Chrysler 300/300C

soozpk

Yes the 800-Chrysler number will patch you through to the 800-992-1997 number, so you can use either one. You need to send a pic of the Jade Green when you get it. We can post all our pics at SuperDave's.

etcarroll

Swung by local dealer yesterday just to see, and found a black 300, base, on the lot. With the 2.7 and one option package, a grand for traction control and related items, $24k+ on the sticker.

Black on black, looked nice. Both front doors, interior, have a horizontal chrome or aluminum strip running horizontally that ties into the door 'pull'. Both rear doors had a space for strip, but it wasn't there. Odd.

Rear wheel wells, interior, have 3 horizontal slots at the 9 o'clock position, odd.

Pictures do not do justice to how short the rear deck is, can't see anyone putting a 'Continental kit' on this car.

Overall, nice presentation.

Now, to drive one!

bo_chung

Looks like a nice domestic alternative to a BMW 7 series. It's better looking and costs 50% less. Mercedes trans., suspension, AWD system with American powerplant. I think I gotta have one.

riker2

The rough ride and noise reports from Healy at USA Today seem to be the exception to what the press has been writing about the 300. The New Car Test Drive review points to the quiet and smooth response of the car, and the Leinarts at the Detroit News gushed about the ride. And that couple is tough-particularly the wife- about drive characteristics.

Given that the outgoing 300M was always taken to task for lots of noise and some harsh driving feedback, my guess is that Chrysler has effectively dealt with these issues.

Maybe Healy had spent too much time the night before his drive taking advantage of the hospitality that Chrysler provided at their open bar reception. A Lexus can feel rough if the driver's had a raucous night before a drive ;-)

I think you have to look at the overall reception of a new vehicle, and like the Olympics throw out the top and bottom scores to get a good idea of the reality.

But we'll all know soon enough what the car really feels and sounds like.

I'll be at the April 22nd reception, and hope to take a drive on the 23rd. I've enjoyed my 300M, but I look forward to Chrysler's progress in its development.

And on a purely practical level, what company invests in excess of a billion dollars creating a vehicle less well mannered than its predecessor?

crispiegee

So I'm a 34 year-old guy, who is single and moderately successful. I have a '97 Avenger ES and a Yamaha YZF600R sport bike, and I have been considering either a 2005 Pontiac GTO (6.0 liter) or a 2005 Mustang GT. (I am a hooligan at heart, and I really want to replace my trusty Avenger with something with GRUNT.)

So I have two great choices, although the Pontiac's styling is not nearly as attractive as the Australian market HSV Coupe 4, and the Mustang will be saddled with Ford's mediocre 4.6 V8 (albeit an improved version).

Now, Car and Driver rips a 5.3 second 0-60 in a 300C, and the big boat is in contention for my hard earned dollar. In terms of content, the 300C is very well-equipped -- on par with my friend's 2004 Acura TL -- but I am disappointed that there is no manual transmission and no way to defeat the dynamic stability control. All my tail wagging antics in snowy weather will be history. ARGH!

I'm in a quandary. The 300C is a bit stodgy, and I REALLY wanted a coupe. But it seems like a great car for the money, if a bit sedate. I feel like I'm too young to have such a big, conservative sedan.

Opinions welcome.

bo_chung

Interesting. I too was (and still is) considering the new Mustang GT and Pontiac GTO (I believe it's 5.7 liters). But I am a bit older (turning 39) with a family. Hence 300C is more practical for me (more useable space and availability of AWD). I think it will ultimately be more liveable. If you got a fast bike to go along with it, you might not miss the stick shift so much. I never felt that big sedans go well with a stick anyway. In most street races, the automatic will probably beat the stick 90% of the time, especially when the motor is so powerful that getting the power down is more important.

riker2

The Pontiac GTO just doesn't have enough style. The exterior really looks a generation behind to me, and the interior seems bland and cheap. Now the new Mustang is another proposition. It really looks like a return to the substance that made the original a legend. But,if you have a bike for fun, and you're 34, maybe a unique and high style sedan is the perfect alternative to your bike ride. Far from being stodgy and conservative, I see the 300C as being a new wild card kind of design that will look different from anything else on the road. Don't confuse the slab sides and high belt line for conservative. It's actually pretty radical.

fsmmcsi

Well, the 300C will be like the '96 Impala SS I once owned - a big sedan far faster than what many might think. My Impala SS looked just like the many Caprice taxis on the road. It was great fun surprising the little Hondas and so forth who thought they were fast. For example, they would pull up behind or beside as if I was going too slow, and I could just take off and leave them in the dust, even on a curve (when safe to do so). I also put Porsche front brakes on that car, and they were very visible through the five spoke wheels at speed, causing many stares from other drivers.

The 300C / Magnum R/T / Charger are faster than the Impala SS was, but I think there will still be many people modifying them.
  
The 300C is an excellent value, with feastures such as the automatic outside rear view mirrors, and should hold its value well.

jcz1

If possible, wait one year and check out the 2006 Charger. Should have a Hemi, and the coupe styling you're looking for, even though it's a sedan with suicide rear doors (assuming these elements of the concept make it into production). You can find picture of the concept many places on the web.

qbrozen

Than I'll give it. I'm 4 years younger than you, yet even I would feel like a rowdy teenager driving a Mustang or a GTO. As much as I dig the new look of the Mustang, I know I would always feel out of place going out to dinner in my suit and pulling up to the valet in such a vehicle. Then again, if I was going out to such a place with more than one person, I couldn't drive because there is no way anybody is going to want to contort themselves and their sunday best and climb in the back seat.

Granted, I don't find myself doing the above activity THAT often, but its just an example of the types of things I find myself doing in my older, more refined age. Having said muscle coupe as a toy would still be great, though. BUT, if its going to be my only car, I want something more versatile and more "my age."

But, don't forget, its just my opinion.

justgreat47

yeah, it's definitely a matter of taste; the american ride qualities tend to favor a more compliant suspension that i favor. my wife has an
a6 and that ride is too harsh for me...the technology is now in production (magnetic ride control) in the sts and vette that lets you have your cake and etc...it was developed for military use, i believe...amazing stuff.

imo, the sporty ride is something you like out of the box, but becomes tiring after living with the car for a while. jackg

intrepidation

The GTO *is* a generation old. It's an Opel, I think, from Australia. Sure, it's got the LT-1 engine, and a six-speed, but after driving a newer automatic for a while, they don't bother me anywhere *near* as much as they used to.

Like you, gbrozen, I'm a bike guy, and until three years ago, did long-distance rallying, which means you have to have comfort, the abitity to tolerate the layout for days on end, yet it can't be a pig in the twisties. To me, the 300C might just be the Honda ST1100, but in car form.

Funny you mention age, as I'm 35, and while I've *never* been a coupe kinda guy, this sedan gets me like the Q45 did when it came out. I prefer cars which are comfy, larger, and preferably flying under the radar, to coin a phrase. The only 2-door 'sports car' I've ever entertained owning was a '93 928S4...glad I didn't go that route, now.

As much as I love the styling and performance stats on the 300C, I'm now eagerly awaiting the DeVille's redesign. If nothing else, I hope it puts a few loaded 300C's on the used market!

shipo

Hmmm, let's see, the last car that I had that didn't have a "sporty ride" was my 1966 Plymouth Valiant, which I finally sold in 1977.

I guess "a while" for me is a little longer than other folks. ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

cjs2002

Anyone Actually recieve there 300 yet or is it still sitting out in the misty bays somewhere...lol... I 2 at my local dealor one was the base and the other was the hemi optiond one.... I asked when they planned to have the 3.5 touring model instock... they said maybe in a month depends on which demand is higher the hemi or the V6s...

joecanuk

Crispiegee, it been posted on many sites that the Charger will look nothing like the 99 concept

justgreat47

god!! i hope it doesn't have a spory ride...it's a large luxury sedan...imo, a spory ride would be out of character to the car's intended target audience....a while is a fair bit of time for me...i'm a buy and hold em type. i geuss it comes down to what one is looking for. imo, the 300c would go up against other full size sedans...such as an sts or gosh..that's about it...can't think of another american car it would compare to in size...to me, comparing it to german hardware is going down the wrong road (npi)and that's more a criticism of dc and not the consumer...gm,ford and dc need to create the american version of a luxury car not try and emulate something else. most americans don't go canyon carving or hitting the twisties...we're a land of interstates and hiways. i'm not saying that the car needs to be a boat, but definitely NOT a euro ride...i want more of grand touring suspension and of course, that's where the active suspension (i'm dating myself) comes into play...now it's possible to have both...it's not cheap but it's the best solution that the engineers have come up with....will definitely have to test drive the c and make my own judgement...i suspect that i will be disappointed...something tells me i'm in the minority. jackg

kvilleboy

First let me say that the Satin Jade / Jade light keystone gray interior really is beautiful. If I buy one, that's the color! So, on to the drive. I have driven both a base 300 and a C now so I can compare. The C is quieter. At idle if I didn't see the tach needle I wouldn't have known it was running. On the road there seemed to be less noise than I experience on the base model. The steering was very precise and the transmission shifts nearly imperceptibly. The "tourtise shell" at the top of the steering wheel is nice looking but may take a bit to get used to as to my touch it felt more "plasticky" than I thought it would.

The ride is definitely different from the base model. I can see where there have been reviewers giving seemingly opposite opinions. This is NOT a soft sprung car. It does not float or wallow. It is tight and taut. Yes, it feels much more "european" than traditional american. On smooth road it rides beautifully - smooth, quiet, soaking up minor road irregularities with subdued thunks. When you hit a pothole or rough rail road tracks you do NOT just glide over them. Don't misunderstand. This does not ride like a lumber wagon!!! It is still smooth but it reacts to abrupt inputs rather abruptly and the sharp "thunk" that results kind of makes you think - "oh - what was that." If you are used to driving a Buick or Caddy or Lexus for that matter, it may take a bit of getting used to, but I expect most people will get used to it very quickly. If you have ever driven a new Grand Prix with the GTP with the competition group the feel of the suspension is rather similar.

The HEMI obviously has ample power. Off the line it really moves out. Getting into it from about 45 it marches away from traffic nicely, but not pushing you back in your seat or anything, the power just keeps coming and coming and coming. Even under full throttle I was amazed at how quiet the car was inside. You could hear the engine and exhaust but the note was never raspy or booming or otherwise objectionable. Very muffled and well insulated.

Well, that's my impression. I hope I don't mislead anyone. I don't find the ride objectionable. It doesn't ride as "hard" as my Corvette but it rides harder than my Envoy. If you want the ride of a Crown Vic - this isn't it. If you like Audi, Mercedes, etc., I think you're going to love this.

stephen

Went to Traverse City today to unload my STS in preparation for a spot in the garage for the 300C I ordered three months ago. One block away, I saw a 300C sitting out in front of Bill Marsh Chrysler. I asked if I could take it for a spin, but no, it was ordered for former Governor of Michigan Bill Milliken. He ordered a black one for himself, a silver one for his wife.

So I went to Cracker Barrel for lunch, and pulled up next to....another 300C parked in the parking lot. So new, it still had the temporary tag. The owner came out while I was admiring it, and said it had 300 miles on it. Perfect. He should put it away and save it for 30 years. It would be a 300C with 300 actual miles. He loves the car, and said it has a good, comfortable ride.

stephen

ruski

On the 300M board we never used to hear from people who would prefer a softer ride. Quieter - yes. But most people from that crowd wanted a sporty car.

You may want to check out what Cadillac has to offer. But then even they are firming up their shocks.

I guess you are stuck with a TownCar.

ruski

the second one you saw at the Cracker Barrel - was that the governor's wife?

dale48

I called 1 800 Chrysler this morning. With regard to an invitation they said contact my dealer.
As for the status of my car they said it was built and released by the factory. She said the last update was 3/25. She said maybe they were doing more inspection and testing. I said I thought they were holding for a release on 4/22. She knew very little and could not explain the lack of status updates.
Anyway I emailed my salesman who replied back to invite me to Premiere night. Re the status of my car he said "as you know, it has been built and I expect it to be delivered to the dealership prior to the Premiere night."
kvilleboy: Thanks for you firsthand evaluation, sounds great. With 340 horses I want a car that allows you to feel the road a little. If I wanted to float, I'd look at a mooshy riding Town Car.

shipo

I posted a message a couple of days ago about a transmission test with a ZF automatic (at least I think it was a ZF) on a 300M from a few years back. Do you remember anything more about that test?

Best Regards,
Shipo

ruski

I too am thinking about the GTO, however I still have 1.5 years on my Acura TL-S lease (can't wait to unload it).

To me GTO looks great. Back in the day, when I had my 1998 Grand Prix GTP, people on the GTP forums discovered this great new car called Holden Commodore and there wasa lot of talk about it. Then the Commodore spawned the Monaro. Back then everyone was dreaming that this car would be available in the US. Well now it is in the GTO shape. I still want it.

But now there is the 300C... Maybe I will have to talk wife into getting 300C when her RX300 lease ends this fall... And I will get the GTO for myself in a year and a half... The only thing is that she wants a 3-row SUV-like vehicle, like a Pacifica... what can I do?

ruski

I remember that the 300M did great with that tranny and we were all hoping to see it one day in a production 300M.

307web

Could you imagine? I'd expect 0-60 around 5 seconds.
Is there even room in the engine bay for the Viper engine?
Maybe it would be more likely in the Dodge Magnum than in a Chrysler even if it could fit because the engine may be too noisy.

carnaught

I realize that this is the 300 Chrysler msg., board, but have you driven the CTSv ? The squared-off upright looks of the 300, especially from the rear remind me of the CTS.

fsmmcsi

I called my local dealer today and he told me that he would receive two 300s tomorrow. He also said that they had been in the LA area holding lot for two weeks.

pat

Yeah, it IS the Chrysler 300 discussion and it seems like it's time (or perhaps past time...) for me to remind everyone of that.

We have discussions for, I think, all of the off-topic vehicles that have been coming up here and they can all be located using the Make/Model search tool on the left side of the page.

So how 'bout we go for some truth-in-advertising and try to stick to the subject -- we can take our other thoughts to the appropriate discussions and pursue them there.

As always, I'll be happy to help anyone find any resource around these parts - just drop me an email.

Thanks!

:-)

dale48

Once the 4/22 premiere has occurred and some of us are actually driving 300's I'm sure talk about other cars will diminish (at least proportionately). We will have much more to discuss. In the meantime you can't blame (too much)those that are on the fence for comparing ownership options. As for me I am just impatiently waiting for delivery. Thanks for the venue.

soozpk

Dale you have me walking the walls here....you actually have the factory release. My dealership doesn't even know when "theirs" are coming in, let alone mine. I'm still assuming mine will be in that first bunch. Yep, you're right, once we get our cars, we'll be posting the likes and dislikes of what we find.

bigmike5

Unless they re-worked the gearing on the 300 to give it more low end torque, there is no way that it or the Magnum will beat 8 seconds off the line. I could believe 8, but show me the money on 6.5 or better using the 3.5 engine.

Got my written Premier invite a week ago, [must be dealer generated], and I am going for a look- see. My M is in for a rear window actuator tomorrow [an old TSB on that item--finally gave out at 6 years but should be covered under my extended warranty] and while I'm waiting on it I will scout the back lot of the dealer for any new 300's.

rayainsw

A general comment about acceleration / 0-60 /quarter mile times and speeds.

As someone mentioned here a while back, gearing is a critical issue regarding times to speeds and over distance. To a lesser degree it is also an issue regarding quarter mile trap speeds.

I have not yet received my C+D with the 300C test, but my guess is that the 2 – 3 shift in this case must occur just AFTER the 0 – 60 timing.

The issue is that with an otherwise identical car, a higher (numeric) final drive ratio will typically result in a more rapid RATE of acceleration. (Setting aside traction limits and things like wheel spin, if the car is powerful enough.) However, if the gearing is such that an additional shift (manual or automatic) is required before reaching either 60 mph or the termination of the quarter mile, the resulting times to 60 and through the quarter may actually be slightly longer. Yet if you picked a different benchmark (0-55 mph or 1000’, for instance) the result would likely be better / shorter times, as the additional shift would not be required.

And launching the car has a number of variables that can affect the times. Skill of the driver, in a powerful car that is traction limited, can be a big one. Actual surface traction can be another. Although formulas exist to allow / correct for atmospheric condition differences, these are harder to account for between different drivers (magazine tests) conducted at different locations.

Terminal velocity in the quarter is less affected by the number of shifts, and therefore is often a v. good indicator of HP, as it is typically little affected by small differences in the skill of the driver in launching the car.

Just my $.02 – or $.01 after mail-in rebate.

- Ray
Typically more concerned with acceleration feel than raw numbers . . .

soozpk

I see that the Tire Pressure Monitoring System is on the list at Mopar's News page: It had been yanked from the 300's webpage, and a note on the last page of the 300 catalog stated "Late Availability". Anyone know for sure if us early buyers will get this system??? My dealer wasn't certain.

 http://scoop.daimlerchrysler.com/product_30005_safety.shtml
 (Listed ALL the way at the bottom)

intrepidation

1:30 EDT or 10:30 PDT, there will be a 30 minute show on the new 300C. I have nothing to do with it, just saw the commercial late last night when surfing around. I think it's called Chrysler Test Drive, which could be an infomercial, for all I know. As long as there are pictures of it in motion and of the interior, *I* really don't care. ;-)

Kelly
'95 Intrepid ES 3.5L owner...for now

qbrozen

actually, the test drive program is very cool and very informative. I saw one where the host and a professional racecar driver flogged the heck out of 2 V8 Lincoln LSs around a racetrack (I believe it was Laguna Seca, IIRC). They didn't hold back at all. It was very entertaining and very impressive. The other ones I've caught (BMW Z4 and S60R, for example) didn't involve a racetrack, but not much less informative.

Guess I'll have to try to remember to set the VCR for this Saturday. Thanks for the info.

intrepidation

I'll definitely make sure either the VCR gets it...for slow-mo and pause, of course...or I watch it.

Flogging is good. ;-)

Kelly

barneym

Here is the dates and times for this program off of the Speed Channel Website. Plus at the bottom is a time for an Autoweek magazine feature on the 300C as well. All times are Eastern.

Saturday, April 10, 2004
1:30 pm Chrysler Test Drive 300C
6:30 pm Chrysler Test Drive 300C
  
Monday, April 12, 2004
6:30 pm Chrysler Test Drive 300C
  
Wednesday, April 21, 2004
2:00 pm Chrysler Test Drive 300C
  
Sunday, April 25, 2004
2:30 pm Chrysler Test Drive 300C
  
Saturday, May 1, 2004
1:30 pm Chrysler Test Drive 300C
  
Wednesday, May 5, 2004
6:00 pm Chrysler Test Drive 300C
  
Sunday, May 9, 2004
10:30 am AutoWeek Chrysler 300C
11:30 pm AutoWeek Chrysler 300C

dale48

Realeased by the factory. I'm jaded(like my car)and at this point and I interpret "released by the factory" to mean shipped to storage. I was glad my dealer was optimistic though.

mikemullin6

Dale48:

Sounds like your 300 is progressing but I wouldn't get too excited yet. Mine was completed on 28 Feb and put in storage in Brampton (status JS). It still hasn't left Brampton as of April 6th and no one can tell me why. There seems to be no rhyme or reason on when a given ordered car is actually shipped.

Hope your experience is better (quicker) than mine.

Mike

fsmmcsi

The latest good review is out in print and on the web by Motor Trend. They report a "smooth quiet ride" and "Autobahn-worthy Hemi power." Their testing showed 0 to 60 in 5.8 seconds, 60 to 0 in 122', and 63.2 MPH on the 600 foot slalom.

justgreat47

definitely the 300m had a spory ride: it was european in it's settings...that's what i'm concerned about. as nice as the 3000m is/was, it wasn't a runaway success as far as the numbers go and i geuss that's my point, imo if dc wants the 300c to be a success at the box office it needs to cater to a wider audience and i just wonder how the engineers will deliver on the ride. i do own a caddy an older one (duh) a seville and that's my point of reference..well controlled but defintely not harsh or noisy...could be a little firmer but as i've said everything is a compromise w/o the active suspension. is this on topic? jackg

carnaught

on order, I bet all of a sudden your cars (mysteriously) come in.

dale48

Do you know something we don't?

intrepidspirit

" I could believe 8, but show me the money on 6.5 or better using the 3.5 engine."

I agree 100%!

The best times I have heard of for the 300M were about 7.5. With the same engine and transmission, the 300 (with it's added bulk) could not break 8, and 6.5 is somebody's pipe dream!

dennis

Sounds like someone confused the 6.5 sec. time for the C model, not the 3.5. I agree the 3.5 could not accelerate that fast.

shipo

I thought that the V6 versions of the 300 were being equipped with the old tranny from the W210 E-Class. Yes, no?

Best Regards,
Shipo

rcf8000

Another voice heard from: Automobile Magazine says 6.1 seconds.

emale

shipo,

the v6 LX cars get the 42RE chrysler parasitic slushbox...only the hemi gets the merc tranny.

shipo

...I suspect that eight seconds to sixty for the 3.5 might be pushing it. :-/

Best Regards,
Shipo

fastdriver

How many models are there anyway? One of my car mags yesterday mentioned 4!

fastdriver