MY BUYING EXPERIENCE WAS HORRIBLE FOR THIS CAR. I HAD TO WAIT 5 WEEKS TO GET MY COLOR, MYSTIC GOLD METTALIC'. WITH IVORY INTERIOR. AS SOON AS I DROVE FROM THE DEALERSHIP TO MY HOUSE THE ENGINE STARTED SMOKING. THERE A LARGE BURNING SENSATION. ALSO THE DEALERSHIP FORGOT TO GET ME ALL SEASON FLOOR MATS AND ANOTHER MASTER KEY,. THEY FORGET JUST ABOUT ALL THE ACCESORIES I BOUGHT. WELL , THE BURNING CONTINUED AND I STARTED OFF TO THE DEALER AGAIN. ON MY WAY TO THE DEALER, THE PASSENGER SEAT STARTYED RATTLING. ALONG WITH THE SPEAKERS THAT I PAID 3 GRAND FOR. (MARKLEVINSON AND NAVIGATION). wHEN I GOT TO THE DEALER HE SAID THAT IT WOULD TAKE ONE WEEK TO CHECK MY CAR OUT AND THEY HAD FORGOTTEN TO CHECK MY CAR FOR DEFECTS AND MAINTANCE. ALSO , THE DEALER HAD PRMISED TO GET MY MASTER KEY AND FLOOR MATS WHEN I CAME BACK AND GUESS WHAT , HE DIDN'T. THEN THE DEALERSHIP GAVE ME THIS CRAPPY RENTAL CAR THATS ALMOST AS BAD AS MY OLD INTEGRA THAT HAS 365,000 MILES ON IT NOW. MY BUYING EXPERIENCE WAS HORRIBLE WITH LEXUS. ILL GIV THE DEALERSHIP A CHANCE TO FIX THE PROBLEM BUT IF THEY CANT FIGURE IT OUT, ILL DEFINALTELY TRADE THIS CAR FOR A 2004 aCURA tl .
This sounds totally bogus. Name the dealership. It sounds to me like someone who just wants to clog up the board with trash. Do you really think that we are so stupid as to take this at face value? There are massive holes in this whole scenario.
You really are. People make their own luck. For some, if they didn't have bad luck they'd have no luck at all. That seems to be your position, but you seem to make your situation for yourself. If your story is true, I feel badly for you. If not, please stop typing bolded stories and posting them here. Even if it is true, there's no need to bold your stories.
...MA dealer offered NAV/ML package with sticker of just under $38K for $3K off without much prompting. I asked about December to Remember, and he said it will include favorable lease rates and maybe a lower interest rate (just as suggested earlier in this thread). Seemed to be quite a lot of ES's on the lot. Acura is now discounting it's new TL $500 to $1K off MSRP depending on region of the country, whereas just a few short weeks ago, most all Acura dealers were holding firm on MSRP. Sounds to me like consumer demand for entry-luxury cars is trailing supply these days.
BTW, this dealer said that December is the end of Lexus' fiscal year, such that December is the best month for savings. Favorable interest and lease rates don't suggest much in the way of savings to me,unless they're talking 0.9% interest rate,which I doubt.
Yes, they said $3K off the $38K, or $35K. I wasn't prepared to buy that day, so I didn't get to the stage of writing up deal paperwork. I don't know for sure, but I suppose it's possible some hidden charges might have appeared to shave a few hundred dollars off these savings.
dacstl - are you saying you that you could have bought a base ES330 for $29,500 ($32,000 - $2,500)? Did they even have such a modestly equiped model on the lot? Can anyone tell me what the most modestly equiped ES300 configuration is typically available (without special order)? All I need is leather (now standard) and sunroof and I'm happy. Can I get that for $29,500 without special order?
I am saying that the dealership commitment that I received through CarBargains guaranteed me a $2,500 reduction from the sticker price for the vehicle that I eventually purchased. I don't know what ES330 inventories are like at dealers in other areas of the country; but in my part of the mid-west, there are no cars "on the lot". I worked with the sales person to define my minimum requirements, and then the fleet manager searched for a vehicle that came close to my specifications. Once delivered, I had the option of accepting or rejecting that particular car - no questions asked. If I had chosen to initiate another search for a car that came closer to my actual preference, the dealer was more than willing to do so, because he knew that he could sell the car that I turned down within a couple of days. My insight into ES330 availability is somewhat limited, but if you are really looking for a "modestly equipped" car, I think you're going to have a hard time.
I am not sure you can buy a new ES330 for $29,500 without a special order. JM Lexus in Margate, FL is supposed to be the world's largest Lexus dealer. His website lists 207 new ES330's in inventory. The problem is that they all have at least the Premium Package and also the Wood Upgrade. Edmund's new car section lists the TMV price for the base ES330 as $31,677. CarsDirect quotes $29,826 for a base ES330 in the 91311 zipcode (Los Angeles). Good luck!
per Edmunds.com - 2004 Lexus ES 330 4dr Sedan (3.3L 6cyl 5A) Premium Package, Wood, Silver, Philly zip Total with Options MSRP $33,250 Invoice $29,475 TMV $32,285
$33,250 MSRP - $2,500 = $30,750 + tax, tags, etc.
Why do I see so many CPO '02s with 15k+ miles for like $31-33k with little/no discounting???
I think $31-33K is high for a CPO 02 when as you say you can buy a new one for $30,750. Edmunds TMV price is $28,621 from a dealer, and $25,981 from a private party. Just for the fun of it, I checked eBay Motors this morning. It appears you can buy 02s for $26K. If you change the oil and filter every four months or 4,000 miles, do you really need to pay an extra $2K to get a CPO?
does anyone know if there there is a way to get the skid control without getting other options? the car i'm looking at has the premium package, but i'd like to get the vsc, without other costly add-ons. help!
Yes, I finally bought my 2004 ES 330. I wanted to post my experience and price for all those people that have helped me.
I got a price of $34,400. for my car with Nav/ML. I was pretty happy with the price. I was extremely happy with the salesman and dealership. They made the buying experience very non-stressful. I'll have it for the holidays which is nice! Good luck to everyone with their purchase.
yesterday we bought a 330 and are very happy with the car and the overall buying experience (which is a bit lengthy). however, prior to paying, we were asked if we wanted to purchase a paint sealant, "on sale for just under $800" (as well as an "extended warranty"). with this sealant procedure, also apply something to the leather to make it last longer, creating a barrier against stains. it was explained to us that since paints are no longer lead-based it was necessary now to protect them further. also with this sealant (from the company "a touch of class") you wouldn't have to wax your car for five years. we declined the purchase.
i'm assuming this is just another way for the dealer to make a profit on a high mark-up item, but don't know for sure. does anyone have any thoughts on this sealant protection purchase, and if it's a good idea? we could still do it if it makes any sense. thanks!
Congratulations on your good judgement in saying no to the paint sealant and leather sealer ruse. This is just a way for the dealer to take you to the cleaners.
I leased a 2004 ES330 for what seems like a fantastic price: $440/month 15,000 miles/year, 48 month lease, Navigation System Premium Package, No money down except tax,tag,title,
Also, do you all pay the acquisition fee and Disposition fee? I was told to negotiate them out of the lease agreement.
The Lexus website offers no help, just refers you to your local dealer. I've yet to get a complete answer myself, but a salesperson now tells me it includes low lease and interest rates (though when asked about the interest rates, he needed to research and get back to me...that was today). He also said because December is the end of Lexus' fiscal year, they intend to discount prices more. Again, I'm not sure what that would translate into for discounting, but the last time I visited for a test drive a few weeks ago in November, he was prepared to offer $3K off the sticker price.
re: JM Lexus reference above, I also received a quote from them today for MSRP-$3000 on a $33,444 MSRP. A local dealer then came within $500 of that in attempting to match
JM Lexus has 169 ES330's in stock per their web site (and discussion with them) and most of these are base plus wood plus premium package to MSRP at $33,444 and they'll sell for $30,500.
is dropping like a rock since it's out some two months back. Now it seems that $500-$1500 over invoice, depending on how loaded it is, is quite doable. Mmmm 300 did not drop this quick when it first came out late 2001, and its invoice price was higher than 330. Now 330 is cheaper than 04 TL, which is still hanging tough near MSRP. What gives? TL's really a better car/deal or what?
I'm not sure what the buyout is because I didn't pickup the car yet, but I'm not concerned because I have no intention of purchasing the car at the emd of the lease.
Ehanced leasing and financing. Lower rates, in the 3's for all vehicles. Lease money factor translates to be about the same. No rebates or dealer cash. Hope this help
than buying? For those who lease it vs. buy it can you shed some insight? It's easier for buyers to know of a good deal since there's the sticker and invoice to compare. How about leasing? How do you know you got a good deal for that 48-mo term where say you've to pay $20K?
Is the same thing as selling price on a lease. The reason why most people lease is because
a)Leasing a vehicle is always a lower monthly payment b)They own a business, where you can write off most of it for tax purposes c)They trade in their vehicle every 3 years or so anyway
These are reasons to contemplate leasing a vehicle. If you drive tons of miles a year, keep your cars until they die, or can pay cash, I wouldn't lease
lehighlexus - This may not be the thread to discuss this topic, but since you are a dealer, you might be able to enlighten me and lexusrock on the possibility of a dealer service department fixing lexusrock's stained dash.
With a little bit of previous experience, I had to play the "game" with my dealership only to a minor degree, but think I did quite well. My salesperson was 110% friendly cool and helpful so long as you keep in mind that he is a salesperson doing exactly what he is supposed to do. He can definelty be your advocate before, during and after the deal, but you must remember that fact at ALL times. Hopefully the following about my experience will help someone.
I got the ES 330 with Premium Package and insisted they change the wheels to CHROME wheels. This means everything EXCEPT Nav, ML Sound and VSC on my car. I had to do a bit of maneuvering and deflecting as they attempted to tell me first what the maximum they could subtract off MSRP was, and then suddenly it switched to the minimum they could do over invoice when I held firm (but polite) ground. That change of angle is usually a good sign.
I offered $35,000 bottom line "out the door" and they eventually accepted after standard resistance over the course of 25 minutes. This comes out to $32,040 before tax, tag, and doc fee is added. No charge to change the wheels either. Boy, they sure add additional good looks to my car!
My two cents: Engage your salesperson in the exact same manner he engages you and do not let any uncertainty pass by if you do not understand something he says, or if he says it too fast. Back him up frequently and ask him to restate if needed, or call him out politely if he morphs something you just said into something that is not quite what you meant or wanted. Show him you are listening and processing everything he says and represents. It will cause them to focus more of their engery on the actual facts of what they say rather than "sales speak"... a better quality of dialogue in my view.
But the most important thing I did (and you can do) has to do with timing. I walked into the lot after-dark one hour before closing time on the LAST day of the month. I knew exactly what I wanted and the lowest reasonable price I wanted to pay. In a nutshell, everyone (except me!) is tired, hungry and wants to go home... yet every sales organization will ALWAYS want their monthly numbers as shiny as possible, especially the volume-style dealers. Not only does this establish a firm quicker end to what is often by design a draining and drawn-out negotiation process (whether or not you are successful by the way), but it also helps to weigh things more in your favor precisely at the time of the month they are most eager to do a "close to unreasonable" deal. Try it sometime, its worked for me well in the past. Let me know what you think. By the way... just why does the credit/finance guy always tower over you in the height of his chair? Coincidence?
Overall, it was an extemely good experience and I am more than satisfied with my salesperson, dealership and of course my shiny new Lexus!
A lot has been said about a better buying experience at Lexus dealers. My experience is that the two I've dealt with is that they are just another marginally ethical car dealer just like all the others. They tried to play all the typical dealer tricks that I've ever heard of and experienced over the years. Tried to offer me thousands less than Blue Book for my trade-in. Sure they offered me coffee and soda but so does my Honda dealer. I love the car and would love to have one but I will probably go back to my Honda dealer who treats us with respect for our intelligence and doesn't play 'car salesman' games.
on my new ES 330 for $31,200 in the Dallas area. It has what this dealership calls a premium plus package, which is the premium package plus heated seats, hi-discharge headlights, rain sensing wipers and rear shade. Sticker price $34,734. I'm not picking up the car until Dec. 23, as it is a Christmas gift for my wife. Now I am going to be shopping for an extended warranty. After I told the manager I would shop for the warranty he offered the Lexus 7/100,000 warranty for $1500. What has anyone else's experience been in shopping Lexus dealers on the warranty? Higher - lower?
Ok Gekko2, I checked out post #190. Are you asking about the MSRP of my car?
The original MSRP of my car was $34,734. The Chrome wheels added an MSRP of $1700 for a total MSRP of $36,434. I drove off "out the door" at $35,000. The base sale price before sales tax, doc fee and license was $32040. According to my math this is $4394 below MSRP. Hope this helps.
Looks like from the recent posts people are buying 330 with less than $200 over invoice now. You did not see that on 300 until the last year (2003). Now in the first year (well really just three months) of an 330 it's already selling at around invoice. What gives? I guess the demand for the new ES isn't that strong after all?
Offered the local dealer $1K over invoice on a 04 with Prem Pkg, heated seats, adj pedals, etc. and they were not interested. Anyone in the NW found a Lexus dealer that is selling an ES in this price range?
I have been dealing with a dealer in Orange County, California who states a willingness to sell me a ES330 for $200 above invoice. The car has a premium plus package (no NAV, but heated seats, HID lights, etc.). The problem is that I think he's inflated his invoice price. He told me that the invoice on this car is $31,370 (leaving me with a purchase price of $31,570 plus taxes and registration). That seems too high of an invoice price to me. Does anyone know what the true invoice price is for the ES330 with the premium plus package? I do not trust the information on Edmunds. Also, what have you been paying for the extended warranty?
Out of pocket matters a lot more than invoice. You are lucky in that you have numerous, large dealers in the so cal area. My advice would be to forget about invoice and go dealer hopping from Orange County to Riverside and San Bernardino, Ventura to San Diego, until you find the best out-of-pocket deal for yourself.
Invoice might matter a lot more (as a basis of price assessment) if you lived in Detroit, Michigan where you have limited ability to dealer hop for a good deal.
If you live where there is snow or rain storms, make sure you get the VSC/Traction control option. Not sure if that is a stand alone option on the '04, but it was on the '03ES. It's an important safety feature and saved my "b..." once.
My wife and I are seriously considering the ES330:
Would like to get the following Options Package: Navigation System/Mark Levinson® Audio Package with Additional Options $5,390.00 - Navigation System/Mark Levinson® Audio Package - High-Intensity Discharge Headlamps (HID) with Rain Sensing Wipers - Heated Front Seats - Vehicle Stability Control (VSC) - Wood and Leather Steering Wheel - All-Season Tires - Power Rear Sun Shade
MSRP from the lexus.com = $37,740.00
Edmonds TMV = $36,308
I just emailed back a dealer letting him know essentially that we are looking for an offer below 36k (this would include destination, processing, handling).
Am I on drugs? Or would this be a good price for the dealer?
I am trying to gauge if I am realistic or not negotiating all-that-well.
starrin/Jason - see post #210. My Opt2 looks like what you want and the offer was $35,910 incl dest fee. I think it's a fair price and a win-win. BUT it's all relative to what you can get. Talk to 3 dealers in your area and pick the best price and package.
Toydriver - thanks for the tip on the VSC. It's included in my Opt2.
Comments
Hope you get everything resolved.
BTW, this dealer said that December is the end of Lexus' fiscal year, such that December is the best month for savings. Favorable interest and lease rates don't suggest much in the way of savings to me,unless they're talking 0.9% interest rate,which I doubt.
Are you saying you can get the car for 35 K? Seems like a pretty good deal to me.
$38K does not sound like a good deal at all.
2004 Lexus ES 330
4dr Sedan (3.3L 6cyl 5A)
Premium Package, Wood, Silver, Philly zip
Total with Options
MSRP $33,250
Invoice $29,475
TMV $32,285
$33,250 MSRP - $2,500 = $30,750 + tax, tags, etc.
Why do I see so many CPO '02s with 15k+ miles for like $31-33k with little/no discounting???
I got a price of $34,400. for my car with Nav/ML. I was pretty happy with the price. I was extremely happy with the salesman and dealership. They made the buying experience very non-stressful. I'll have it for the holidays which is nice! Good luck to everyone with their purchase.
Sounds like you got a great price on yours with the Nav/ML.
Just curious...did yours come with VSC? If so, what part of the country are you in?
Thx...
Mike...
i'm assuming this is just another way for the dealer to make a profit on a high mark-up item, but don't know for sure. does anyone have any thoughts on this sealant protection purchase, and if it's a good idea? we could still do it if it makes any sense. thanks!
$440/month
15,000 miles/year,
48 month lease,
Navigation System
Premium Package,
No money down except tax,tag,title,
Also, do you all pay the acquisition fee and Disposition fee? I was told to negotiate them out of the lease agreement.
Thanks for any information
a)Leasing a vehicle is always a lower monthly payment
b)They own a business, where you can write off most of it for tax purposes
c)They trade in their vehicle every 3 years or so anyway
These are reasons to contemplate leasing a vehicle. If you drive tons of miles a year, keep your cars until they die, or can pay cash, I wouldn't lease
Please see the ES300 thread for my topic. Thanks.
If there is , they should let us in on it !!
I got the ES 330 with Premium Package and insisted they change the wheels to CHROME wheels. This means everything EXCEPT Nav, ML Sound and VSC on my car. I had to do a bit of maneuvering and deflecting as they attempted to tell me first what the maximum they could subtract off MSRP was, and then suddenly it switched to the minimum they could do over invoice when I held firm (but polite) ground. That change of angle is usually a good sign.
I offered $35,000 bottom line "out the door" and they eventually accepted after standard resistance over the course of 25 minutes. This comes out to $32,040 before tax, tag, and doc fee is added. No charge to change the wheels either. Boy, they sure add additional good looks to my car!
My two cents: Engage your salesperson in the exact same manner he engages you and do not let any uncertainty pass by if you do not understand something he says, or if he says it too fast. Back him up frequently and ask him to restate if needed, or call him out politely if he morphs something you just said into something that is not quite what you meant or wanted. Show him you are listening and processing everything he says and represents. It will cause them to focus more of their engery on the actual facts of what they say rather than "sales speak"... a better quality of dialogue in my view.
But the most important thing I did (and you can do) has to do with timing. I walked into the lot after-dark one hour before closing time on the LAST day of the month. I knew exactly what I wanted and the lowest reasonable price I wanted to pay. In a nutshell, everyone (except me!) is tired, hungry and wants to go home... yet every sales organization will ALWAYS want their monthly numbers as shiny as possible, especially the volume-style dealers. Not only does this establish a firm quicker end to what is often by design a draining and drawn-out negotiation process (whether or not you are successful by the way), but it also helps to weigh things more in your favor precisely at the time of the month they are most eager to do a "close to unreasonable" deal. Try it sometime, its worked for me well in the past. Let me know what you think. By the way... just why does the credit/finance guy always tower over you in the height of his chair? Coincidence?
Overall, it was an extemely good experience and I am more than satisfied with my salesperson, dealership and of course my shiny new Lexus!
I love the car and would love to have one but I will probably go back to my Honda dealer who treats us with respect for our intelligence and doesn't play 'car salesman' games.
Not a good experience.
The original MSRP of my car was $34,734. The Chrome wheels added an MSRP of $1700 for a total MSRP of $36,434. I drove off "out the door" at $35,000. The base sale price before sales tax, doc fee and license was $32040. According to my math this is $4394 below MSRP. Hope this helps.
Invoice might matter a lot more (as a basis of price assessment) if you lived in Detroit, Michigan where you have limited ability to dealer hop for a good deal.
2004 ES 330
Opt 1
Premium, HID, Wood, etc.
$35,170 MSRP
$33,370 Sale
Opt 2
Nav, ML, etc. (Everything but Gold Package and AVS)
$37,930 MSRP
$35,910 Sale
Comments?
Not sure if that is a stand alone option on the '04, but it was on the '03ES. It's an important safety feature and saved my "b..." once.
My wife and I are seriously considering the ES330:
Would like to get the following Options Package:
Navigation System/Mark Levinson® Audio Package with Additional Options
$5,390.00
- Navigation System/Mark Levinson® Audio Package
- High-Intensity Discharge Headlamps (HID) with Rain Sensing Wipers
- Heated Front Seats
- Vehicle Stability Control (VSC)
- Wood and Leather Steering Wheel
- All-Season Tires
- Power Rear Sun Shade
MSRP from the lexus.com = $37,740.00
Edmonds TMV = $36,308
I just emailed back a dealer letting him know essentially that we are looking for an offer below 36k (this would include destination, processing, handling).
Am I on drugs? Or would this be a good price for the dealer?
I am trying to gauge if I am realistic or not negotiating all-that-well.
Thanks in advance for any advice/input,
Jason
Toydriver - thanks for the tip on the VSC. It's included in my Opt2.