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"Daytime Running Lamps shall be required in the form of high beam headlights run at reduced intensity, or low beam headlights run at full or reduced power, that are activated by the ignition switch. They shall turn on automatically when the vehicle is started and be overridden when regular headlights are activated. Driver deactivation may be not be allowed."
Lexus line
HIDs
Low Beam
Outside the USA
Almost no weight
No cost
So now, it's not only almost IMPOSSIBLE to buy a Prius, it's also not even possible to ORDER one !!
Talk about poor planning !!!
LAterZ.........
It sure looks like the poor planning is on the part of all the other automakers, not Toyota (or Honda).
Toyota will have sold 250,000 Prius by the end of the 2004 model year (a few weeks from now). That's one heck of a headstart for when the mainstream demand finally begins (in 2006).
Right now, the situation is no different than what several other recent popular vehicles have also endured during their initial rollout.
JOHN
Of course both of those have those stupid "Toyota Protection" crap packages on them, bringing the MSRP up even higher.
On that note: Has anyone done any research on Toyota Southeast? Apparently Toyota has added a MIDDLE MAN between the Manufacturer and the Dealers. The Moran Family owns the rights to all of the Toyotas in the Southeast and even does its own financing. I know I'm over simplifying it but I was doing some research yesterday and found their website. Pretty interesting as they do it nowhere else in the US.
Then again, we can see the inventory in the entire region, which I haven't been able to do anywhere else through Toyota.
I am now a Prius owner.
If you're in the market, but don't want to wait, keep your eyes on the various message boards and mailing lists, like PriusChat, PriusOnline, and the Yahoo! groups. Many dealers come up with 'loose' Priuses -- Priuses delivered to them by the screwed up allocation system Toyota's running right now, that don't match any of their wait-listers. And several of them find ways to get the word out the 'net when that happens.
Many of these, it's true, want to charge a markup -- sometimes a hefty one. Occasionally, however, you'll find one who doesn't. I was fortunate enough to find such a one in Rhinelander Toyota, in Rhinelander, WI, last Friday, and pounced exactly in time to drive home with a Seaside #3 on Monday.
Upshot? If you're in a hurry, don't rely on the waiting lists. Be active about it. There are actually quite a few Priuses floating around 'loose' in any given week, but there's no centralised, easy way for the dealers to match these up with customers...
Simple, you can't live within a vacuum.
The supplier of the battery-pack is not Toyota. No matter how many more Prius Toyota wants to produce, they can't.
Plus, the United States isn't the only country in the world. In fact, since we have the lowest costing gas, it only makes sense that demand for Prius would be higher elsewhere.
And of course, they want to compete with the other automakers... not destroy any chance of cross-marketing their product to them, or worse cause them to go bankrupt. Heck, they could even shot themselves in the foot by increasing the production 500,000 units and discovering the demand is actually 5,000,000. Oops!
Economics is a nasty beast.
JOHN
How do you figure they are ahead of the game? If they lost an average of $5000 per Prius that looks like they are down about 1.25 billion at this point. If CARB opens up the market for all the diesels that are now sold in the rest of the world, which is being strongly considered. It will kill the hybrid market in 2006. There is no way they will get a Land Cruiser size vehicle with a hybrid to perform and get the economy they can with a modern diesel. And make near the profit that the diesel cars will offer. At the rate things are going we may never see another hybrid actually make it to market.
How do you figure?
All vehicles incur a R&D expenses. And since the HSD cost will be spread among several vehicles, it looks like Toyota actually got off rather cheap. Instead of having to build entirely new bodies for each, all they have to do is make modifications to existing ones to accomodate HSD.
> It will kill the hybrid market in 2006
Been inhaling diesel exhaust, eh?
CARB will not "open up" diesel for general sales. The EPA (for the rest of the country) won't either. Even with low-sulfur diesel, the vehicles are still too dirty. Adding cleansing equipment will push the price beyond that of hybrids... which are clearly more efficient in city & suburb & highway-commute-delay traffic anyway.
(No further comments about this should be posted here. Use the proper topic for that instead.)
JOHN
Go to sleep for a year, and this will all seem a bad dream - there will be greater supply not only of the Prius, but of other alternatives as well.
I've probably owned more Toyota products over the years than anyone on this board - I'm a big fan. And I think the new Prius is a fantastic piece of work...but the current situation in the US for this car can only be a public-relations black eye for the company. I don't need this car right this minute - but for someone who does, it sure seems a legitimate topic to talk about what else there is out there.
I got that same email from Fred Haas. Do I asked them the price and option packages and the were significantly above MSRP.
They had a option #1 and option #3 both at approximately $7,900 over MSRP.
Again that is just their asking price and not the actual price
Anyway, I have decided a hybrid is not for me, not even the HAH.
I have decided to get a 2005 S2000 in new formula red around November 2004.
Good luck everyone with their Prius orders.
YMMV,
MidCow
Congrats (in advance).
Thanks!
http://www.theaircar.com
Ed Headington
How do you figure money spent on a Prius is "wasted"? You get a car you can drive every day for many years, right? Using the same reasoning, you could argue that money spent on any new car is "wasted" because hundreds or even thousands of dollars fly out of your pocket the moment you leave the dealer's lot. It should be obvious that people don't buy new cars to earn money on them. They don't appreciate, with a few rare exceptions. It's all "money down the toilet." So if a Prius will put a smile on someone's face, why not throw the money away on it rather than some other car?
People are willing to pay $5,000 over MSRP plus any other junk fees dealers reqire, just to get ahead of a list..
What have Toyota learned from this?
My bet says the Highlander hybrid and RX400h will also be "Of short supply".
If they made more, and the dealers could not sell over MSRP and they had "adequate" supply, Toyota would make more money.
Of course, if the Prius really costs more to produce than the invoice price they charge the dealerships, the more they sell, the more money Toyota loses.
I think paying MSRP on a Prius is marginal, for the reason people that buy cars that get great mileage generally do that for the savings. Paying $1000 or more above MSRP encourages dealers to screw the public. That is just me. I have never paid MSRP for a vehicle and never will. I shop the whole US and get the best price I can get. I have done that since the early 1970s when you could not get a deal in Alaska to save your soul.
I know as well as anyone the whole Prius deal is an environmental show. Be like the stars that are green. Let me tell you the difference that makes in our environment is insignificant. We have planes, trains, heavy equipment and factories that are spewing more filth than today's worst cars could dump in a 1000 years. If a 20 year old car is maintained properly it pollutes only slightly more than the Prius. If the Lobbyists for industry ever loosen the strangle hold on Congress we could get some environmental laws with teeth.
I have never paid over MSRP for a car either. I walk away from dealers that add "ADM" to cars, if they refuse to remove it. And I walked away from a new Prius at $800 under current MSRP because for me, in my present situation, that still doesn't represent a good value compared to another car that I did buy. But if someone wants to pay MSRP for a Prius or some other car, or even over MSRP, it's their money and their business.
You are probably right on the supply and demand prices paid for the Prius. I was trying to put it on a higher level than say a Mazda Miata when they were a rage and people paid way over MSRP. There is such a big hit anyway when you drive it off the lot, then to add more to that hit seems crazy. In the case of the Prius you can add "greenie" status symbol, which to some people may be worth more money. It just goes against all common sense economics.
A complete list of voice commands has been posted (and is discussed) along with features, etc. at john1701a "Toyota Prius 2004+" Dec 27, 2003 5:45pm
I'm going to move your post to the Toyota Prius 2004+ discussion. Be sure and use the search box in the upper right of that discussion to find more interesting and helpful hints.
Also - don't forget to post about your buy in the Toyota Prius: Prices Paid & Buying Experiences discussion.
Again - congrats!
Be sure and use the small 'search this discussion' box in the upper right to for more helpful tips.
Price Gouging: (n) Pricing above the market when no alternative retailer is available
I paid Msrp for my new 2004 Prius in April. I guess I would consider this to be market price for this car as several fair minded dealers have told me so. The dealer in SC that I mentioned with used 2004 Prius' for 30k+ is in the position of having something that no other retail dealer in the area has, (unless you open up the area to California.)
This is gouging!!
You might "need" a car, but you don't "need" a Prius specifically.
It is not gouging unless the Prius was the only vehicle available and that dealer was the only dealer it was available from.
You can bring it to a third-party installer yourself, or have the dealer handle it for you.
JOHN
They are Toyota leather seat covers, the same that are offered in the European market.
Please note that the objective of this discussion is for consumers to post the price they paid, their buying experience or experiences they are having with the dealer on an order (includes wait list messages, etc.)
Thanks.