I think maybe you are putting your own spin on this story, which does not say anything about "reliability" or the current state of affairs with regard to the Mexican plant...
...sales in the United States and North America suffered, with executives blaming quality problems and the late start in introducing the revamped Jetta.
"We had serious quality problems in our Mexican plant," VW Chief Executive Bernd Pischetsrieder said during a conference call Friday with analysts. "The situation in the U.S. remains disastrous."
The company's operational loss inthe U.S. during the first six months rose to 596 million euros ($720.74 million) from 503 million euros the year before
Note the use of the past tense with regard to the quality problems. It seems to me that what he is reporting as "disastrous" is the overall financial performance...based on the paragraph that follows that statement.
Don't forget this is the new boss...maybe he is saying this company has been a disaster in the US recently to lower expectations for himself .
You can see their TV advertisement is targeting at young couples (25-30) without childern. For them, a more powerful equipped car with good gas mileage is more appropriate than driving a minivan.
What genius in Wolfsburg decided that the Jetta in our continent should be designed for young parents? If you design a car for a pretty dull market segment, dont you think you will end up with a dull car? No offense intended to young parents, in fact I am a semi-young parent myself(ok I confess I am middle aged)--but why target a Jetta to a group that is most suitable for a mini-van?
The new Jetta was targeted to that group because they are the ones that had been buying the previous Jetta. Those current owners now are moving upward in the automotive food chain and VW wanted to keep them in the fold while moving the product upmarket.
You have to consider that a New Jetta weighted much heavier than a Accord, and the 30MPG is very good already, comparing to my GLI only get 23MPG on highway.
I heard Honda is bumping up the horsepower on the Accord for 2006 to 170. We have the same engine in our CR-V and it is smooth and sweet. As much as I like the "German feel" of the VW, the Accord is starting to look interesting.
I think you may be correct. My intention was to not put my own spin on the story. But, as many folks do on this board (me included) I may not of read the paragraph thoroughly. My apologies.
BUT, I still may put out there that the quality coming from the Mexican plant MIGHT still be disasterous. Time will tell if VW has their act together.
Well, I read the same story, did get the quote right, thought about posting it here, but wondered in the end just what the guy meant. I thought it pretty remarkable that the CEO is willing to say, in a place where he knew he would be quoted, that after all their money, time, and effort, they still couldn't get the Mexican plant to get it right out of the box.
The early problems with the New Jetta didn't strike me as particularly awful [based on what I've read elsewhere], but were bad in the context of how hard VW claimed to have worked to get it right from the start this time. In that sense, it IS disastrous for the NA market, because this is a car they wanted to get them back on track.
It's a three-pronged problem: they need to get reliability and total problem count at least within shouting distance of the Japanese leaders [Hon/Toy]; they need to get their pricing structure competitive, though that would be less important if they fixed problem number one; and the dealers have to be able to solve problems the first time when they do arise.
The dealers are probably no less competent than the typical Honda or Toyota guy, who lord knows, do not set the world on fire. But those people get by because they don't have to deal with so many cars with problems to begin with - it's the sheer volume of the things that break that seem to overwhelm the VW dealer body.
I've driven the New Jetta diesel, and the new Audi A3, and found both cars very impressive and expect either could meet my needs. But both are overpriced for what you get, and both scare the bejeezus out of me in terms of the risk of getting through 5-8 years of ownership without spending an inordinate amount of time in the shop. I still might pull the trigger next year, but they have to show me something before it happens - a real commitment to getting it right and keeping it that way.
The boss man seems to finally be somebody who gets it [if the new leadership at Daimler doesn't try to lure him back to run Mercedes, the job he really wanted in the first place] - sure hope he can actually accomplish something on this topic.
that so many bad cars come out of Mexico, which has had years to get their manufacturing house in order but somehow continues to produce unreliable products. Then again, Mexico now has to compete with China, whose workers are paid even less (several Mexican-based appliance manufacturers have since moved production to China).
As for VW or Audi, am waiting for a sign that things have really changed. The product's designs are better, but the dealers and service, who we'll spend most of our time with after buying the product, aren't.
Toyota, Ford, DC, Nissan are all producing in Mexico and getting quality audits that match those of their plants everywhere in the world.
VW couldn't get their US plant off its hind end [remember the PA plant??] either - it's the SYSTEM and the PROCESS, not the country or the workers. The problems are related to the design and production of the subsystems, not how they're screwed together in the final assembly. The Japanese in particular are masters at moving their SYSTEM anyplace they want to put it. VW just doesn't have the management expertise at the production design level to get what they want done without enormous extra effort. This is a German problem, not a Mexican one. BMW and MB also have struggled to get it right in SC and Alabama, respectively....they don't have the total picture as clearly focused as Honda and Toyota.
For every VW Jetta buyer there appears to be 3 potential buyers who refuse to buy one based on reliability fears!
What is the solution? An industry leading warranty for all VWs.! That wont happen until VW Corporate themselves have confidence about the reliability of their own products!
My advice to VW. Bite the bullet and offer a great warranty or risk being a small unfprofitbale player in N. America.
VW does offer a great warranty. 4yr/50K miles warranty is one of the top warranty's in the business. Who offers a longer warranty in their price segment? I think Hyundai offers a 10yr/100K powertrain warranty, but their basic bumper to bumper is 4yr/50K I think.
His point is that VW should go the extra mile - do something dramatic that's focused on the quality perception.
Something like 6 years/75000 would get attention. But for me, the lingering concern still is how well the dealers can cope with problems when they occur. The best warranty is the one you never have to use...they really need to get their initial satisfaction numbers in line with the best from Japan. Do that, and sales will take care of themselves.
Based on the article above, VW's troubles appear more apparent than before. I dont know about USA, but the Jetta wagon in Canada is a hit! A delay of a few years is beyond comprehension!
Problems at the Mexico plant seems to be the likeliest reason. The real source of all VW's problems is mismanagement.
Is there some good news about VW? Unfortunately the good news is based on rumor! A new VW wagon that has AWD and will be differentiated from the Jetta-line(different name, different styling) will be introduced.
Will the above happen? With VW management dont bank on it!! Or if the rumors are true a new AWD wagon's price will cause potential customers to flee to the competition.
The old Jetta wagon will continue to be produced and the new Passat Wagon is coming this year. There is also the Golf hatchback coming sometime in 2006, if I recall correctly
I don't know how significant VW wagon sales are in the US, I would guess not very...and if so that would mean they are not very significant in US and Canada combined.
I'm sure an AWD wagon will cost more than the outgoing one...but AWD, while not something I care much about, seems to be something most people are willing to pay a premium for.
What genius in Wolfsburg decided that the Jetta in our continent should be designed for young parents? If you design a car for a pretty dull market segment, dont you think you will end up with a dull car? No offense intended to young parents, in fact I am a semi-young parent myself(ok I confess I am middle aged)--but why target a Jetta to a group that is most suitable for a mini-van?
Sorry, but a baby does not a minivan make, and whoever said that parents are any duller than non-parents? A Jetta (or Golf) is a perfect car for parents with 1-2 kids - the vast majority of all parents - while a minivan is rarely justified. It's roomy (at least by European and long-forgotten US standards) and extremely safe. At the same time, available engine options are both reasonably frugal and performance-oriented. Be honest: can you look at a GLI or GTI and call it dull?
The new Jetta, in particular, is just fine for people with up to two kids. The fore-aft room in the back seat is comparable to the current-gen Passat - I've spent a lot of time in the back seat of my friend's '01 Passat, and the new Jetta offers at least as much leg room and general squirm space. Width is slightly less, of course, but that's only an issue if you want to carry three people back there.
My brother and I grew up in the '50s in a series of small sedans and wagons - mostly Ramblers - and somehow we never felt deprived or put upon in the back seats of these cars.
No, I see nothing irrational about young parents considering the new Jetta the ideal car. Not everyone needs a truck or a minivan the split second the second kid arrives.
I feel very comfortable driving a tiny BMW e46 3 series with a wife and two kids for daily commute and long road trips.
My point was let the car sell itself vs. pigeonholing a lifestyle. The prior generation Jetta was popular not only among families but also young singles and middle agers.
I notice that many Honda Ads focus on the "car" and not "silly looking trendy people" who own the car or at least act as if they own one(like as if Tiger Woods owns a Buick??)! Those Honda auto-focused ads are the type of ads I prefer. To each their own!
Hi, Just picked up my new 2006 jetta TDI with DSG trans and luxury package. So far, so good! Moved from a very tired Volvo 850 turbo ( read expensive ),mainly for the fuel savings, and the fact I am partial to european automobiles. No problems with starting or stereo, wind noise is minimal and I am impressed with the power even with the low HP numbers.DSG trans is very cool. I am in my mid forties, and the car is a company car to be used only by myself, and I am looking forward to 3 years of hopefully trouble free service. I will continue to post my experience for other readers.
Good point/suggestion. I was thinking that VW should give us a 280hp R36 version of the Golf and Jetta. This new R32 Golf isn't any improvement under the hood over the previous R32 Golf. I think that is why they are saying that VWoA doesn't have any plans to bring the "R32" here.
I have it all figured out how to save VW in this country. Since they can't compete on price dollar for dollar with the Japanese (much less the Koreans) I'd turn up the wick on the performance and features across the board.
There is no way a car with 5-cylinder engine that is rumored to be 1/2 of a Gallardo V10 need make so little power and be unrefined. I'd fix that first and give the base Jetta 190hp, and the GLI would get 225hp and then there would be a 280hp R36 version. The R36 version can be 30K, but no other Jetta model should approach 30K.
It can't cost that much to turn up the boost on the GLI and tweak the base 5-cylinder for a few more horses.
VW says they're serious about the U.S. market but I don't believe it, yet.
You think they're not serious about the U.S. market? In Canada, they don't even offer Climatronic on the Jetta or the Dynaudio option on the new Passat. Yet, the prices are significantly higher than comparably equipped cars in the U.S. which are not de-contented compared to their Canadian offerings. It's an absolute joke.
I have it all figured out how to save VW in this country. Since they can't compete on price dollar for dollar with the Japanese (much less the Koreans) I'd turn up the wick on the performance and features across the board.
Or on quality with the Japanese or even Americans. I bought mine - two - a 2001 and 2005 - only because of the extra safety features and "fun to drive" factor. Now other makers are catching up. I am very disappointed by the output of the new 5 cylinder, especially in the very heavy Jetta. On the other hand, the new Jetta has outstanding side impact crash tests.
I just wish VW would get about 180 hp of this base engine (the Accord and Camry are reported to be up to 170 hp in 2006 out of their 4 cylinder engines). There is no reason why a Malibu with its low tech, cheap V-6 should out-accelerate a VW.
"Or on quality with the Japanese or even Americans." - micweb
I have to disagree with you there... When I bought my 2000 Jetta 1.8t it was MUCH higher quality inside and out than anything in its price range from japan or america. Today, that may be a different story. Personally, I think the new Jettas look like total @$$. and in turn, they arent selling the way the old model did. I went to a dealership today, and there were more people there to snap up the 2005 jettas than there were for the 2006. Did they even change the seats?? Look and feel the same to me. Why not stick with the nice Recaro/ GLI seats? VW just shouldn't have tried to mimic the new Audi look so closely.
Hopefully, VW will cycle through this junk like Nissan did with the 2000 Altima.
There is no way a car with 5-cylinder engine that is rumored to be 1/2 of a Gallardo V10 need make so little power and be unrefined. I'd fix that first and give the base Jetta 190hp, and the GLI would get 225hp and then there would be a 280hp R36 version..
Just remember that this engine (which indeed is derived from the Gallardo) is the base engine, replacing the 100-115hp 2.0. The 2.0TFSI (in regular and GLI version) is also available. And, by all accounts, a 280-300hp R36 seems to be in the making.
someone had said they would keep the 3.6 exclusive to the Passat, and it wouldn't be available for the Jetta?
Since the '06 Passat uses the 2.0T as its base engine (sharing this engine with the Jetta), it would give it a little exclusivity if the 3.6 were solely for its use among the cars.
I assume that somewhere down the line, if VW ever gets its act together on having a new van, the 3.6 would be standard there.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I think the theory is that since there will be a Golf R32, there maybe a Golf R36 and therefore a Jetta R36.
If the Jetta R36 does appear, I don’t see it as a bargain or a poor man’s sports car. It will probably be a limited production release giving exclusivity. Since the Passat and Jetta share many components, I see the theoretical Jetta R36 being priced close to the top of the line Passat.
I have to disagree with you there... When I bought my 2000 Jetta 1.8t it was MUCH higher quality inside and out than anything in its price range from japan or america. Today, that may be a different story.
I agree - the quality you see and feel, plus the ergonomics, were and still are much better than most of what is out there. By quality, I meant repair record, which is not up to the appearance etc. quality.
you have to consider that the Accord is one of the most boring cars on the planet and handles like a blimp, while the New Jetta is relatively interesting to drive, handles way better than you'd think reading most of the reviews, and has more than enough power from the base engine. Since most people drive automatics, you'd think the fact that a six-speed auto is standard would get more press, since nobody else gives you more than four gears. Result: while "more powerful" cars are roaring away at a jillion RPM to accelerate, the Jetta is working nicely with all six gears and keeping revs and engine noise at a nice point. As to more power from the base engine - - think about VW - - every time they come along a year or two later and extract another 10 to 20 percent out of their engines. So they've just been conservative to give themselves somewhere to go with the engine for the next few years. I am sure they'll end up with 180~200 out of that box.
"you have to consider that the Accord is one of the most boring cars on the planet and handles like a blimp"
You must have never driven a blimp. :-)
It is great that VW popped a 6-speed auto in the Jetta, but then they need to complete the package. Lump the best auto tranny with the slowest engine in the segment, then price it as a premium compact, and a lot of potential buyers will walk on by. "Premium" should mean a well-balanced package that is a step up from regular compact cars. Key word: well-balanced.
Plus, a car like this shouldn't really have a "value edition", which doesn't compete well with other compact cars at the price on its sticker.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
The thing is for the price, the Jetta should have 180-200hp right now. Especially considering its got a cylinder up on all the 4-cylinder competition.
I can't remember what Korean car it is, but they brag about it having a I6, but it has a ridicuously low hp number, like 160hp or something. Thats absurd for them to brag about such an under-performing engine.
The previous numbers are not lies. The SAE changed the way the testing was done for 2006. The previous testing procedure had loopholes in them that many manufacturers took advantage. Much in the same way that manufacturers took advantage by calling vehicles like Outbacks, Pacificas, PT Cruisers trucks in order to meet lower safety and fuel economy standards.
But I think that people, if I may speak for the masses, are saying it requires more hp (power) because the performance is not what it “should” be for a 5cyl car with a 6speed transmission.
I was expecting a “miracle” with that combo – 5 Cyl (high torque) with a 6 speed tranny (expect miracle different discussion)
Maybe the real world driving is more than adequate even if it is not drag race champ. Like the article said (quoting Edmunds) hp is not what drives family sedan sales.
So for 2006 the BASE Jetta may only have 40 (or less) hp difference between it and a V6 Camry; this should make some people happy it’s almost like taking a $10 bill and putting another zero at the end; it may make you happy thinking you have more, but if you can’t put it to real world use it’s just funny money “funny hp?”
Personally I would not care if it was rated at 120hp with a 6 speed if it had a 0-60 of 8.0 1/4mi under 17
Read the second paragraph where it says "strict new tests". Nobody lied - they just took advantage of the testing standards. The word lie isn't anywhere in the article. jeffyscott used the word.
Not to get into the whole semantics of “depends what is IS” but when I read “new tests force automakers to come clean with buyers” I read it as saying they were deceptive.
Not to say they were (I have no idea), just stating the article has a slant (or spin if you will) indicating the automakers were misleading.
If I were to tell my wife “I’m going to come clean with you honey” I think red flags would go up :P
That's how they designed the headline - to draw you in and read the article. It's only in the article that they gloss over the fact (the important part) that the tests changed. They also gloss over the fact that not all manufacturers are using the new test yet because only new or revised powertrains have to be tested under the new standards. Honda and Toyota are retesting every engine - new, revised, or not.
Reminds me of a recent TV news story here in Boston:
"Big Dig Tunnel Hit By New Problem".
"Tunnel Shut Down Due to Dirt Falling From Roof"
Towards the end of the story they reveal:
"Problem caused by truck that was not working on the project that lost it's load above an air flow grate".
I think this is the only place I have posted this link. I saw it posted it on Ford Fusion forum by someone else. I thought it was worthwhile to post it here as not everyone reading about the Jetta is also going to be reading about the Fusion. My deepest apologies if I have offended you by causing you to have to see this link more than once. Should I email you for approval before posting any links in the future?
No need for sarcasm. I thought I saw that you had posted it in a few places. Perhaps it was a similar user name. I'm just tired of seeing it all over the place. The Detroit News really blew it out of proportion.
I saw the GLI at my local VW dealership. It was the fully-loaded package with the power seats, dual-zone A/C, leather, DSG Transmission, 17" alloy wheels, etc. with a sticker price of 28K.
isn't that pretty much the same price as the A3 with sport package? Of course, they have different body styles so they won't compete directly, but VWs priced the same as comparable (in performance and amenities) Audis sounds like VW needs to examine its pricing structure.
My local dealer got a whole stack of '06 Jettas in, and I could see it from the freeway, so I thought I would stop by. They were not for retail sale: in the windows of every one was a sign reading "Enterprise RAC".
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
They get the good engines, while we get stuck with the 5 cylinder...
If it were up to me, I would make the 2.0T the base engine, the 5 cylinder would be the TDI engine, and the R36 would be the top of the line. But that's just me...
> Um your link says base engine in Europe is 102 hp, 1.6 liter...so how are we worse off with 150 HP, 2.5 liter, 5 cylinder?
My point is that they have more choices than we do. And if you read my previous post carefully, I would make the 2.0T the base engine and the 2.5 the turbodiesel (which would eliminate the need for timing belt changes since it has a timing chain). I'll keep my 1.8T Wolfsburg Jetta and you can have the 150hp 2.5 liter. I 'll even drive my "beater" car - 1997 Jetta Trek before I buy the abomination called Jetta V. I'll wait for the Jetta VI. Maybe VW will have its act back together by then (I'm not holding my breath, yet).
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Comments
http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosinsider/0507/31/autos-263925.htm
...sales in the United States and North America suffered, with executives blaming quality problems and the late start in introducing the revamped Jetta.
"We had serious quality problems in our Mexican plant," VW Chief Executive Bernd Pischetsrieder said during a conference call Friday with analysts. "The situation in the U.S. remains disastrous."
The company's operational loss inthe U.S. during the first six months rose to 596 million euros ($720.74 million) from 503 million euros the year before
Note the use of the past tense with regard to the quality problems. It seems to me that what he is reporting as "disastrous" is the overall financial performance...based on the paragraph that follows that statement.
Don't forget this is the new boss...maybe he is saying this company has been a disaster in the US recently to lower expectations for himself
How bout 160 horses and 34 MPG (Accord)?
~alpha
The new Jetta was targeted to that group because they are the ones that had been buying the previous Jetta. Those current owners now are moving upward in the automotive food chain and VW wanted to keep them in the fold while moving the product upmarket.
How bout 160 horses and 34 MPG (Accord)?
I heard Honda is bumping up the horsepower on the Accord for 2006 to 170. We have the same engine in our CR-V and it is smooth and sweet. As much as I like the "German feel" of the VW, the Accord is starting to look interesting.
BUT, I still may put out there that the quality coming from the Mexican plant MIGHT still be disasterous. Time will tell if VW has their act together.
The early problems with the New Jetta didn't strike me as particularly awful [based on what I've read elsewhere], but were bad in the context of how hard VW claimed to have worked to get it right from the start this time. In that sense, it IS disastrous for the NA market, because this is a car they wanted to get them back on track.
It's a three-pronged problem: they need to get reliability and total problem count at least within shouting distance of the Japanese leaders [Hon/Toy]; they need to get their pricing structure competitive, though that would be less important if they fixed problem number one; and the dealers have to be able to solve problems the first time when they do arise.
The dealers are probably no less competent than the typical Honda or Toyota guy, who lord knows, do not set the world on fire. But those people get by because they don't have to deal with so many cars with problems to begin with - it's the sheer volume of the things that break that seem to overwhelm the VW dealer body.
I've driven the New Jetta diesel, and the new Audi A3, and found both cars very impressive and expect either could meet my needs. But both are overpriced for what you get, and both scare the bejeezus out of me in terms of the risk of getting through 5-8 years of ownership without spending an inordinate amount of time in the shop. I still might pull the trigger next year, but they have to show me something before it happens - a real commitment to getting it right and keeping it that way.
The boss man seems to finally be somebody who gets it [if the new leadership at Daimler doesn't try to lure him back to run Mercedes, the job he really wanted in the first place] - sure hope he can actually accomplish something on this topic.
Then again, Mexico now has to compete with China, whose workers are paid even less (several Mexican-based appliance manufacturers have since moved production to China).
As for VW or Audi, am waiting for a sign that things have really changed. The product's designs are better, but the dealers and service, who we'll spend most of our time with after buying the product, aren't.
Toyota, Ford, DC, Nissan are all producing in Mexico and getting quality audits that match those of their plants everywhere in the world.
VW couldn't get their US plant off its hind end [remember the PA plant??] either - it's the SYSTEM and the PROCESS, not the country or the workers. The problems are related to the design and production of the subsystems, not how they're screwed together in the final assembly. The Japanese in particular are masters at moving their SYSTEM anyplace they want to put it. VW just doesn't have the management expertise at the production design level to get what they want done without enormous extra effort. This is a German problem, not a Mexican one. BMW and MB also have struggled to get it right in SC and Alabama, respectively....they don't have the total picture as clearly focused as Honda and Toyota.
What is the solution? An industry leading warranty for all VWs.! That wont happen until VW Corporate themselves have confidence about the reliability of their own products!
My advice to VW. Bite the bullet and offer a great warranty or risk being a small unfprofitbale player in N. America.
Something like 6 years/75000 would get attention. But for me, the lingering concern still is how well the dealers can cope with problems when they occur. The best warranty is the one you never have to use...they really need to get their initial satisfaction numbers in line with the best from Japan. Do that, and sales will take care of themselves.
Based on the article above, VW's troubles appear more apparent than before. I dont know about USA, but the Jetta wagon in Canada is a hit! A delay of a few years is beyond comprehension!
Problems at the Mexico plant seems to be the likeliest reason. The real source of all VW's problems is mismanagement.
Is there some good news about VW? Unfortunately the good news is based on rumor! A new VW wagon that has AWD and will be differentiated from the Jetta-line(different name, different styling) will be introduced.
Will the above happen? With VW management dont bank on it!! Or if the rumors are true a new AWD wagon's price will cause potential customers to flee to the competition.
I don't know how significant VW wagon sales are in the US, I would guess not very...and if so that would mean they are not very significant in US and Canada combined.
I'm sure an AWD wagon will cost more than the outgoing one...but AWD, while not something I care much about, seems to be something most people are willing to pay a premium for.
Sorry, but a baby does not a minivan make, and whoever said that parents are any duller than non-parents? A Jetta (or Golf) is a perfect car for parents with 1-2 kids - the vast majority of all parents - while a minivan is rarely justified. It's roomy (at least by European and long-forgotten US standards) and extremely safe. At the same time, available engine options are both reasonably frugal and performance-oriented. Be honest: can you look at a GLI or GTI and call it dull?
My brother and I grew up in the '50s in a series of small sedans and wagons - mostly Ramblers - and somehow we never felt deprived or put upon in the back seats of these cars.
No, I see nothing irrational about young parents considering the new Jetta the ideal car. Not everyone needs a truck or a minivan the split second the second kid arrives.
I feel very comfortable driving a tiny BMW e46 3 series with a wife and two kids for daily commute and long road trips.
My point was let the car sell itself vs. pigeonholing a lifestyle. The prior generation Jetta was popular not only among families but also young singles and middle agers.
I notice that many Honda Ads focus on the "car" and not "silly looking trendy people" who own the car or at least act as if they own one(like as if Tiger Woods owns a Buick??)! Those Honda auto-focused ads are the type of ads I prefer. To each their own!
Also, how is the "Premium" sound system?
Any wind noise in the car?
Thanks.
Just picked up my new 2006 jetta TDI with DSG trans and luxury package. So far, so good! Moved from a very tired Volvo 850 turbo ( read expensive ),mainly for the fuel savings, and the fact I am partial to european automobiles. No problems with starting or stereo, wind noise is minimal and I am impressed with the power even with the low HP numbers.DSG trans is very cool. I am in my mid forties, and the car is a company car to be used only by myself, and I am looking forward to 3 years of hopefully trouble free service. I will continue to post my experience for other readers.
http://www.vwvortex.com/artman/publish/volkswagen_news/article_1472.shtml
I have it all figured out how to save VW in this country. Since they can't compete on price dollar for dollar with the Japanese (much less the Koreans) I'd turn up the wick on the performance and features across the board.
There is no way a car with 5-cylinder engine that is rumored to be 1/2 of a Gallardo V10 need make so little power and be unrefined. I'd fix that first and give the base Jetta 190hp, and the GLI would get 225hp and then there would be a 280hp R36 version. The R36 version can be 30K, but no other Jetta model should approach 30K.
It can't cost that much to turn up the boost on the GLI and tweak the base 5-cylinder for a few more horses.
VW says they're serious about the U.S. market but I don't believe it, yet.
M
I have it all figured out how to save VW in this country. Since they can't compete on price dollar for dollar with the Japanese (much less the Koreans) I'd turn up the wick on the performance and features across the board.
Or on quality with the Japanese or even Americans. I bought mine - two - a 2001 and 2005 - only because of the extra safety features and "fun to drive" factor. Now other makers are catching up. I am very disappointed by the output of the new 5 cylinder, especially in the very heavy Jetta. On the other hand, the new Jetta has outstanding side impact crash tests.
I just wish VW would get about 180 hp of this base engine (the Accord and Camry are reported to be up to 170 hp in 2006 out of their 4 cylinder engines). There is no reason why a Malibu with its low tech, cheap V-6 should out-accelerate a VW.
I have to disagree with you there... When I bought my 2000 Jetta 1.8t it was MUCH higher quality inside and out than anything in its price range from japan or america. Today, that may be a different story.
Personally, I think the new Jettas look like total @$$. and in turn, they arent selling the way the old model did. I went to a dealership today, and there were more people there to snap up the 2005 jettas than there were for the 2006. Did they even change the seats?? Look and feel the same to me. Why not stick with the nice Recaro/ GLI seats? VW just shouldn't have tried to mimic the new Audi look so closely.
Hopefully, VW will cycle through this junk like Nissan did with the 2000 Altima.
Just remember that this engine (which indeed is derived from the Gallardo) is the base engine, replacing the 100-115hp 2.0. The 2.0TFSI (in regular and GLI version) is also available. And, by all accounts, a 280-300hp R36 seems to be in the making.
Since the '06 Passat uses the 2.0T as its base engine (sharing this engine with the Jetta), it would give it a little exclusivity if the 3.6 were solely for its use among the cars.
I assume that somewhere down the line, if VW ever gets its act together on having a new van, the 3.6 would be standard there.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
If the Jetta R36 does appear, I don’t see it as a bargain or a poor man’s sports car. It will probably be a limited production release giving exclusivity. Since the Passat and Jetta share many components, I see the theoretical Jetta R36 being priced close to the top of the line Passat.
Who knows it’s VW hard to predict.
I have to disagree with you there... When I bought my 2000 Jetta 1.8t it was MUCH higher quality inside and out than anything in its price range from japan or america. Today, that may be a different story.
I agree - the quality you see and feel, plus the ergonomics, were and still are much better than most of what is out there. By quality, I meant repair record, which is not up to the appearance etc. quality.
You must have never driven a blimp. :-)
It is great that VW popped a 6-speed auto in the Jetta, but then they need to complete the package. Lump the best auto tranny with the slowest engine in the segment, then price it as a premium compact, and a lot of potential buyers will walk on by. "Premium" should mean a well-balanced package that is a step up from regular compact cars. Key word: well-balanced.
Plus, a car like this shouldn't really have a "value edition", which doesn't compete well with other compact cars at the price on its sticker.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I can't remember what Korean car it is, but they brag about it having a I6, but it has a ridicuously low hp number, like 160hp or something. Thats absurd for them to brag about such an under-performing engine.
M
Especially since the numbers may be lies anyway...
http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosinsider/0508/17/A01-283759.htm
The previous numbers are not lies. The SAE changed the way the testing was done for 2006. The previous testing procedure had loopholes in them that many manufacturers took advantage. Much in the same way that manufacturers took advantage by calling vehicles like Outbacks, Pacificas, PT Cruisers trucks in order to meet lower safety and fuel economy standards.
But I think that people, if I may speak for the masses, are saying it requires more hp (power) because the performance is not what it “should” be for a 5cyl car with a 6speed transmission.
I was expecting a “miracle” with that combo – 5 Cyl (high torque) with a 6 speed tranny (expect miracle different discussion)
Maybe the real world driving is more than adequate even if it is not drag race champ. Like the article said (quoting Edmunds) hp is not what drives family sedan sales.
So for 2006 the BASE Jetta may only have 40 (or less) hp difference between it and a V6 Camry; this should make some people happy it’s almost like taking a $10 bill and putting another zero at the end; it may make you happy thinking you have more, but if you can’t put it to real world use it’s just funny money “funny hp?”
Personally I would not care if it was rated at 120hp with a 6 speed if it had a 0-60 of 8.0 1/4mi under 17
The title
Asians oversell horsepower:
Toyota, Honda inflated claims of engine muscle; new tests force automakers to come clean with buyers.
Not to say they were (I have no idea), just stating the article has a slant (or spin if you will) indicating the automakers were misleading.
If I were to tell my wife “I’m going to come clean with you honey” I think red flags would go up :P
Reminds me of a recent TV news story here in Boston:
"Big Dig Tunnel Hit By New Problem".
"Tunnel Shut Down Due to Dirt Falling From Roof"
Towards the end of the story they reveal:
"Problem caused by truck that was not working on the project that lost it's load above an air flow grate".
Hmm. If it bleeds - it leads.
I think this is the only place I have posted this link. I saw it posted it on Ford Fusion forum by someone else. I thought it was worthwhile to post it here as not everyone reading about the Jetta is also going to be reading about the Fusion. My deepest apologies if I have offended you by causing you to have to see this link more than once. Should I email you for approval before posting any links in the future?
My apologies for offending you.
Peace and Out.
My local dealer got a whole stack of '06 Jettas in, and I could see it from the freeway, so I thought I would stop by. They were not for retail sale: in the windows of every one was a sign reading "Enterprise RAC".
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
With the combination of VWoA's boneheaded decisions and the Euro exchange rate - I'm not holding my breath....
If it were up to me, I would make the 2.0T the base engine, the 5 cylinder would be the TDI engine, and the R36 would be the top of the line. But that's just me...
http://www.vwvortex.com/artman/publish/volkswagen_news/article_1489.shtml
We are happy with the 5 cylinder and would not want to pay more for a turbo that we really do not want...if you want it you are free to pay for it.
My point is that they have more choices than we do. And if you read my previous post carefully, I would make the 2.0T the base engine and the 2.5 the turbodiesel (which would eliminate the need for timing belt changes since it has a timing chain). I'll keep my 1.8T Wolfsburg Jetta and you can have the 150hp 2.5 liter. I 'll even drive my "beater" car - 1997 Jetta Trek before I buy the abomination called Jetta V. I'll wait for the Jetta VI. Maybe VW will have its act back together by then (I'm not holding my breath, yet).