3 years / $5000. What to buy?

kibu

Hi amazing people, I am ready to buy my first car and I'd love your help!

Next month I am moving from NYC to Jersey for a new job. I intend to have this job about 2-3 years since I am ambitious (promotion/different job) and it is taxing, but fun. After that I am planning to move back to the city. So I am thinking I need a car for 2 to 3 years.

My total car budget target for three years is around $5000, this includes car cost + taxes/title/registration + maintenance, but excludes gas & insurance. Do you think this is doable?

I do not care what my car looks like, only about reliability and mileage. Except I do not want a Smart Car.

Leasing:
I have found that leasing is out of the question for now, the cheapest overall lease cost I have found was about ~$7000.

Buying:
Two options:
1. Buying a more expensive car and selling it at the end of the period
+ Newer car, will break down less
+ Potentially (much) better MPG (money-saving)
- At end of period, I will not have a car
- Bigger purchase or open a loan
- Having to sell the car at end of period
2. Buying an older car around 2-3K and saving the rest for maintenance
+ End of period I still have a car if needed, or I can sell it
+ Cheap initial investment, no loan needed
- Breaks down more often
- Less MPG

These are the pro's and cons I have thought of so far. Have I missed something here?

I'd love your opinion on what would be a good route and / or buy for me?

Thanks in advance!

Michaell

kibu said:

Hi amazing people, I am ready to buy my first car and I'd love your help!

Next month I am moving from NYC to Jersey for a new job. I intend to have this job about 2-3 years since I am ambitious (promotion/different job) and it is taxing, but fun. After that I am planning to move back to the city. So I am thinking I need a car for 2 to 3 years.

My total car budget target for three years is around $5000, this includes car cost + taxes/title/registration + maintenance, but excludes gas & insurance. Do you think this is doable?

I do not care what my car looks like, only about reliability and mileage. Except I do not want a Smart Car.

Leasing:
I have found that leasing is out of the question for now, the cheapest overall lease cost I have found was about ~$7000.

Buying:
Two options:
1. Buying a more expensive car and selling it at the end of the period
+ Newer car, will break down less
+ Potentially (much) better MPG (money-saving)
- At end of period, I will not have a car
- Bigger purchase or open a loan
- Having to sell the car at end of period
2. Buying an older car around 2-3K and saving the rest for maintenance
+ End of period I still have a car if needed, or I can sell it
+ Cheap initial investment, no loan needed
- Breaks down more often
- Less MPG

These are the pro's and cons I have thought of so far. Have I missed something here?

I'd love your opinion on what would be a good route and / or buy for me?

Thanks in advance!

I think there is a third option ... buying a car that is 2-3 years old and selling it at the end of the period.

A used Honda or Toyota will be quite reliable and hold its value well.

I've asked for others to come over and share their opinions as well - you may be asked additional questions, so stick around!

qbrozen

michaell, I think your option 3 and the OP's option 1 are the same thing.

$5k over 3 years is, IMHO, not something you can count on. It can and has been done, but there are no guarantees. You have to get a good deal to begin with and get lucky at sale time. Do you yet know how many miles you will be driving?

suydam

An older Buick should hold up well, be cheap to maintain, and easy to sell later.

stickguy

Buying a cheap car sounds good in concept. In reality, much harder to do. You can buy them, but odds of getting 3 reliable, cheap years out of one are not great

Me, I would stretch budget to $200 and get a cheap sign and drive all-in lease. Cost certainty, no cash outlay, no dealing with repairs.

Next best is finding something basic and not too old (say a 2010) for about 10k, and selling at the end. Higher monthly cost, but may be lower over 3 years with resale

nyccarguy

Fit.

kibu

Thanks for all your answers!

First of all: the amount of miles I'll drive will be between 5-8k, since my commute is only 5 miles one-way.

Michaell: Yes, that was was option #1 and still very possible. Like Stickguy mentioned, I actually was looking earlier at a Nissan Altima 2010 with 50k miles on it at a very reputable dealer for $8500 (so $10k all included). If in good working order, that might have been a deal I should have grabbed? Selling it 3y later with +20k miles for about $5000.

I find this kind of fun, finding a good deal. Here is another idea: buying and selling a used Prius with 150k miles. I hear they are very reliable. Say I can buy one for $10k all included (tax too), would I be able to flip it for $5K after 20k miles / 3 years?

stickguy

Thatvaltima seems like a good deal, and fits the profile.

suydam

Do you have a budget you can stretch? Not everyone does. It's important you have enough to live on aside from the car. If not, an older Buick Century or Chevy Cruze will cost less and you will also be able to get a newer one with less miles than you would a Toyota or Honda. If you get it thoroughly checked out by a mechanic first it should be fine for 3 years and not a lot of driving.

kibu

suydam said:

Do you have a budget you can stretch? Not everyone does. It's important you have enough to live on aside from the car. If not, an older Buick Century or Chevy Cruze will cost less and you will also be able to get a newer one with less miles than you would a Toyota or Honda. If you get it thoroughly checked out by a mechanic first it should be fine for 3 years and not a lot of driving.

Stretching a budget can make any option work but first I'd like to work with the $5000, 3 year model, since although I have some savings, I can spend the following per month:
Car cost & maintenance: $140 ( *36 = ~$5000)
Gas: $60
Tolls: $70
Insurance: $100

You mentioned a Century, do you mean something like this 2003 model for $2500??

The cheapest Chevy Cruze I could find was a 2011 for $8000 on craigslist..

kibu

Also, what about one of these two? 3 years later with an extra 20k miles on it I should be able to flip those for about $5000, right?

suydam

Yes, Cruze was only made starting 2011. The good thing about the Century and LeSabre is that they were often owned by people who didn't drive them much. I think '05 was their last year so I'd look for one of those. Again, pay a mechanic to check them well if you go that route.

kibu

suydam said:

Yes, Cruze was only made starting 2011. The good thing about the Century and LeSabre is that they were often owned by people who didn't drive them much. I think '05 was their last year so I'd look for one of those. Again, pay a mechanic to check them well if you go that route.

Great! Although '05 was their last year, are parts still easy to get?

You seem very knowledgable, do you like any of the 2 models listed in the picture from my previous post?

suydam

I am not that knowledgable, just have 3 kids now grown up and a lot of experience with buying older used cars. If you have 10k to spend I would definitely try for an older Camry or Corolla but they will be hard to find without a lot of miles on them. The Corolla above sounds good -- if it checks out well!

stickguy

The Sentra is not a bad looking deal. If clean, you won't lose much.

Keep in mind that your monthly payment will be well over $140. $10,000 over 3 years is going to be at least $300/month. Sure you cash out at the end, but still need to pay for it up front.

kibu

Thanks, well I am 27 years old and have no experience, so to me you are pretty knowledgable

About the corolla or sentra, I don't have 10K to spend but with a car loan I'd be making monthly payments (5/6y loan) and by selling it after 3 years for $5K I would be able to pay off that loan instantly, at least that would be the plan.

So it seems I have a couple routes I can go. Buy a Buick Century low mileage for cheap, get a 2007-2010 Corolla and sell it later. What about getting a Prius for ~$10K / 150K miles? The resale value of those seem to be great, or is this too much of a gamble at such high mileage?

stever

The iffy factor on the Prius is the life of the battery pack. Expensive fix, although you can just replace cells.

But with any car with that many miles, you may experience an expensive transmission or engine repair. Kind of the luck of the draw. I'm driving an '09 minivan with 146k that I picked up last year with 125k on it. Even then, it cost me $10,500. Fortunately (touch wood), I've only had to do a brake job on it to date.

Friend of mine just got an '03 F-150 to drive north and then flip. Lots of miles, and it cost him $4,500. The pre-purchase inspection went okay, but he still dumped $1,100 into it immediately to fix a worn steering pitman and do the fluids and some other odds and ends.

Cars aren't cheap any way you cut it.

kyfdx

Rather than buy an $8K car, with no guarantee that you won't have major repairs, I'd lease a Civic for $200/mo. and fix my costs at $7200 for depreciation and finance charges for three years..

stickguy

I would stay away from super high miles like that. May also have a problem getting a 6 year loan on a 6+ YO car.

That century looks ok but definitely need something like that checked over first. Not that easy on a cheap private sale in my experience.

qbrozen

I'd be avoiding Buicks. They are good buys used because they depreciate steeply. That depreciation doesn't suddenly halt once the 2nd buyer picks it up.

So you are looking at only putting on 20k. That's a good thing, but doesn't necessarily matter with certain makes. Let's say, for instance, you buy a 7-yr-old Buick with low miles. When you are done, it will be a decade old. The only people who seem to not worry about 10 years on a car are buyers of Civics and Corollas. I think that Corolla you posted has a pretty good chance of meeting your needs.

HOWEVER, buying from a dealer and then selling it privately is going to eat into your pocket as it is. For example, that $8500 dealer price is fair enough for a dealer. That same car would be more like $7500 private party.

kibu

Again, thanks for all the great info, I am definitely learning here!

It seems that in a way, buying a car is always a gamble. You can be lucky and drive 200,000 miles without any major repair or unlucky and be doing major repairs every 30k miles. So, it just becomes question of how to minimize this risk the most.

I am leaning towards an older generally reliable car buy, such as the Buick Century mentioned earlier, with <100K on it and having it thoroughly inspected by an independent mechanic first - which should be able to spot any major repairs, right? Fuel efficiency wouldn't be great, but with a purchase cost of max $3000, I would have $2000 to spend on any repairs that come up in the next 3 years. And potentially the biggest advantage is that in 3 years, I still have a car left... OR I sell it again for some extra cash.

Feel free to disagree here of course, and please tell me why.

Suydam already mentioned the Century. Given these parameters, which other cars would you recommend me looking at?

I am seeing that Civics & Corolla's in my price range all have >120K miles on them...

stickguy

your plan can work out fine. It will of course take a certain amount of luck that you get a trouble free car. Having it professionally inspected will be important, but that is still no guarantee.

as you have figured out, Honda's and Toyota's fetch premium prices. Even well used ones. But, there are plenty of other good cars.

rule of thumb in the cheap range is maintenance and condition is more important than the brand. A babied Nissan is a better bet than a neglected honda. Domestics also tend to be cheaper and while not always pretty, generally durable.

that Buick or similar is worth looking at. A midsize Pontiac. Saturns. Maybe a Focus. Sentra/ early Fusion. Kias and Hyundais.

Speaking from experience, the 3k and below bottom-end of the market is a tough place. Lot's of iffy stuff (and shady people!), and ulta competitive. when a good unit shows up, it goes fast (get there early with cash in hand). Also largely private sellers.

here's one that could be OK.

https://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5009433553.html

Found one at a place near me (south Jersey). They specialize in high end stuff, but occasionally have something cheaper move through (and fast!). This looks about as good as you are going to get for 2K!

http://www.royaleasing.com/detail-2000-ford-focus-se-used-13552368.html

kibu

stickguy said:

........

Thanks Stickguy. The Ford Focus does look good! It is a 15 year old car with 180K miles though, but you're saying looking at the maintenance records and having a mechanic look at it would be more important than the numbers.

stickguy

oops. misread the miles. I thought it was 108,000.

but yeah, that is what you get for the money.

kibu

What do you think of this 2002 Sentra , this 2001 Ford Taurus or this 2002 Taurus SES?

qbrozen

private party, 2002 or up Protege. That's your best bet if you are going to attempt the cash route at this pricepoint.

Here's an example.

stickguy

the Sentra looks like it could be a decent option. Assuming you want to drive a 13 YO car with crank it yourself windows. Some people like the taurus, and they can come cheap. Not my cup of tea.

kibu

That Mazda Protege actually looks pretty good. Yeah, now it's going to be a matter of preference. Thank you all for the awesome info so far, I really appreciate it.

Last question: The 2007 Corolla LE I posted earlier, with 48K miles on it for (all-in) $10K financed. In terms of reliability & resale value, would you consider that a good buy personally?

And what about Sentra 2010 with 54K miles for the same price?

stickguy

either one should be a good bet to be reliable, and hold value. at some point it becomes personal preference (do you actually like the car?). Corollas always sell, but it will be 11 YO in 3 years. The 3 models years on the Nissam make a difference. It also looks to have a few more modern amenities (like an aux input jack). A good bet to give you 3 years/20K relatively trouble-free miles (but no guarantees of course).

kibu

I actually found another option, getting a car from Hertz. So far in my area I have found 50-60K miles cars like:
- 2013 Hyundai Elantra GLS Sedan for $11K plus tax, title, registration (so $12K all-in)
- 2013 Toyota Corolla LE for $11K plus tax, title, registration (so $12K all-in)
- 2013 Mazda Mazda2 Touring Hatchback for $9K plus tax, title, registration (so $10K all-in)
- 2013 Nissan Versa 1.6 S Sedan for $9K plus tax, title, registration (so $10K all-in)

Those all seem pretty fair deals, right?

stickguy

yes, all pretty cheap. the elantra and Corolla are much more substantial cars, for not much more money.

suydam

Looks good, but check them out too.

stever

Even then, don't be surprised if something is missed. Even new cars can have glitches but they at least have warranties. Some used cars do too - if you buy a used car from a dealer here in New Mexico, you get a fifteen day warranty. California has something similar I think, although they may charge extra for it out there.

But finding a used car at a dealer in your price range is even tougher than a private party sale and if you use a dealer that does offer some sort of exchange (Auto Nation?) or warranty, you'll blow your budget.

All of which makes @kyfdx's leasing suggestion attractive, since it removes the unknowns from the equation, even though it costs more the day of purchase (but maybe less two days after!).

kyfdx

I have to say..... the last crop of late model, former rental cars that were posted look pretty good.. If you can find cars like that, that have some warranty left (do ex-rentals have warranty?) for $10K-$12K out the door, then I'd pick that over a cheap lease..

But, any sub-$8K car is a crapshoot.... I'd lease in a heartbeat, rather than buy one of those.. I spent a lot of time looking in the sub-$10k category and it's depressing..

suydam

All of which just goes to say -- if you have more $$ you can do better. But not everyone does.

kibu

I am also considering that, since I might get promoted next year, or two years, or four years from now, if I go with the Hertz option with $10-12K | 72-month I can get rid of car at any point and get a good deal out of it. Even if I have to go longer than 3 years, I'll still have a relatively young (thus reliable) car to drive and make payments to.

kibu

Ok, so I have made a compilation of the best Hertz deals I could find in a 50 mile area around me. Which would you choose?

stickguy

I agree with KY. Huge difference between one of these Hertz units (which come with at least a 12/12 warranty through them, and some may have some factory powertrain left). Cheap to buy is a tough pool to swim in, and the costs can mount quickly.

I actually poked around a bit today on a Hyundai dealer site, looking at Elantras, and the Hertz ones seem to be a good 3-4K cheaper (adjusting for miles). so a good way to go. Should give you 3 years/20,000 miles no problem. and are new enough to have modern safety and interface (USB. Bluetooth) functionality.

any on the list can work. up to you to see what you feel comfortable with. I know Bergen county and NYC, so a real tiny car (like the 2, Yaris or Versa) might not be the best idea!

To me, a corolla/3/Sentra/Elantra class car is probably the best bet, and you should get your money back down the road (holding value).

of that list, the Versa, Accent or Corolla look the best to me. Though if you like the size, the Mazda is certainly cheap.

good way to go overall though if you don't want to do a lease. And easy for you, since they are at a sales lot, they can do financing, they have service records, etc.

stever

I'm a bit surprised at the asking prices. It's been a while since I shopped at a rental lot but my dated experience was that the rental car companies were asking more than dealer retail for their cars. Things have changed for the better.

stickguy

out of curiosity, I checked a few other rental companies (Avis, Enterprise). They looked to be notably higher than Hertz, for same basic cars. Pretty much roughly dealer priced.

I looked at Hertz local here in Philly, and prices were also good. Still surprised to see them all running with miles in the 50s. Guess I still live in the past, when rental units were retailed by the time the had 25K on the clock, if not less!

qbrozen

I don't like any of those options, personally. Aside from the fact that the Versa is an awful car, you can get a brand new 2015 for $12k. Saving $3k for a 2-yr-old model with 50k miles is simply silly.

Mazda2 is a better buy. I drove one with a stick and really liked it. Not sure how the automatic would affect it. Problem with that car is that it might not be so easy to sell afterwards. It is quite small and an all-new version is just around the corner. Anyway, right now, that vehicle would get a hair over $8k at auction, so $9300 is a good deal.

Sentra and Corolla have alot of miles, and they are rental miles, let's not forget.

Only one on there I can't really speak to is the Yaris. Those are floating around the very high $8k mark at auction. Seems like a good value considering a new one would run you $16,580.

suydam

Yaris is simply an awful car. I wouldn't wish it on anyone. And it wouldnt be as easy to sell later as a Sentra or Corolla. That's not many miles for either of those. If they check out ok I think they would be a good bet. The Mazda is a good car, but really really small, and not everyone will like that as their only car. A Corolla is more practical all around.

kibu

qbrozen said:

I don't like any of those options, personally. Aside from the fact that the Versa is an awful car, you can get a brand new 2015 for $12k. Saving $3k for a 2-yr-old model with 50k miles is simply silly.

Mazda2 is a better buy. I drove one with a stick and really liked it. Not sure how the automatic would affect it. Problem with that car is that it might not be so easy to sell afterwards. It is quite small and an all-new version is just around the corner. Anyway, right now, that vehicle would get a hair over $8k at auction, so $9300 is a good deal.

Sentra and Corolla have alot of miles, and they are rental miles, let's not forget.

Only one on there I can't really speak to is the Yaris. Those are floating around the very high $8k mark at auction. Seems like a good value considering a new one would run you $16,580.

That's a really interesting comment @qbrozen. Given that you don't like any of these options, what would you do given my situation?
And also, where do you find a new Versa for 12K?

qbrozen

check truecar.com for pricing.

I still come back to my Protege suggestion. Buying a more expensive car may give you more peace of mind in the short-term, but its going to be a headache when you need to get rid of it, especially if you have an active loan on it. You're going to be looking for people who have more cash on hand or need to get a loan themselves, and you'll need to get them to spot you the money to pay off your loan and get the title.

I'd spend $3500-$5k cash on a well-maintained, low-mileage, private party Protege (or really any 4-cyl mazda). You'd probably only need oil changes during your time with it and then sell it for $2k-$2500 when done.

There does not seem to be a shortage of them:
http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5000341962.html
http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5000849941.html
http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/cto/5012261694.html
http://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/5011314914.html
http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/cto/5003033905.html

kibu

Those look good too! Darn.. haha, I just thought I had figured this out!

@stickguy, you've been giving me a lot of info. Do you agree with qbrozen's suggestion of the Mazda Protege (2000-2003 with 100K miles)?

stickguy

those are good cars. if you get the right one, and it works for your needs (they are a lot more basic). I like Mazdas. But, anything that old with those miles, is always possible something fails.

kibu

Ok great! I think that leaves me with 2 good options then. I'm going to think about going through the motions with the older Mazda (traveling to private seller(s) by public transportation, mechanic(s) & transaction) versus just getting a Hertz Certified (1year warranty) Corolla LE.
The first option might be cheaper but will definitely cost me quite a bit more time and can be potentially frustrating, the second option doesn't, but it might have the same time & frustration at the end of my period, when I want to sell the car.

qbrozen

kibu said:

@stickguy, you've been giving me a lot of info. Do you agree with qbrozen's suggestion of the Mazda Protege (2000-2003 with 100K miles)?

no. 2002 and up. 2002 was the first year of a redesign. The model prior to that was not nearly as nice. By the way, as you saw in some of my links, a 4-cyl mazda6 is a good buy, too. And, if you can find it in your pricerange, a mazda3.

kibu

Ok great. I have been reading some success but also horror stories about Hertz, but I am sure I could find them too about the Mazda.

I'll be looking after I have moved, in June. I will probably first check out a Mazda or two, experience how they drive and maybe get one checked by a mechanic if I like it. If not, then I'll buy a Hertz certified.

kibu

Hey guys, what do you think of these cars? Mostly Mazdas, the last one is a corolla.

1. http://newjersey.craigslist.org/cto/5035862586.html

2. http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/cto/5036773727.html

3. http://newyork.craigslist.org/brx/cto/5035787289.html

4. http://newyork.craigslist.org/brx/cto/5012619463.html

5. http://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/cto/5029970297.html

stickguy

for your purpose, the Corolla is the deal of the bunch. Probably gone quick though. The few diamonds on CL don't last long.

stay away from the Millenias. not something you want to mess with. The 626 has too many miles.

the 6 is interesting. Cheap if it is 100% mechanically, but that is a lot of body damage. Would need someone that knows to look at it close to see what kind of problems are underneath. Also getting up there in miles. Could easily become a needy moneypit.

so, the Corolla is uninspiring, but if a legit car, likely to be cheap to own for a few years, and will hold it's value.