Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Options
Most popular vehicles
Popular New Cars
- New Acura MDX
- New Acura RDX
- New Audi Q5
- New BMW 3 Series
- New BMW X3
- New Buick Enclave
- New Cadillac Escalade
- New Chevrolet Equinox
- New Chrysler 300
- New Dodge Challenger
- New Ford Edge
- New Ford Escape
- New Ford Expedition
- New Ford Explorer
- New Ford F-150
- New Ford Focus
- New Ford Mustang
- New Honda Accord
- New Honda Civic
- New Honda CR-V
- New Honda Fit
- New Honda Odyssey
- New Honda Pilot
- New Hyundai Elantra
- New Hyundai Santa Fe
- New Hyundai Sonata
- New Hyundai Tucson
- New Jeep Compass
- New Jeep Grand Cherokee
- New Jeep Wrangler
- New Mazda 3
- New Mazda 6
- New Mazda CX-5
- New Nissan Altima
- New Nissan Maxima
- New Nissan Rogue
- New Porsche Cayenne
- New Ram 1500
- New Subaru Crosstrek
- New Subaru Forester
- New Subaru Impreza
- New Subaru Outback
- New Tesla Model S
- New Tesla Model X
- New Toyota 4Runner
- New Toyota Camry
- New Toyota Corolla
- New Toyota Highlander
- New Toyota Prius
- New Toyota RAV4
- New Toyota Sienna
- New Toyota Tacoma
- New Volkswagen Jetta
- New Volvo XC60
- New Volvo XC90
Popular Used Sedans
- Used BMW 5 Series
- Used Chevrolet Impala
- Used Chevrolet Malibu
- Used Chrysler 200
- Used Dodge Charger
- Used Ford Fusion
- Used Ford Taurus
- Used Honda Accord
- Used Honda Civic
- Used Hyundai Elantra
- Used Hyundai Sonata
- Used Tesla Model S
- Used Toyota Camry
- Used Toyota Corolla
- Used Volkswagen Jetta
Popular Used SUVs
- Used Acura MDX
- Used Acura RDX
- Used Ford Edge
- Used Ford Explorer
- Used Honda CR-V
- Used Honda Pilot
- Used Hyundai Santa Fe
- Used Jeep Compass
- Used Lincoln Navigator
- Used Mazda CX-5
- Used Nissan Rogue
- Used Subaru Crosstrek
- Used Subaru Forester
- Used Tesla Model X
- Used Volvo XC90
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/faq.htm
currently, the only state where the Prius can ride
solo in the HOV lanes is in VA, and only if they
have the special fuels license plate from VA.
of course, if you have the prerequisite number of
people in your Prius, you can always ride in the
HOV lanes, but...
the classic Prius' design (using parts from the same
company that the classic Prius got parts from, which
is partially owned by Toyota).
Nissan has also licensed hybrid technology from
Toyota...
those deals have to count as recouping some of
the costs of hybrid development...
I would think a house power system would have completely different needs and would be characterized by relatively steady-state electricity demand with no need for shaft torque.
There are quite a few home generator/battery storage systems out there engineered specfically for the needs of a house generation system. Some systems even provide for co-generation in conjunction with the power utility. I would think any of these system would work better and be a LOT cheaper.
Thirty years from now, I could see scrounging junkyards for 2004's Prius powertrains to canabalize parts to put together a system though.
- Mark
If you are attached to the grid, there is really no need for batteries even if you have solar panels. Many power companies allow you to spin your meter backward if you produce more power than you use. Batteries are a pain to deal with.
The Prius system is designed for an auto application with quick and strong current needs. The closest thing in your home is when your AC kicks on, or maybe when you turn on a vacuum cleaner. Maybe the battery research Toyota sponsors will one day be useful in other applications.
being developed by NASA et. al. http://www.aviationtomorrow.com/
The current design is using the "classic" Prius/Panasonic
battery pack as the electric battery storage unit.
Best designed battery pack they could find, and at a reasonable
cost. (Used packs are great.)
Thanks to the WPI Fly-In event (where the plane
was displayed) people, they let us have a hybrid gathering
there too. Got to see the first 2004 Prius in New England
(10/11/2003) there!
I feel that way since Toyota is a Japanese company and not subject to quite the same SEC reporting requirements as companies based here. So when they say we spent X on development or 'are now profitable' it is most likely based on their rules of disclosure and accounting to which most of us have even less insight.
For example, when they said that they spent $2 billion on development, was that all of their money, was it pooled with others, was it a partial grant from the government, blah, blah, blah. Does that include capital expenses? How do they depreciate? Did they share the expenses with other product lines...
I think we should focus on the Prius. The Toyota finances are inscrutable and in the end irrelevant. IMHO What matters is our finances. Is is a good deal for us at the price we can negotiate.
Been considering a home genset to directly (mechanically coupled) run an GSHP (ground source heat pump, well water) so I can scavenge the water jacket heat during the winter.
Except as an emergency backup the fuel economy of a genset does not otherwise lend itself to independent electric power generation ONLY. More costly than buying it from "them".
But maybe buying a 20KW genset when one only needs 16KW and derating the engine via the atkinson cycle (as in the Prius) might be worthwhile for genset fuel economy.
From the drivers position the rear field of vision is very limited to begin with. Moreover, the top 5-6 inches of the view is the inner ceiling of the car. A few inches below the center of the view are 2-3 inches of sight blockage (exterior spoiler) extending across the entire window. I felt as though I was looking through two narrow window panes. What in the world were they thinking about? A possible fix might be to extend the window an additional 6 inches into the roof line and eliminate the spoiler.
As much as I liked the prius and the technology behind it, the rear window is a deal killer. I'll wait for Toyota to fix the problem, or for the competition to catch up with their own models.
Alan in Portland, OR
My height is 5'8". That's quite average. So my size and taller should see just fine. There's likely a specific shorter size that doesn't fit well, but no one has reported that detail yet.
JOHN
Just rented a Prius for the weekend. WooHooo...!! Going to be one interesting weekend. Now that the kids have stop ringing the door bells for candy, I can sit down and type in some questions:
1) At night, I noticed a green line reflection coming from the speedometer right in front of me, in the line of sight. I've read that you can elliminate this issue by turning down the dimmer switch on the left of the stearing wheel. I've tried this but nothing happens. Have you seen this problem? I know that the green line reflecting off the windshield can be fixed but don't know how.
2) This one could be tied to the item 1 above. On page 153 of the Owner's Manual it say that the screen can be in the "day mode" or "night mode" depending on the position of the head light
switch. When I push the "Display" button, my screen does not show "Day mode" or "Night mode" at the top of the "Display" screen. How do I get this "Day" or "Night" mode back? There is a paragraph stating that "if the km/h or MPH button is on, mode switching cannot be done". It looks like I have "Day mode" on constantly. How do I reset it to switch between Day and Night??
3) This one may also be tied back to item 1 and 2 above. I notice that when driving at night, none of the lettering on the dash lights up. The buttons I am refering to are "Load" "AM" "FM" "PWR" etc...and buttons on each side of the screen. All in total darkness.
Well, that is it. So far my driving experience has been great and I love the car. Can't wait for my Prius to finally come in. Unfortunately, I have to depart with this one on Monday...maybe
Tuesday...or hmmm...maybe even Wednesday... :-)
Hope someone can help me with these questions...
Tony.
___In regards to HOV-lanes, do all PZEV’s meet the requirement to drive in the HOV lanes in Virginia or just Hybrid’s and those that actually travel with 2 or more carpooler’s? The reason I say this is that the 5-speed Insight receives absolutely fantastic mileage but pollutes more (higher HC and NOx but much lower CO2) then most ULEV based automobiles on the road today. The much lower mileage rated CVT based Insight is a SULEV so I don’t know if this is a problem for those vehicles? A State Trooper will in no way be able to figure out if one is driving the CVT or the 5-speed ... from the outside anyway.
___Mrvadeboncoeur, rumors floating around the net as of the last few days are saying Ford has decided not to use the Toyota First generation drive train for the upcoming Escape but instead are going with their own Hybrid design which makes sense to me. Some guys over at Priusonline are mentioning this as well?
___Footie, if you look over the two links I provided a few pages back, one mentions it costs ~ 1.2 Billion to bring a domestic designed and built mid-sized automobile to market here in the US and the other says it may cost the Japanese automakers just $250 to $500 Million if there are shared components. Since the First generation Prius was designed before the Echo, I would probably say the R&D cost of the drive train as well as that of the automobile itself was from the first generation Prius budget over that first 4 or 5 years anyway. Since very little of the 04 Prius’ “technology” shares anything with any other Toyota or Lexus, I would lean towards the higher end of the R&D cost as well. I posted in another Prius thread a link about Honda’s latest Diesel engine. If I remember correctly, the Honda design team for the engine alone consisted of ~ 1,000 engineers and 2 solid years of work. That is a lot of Yen for the engine not even considering an entire automobile and an even higher tech drive train. Before that, Honda was purchasing or licensing their Diesel tech for European consumption from both Isuzu and Rover. I am a bit foggy on the details but it gives an insight as to the actual costs. I never said I knew what they were so take the numbers as they are presented and prove them otherwise if you feel you must.
___As you said, focus on the Prius ... Prius profitability has been mentioned many times in this and many other Prius threads in the recent past. These statements came from Toyota, right? If the numbers don’t add up irregardless of where the funding came from, when will it make sense financially for Toyota to build an affordable version if it isn’t profitable? Then again, Space travel has been very profitable for Boeing and Raytheon as well ... The only problem is that they didn’t really fund much of the R&D for those projects either
___Good Luck
___Wayne R. Gerdes
https://www.dmv.state.va.us/webdoc/citizen/vehicles/cleanspecialf- - uel.asp
In VA, gas/electric hybrids (specifically the
Toyota Prius, Honda Insight and Civic Hybrid) are
allowed to get the Clean Special Fuel Vehicle license
plates.
Only if you have the above license plate can you
drive solo in the VA HOV lanes. If you're from
another state (MD, for example) and you're in a
hybrid, you cannot ride solo in the VA HOV lanes
because you don't have the correct license plate.
(Note that other states also do a special license
or decal/sticker in order to identify the vehicle
that can drive in their HOV lanes solo:
http://www.afdc.doe.gov/p_single_faq.cgi?10
Unless you find a clueless person at the DMV to
give you the sticker, currently the only state
that allows hybrids into the HOV lanes with
less than the required number of passengers is
VA. But that ruling is phasing out in VA...)
1. 11.2 secs
2. 11.0 secs
(battery charge rest)
3. 10.0 secs
4. 9.4 secs (!!)
5. 9.7 secs (!!)
Happy with those, we moved on to more important efficiency observation in various situations. Too unscientific to list...
-----
Previous message...
1) At night, I noticed a green line reflection coming from the speedometer right in front of me, in the line of sight. I've read that you can elliminate this issue by turning down the dimmer switch on the left of the stearing wheel. I've tried this but nothing happens. Have you seen this problem? I know that the green line reflecting off the windshield can be fixed but don't know how.
2) This one could be tied to the item 1 above. On page 153 of the Owner's Manual it say that the screen can be in the "day mode" or "night mode" depending on the position of the head light
switch. When I push the "Display" button, my screen does not show "Day mode" or "Night mode" at the top of the "Display" screen. How do I get this "Day" or "Night" mode back? There is a paragraph stating that "if the km/h or MPH button is on, mode switching cannot be done". It looks like I have "Day mode" on constantly. How do I reset it to switch between Day and Night??
3) This one may also be tied back to item 1 and 2 above. I notice that when driving at night, none of the lettering on the dash lights up. The buttons I am refering to are "Load" "AM" "FM" "PWR" etc...and buttons on each side of the screen. All in total darkness.
Well, that is it. So far my driving experience has been great and I love the car. Can't wait for my Prius to finally come in. Unfortunately, I have to depart with this one on Monday...maybe
Tuesday...or hmmm...maybe even Wednesday... :-)
The dimmer dial clearly wasn't working. In my 2004, that line is quite visible at full brightness. But rolling the dial allows you to turn in down so dim that you couldn't produce a glow from it even in total darkness. I usually roll it to about the middle.
To everyone else, note that it is just a thin line. Not a glowing section like the old design would have produced in that location.
> 2) When I push the "Display" button, my screen does
> not show "Day mode" or "Night mode"
Again, something was wrong... perhaps an missed/incomplete post-transport prep step. With the lights on, pushing "display" should reveal a mode button along with the brightness & contrast adjustments.
> lights up... "AM" "FM" "PWR"
Since the illuminated "Mode" button on the steering-wheel and the illuminated "Audio" button next to the Multi-Display serve the same purpose (by multiple clicks, rather than a specific) there really isn't any need for them to be illuminated.
> "Load"
Since you probably don't want to scratch your disc and the slot is only disc thickness (obviously), this button was likely intentionally not available any other way except directly and in good lighting conditions. The load indicator lights on either side of the slot are very easy to see anytime, thankfully.
JOHN
Due to the contradictions on the VDOT web site about the expiration date for the HOV lane (July 2004, 2005 or 2006?), and the lack of evidence concerning decisions by the legislature, I have submitted several e-mails to obtain clarification. Despite the Virginia HOV task force recommendations against extending the date to 2006, the Virginia General Assembly has indeed moved forward and granted it. They also referred me to a Washington Post article that also confirms this
www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node=&- contentId=A26365-2003Oct1¬Found=true
So it is confirmed. Virginia drivers with the special clean fuel plates, will have solo access to HOV lanes through July 2006.
While I am still going to hold off on buying the car, the Prius definitely holds a much higher value for Virginia buyers.
I will try the "Display" button again with the headlights switched on to see if this will help. Yes, I did noticed that the dimmer dial did nothing when I rolled it up or down. Clearly, something is not working right here.
Tony.
Pushed "Displayed". Still no "Day" or "Night" mode button on the screen. Tried adjusting dimmer switch...no change to brightness of readouts, etc...dimmer switch not functioning at all.
I don't understand this statement on page 153 of manual: "...if the km/h or MPH button is on, mode switching cannot be done. In this case, "Day mode" is not shown on the screen." So, how do I turn off km/h or MPH button??
Yet another statement: "If the screen is set in day mode with headlight switch turned to on, this condition is memorized in the system..." So, apparently, the "Day mode" is locked into the system. Question is, how do you get out of "Day mode"
Out of option...
Any more suggestions?? Anyone?
For the classic Prius, UK and European Prius did
not have the little dimmer wheel for the dashboard
light dimming. Instead they had a little button
on the dash, I think it was if you press and hold
the km/h / MPH switch that would switch from day
to night brightness on the LCD screen. (Their dimmer wheel was for manual headlight leveling.)
For the classic US Prius, the km/h / MPH button
doesn't do that. There's a little dimmer wheel, all
the way turned up the dash is at full brightness,
all the way down the dash is not illuminated, and
you have various levels of light on the dash in between.
If you have the dimmer wheel all the way up, and
you have your headlights on, a button appears on the
LCD screen (I think when you press Display) that
allows you to go from Day Mode to Night Mode. Day
mode just makes the LCD screen at full brightness,
Night mode puts the LCD screen at dim.
since I always drive my classic Prius with the
lights on (poor man's DRLs - US Prius have auto-off
headlights when you exit the driver's door, DRLs
weren't an option for my model year (2001 US)), I
don't recall what happens with the dimmer wheel if
you don't have the headlights on. I do know that
the Day Mode button only becomes active if the
dash dimmer is on full brightness, though.
Jan 40.9
Feb 41.0
Mar 43.2
Apr 46.1
May 47.1
Jun 47.5
Jul 47.8
Aug 48.2
Sep 48.6
Oct 46.5
Nov 44.6
Dec 41.5
Using that, I'll be making comparisons to my 2004 Prius (which is cleaner, bigger, and faster) to prove that the best got even better.
The October average for my 2004 Prius calculated to an average of 49.7 MPG. So despite not even being broken in yet, the improvement is rather obvious.
Any predictions for November?
JOHN
Which dealer were you dealing with in Portland? I went to two on Sunday to test drive a Prius, had a bad experience at one, and an ok one at the one in Beaverton.
I'd be curious as to which to avoid.
Cost-Effectiveness and Interior-Layout are the subject of discussion now. Both are silly, since in a few years costs will be lower and a variety of layout will be available. But I suppose people need something to talk about in the meantime.
As for my own report, break-in is complete. So I dropped the pedal to the floor to see what happened. (No wonder the enthusiasts disappeared, there's more than enough pep now. They have nothing to complain about.) Efficiency has been amazing. For a cleaner, bigger, faster car to get even better MPG is great. The October average (749 miles of driving) calculated to 49.7 MPG. That's quite impressive for cold weather. Later when the Minnesota winter machine kicks in and everything freezes solid, I'll be very watchful of what happens. The classic Prius was quite impressive under those conditions. The new Prius, with its special thermal system for retaining heat, should really dazzle then.
I'll look forward to Spring like I never have before. Last year, I set a personal record achieving a 50 MPG tank in late February. This year, I potentially could do that even earlier. And of course later, Summer will be a blast. All last year I maintained a 50 MPG average. At that point, the 2004 would have really loosened up. And I'll have switched to synthetic oil then too. So the efficiency will climb. Close to 60 MPG at times, I'd imagine. An average in the mid-50's will be a great way of promoting the AT-PZEV aspect.
The hybrid itself fits like a glove. I'm actually a bit surprised how rapidly acclimated to the new one. But then again, I missed the hatchback I used to own 10 years ago. Getting one back, hybrid style, is wonderful. You'd be amazed how practical that is. I have already tossed the bike in back. Just lower the back seats, lay down a blanket, and unclip the front bike-tire. The rest of the bike fit back there without any need to wiggle. It set right down with room to spare. The tie-down locations are well placed. That will allow the placement of a second bike. Not having to accept a MPG penalty from carrying 2 bikes now will be very nice.
I played with the Navigation System the other day... or my sister did. She really enjoyed being able to look up a location and request the "Nav Lady" to instruct us how to get there as we drive. I hadn't realized just how well thought out that system was. As you get close to the next turn, an imagine it the corner will point which way to turn and how far you are from it. And when you do get close, a secondary map pops up and shows you a close-up.
The Voice-Recognition work surprisingly well. I can easily see that becoming quite popular as the list of commands expands and its ability to understand even the most difficult speaking grows. We really will be speaking to a computer like on Star Trek some day. Just speaking a command rather than having to reach for a button is obviously safer.
Shifting is sweet. It's quite apparent now why Toyota abandoned the traditional mechanical shifter. Because when you shift into Drive or Reverse, the typical behavior is that nothing but the indicator changes. No other activity takes place. The engine will commonly remain off, just like when you first power-up (all it does is boot the computer).
The brakes are completely "normal" now. Toyota's scheme for simulating the traditional response people expect is well implemented. Heck, even the "bounce" is gone. When you hit a bump while decelerating hard, the brief disabling of the regen system (to prevent potential damage to it) isn't apparent anymore.
At night, the HID headlight as shockingly bright. It's like having the high-beams on without blinding anyone, since they are aimed down like traditional lights. And the light distribution on the road is so clean that you can easily see every bump & crack.
The ride at 42/40 (that's tire-pressure at 42 PSI front, 40 PSI back) is pleasing. I figured that would be the case. But you never know until you try. This will allow the tires to last longer, improve MPG, and help improve handling... which is great. The larger tires and the longer wheelbase deliver as expected. There's a long, narrow, steep, curvy hill that I used to test it. My classic Prius was on the edge of losing it at 38 MPH (the recommend safe speed was 30 MPH). The new Prius clearly holds to the road better. There wasn't much of any lean on the tight turns. Of course, that introduces a new problem. Some people will likely take advantage of that ability.
I suppose that's enough detail for now. The next report will include the results of a highway cruise with the hybrid interior loaded. Stay tuned.
JOHN
post I would probably would have purchased one but I was not impressed with
the look.
So I purchased in Oct 02 a Jetta Wagon GL TDI 5-speed which has given me an average
of over 55 MPG for the last 27,700 miles.
I am curious how the electric heater and air conditioner work it seem that this would take
a large amount of electrical energy requiring the engine to be operating.
Also on the Navigation system option does it require a monthly fee to operate or is it
free just like regular AM-FM radio.
Also I am looking forward to your report on highway MPG espically at cruise control
operation.
Thanks
Alster 2
They had one in stock for sale, white with gray interior with curtain airbags and
rear wiper.
I asked if this was for sale. He responded yes. So it was not a demonstrator or
factory demo car. The price was about 23,000 if I recall.
So they are out there.
Alster 2
So what I want to know is, did Toyota tap Majel Barrett-Roddenberry for the voice of the computer/nav system in the new Prius? ;-)
Thanks for the detailed report, John. I really appreciate the first owners taking time to post their experiences to help people like me who will be making the buying decision soon. Based on the growing order backlog and my timing, I figure I'll need to place an order by the end of the year. Still haven't taken the whole family for a test drive. Maybe we'll rent one for a few days and see how it holds up in day-to-day life, and see if it's realistic to get a Prius instead of another minivan.
To my surprised, While I was on business travel, my dealer called me and informed me that My Prius is on US. port! and It should be at the dealer within 10 days! Then Last Tue. My dear let me know it's came!
I took my delivery Yesterday. Prius04 with Option #7. MY EXEPERIENCED WAS THAT IT WAS VERY EXCITING TO DRIVE AND I LOVE EVERY BIT OF IT. MANY TIMES I HAVE TO WHAT THE ODOMETER! IT HAS ZIP THAT IT GET UP QUICK WITHOUT YOU FEELING IT!
I AM A BELIEVER!
ANTZ.
PS: Yeah, what about all pioneers purchases? I was not own the 03 model, but ordered in mid September and got it a week ago?
I'd be happy to tell you my opinion but not(more) openly yet. [I want delivery & the walls have ears]. email me: alnvilma@lycos.com for a story!
What is the break-in period? How long should it last and how is the car driven differently during break-in time? Thanks, Geo's wife
> a monthly fee to operate
That question comes up a lot, I'll have to add it to the misconception list.
The answer is NO, it's free after the initial purchase.
Everything is based on the DVD in the system. Data is read directly from that and plotted accordingly based on GPS identified location.
And yes, the DVD can be replaced later for more recent map data. It's not cheap though.
JOHN
The discussion will be moved to our "What Did You Pay?" board in the next day or so.
Here is the link to the discussion:
/direct/view/.ef21c65
The seats are grey. The doors and dash are a
two-tone grey and a dull/grey burgundy (not a
bright red at all, more of a grey with some red
undertones).
The car calculates it's position based on the GPS
satelite signals, and places you on the map.
The map data, including the voice and the POI database,
are all on the DVD.
In a few years, if you wish, you can purchase a
new/updated DVD, but nothing is forcing you to do so.
Last price I heard was in the $400 range.
My understanding is that it's the same system as
in the Lexus - it's a Denso unit.
I copied a clip from The Tonight Show with Jay Leno
back on 7/23/2002 when he interviewed David Hyde
Pierce about his new Prius. Funny story about the
Nav Lady (computer voice that gives directions on
the Nav system). If you don't like late night
network TV language, don't watch the punchline, but
it's not that bad...
http://www2.kluge.net/DHP-Tonight.mov