on!
Mark
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Family history also holds that he got stuck going round and round Dupont Circle a few times trying to get out of the District on that same trip.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
ateixeira, "Crossover SUV Comparison" #4827, 4 Jan 2008 8:17 am
Note the article merely said the GPS told him to turn right, that's false, the GPS would have said something like "turn right in 300 feet on Main Street".
100% driver error. His license should be revoked.
If the GPS says turn left, and a pedestrian is there, should be run over the pedestrian and blame the GPS?
The guy should not be driving.
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I remember my rental in Vegas had nav, not the OEM unit but some weird model offered by Hertz...I preferred to leave it off and just find my own way, but a passenger had to play with it...it wanted me to turn left into a barrier dividing a road...must have been built after the nav was last updated.
Clearly he was driving too fast for conditions, made a wrong turn, and blamed the GPS for it all.
I rented one in Florida last October and they offered to help me, though I was already familiar with Garmins.
They should allow updating over either something like XM satellite, FM radio data broadcast or a cell phone internet connection so when you search for the nearest restaurants, and other POI, you are getting what's there now, not what was there a year or two ago.
I have tried some cell phone based nav services like Telenav that keeps the POI database on their server, but they do not seem to update their database all frequently , so those can also have POI listings that are quite old and incomplete.
It would be great if Google Maps offered a full turn by turn nav system and offered their local listings service to nav makers.
You can get live traffic from XM and Traffic Message Channel, so why not live search from Google or Microsoft?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nNOBB41xdA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQuq9Lzm5y8
Other car makers and Garmin need to follow suit.
I suppose they could charge a monthly fee or else make it free and send you sponsored ads with the information.
Does Pioneer offer a dynamic POI with their NAV? I know they have XM integration for traffic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nNOBB41xdA
I haven't heard of any other nav system with dynamic POIs, but this has to be the future. Updating the POI database on a DVD every year or every other year is very inadequate the way businesses and especially restaurants come and go.
They could actually take this further and tie it to GOOG411
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cN0q8SvlQAk so you can search by voice and and have the address sent to your phone and then beamed to the nav via bluetooth. To make it even easier, so you don't even have to say your location, your location info could be sent via bluetooth to your cell phone, then over the internet to Google.
They just need to be a bit more innovative and tie these already-existing technologies together.
http://dash.net/product.php
It looks good, but I'd like to see one of the more mainstream brands like Garmin make a similar device.
This makes more sense than only having a static database that's partially out of date the first day it hits the shelves.
Here is a Youtube video demo
I probably won't use them because I'm already paying $19.99 for data and I don't want to pay another $10-$13 for another connection just for a GPS.
$10-13/month is a bit high, but I might consider it. Especially if it includes every GPS unit in your household (we own 2).
FWIW, the maps aren't as bad as you make them sound. Roads don't change that often. I guess new housing developments pop up, but even then, you'll find most places you need, and can find the nearest intersection if it's a brand new house not yet mapped on your unit.
If Dash updates constatly or even every 6 months instead of every 18 months then the $5 comparison doesn't work since you would be getting more updates. The POIs would updated daily since they are live from Yahoo!.
I do not agree. When I updated my 2004 Accord's 2003 maps to the latest version in December, I found very few noticeable differences in my everyday driving in the metropolitan NY / NJ area. Sure, there are many other changes for other geographical areas on the DVD, but most people won't find much of a difference unless they are in newly built neighborhoods.
"...The POIs would updated daily since they are live from Yahoo!"
I again do not agree. Anything that Yahoo!, or any other service, might be carrying would have to be based upon VERIFIED updates that the mapping companies (NAVTEQ or TeleAtlas) publish and sell to the services. That doesn't happen without the mapping companies' crews driving on the actual streets. That process takes years since there are small numbers of fully equipped crews available and millions of miles of roads to be driven.
The phone numbers will be included in the POIs so you can call to verify the address before driving to the location if you wish.
I did add a new street for a friend's house that had just been built, new development. But that was the only address out of my 100 or so Favorites that needed updating.
I'll have to see how the POIs are, if they're more accurate. The v8 maps were poor between the Chesapeake Bay Bridge to the east coast. Some McDonalds were missing that had been there for years, decades even. Specifically the one on Rt. 13 and 404 in Deleware.
The City Select v8 was also missing two Shell stations on my way to the beach from the capital area. One just east of the Bay Bridge, and another on Rt. 113 near 404.
In fact let me try to find them and I'll post again shortly...
If it fixes all of those, it was worth it.
The Thompson Creek Shell just east of Rt. 50 is there. Cool. Score one for 2008 maps.
The McDonalds at the intersection of Rt. 404 and Rt. 13 in Deleware is not there.
WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU CITY NAVIGATOR NORTH AMERICA NT 2008?!
Sheesh, that McDonalds has been there for DECADES! Literally. Decades. It's right next to an Amoco and a Royal Farms. The Amoco is not listed either. :sick:
Looking further, the McDonald's just south of the intersection of Rt. 404 and Rt. 113 is also MIA.
Do the map folks have something against McDonald's? Are they owned by Wendy's?
I can't think of a more visible point-of-interest.
So out of the 4 things it could not find before, in v8 of the maps, it fixed 2 but still misses 2 others.
Costco has it on sale for $200.
We have 2 units, and a friend expressed an interest in maybe buying one of our used ones.
If I do that, I would buy the 200W instead of buying map updates for the old one. It would cost me $200 instead of $75, but I'd end up with a bigger screen. Plus whatever my friend agrees to pay for the used one.
So, how is the 200W? It would replace a StreetPilot c320.
It also does not come with an A/C charger and the only mount provided is a windshield suction cup. It also does not "speak" street names, just turn left in 200 feet sort of thing. But the name of the street is on the display and I haven't found that to be a problem. Also, no Canada maps... but I have no plans to go there any time soon.
It has a pedestrian mode and a GPS mode (enter coordinates), but I have not yet used either.
I like it.
james
Let me see...
I don't think I've ever used the AC charger. So don't care about that. I use the car charger.
I use the suction cup now, so that's fine.
Satellite acquisition is likely the same on the c3xx series. I think only the c5xx got the new, quicker technology for that.
No street names, hmm. My c340 has that, but technically I'm replacing the c320, which also does not speak street names. So it's still an upgrade on the screen size, plus new maps.
I'll check out the specs on the Garmin site, too.
Glad you like it.
Would it have MD and AZ? We do travel with ours.
From the Garmin site:
"This stylish navigator and travel companion comes with preloaded maps for the lower 48 states, Hawaii and Puerto Rico or regional coverage in other areas."
200W
Maybe regional Mexico? - james
Here's a review of the 250W:
http://www.gpsmagazine.com/2007/06/garmin_nuvi_250w_review.php
The 200W is a somewhat decontented varient.
Of course I'd still think twice about the lack of Text To Speech.
It works great and doesn't slide around,
Have you ever sent corrections to the people that do the mapping and POI? I have sent corrections to the people on the Big Island that put out the Map Books. They used them on the next printing. They did thank me, but did not send a complimentary updated book. Some things can slip through the cracks and not get caught unless they know about them. Who knows you may get a free update for letting them know.
Have you reported your findings to NAVTEQ here?
http://mapreporter.navteq.com/dur-web-external/secured/submitDur.do?userType=CON- SUMER&language=en
Don't expect a fast response, but your input MAY make it into a future update.
http://reviews.cnet.com/Garmin_Nuvi_880/4660-13855_7-6826262.html
http://video.gearlive.com/video/article/q108-ces-2008-video-garmin-nuvi-880-gps/-
I have TTS on my c340 but I gave that to my wife because she needs more help than I do.
I'll be OK with the 200W. At that price, I'll sell it in a couple of years and upgrade again. Can't believe it's under $200 for a widescreen!
What surprises me is how long those places have been there, and still nothing fixed. Google Maps and Mapquest have them, for instance, and those are free!
Update: I need more info. It won't take Rt. 13 and Rt. 404, Deleware. I'm sure those roads have local names that I don't know.
Next time I drive by those places I'll save them and capture the latitude and longitude, so I can give them enough detail.
I've been suffering from a bit of GPS withdrawal. I sold my c320 before I got its replacement, so I've been Nav-less. It's funny how used to having one you become.
I'm hoping the bigger screen helps since it'll go in my big Sienna. The unit is farther away than it was when I had it in my Forester. I'm hoping the sound quality is as good, so that's one concern.
My 200W sounds fine to me. I usually leave the volume set at 70% in my Tacoma. I'm sure that your Sienna is quieter unless you crank up the tunes or your kids play their DVDs at high volumes.
Your Sienna probably has a more steeply raked windshield than an old Tacoma, so your unit will be farther away if mounted on the lower portion. Some vehicles would be an impossible reach: think the old GM "dustbuster" minivans. :P
james
I actually use the provided disk with the two-side tape, so mine is mounted just above the stereo. It was the only flat surface on that dash, yet the position is pretty good and doesn't block the forward view at all because it's low.
It's still farther away from my eyes, but the bigger screen should help.
Can't wait!
Plays MP3, has 3G data, camera, WIFI, bluetooth etc. etc.
Should be selling by fall.
http://www8.garmin.com/nuvifone/
http://www8.garmin.com/nuvifone/
And hopefully it won't be anchored to AT&T like the iPhone is (CR rated AT&T last among the 4 biggest carriers in the DC area, where I work).
I love the idea of convergence - one device that keeps doing more and more things.
It's late for me, but maybe when my wife is ready for her next GPS...
Wonder what carriers will offer it? Hopefully T-Mobile or Sprint.
PS It sounds so much like "movie phone" I had to read it a couple of times.
Should I register it and download updates? More "car" designs?
Where's the Australian English voice? Does it not have it?
Quick impressions so far, pro:
* screen is huge
* screen is bright, great contrast, love it!
* worked perfectly right out of the box
* incredible for the $199 price (free shipping)
* arrow replaced by a car icon
* lighter, smaller, thinner, even the dock base is smaller
con:
* sound is tinny, volume is loud enough, but it sounds tinny
* more layers on the menu: where to, POI, food (added one step)
* no Australian English pre-loaded
* to undock, you have to manually remove the charger plug
* a bit harder to adjust the volume while in use
Can I add languages? It has Brazilian Portuguese, so that's strange.
The speaker is on the back, plus it looks like it's not stereo, so I know what people meant by the sound not being as good. The c series has 2 speakers and they're on the sides, so it sounds better, without a doubt. This is OK: I can still hear it loud and clear, just the sound quality gets a C+ instead of a A- for the c series.
The layers on the menu are OK, I suppose, given it has more features, like a photo slideshow. I'm sure a lot more, which I will explore soon. Any "you gotta see this" items for me to check out?
Overall, I'm happy. You can see where they cut costs to reach a price point, but the only thing I'll ever notice is the drop in sound quality. I'm hoping the Australian lass fixed that somewhat.
If I can't run it, to manually do the route do I pick my final destination and just keep adding viapoints until everything is there?
THanks,
Mark