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The in-state versus out of state prices are unreal :mad: For a 48/48 an online quote from an out of state dealer was $1,205 and the in state dealer was $2,705 :surprise:
You FL folks need to band together and get extended auto policies excluded from this law.
If you go to any of the online HC links, like the one user msw66 provided, they will not sell you a plan once you disclose you live in FL.
BTW, there is a HC specific forum here at Edmunds .
Dennis
I was hoping to learn from other Floridian's experience.
I know it is a rip-off. Florida's insurance situation is a nightmare, and extended warranties are a minimal issue. I just renewed my professional liability insurance and there was a 2% surcharge to help bail out Citizens Insurance, the State's property insurance Company. I've got a real problem with it.
I too got that on my State Farm auto policies. Don't ya just love it? For those not familiar with Citizens, it's a state run home owner's insurance company for folks that live on the coast and can't get insurance elsewhere. So instead of jacking up the policy holders rates, our lovely legislators are forcing the rest of us Floridians to chip in with a surcharge on EVERY insurance policy, homeowners, auto, liability, etc, etc. :mad:
If you don't own property out of state, I am not sure of the cost and legality of setting something up to dodge the FL law. A mailboxes etc type address would be cheap enough to set up, but you are likely to run afoul of the law if you got caught.
Dennis
My car only had 11,500 mi. on it so I got the new car rate. 7 yrs,100,000 mi and 0 deduction. Including the optional electronics care the total was approx. $2,900. As my car was 2.5 yrs old at the time of purchasing the warranty I am covered for 5.5 yrs after the 4yr MB warranty expires.
1. What is OEM (I feel silly asking)
2. What is the difference between extended warranty and mechanical breakdown--Geico offers the latter but I'm really lost. And,
3. What if I leave Geico?
Hmmm--I just figured out that Pontiac is GM. So it seems maybe I should go with that. The dealership didn't give me a copy of their EW program, and neither did my credit union. I'm waiting on Geicos info to arrive.
Pls. help or refer to better links. I love the internet but I still spend hours just looking for info and reading about everyones' experiences. Thanks.
2) What is the difference between extended warranty and mechanical breakdown--Geico offers the latter but I'm really lost. - that sounds like just a way of saying the same thing and marketing it in different terms. You'd have to ask Geico or read their info as to what their meaning of mechanical breakdown coverage really covers. Perhaps someone on this post has experience with Geico - otherwise call them back and ask them to clarify. Same goes with your #3 question.
The Pontiac Vibe is actually a 'disguised' Toyota Matrix. It is engineered by Toyota, it just has a slightly different exterior and interior - the chassis and powertrain are all Toyota.
If you are serious about an extended warranty you really need to consider a warranty that is factory sponsored - meaning a GM warranty in your case. Not all GM dealers will sell a GM extended warranty, and if they do they might not offer it up as a first option because they can make more money selling an 'aftermarket' warranty. I've been in the OEM auto business and I can tell you that you'll be much happier knowing you have a factory backed plan than any aftermarket. It might cost you more, but in the long run the security of knowing that the claims will get paid directly to the dealer, the company won't go bankrupt (as many aftermarkets do), and the process in which approvals and repairs are made are all within the GM network is worth the extra money.
Price it around on the Internet - Google GM extended warranty - and call your dealer back and specifically ask them about the GM plans that are offered.
My last car, also a Toyota twin, was still going strong at 20 years, 252, 000 miles and I never considered, or needed, an extended warranty. But I"m older, and the Vibe has more computer chip thingees, and air conditioning (hallelujah) so I'm thinking about it...
The reason this is so popular is that BMW has no factory backed extended warranty other than CPO. To me this makes a lot of sense if you live in a state that does not charge full sales tax on a lease and depending on how much the dealer charges you for this. Quite often BMW will offer the car to the turn in dealer for less than the buyout, if they pass this saving on to you it can cover most/all of the CPO cost.
Remember you can still buy it for the residual if they come back with a high price. If they find flaws that have to be fixed for CPO (for example the tread depth may be fine to turn the car in, but not enough to resell as CPO) you could always get these fixed yourself before you turn it in and re-buy. You do have to use genuine BMW parts and similar high performance tires, but you don't have to pay the inflated dealer parts and labor prices.
Dennis
Good luck...
M
I couldn't imagine taking my vehicle in for the "little items" you mention and pay the $50 or $100 deductible.
If you also read my earlier post I mentioned that I would never go with an aftermarket company. Always go with a factory backed warranty. I worked for an auto manufacturer for many years and I always heard the horror stories of aftermarket warranty companies going BK - I am still active in the automotive field and this trend has not stopped.
It's purely an insurance policy and a matter of choice. If you are the type that doesn't want to spend the few thousand now and take a chance that during the life of your ownership you don't incur any costly repairs, then don't buy one. If you are more of the type that you don't like any surprises and you'd rather pay now to have that added comfort, then you probably should buy something that suits your years of ownership and your annual mileage driving habits. With repair shop rates running about $100 - $125/hr it doesn't take much of a repair for the bill to reach a rather large sum.
I would pay $1400 for a 100K mile maintanence plan on a BMW in a heart beat. Every one I have ever talked to says it cost them at least $125 to get the oil changed on there BMW. 5000 maintanence schedule for 100K miles is 20 oil changes at $125 a pop is $2500. That is at todays prices, not what it will cost you 4 years from now.
That does not even count the other maintanence it covers.
You also would have to go by the BMW service minder system so you would NOT be getting an oil change every 5k miles - it would be more like 12k to 15k per change or once per year no matter the miles - at least that is how the factory maintenance works.
Other than CPO, I don't think there is a BMW backed extended warranty. They do offer maintenance deals and individual BMW dealers will offer 3rd party warranties.
Dennis
Depending on the cost, the CPO warranty is well worth it, the maintinence package, not so much IMO.
BMW's "Free Maintinence" is a bit of a scam IMO, as they only pay for a fraction of what the car truly needs to last as long as it ought to. 12k oil changes, lifetime driveline fluids and the like are not good for your car's long term health.
I have yet to see a GM Automatic in a BMW with lifetime fluid make it past 130k miles, yet the damn near identical trannies that got fluid and filter changes every 30k miles easily hit 200k.
Why pay someone else to do something that you can handle on your own? Why give up hundreds of dollars of interest income?
You should certainly buy insurance to shield yourself from catastrophic losses. I carry the best homeowner's policy available in my area because the cost of rebuilding my home could easily cost me hundreds of thousands of dollars. A loss of that magnitude would cripple me. But a $2K repair bill, while unwelcome & annoying, shouldn't be a setback for anyone with a strong balance sheet.
We want somebody else to take care of us! Who cares if it costs more, we need peace of mind!
(you know I'm being sarcastic, right?
Before they gave away the service the monitor lights would go on about 5-6k to tell you to bring it in for a pay oil change. When they changed to "free" changes they changed it to 12k-15k. Their excuse for the change is that they went to full synthetic oil so they did not need to change it so much.
Dennis
I won't say who I work for, but our company has been in the ESC business for over 20 years and the insurance industry for over 80 years; our parent company has been around for over 125 years. I say this because so many people in this forum seem opposed to getting an aftermarket ESC because they keep hearing other people say the aftermarket producers go bankrupt all the time. In reality, there is very little chance that we or any of the other major aftermarket producers will go bankrupt (sure, there's still a chance, but then there's also a chance that the auto manufacturer will go bankrupt, and that small chance probably wouldn't stop you from buying the car). We spend a great deal of time researching and analyzing data to properly price our product. And we only sell it through reputable auto dealerships ( I'll explain why shortly). A few auto manufacturers, e.g. BMW and Hyundai, actually use "aftermarket" companies to provide their factory extended service contracts.
I'll admit, a number of "fly-by-night" operators went belly up and their ESCs wound up being worthless, but these can basically be broken into two groups: The "we're cheaper than the others" Newbies and the Internet Based Companies.
The Newbies were generally subsidiaries of other companies, not necessarily insurance or automotive related, that thought that there was a killing to be made in the ESC market. With little or no experience in this type of market, they priced their product to get the business, and then... they reaped the whirlwind. Every insurance department in the country has a two-part mandate about pricing: Price it fair, price it adequate. These guys were severely underpriced and wound up getting way more business than they could cover. They subsequently folded and left their policy holders high and dry. Some blame falls on the insurance departments for letting these rates through, though the "warranty" business is not under their purview (see below). The automotive dealerships were also partly to blame for this situation since the vast majority of ESCs are sold through them: They saw a chance to make more profit and jumped on it. Most of them learned their lesson, however, and have gone back to using only the tried and true.
The Internet Based Companies were bound to fail. How many of you would insure property you've never seen or inspected for someone you've never met? It's an underwriters worst nightmare! People could go out to the internet and buy a relatively inexpensive ESC and then proceed to rebuild their piece of junk car. We have an expression for this in the insurance business: Adverse selection. Either you select the risks or the risks will select you. And these guys got "selected against" big time.
Which brings me back to why we (the majority of aftermarket producers) only sell through reputable auto dealerships. You can understand now why we don't sell on-line. We don't sell directly to the public through insurance agents either, since most agents aren't mechanics; they really can't tell if a car is a reasonable risk or a ticking time bomb. And we don't sell though those "buy here, pay here" dealerships, the kind that pop up on a street corner only to disappear 12 months later (talk about adverse selection!). Additionally, the purchase of the ESC has to made within a certain time period after car purchase, generally a month or so. If the customer decides they want one later, they must have their car inspected and certified at selling dealership, usually at the owner's expense.
One more thing before I forget: The difference between "extended warranty" and "mechanical breakdown" is purely legal. "Mechanical breakdown" is actually Mechanical Breakdown Insurance, MBI. Since MBI is insurance, it can be regulated by the different state insurance departments. On the other hand, a warranty is not technically insurance, so it isn't regulated by the insurance departments. When you get right down to it, they provide the same thing, but have different legal connotations. I'm not a lawyer, so don't ask me to explain.
If you follow the industry, know someone who has experience with an aftermarket contract and done your homework (and it saves you a significant amount of money) then perhaps an aftermarket is a good decision. If on the other hand you have no knowledge, recommendations (other than the dealer) and the OEM fits within your budget then I'd go that route.
True, to a degree. But a dealer is not going to alienate his customers just to maximize his profit on ESCs. If the dealer sells contracts that cause nothing but problems for his customers, he winds up paying for it in the end and he knows that. It's just bad business choosing your ESC provider on price alone.
What I'm really trying to point out here is that if you're planning on getting an ESC, don't be scared off from getting one from the dealer just because it's not a factory plan. Know what you want/need in an ESC and what you're willing to pay for... no different than when you're getting ready to make the car purchase.
I would agree - you hear stories of folks complaining about stuff not covered by ANY extended warranty when something fails, but never hear of folks getting told the OEM plan they purchased is now no good. While every part is not covered you never have to worry that the dealership will not honor the OEM plan.
We had a GMPP years ago on my wife's car which broke a rocker arm. The arm was covered, but they wanted up to pay to clean out the metal shavings and other things that occurred when the arm broke. We refused just based on the absurdity of them expecting us to pay - none of this would need to be done if the covered part had stayed in one piece!
I think HondaCare is one of the better OEM plans out, yet at least one local dealership (owner by a big chain) does not even offer it at all, then have some other warranty they offer. You can't tell me it is not because HQ dictates it due to higher profit margin over HondaCare.
A local BMW dealer has had at least two difference after-market extended warranty companies in the last few years What does that say to the folks that purchased the first plan? That they didn't like it and went with someone else - or just make more money off the other plan.
I don't care how much research you do and how many folks you talk to up front, any of these companies not factory backed CAN and HAVE left folks without coverage.
I always tell folks decide if you need coverage or not, and if you do then only by an OEM plan if that is available. Anything else is just a big risk.
Dennis
I found this article interesting:
http://www.sptimes.com/2003/10/12/Business/Warranty__no_guarantee.shtml
It illustrates why I don't hold much store in AMBest's ratings.
Dennis: it's a good thing GMPP didn't learn about the dealer trying to charge you extra-it's against the rules!
I can submit to GMPP for added time; I can't charge the customer.
A dealer could get into hot water pulling that trick.
Total bull. Look at API's website - http://www.apiprotection.com/aboutus.aspx
They were founded in 1984 and there are OVER 300,000 contracts and GPR claims in default. See the bankruptcy site at http://www.apibankruptcy.com/ If you happen to be a creditor there will soon be a deadline for filing claims and it may be worth your while to attend the September 5th meeting... but reality is your money is most likely gone.
"Which brings me back to why we (the majority of aftermarket producers) only sell through reputable auto dealerships. You can understand now why we don't sell on-line. We don't sell directly to the public through insurance agents either, since most agents aren't mechanics; they really can't tell if a car is a reasonable risk or a ticking time bomb. "
Again... this all sounds great unless you are someone who knows how this business really works. First "reputable" doesn't mean jack. All that matters is loss ratio. A dealer could be as dirty as they come but as long as they perform you and I both know you'll embrace them like a brother. API wasn't pulled down by irreputable dealers. For that you would need to look to the owners of API (who are also the owners of Intercontinental Warranty Services www.iwsgroup.com).
"Since MBI is insurance, it can be regulated by the different state insurance departments. On the other hand, a warranty is not technically insurance, so it isn't regulated by the insurance departments. When you get right down to it, they provide the same thing, but have different legal connotations."
This part is right. The Illinois Dept of Ins sued API in June to stop them from using the dealer reserves to pay anything other then claims. Because of the laws in IL, they lost that case and the assets of the company can now be used to pay the Hooters bills, the Lexus and Porsche leases etc -- and then a few claims of course....
See http://www.ilnb.uscourts.gov/JudgeDoyle/Opinions/Automotive_Professionals.pdf
I would bet "reputable" in their book is a dealer that sells lots of policies for them - that is probably the only qualification.
Dennis
or warranty direct???If so any info would help..
People advised her to go to the insurance company to file her complaint. This is when she found out, the insurance company (Interstate) is located in the same building! I am sure she would get alot accomplished there! :mad:
Warranties Backed by a Risk Retention Group
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Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
I'm not surprised that Interstate and WD share a building. They probably share a few upper level employees.
I checked out Certified's website. In business since 1997! Who Hoo! I can't find out who they are backed by, but their contracts look like the standard junk.
Buy at your own risk.
At Automotive Professionals Inc (API) you have the Hawks, who are screwing people by the thousands there but still able to sell warranties through Intercontinental Warranty Services (IWS). Also coming out of API is William Rosenbach and Larry Roseberry. Check out the association there with Heritage Warranty and CarCare... and now at "Million Mile Motor".
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
Thanks.
John