Honda Accord vs Acura TSX

clstayton

Since the TSX is smaller than the Accord, I would assume that the Accord has a better ride in respect to comfort and noise control than the TSX. I am sure the TSX handles better on curves etc., but how does it compare on long trips. Many smaller cars are not good companions for traveling many miles. What do you say - you TSX owners. I like the looks and added fun the TSX most likely provides, bur what is it like to ride in for several days when you want to put in 8 to 10 hour driving times?

johnny420

8-10 hours is a long time to drive in any car, but I have driven over 300 miles at a stretch in my TSX, and it's pretty comfortable. I'd have to say my 2000 Accord was slightly more comfortable, and roomier too, but the TSX does the job.

The TSX doesn't just handle a little better than my old Accord, it handles a lot better. The 200 HP V6 in the Accord, though, is probably a better powerplant than the 200 HP I4 in the TSX. The new Accord V6 will blow it away (240HP) straightline, sacrificing some handling in the process.

Road noise can be pronounced in the TSX, but so it was in the 2000 Accord, too. I hear the new ones are better. In spite of road noise, the TSX is very solid. I've yet to hear a rattle in mine.

The seats in the new Accord and the TSX are excellent, but if I were going to make frequent 8-10 hour drives, I'd probably have gotten the Accord. It's quite a bit roomier and has a softer ride. It's just a better highway cruiser, and still fun to drive. Believe it or not, the 240HP V6 will probably get significantly better gas mileage, too, on regular unleaded fuel.

Have you considered the '04 TL?

Johnny

clstayton

Thanks for the info on the TSX. I believe you have answered my one concern about it. I don't believe you can beat the price for all it has to offer, but I need a vehicle that provides comfort on long trips.

Have you driven the TL? I live in an area where the nearest Acura dealer is almost 100 miles away. Thus, I have not driven either the TSX or the TL. I have driven the Accord and Passat and compared them to the TSX and TL using my computer. I like the Passat, but the reliability is not there like it is for the Accord and the Accord is more roomy. But, I like the Passat ride best. It really handles rough roads better than any similarly priced vehicle I have driven.
And, it is a very quiet vehicle compared to the Accord. If you have driven the TL, I would appreciate your comments. It is quite pricey compared to the Accord.

I own a 2004 Honda Pilot, but I'm looking for a fun to drive, comfortable sedan. My wife wanted a SUV and I believe the Pilot was an excellent choice!

riez

Accord EX V6 coupe wins their 3-car comparison test against Solara SE Sport and Sebring LXi Coupe. Interesting performance data for Accord, which has 6-speed manual: 0-60 mph in a mere 6.3 seconds! 1/4 mile in 14.8 seconds at 97.2 mph. Pulled 0.81g with decent 63.9 mph speed thru slalom. And it achieved the best mpg (23.3 overall).

If you can live with a coupe, the Accord is a heck of a value.

johnny420

I test drove the TL in its 6 sp MT form, which differs from the AT version in that it has a sport-tuned suspension and exhaust, and powerful Brembo brakes up front. It is a sweet ride, providing all the HP and room the TSX lacks.

Like the TSX, it does sport a rather stiff ride, but it's not jarring, and the car is very comfortable and luxurious, with a well-appointed interior. Road noise is probably on par with the Accord, meaning it's not especially quiet, so if that's important to you, I'd suggest test driving it over a variety of rough road surfaces. I can't speak to the Passat in this regard.

The TL also handles very well, and has a terrific drivetrain. The Brembo brakes are outstanding. I think it's a great car, and might well own one someday in the near future.

If quietness, plushness and long-trip comfort are paramount for you, perhaps the Passat would be best.

Try reading some of the Acura TL board here at Edmunds. There you can converse with TL owners. Most are very happy with their cars.

Johnny

clstayton

Thanks for the 2004 TL info. I had a feeling it was a great vehicle. Consumer Report just gave in a number one rating in its class. I think I would be quite pleased with it. I need to make the trip to test drive one.

Thanks again for your info on both the TSX and the TL.

Chuck

algroth

A bit off the subject matter, but here goes: Mazda took back my 2003 Mazda 6 V6 and even though I've only had my 2004 Accord V6 for a week, I'll say this: the quality of the Accord is like night and day compared to the Mazda. In nearly every way the Accord is a better car (especially much faster); the only advantages of the Mazda were a bigger trunk and a sportier, tighter feel on the road and on curves. Just thought you'd like to know.

carguy58

thinking if unchanged for the 05 model year and the discounts are significant on the 6 I would trade in my Acura CL and go back to the Mazda camp. Some people haven't had a lot of luck going from the Honda camp to the Mazda camp. I wonder if its some kind of curse or something.

anonymousposts

Trading a CL Type-S for a 6 of any level?? The CL seems like so much more car even if it doesn't handle as well.

carguy58

I really like the styling of the 6. I have the base 02 CL. I don't know just a thought. I really like the Acura but the 6 is very nice looking. I have to see what rebates are on the 6 next year(not this year.)

rluerra

Before I start this post I just want to say that Honda deserves a big hand for these two great vehicles. I started my search for a new car about two months ago. It all started when I saw the picture of the new TSX. I instantly fell in love with the looks of this vehicle. The next step was a test drive. I was hooked on this car. The TSX handled like a dream. After test-driving the TSX I went next door to test-drive the new Accord EX-L sedan (I heard many good things about this vehicle including the Edmunds most wanted award). I was as equally impressed with this vehicle (both vehicles tested where man. trans). I was very surprised that the Accord was comparable to the TSX in terms of speed and handling (Honda clutches are the best). I thought and pondered about both vehicles all week long before making the purchase.

I liked the TSX looks (I also think the Accord looks good, but the TSX won in this category). Yet I liked the Accords inside room (a big difference in terms of space from the TSX) and the fact I could get one with a navigation system. So when it came down to it I purchased a 04 Accord Sedan EX-L (5spd. MT) with naviagation for 23600.00 (two hundred over invoice). The interior room was the clincher (on my second test drive of the TSX I sat in the back seat and I would pity the passenger taller than 6 foot). In the end I chose the Accord because I really felt the differences from the TSX to the Accord was not worth the price (2500 difference). I also felt that the Accord was just as good in terms of handling and driving excitement. IMO give both a shot, no matter what you’re getting a great vehicle.

tlauro

for those that are considering the Accord but want better handling, it can be done very cost effectively.

Just adding the front and rear sway bars from the 04TL to the 7th Gen Accord and then the 6spd Accord Coupe's Strut Tower Bar will greatly increase the abilites of the vehicle in the twisties. Total Cost is about $225 for all the parts.

Add it a good set of tires to replace the stock rubber and it will handle like a dream. I like Pilots.

I'll stack mine up against a TSX any day and will soon do so as Auto X is big here in my area

fedlawman

You can definitely upgrade the Accord with suspension upgrades to basically match the TSX.

Shocks and springs - $600
Sway bars and bushings - $350
17" Alloys - $500
17" Tires - $500
Installation - $350 ($70/hr for 5 hours)

Accord EX sedan w/leather MSRP - $23,500
Suspension upgrades - $2,300

Total - $25,800

But the TSX still has...

Subjectively better styling
Exclusivity
4 year, 50,000 mile warranty w/ roadside assist
Free service loaner cars
Shorter wheelbase, length, width
6-speed MT
TCS/VSC
360 Watt, 8 speaker stereo
Dual exhaust
Xenon headlights
Wood or titanium trim
40 more horsepower

And it only costs about $1000 more than an "upgraded Accord." If your looking for auto transmission, the price is now even.

lmacmil

Maybe it's just me but I don't think it makes sense to spend a lot of money "upgrading" a new vehicle to make it ride/handle/perform like something that already exists. All the upgrade money is basically flushed down the drain at trade-in/sale time. Few, if any, would be willing to pay extra for that stuff.

I too am comparing the manual TSX vs. the V6 Accord coupe. Styling-wise I'd call it a tossup (tho' the TSX is definitely better looking than the Accord sedan). The TSX probably has a slight edge on interior quality and 4 doors are definitely more practical if anyone needs to ride in the back seat. The TSX has a better warranty and more exclusivity.

The big difference for me is the V6 in the Accord. The low end torque and power is great to have when you need it. For the kind of driving I do, I'll never notice if one handles better than the other.

Fortunately, I don't have to make a decision anytime soon.

fedlawman

It all depends on what you want...

4 doors or 2?

Do you prefer better handling or more horsepower?

Both cars are excellent choices.

280hp

The reason not to go with the TSX is that its not called the Honda Accord here, while the Honda is.

ok. that probably doesnt make sense...

lmacmil

One thing that might sway my decision is that the closest Acura dealer is 100 miles away. I know the Honda dealer could do routine maintenance but should the Acura need warranty work, I'm sure I'd need to go back to the dealer.

flowerpower

hi, just a note on interiors between the two on the tsx problems and solutions board owners of tsx are noting that the leather on the tsx is painted vinyl and that several owners are having discoloration problems due to belts(clothing type staining the quote leather interior of the tsx when wet ie raining etc or other items purses etc has anyone experienced this with the accord leather interior. thanks for any feedback.

fedlawman

"owners of tsx are noting that the leather on the tsx is painted vinyl and that several owners are having discoloration problems..."

One guy had a cheap leather belt rub off on the seat. Sounds like he needs a better belt...

blane

My 2004 Accord Coupe's light tan leather has had no problems since December. Perhaps fedlawman's right about belt quality.

tommyijr

TSX w/ parchment interior, had the ride since Aug. '03 and not one problem w/ the color....

kapus

After much consideration I think I am going to get the Accord. I like the TSX styling more than the Accord, but in general the difference between the two cars is not worth the premium in my opinion, especially now when the Acura dealers are not providing any deals on the TSX. Maybe this will change next year when the newness of the TSX wears off and there is a larger supply. Also, with the TSX you end up paying for a lot of frills which are not important, at least to me, like heated leater seats and wood trim. I'll take the money I saved by buying the Accord and go on a couple of nice vacations.

analyst7

This was a very tough call. The Accord EXV6 has more power, XM, more room, lower cost,but no soul. I felt like I was driving a "fine family car." Great for the kids, but don't take the corners too fast. And that smilin' butt - I couldn't live with that even after spending time in the nice interior.

The TSX is smaller, less powerful but still really quick, much better handling, though the ride's a little firmer. Its sleek, understated exterior styling cloaks a phenomenally elegant, comfortable, contemporary interior right down to the deep blue interior light that highlights the center console at night. The gauges are more beautiful than Accord's and the speedometer isn't the size of a wall-mounted kichen clock. Plus, the TSX has a fantastic tiptronic-style auto transmission that is as seamless as they come, an option unavailable on any Accord. Finally, the rear seats fold down 60/40 unlike the Accord sedan's single-seat fold.

Even though the TSX cost more, it is still an excellent value for what it is - a little jewel that rewards its driver in spades. The pearl white/parchment combination is fantastic, and my car gets a lot of stares, either due to its exclusivity, its look, or both.

Again, these are both fine cars. If you first and foremost need seating for five as a primary car, the Accord should probably be it. If you have even a moderate interest in a more compelling driving experience, the TSX is it. Both cars are worth the price paid, even though the TSX is only modestly discounted at this point.

lmacmil

I love the look of the TSX and it is appointed beautifully. After driving the automatic version (they had no manual version in stock), I don't think it has enough low end torque. Haven't driven an Accord yet but I have no doubt that the V6 will be just fine. Don't care for the rear end of the sedan but the coupe looks fine and I don't need for doors. The fact that the nearest Acura dealers is almost 100 miles away is also a factor. Won't be deciding any time soon so I'll keep reading what others have to say.

greathanny

I haven't driven a TSX yet since there are no dealers in my city. In general, I like the new Accord; however, I really don't like the quality/feel of the leather that comes in the Accord. It feels somewhat plasticy, stiff and cheap. I really like the leather in, for example, the Lexus ES 300 -- its a soft luxurious feeling leather. Can anyone describe the leather in the TSX? Is it similar to the Accord leather? Is it a soft leather, stiff leather, or somewhere in between? Does it feel cheap (plasticy) or luxurious? Thanks in advance.

jlb1166

Analyst7;

I also have Pearl w/Parchment. It is a very classy combination and I too get lots of looks and compliements.

I agree with your assessment of the TSX vs. Accord and would add that I also enjoy the fact that I never see another TSX on the road. You can't swing a dead cat without hitting an Accord in my town.

analyst7

Jlb,

Thank you for your reply, and I'm glad you're happy with your TSX. You just forgot to add WHY you can't swing a dead cat without hitting an Accord. It's not because they're so many Accords are out there, it's just that they can't swerve out of the way in time.

Analyst7

analyst7

Greathanny, it sounds like you're really...uh...into leather. As a TSX owner, I don't think the TSX leather feels cheap. It is perforated (I don't think the Accord leather is perforated) and comfortable. THe perforation helps the leather breathe, I understand, and stay cool in the summer. I also felt the Accord leather was comfortable, too. Too your point, the Honda/Acura grade of leather is not that buttery-soft grade of Lexus or Jaguar, but it is far above Mazda. If you want to feel cheap leather, sit in a Mazda 6. In fact, aside from the actual seating surfaces, Mazda uses "leatherette" on the borders of the seat and interior. You could trampoline on it if you want.

I hope that helps, and also hope that your quest for comfortable leather is limited primarily to auto seats, and not to the crack of Mistress Ramona's Indonesian Bullwhip.

Have a good one,

Analyst7

aardvark

I've driven the Camry LE, Honda EX V-6 and a TSX.
All are very fine cars, but I've settled on the TSX.

Some of the reasons were covered by Analyst 7, but handling was the biggest reason. The Camry is probably the ideal car for the 8 hour drive: very spacious, very quiet and very comfortable. By comparison, the Accord is more of a driver's car. It handles more nimbly, and the V-6 acceleration is hard to beat.

But I drove the Accord after the TSX, and it seemed to handle more like the Camry than it did the TSX.

The biggest surprise came from my wife. She liked the TSX, but almost immediately ruled out the Camry as too big, then pretty much thought the same of the Accord. And this is someone who likes lots of trunk space! But she just doesn't want to drive what seems like a bigger car, and the TSX's handling gives her a better sense of control.

So on the evolutionary scale, the Camry goes to the right as "Dad's car," aka big cruiser (I'm sure some big [non-permissible content removed] Cadillac or Buick is ever further to the right) while the Accord is more to the left as a driver's car, while the TSX starts to get into the bonafide sports sedan territory (the real sports sedans being those whose names you can fill in the blank).

The other evolution I've noticed since it has been ten years since I've bought a car is that technology has allowed automakers not to improve gas mileage, but to simply make today's cars bigger. My '94 Accord gets as good or better gas mileage than the '04 model (and I'm not talking the V-6). And yet today's model is considerably more roomy. That's all well and good, unless you just don't want to be driving a bigger vehicle.
In other words, the TSX, based on the slightly smaller European Accord, is probably very close in size to what we've had.

Given the choice, many would gladly opt for the bigger, roomier car. We didn't.

And the TSX is just a lot more fun to drive.

dep

We just drove both the TSX and the EX v6 Accord; both auto. The TSX was as a loaner while another car was in getting some work done so I got a chance to really drive it.

Here are some thoughts I have on the two cars:

+s for TSX
Styling (int. and ext.)
Handling in tight turns
HID head lights
Crisp auto-manual shifter (you will need it; see below)
VSC standard
4y/50k

-s for TSX
Smal power plant; I felt like I needed to use the auto-manual to get just OK performance out of the car VS that Accord or TL
No memory seats, mirrors, etc.
Radio was good but did not live up the the billing
Only driver window is auto down/up

+ for Accord
Styling (int. and ext); but 2nd place to the TSX
Power plant; lots of power from slow to fast
Good fuel econ. for a 240hp eng.
Seats are great
More room than the previous gen. Accord/TL
XM Radio; nice to have it standard
VSC standard
Smooth 5 speed auto. trans.; but no auto-manual
Very smart key/remote entry all-in-one
Price; at ~$23,500 it is the best value in its class; IMO

-s for the Accord
Not as agile as the TSX at its limits
No memory seats, mirrors, etc.
No HID lights
No auto-dimming mirror
No auto-manual available
No 'sport' tuned package; would have paid another $1000+ for 17" tires, sport tuned suspension, etc.

We went with the Accord as we could not get over the lack of power in the auto TSX. Had we wanted a manual we MIGHT have felt the TSX was more capable; not sure.

tblazer503

I had an '03 Accord EX 2.4L 5MT, traded it in for the 04 TSX Graphite w/ Navi, charcoal leather. If anyone is interested, here is my breakdown of the differences....

Appearance:
TSX Hands down... I generally run PIAA Super HID Plasma's in all cars, so that saved me a little bit of $$. If I could have my way, I would have gotten the TL due to all LED lighting in the rear, and dual HID's, but lack of $$$ stopped that dead in it's tracks. =o)

Power:
They are both the same. 2.4L one has a slightly higher c/r and takes more expensive gas, the only real difference is that you can hold a gear longer and get that extra HP out of it, other than that, it's a wash IMO. I do hate the drive-by-wire system, really diminishes response time IMO.

Drivetrain:
Love the tiptronic on the TSX. "almost like driving a manual" but not really... I can shift faster, but not as consistently as the AT... =o) And the AT is included in the price.

Handling:
Everyone that has ridden in the TSX agrees. TSX handles much better than the Accord did. The TSX feels like it has a firmer grip on the ground, and it doesn't feel as "squirrelly" as the Accord did during turns. 17's are great on the TSX

Interior:
Love the gauges even more than I loved the Accords. Love my Navi. Leather w/ heated seats, really enjoy the trim, and the stereo is actually 1/2 decent.

Space/Cargo room:
For interior space, the Accord wins. No one sits in the back seat of the TSX because no one I know has legs that are only 3" thick. =o) I hate it when there are knees in my back... Trunk space is much bigger in the TSX... didn't have to upgrade the speaker system, so I don't have that cumbersome amp rack, and 2-12" speakers in the back... =o)

This is how they stack up in value IMO
Outside Appearance: TSX +1000 (needs nothing IMO)
Power: TSX -500 (no difference, but gas is more)
Drivetrain: TSX +500 (VSA + tiptronic)
Handling: TSX +1000
Interior: TSX +1000 (Stereo, lighting, accents, IP cluster, etc)
Extra Warranty: ~500-1000(loaner car, roadside for 4 years, extra length, etc)

So this puts a $3000 premium on the TSX in my book over the Accord EX-L 4cyl w/ Auto/Navi.

MSRP of the Accord would have been 26,790 say you get $200 over invoice...24,354.
MSRP of the TSX was 29060. Since it was a slow day I picked it up for just under 27,000 Out the door including the all season mats, license, etc. Not a bad deal, too bad I owed too much on the Accord...=oP

BTW, for those who hate that brake dust. I just Put some Meguiars polish on all the rims and I notice 2 weeks later, they are not very dirty. even the inside dish gets pretty clean with just a spray of water now... hopefully it will last....

Good luck everyone, and hopefully i'll keep this one for more than 18months... =o)

(darned bad habits...)
'00 Civic EX 4dr 04/00-09/01
'02 Trailblazer 4X4 LS 09/01-11/02
'03 Accord EX 4dr 11/02-03/04
'04 TSX Navi Auto....... hopefully the last one in a while...

lmacmil

Are you actually buying and trading on 14-18 month intervals? Why don't you lease?

Re: power. Are you saying the manual Accord was about the same as the auto TSX? I drove an auto TSX and didn't think it had much ooomph. I didn't try shifting it manually.

ac00lra

I have the TSX and the leather in it is much better than the Accord's leather in my opinion. My friend who owns a Bimmer kept saying that my leather is now BMW quality. The TSX's version feels much higher in quality.

lexusguy

To the folks that would like a little more power on their TSX, remember that it is essentially the same engine as the RSX TypeS, and there are A LOT of upgrades for that car. A simple air intake\exhaust upgrade could easily add 30hp or so, and make the car feel much more responsive. Or, add a JR supercharger, give yourself 350hp, and smoke any EX V6 that comes your way

groupworker

I am a mom of 3 teens and after driving a volvo station wagon for 6 years and a dodge caravan mini van for 6 years I was ready for something small, fuel efficient and fun. After driving the altima, mazda 626 and honda I almost bought the honda. Just went to the Acura dealer because I was curious about the TSX and my husband had an Acura Legend in the late 80's which we loved. I immediately fell for the TSX. Couldn't believe that a 4 cyl. could have more power than the 6
cyl Honda. Also, it felt like a small luxury car that I would expect to be in the 30,000+ range. After test driving both the accord and tsx several more times we decided to go with the TSX. About $2-3,000 more than the accord, but we hope we'll make up part of that with the gas mileage and the longer warranty period.

venus537

there are 4 cyl. engines (they're turbo charged though) out there that have more power than the accord's V6. The TSX's 4 cyl. certainly isn't one of them. an accord v6 will smoke any TSX.

but then again, that's not what the TSX is all about.

lexusguy

The updated 3.0L in the Accord makes 240hp which is more than the TSX. 200hp is nothing to sneeze at though for a little 2.0L, its as much as the domestic's ancient 6 cylinders can muster. 4's can be capable of gobs of power though, just ask the Lancer Evo MR.

mulifat

<<After test driving both the accord and tsx several more times we decided to go with the TSX. About $2-3,000 more than the accord, but we hope we'll make up part of that with the gas mileage and the longer warranty period. >>

While I agree with your other points about the TSX being the better choice(I have one and my wife has the Accord) you probably will not get better mileage on the TSX vs. the Accord 6. In fact, the Accord 6 might even get slightly better gas mileage than the TSX, plus you can use regular. So between the inferior mileage and the Premium requirement, the TSX will cost you more in gas

fedlawman

groupworker - I've had my TSX for one year now and would buy it again if I was in the market...your assessment is dead on. BTW, my other car is a Volvo wagon!

venus537 - Actually, the only Accord that can smoke a 6MT TSX is the V-6 Coupe with 6MT. Saddle the Accord V-6 with an automatic transmission, and the 6MT TSX will be an even match.

lmacmil

The last MT road test produced a 14.9 quarter mile in an automatic Accord V6. No way to get that from a TSX.

lexusguy

Turbo it

fedlawman

I haven't seen the Motor Trend review...could you provide a link?

Car and Driver got 0-60 in 7.0 secs and the 1/4 mile in 15.5 secs for the Accord V-6 sedan.

They got 7.2 and 15.6 for the 6MT TSX.

Either way, they're close.

lexusguy

Yes, the TSX with the 6-speed is not a slow car. Its almost the same as what an IS300, 325i, and A4 1.8T get.. which are exactly its competition.

lmacmil

The 14.9 quarter was published in the Feb 2004 issue. In their first test of the 2003 model, they got 15.0 in Sept 2002. By contrast, they were only able to record a 16.0 for a manual TSX. Since most of us don't do 1/4 mile sprints, I'd venture to say that the low end torque of the V6 would make the Accord seem substantially quicker in everyday driving.

riez

Since the vast majority of passenger cars, esp. sedans, are sold in the USA with automatic transmissions...

1. Anyone seen a published test report anywhere (including European test of Euro-Accord, as the TSX is based on the Euro-Accord) of a TSX automatic? The lack of low-end torque and the need for high RPMs to generate HP, likely means the AT really saps performance in the TSX. I'd love to see AT test results.

2. Anyone know what percentage of V6 Accord coupes and TSXs are sold with automatics? Wonder if the percentage buying TSX MTs is higher than most other sedans, including BMW 3 Series, MB C-class, and IS300.

lexusguy

If I remember the automatic TSX hits 0-60 in about 8.5 seconds. I dont know about the 1\4 though.

riez

Lexusguy... Where did you see it? I haven't seen C&D, R&T, Motor Trend, Automobile, AutoWeek, Sport Compact Car, or Consumer Reports (all of which I subscribe to) test an automatic TSX.

anonymousposts

The automatic TSX 0-60 time is a little disappointing considering the 4 cylinder automatic Accord has been tested at the same 0-60 (8.5 seconds).

njroadrider

choice is between accord 6spd v6 coupe and the tsx.
I don't need 4 doors.
I like the styling of both, and you can dress up the ugly rear of the accord with body treatment.
v6 240 will always win over 4cyl 200.
cannot get hid lights on accord.
interior is a little nicer on tsx.
honda takes reg gas.
accord a little roomier.
accord v6 man has better handling then regular accord.
accord has xm.

please guys let me hear your feedback and thoughts.

also what will help is if someone can compare the stereos. What size are the speakers in the tsx compared to the accord? Seems like they may be the same. Thanks

lmacmil

I'm not buying anytime soon but both of these were on my "short list." Were I buying today, I'd go with the Accord V6 coupe because of the engine. I'm driving a 3.5l Intrigue now and the power/torque is great. My son has a Matrix XRS (1.8l, 180 hp) which is in the same league, speedwise, as the TSX. You have to keep the revs above 4000 to do anything and at that speed, it's pretty noisy and buzzy. I know the TSX would be smoother and quieter but there's just no way 166 lb-ft of torque can compete with 212. The regular gas is a benefit but I suspect that would be offset by the TSX superior mileage.