Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Toyota Prius



  • I think the laws may vary from state to state but I know that in Ohio car dealers must refund deposits when requested IF the deposit was not for a specific car, i.e. Vehicle Identification Number (VIN) specified. A VW dealer tried to keep a deposit when the new Beetles were coming out in 1998 and was quite adamant and nasty about it. I found out that it was against the state law for them to do that and told him I was going to contact my attorney. We picked up the refund later that day! This was the same dealer that was charging $3000 or more over the sticker price with no promise of what color we would get or when we would get it. We were very fortunate to get exactly the color we wanted for the sticker price which was unheard of in those first months. Good luck!
  • "Actually, that number [36,000] is for the first production cycle, not year. It turns out that a second cycle will begin early next spring!"

    Do you anticipate (or know) if, for the "second production cycle" next Spring, there will be any revision in either the USA 2004 Prius offering itself -- e.g. "Japan Prius" features like 16" wheels?...EV button?...parking-assist...whatever else -- or perhaps revisions in the option-packages or trimline options? (Someone had pointed out there seem to be differences in the Prius versions being initially released in the US and in Japan, and the following video reveals some differences as well )

  • I am very interested in the 2004 Prius but need to buy my car in this calendar year. I have contacted the Toyota dealers in the past day about availability but have not heard anything yet. If I am not able to buy a Prius this year then I would buy the 2003 Civic Hybrid. This evening is my first night on the two messagge boards for the PRius but it doesn't look too promising for a 2003 delivery date for a Prius. Any odds? Any thoughts!

    BichonCar in Cincinnati
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    > second production cycle

    Since Toyota has been known to change package offerings throughout the year, actually planning to begin another cycle in the middle really doesn't surprise me.

    > 16" wheels

    That's just plain not going to happen (especially since the aftermarket route is so simple). It would compromise city performance. What would you gain?

    > EV button

    With the way misconceptions about hybrids thrive in this country still, I really don't think the market is ready for it yet.

    > parking-assist

    That's possible.

  • boxfanboxfan Posts: 180
    "The S Touring Selection and G Touring Selection are fitted with a specially tuned suspension for a sportier driving feel." The "S Touring Selection and G Touring Selection" also come with the 16" wheels. I wonder if the US version will have the "specially tuned suspension?" It doesn't seem to be an option, but maybe that's the standard suspension for the US version?

    Re: 16" wheels--"What would you gain?" Well, better handling. That's the original reason for bigger wheels and lower profile tires, although most people now buy them for looks. In principle, you'd think you could find lightweight rims that wouldn't compromise mileage much, but I don't know how you'd choose the rims.

    I do think the new Prius looks better with lower profile tires. The show car version had ridiculously large rims, but I think they made the car look better. Just my opinion.
  • yerth10yerth10 Posts: 428
    What is meant by EV button.
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    > What is meant by EV button.

    Prius offers an EV mode called "STEALTH", the ability to drive up to 42 MPH without the engine running (this speed is expected to be faster in the 2004).

    The engine will restart when the electrical draw becomes high and the battery-pack desires (but does not need) to be recharged. The system then takes advantage of the engine to both provide thrust and electricity at the same time. So of that electricity is immediately consumed by the motor for additional thrust, the rest is used for recharging. The end result is an efficiency gain.

    In some cases, drivers would like to prevent the engine from restarting, since they can predict what the driving needs will be. The hybrid system can't, it only knows what conditions are at that moment. An EV button would allow owners to inform the system that it is ok to leave the engine off for awhile. Then you can enjoy the pleasure from "stealth" a little longer.

  • In the US, the 2001-2003 Prius has an EPA rated
    average 48MPG. In Japan, the equivalent agency to
    the US's EPA also tested the Prius to their testing
    cycle, and gave it a MPG rating in the 60s.

    Different testing cycle, different results.

    Same thing goes with reading Canadian estimated
    l/km (convert to MPG) - different test cycle than
    in the US, often rates higher than in the US.

    Also remember when doing your l/km conversions, to
    convert to US gallons rather than the (larger)
    imperial gallons.
  • yerth10yerth10 Posts: 428
    British don’t use gallons, quarts, pints, ounces anymore.
    They sell gasolene and all other liquid stuff only in liters.

    Liberia is the only other country in the World that uses
    US gallons, ounces, etc.

    It will be better if the testing can be standardized.
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    > It will be better if the testing can be standardized.


    Road & Temperature conditions vary drastically throughout this country alone. Those factors have a profound effect on efficiency. So even the just the EPA testing here doesn't reflect what many drivers will actually encounter.

    And to make matters even more complicated, the fuel itself differs. The stuff I use is 10% ethanol, 90% gasoline. It isn't as efficient as 100% gasoline, but it is cleaner and does reduce oil dependence a little.

  • yerth10yerth10 Posts: 428
    "Road & Temperature conditions vary "

    So do they take the average of Colder North (Minnesota, Massachussets)
    and Hotter South (Texas, Florida) in their mpg figures.

    "10% ethanol, 90% gasoline"

    Is gasohol more expensive than the regular gasolene.

    Many countries like Japan, India, Thailand, etc are venturing
    into bio-fuels, hope they become part of the regular fuel for

    BTW, GM, Ford & Chrysler have taken a big lead in FFV.
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    > So do they take the average of Colder North (Minnesota, Massachussets)

    I lived in both MN and MA. They quite simply don't compare. You'll never see -13^F there like I did with my Prius here. The Hotter South isn't accounted for either.

    Vehicles are tested at 68 F to 86 F ambient temperature, without the A/C.

    That obviously doesn't reflect what owners actually have to deal with for temperatures.

    > Is gasohol more expensive than the regular gasolene.

    That's the only thing available here in Minnesota. We literally don't have the option of buying it any other way in the metro area. And out in the rural outback, 100% gasoline only available in the highest grade for special engines only (like for boat & snowmobile use). That means ethanol production is fairly competitive. Prices are similar to what others pay for gas throughout the country.

    > GM, Ford & Chrysler have taken a big lead in FFV.

    Not really. All they actually do is make the technology and collect the pollution credits from each sale. They do no advertising of the FFV abilities whatsoever.

    E85 is commonly available in the metro of Minnesota. It has been for years. I've never, ever seen an advertisement from GM, Ford, or Chrysler stating their vehicles can use it. In fact, I've only seen 1 FFV owner ever that actually did. Most don't even realize the vehicle they've own for years can use E85. That's really sad.

  • jchan2jchan2 Posts: 4,956
    Well, the reason the big three created Flex Fuel Vehicles is because they wanted to sell more SUVs, so they got more credit for selling FFVs. In fact, almost no one uses FFVs. You may be able to get one delivered in December if you're lucky- otherwise a January or February delivery date is more realistic.
  • do anyone know how many years the battery will last before replacement? What about cost?
  • jchan2jchan2 Posts: 4,956
    have a seven year warranty but are expected to last over 200K miles. By then, you would have bought a new Prius.
  • revkarevka Posts: 1,750
    because it was not within our Town Hall guidelines. Please be aware that while it's okay to link to 2004 Prius information at Toyota's main website, our policy does not permit links to individual Toyota dealerships or salespeople's websites.

    To those concerned - Feel free to email me if you have any questions regarding this matter. Please do not address this with me here.

    And let's get back to the subject of the 2004 Toyota Prius. Thanks! ;-)

    Hatchbacks & Wagons Boards
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    The classic (2001-2003) battery-pack was expected to last 10-12 years or 150,000 to 200,000 miles. We obviously can't confirm that time aspect, but we do know of one owner that exceeded 200,000 miles without any trouble.

    I'm not sure what the original (1997-1999) was rated for, but it was bigger and not as powerful. So Toyota's continued research is paying off.

    And now for the 2004, the pack offers an even greater energy storage density and the module count has been reduced from 38 to 28. So obviously, cost is dropping as a result.

  • yerth10yerth10 Posts: 428
    "module count has been reduced from 38 to 28"

    Any idea of whether the battery size has increased.

    As far as I know the Prius (2001-2003) has the same
    size battery as Prius (1997-1999) while delivering
    25 % more power.

    Same is the case of Civic hybrid over Insight.

    Improvements in battery tech in hybrid vehicles will
    also benefit other products like

    * Electric Vehicles (Grocery store & golf carts, electric scooters, etc)
    * Portable Devices (Notebook computers, cellphones, etc)
    * Battery based generators / power storage systems.
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897

    Cell Voltage:................1.2........1.2.......Volts DC
    Cells per Module:..............6..........6.......Count

    Module Nominal Voltage:......7.2........7.2.......Volts DC
    Module Capacity:.............6.5........6.5.......Ah
    Module Capacity:............46.8.......46.8.......Wh

    Module Specific Power:.......1.3........1.0.......kW/kg
    Module Specific Power:......1.35.......1.02.......kW/Module

    Module Specific Energy:.......46.........46.......Wh/kg
    Module Specific Energy:....47.84......46.92.......Wh/Module

    Modules per Pack:.............28.........38.......modules
    Pack Voltage:..............201.6......273.6.......DC-nominal
    Pack Specific Power:.......37.86......38.76.......kW/Pack
    Pack Specific Energy:.......1.34.......1.78.......kWh/Pack
    Pack Capacity-Ah:............6.5........6.5.......Ah
    Pack Capacity-kWh:..........1.31.......1.78.......kWh
  • dupiedupie Posts: 22
    John: Have you any idea if the new Prius 04 owners are receiving the color they they requested when placing the order. I remember in 2001 I was going to place an order and the sales person said he could not garentee what color would come in, do you feel that is the case with the 04 Prius orders?
    When I ordered my 04 Prius the sales person seemed a little hesitant about indicating a color on the order. (I selected the Salsa Red)
  • yerth10yerth10 Posts: 428
    In Prius-2003
     battery weight - 38.7 kg
     vehicle weight - 1257 kg
     battery takes 3.0 % of vehicle's weight.

     In Prius-2004
     battery weight - 29.1 kg
     vehicle weight - 1313 kg
     battery takes 2.2 % of vehicle's weight.

     That’s a significant reduction in battery weight while generating
     the same amount of power.
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    I don't see any reason why there would be a color issue this time. And if there was, it would only be with the pre-orders.

    The regular (dealer) orders are quite diverse for the 2004. For the 2001, factory order options (internet only, like the pre-order process) were literally limited to just color selection. Lots has changed since then.

  • jchan2jchan2 Posts: 4,956
    Does anyone know if one color will be easier to find than other colors? Because I have a feeling that the Treeland Green will be fairly hard to find and that there'll be a lot of Reds, Beige, and Silver. I suspect White will be in very limited supply.
  • Can I go to my dealer and preorder a 2004 Prius now? Also, will the Prius come with the EV stealth feature and that neat self-park feature?
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    "Pre-Order" was an opportunity only available for those that internet-ordered a 2001 or 2002 which expired on July 21.

    Now is the option available to everyone. The variety of packages to choose from is much wider too.

    "Stealth" is available on all Prius. It's an inherit part of the design. When the emissions system is warm and the power demand is below 21kW, the engine will remain off. This allows you to drive up to 42 MPH using only electricity. When demands goes above the threshold, the engine will momentarily restart. If that was only to get up the a hill, the engine will quickly shut off once you get to the top.

    The upper-limit of stealth is expected to increase with the 2004, since the motor and power available has increased. But I haven't heard what that limit is yet.

  • last I read these 2 features were only available
    in the home market (Japan), and maybe Europe.

    EV Button would allow you to tell the car that you're
    going a short distance, don't bother turning on the
    engine, such as you're just parking the car in the
    garage at night and don't wish to wake anyone...
    (The Prius otherwise will go into EV whenever it
    feels like it, based on power demand and emissions...)

    The self-park feature that has been getting a lot
    of press lately, would let the car reverse and
    park itself (say, parallel park, like in the demo
    footage available), while you set the marker points
    from the rear-camera video footage, and you also
    brake the car (you don't have to steer).

    For all the press, it'd be nice if it was available
    here in the US, but... Maybe later? (Sort of like
    getting cruise control as an option on the 2002
    Prius, as it wasn't available in the US on 2001s...
    (but you can retrofit cruise to a 2001 - the
    Toyota kit works great.))
  • You can go to your dealer and "pre-order" a 2004.
    Just make sure that IF you're asked for a deposit,
    that it is refundable.

    Dealers that have some clue about the 2004, are
    taking orders. Some are just for right of first
    refusal, while others are trying to order through
    their region the specific color/option package
    that you're looking for.

    Call around. If the salesperson that you're talking
    to isn't Prius-savvy, try another salesperson, or
    go to another dealership. Usually the internet or
    fleet or hybrid specialist is the person most likely
    to know about what's going on with the 2004s.

    You'll probably have better luck if you know that
    your local dealership is Prius-certified (has a
    Prius-trained mechanic on staff). There's a search
    option on the Toyota dealer locator.
  • kernickkernick Posts: 4,072
    This may not be a concern in Japan, but I'm sure it is a major concern with offering it in here in the U.S.

    Unlike cruise control where the operator has the expectation of needing to override the control by tapping the brakes, and still needs to steer, this auto-park feature's expectations is no human intervention.

    So say as the Prius is self-parking it has an accident. An example might be a child running from the side behind the car. Or one of the sensors is covered with snow or mud, or has an intermittent electrical problem. Is Toyota responsible or the driver, who really isn't driving?

    I could see that being a very messy issue in the U.S.
Sign In or Register to comment.