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Comments
Regarding the power. I've rented one and thought it had plenty of power. We were in SF and going up Jones street (the steepest hill in SF?) and we were behind a brand new Prius (Salsa Red just like the one I was looking to get :-( ). Now I had only driven one around Atlanta so I was very interested when we pulled behind them in our rented LeSabre. I swear we could barely keep up with it!
If I weren't a Bay Area native I'd say something bad about "them" taking all of our Prius'!
Anyway...got an appointment for today (Thursday. After diags this is what they said:
"FOUND SCREEN DISPLAY TO HAVE AN OPEN CIRCUIT
ORDERED NEW SCREEN"
Think I will start looking into buying extended warranty...anyone have any ideas which one and how much I should pay?
And indeed, there were a shocking # of these cars tootling around the area when i was there.
Yet my local dealerships (florida) say that the wait list extends 6+ months or more. :-( What is the deal with toyota's distribution system?
in regards to power, it was never an issue, even on the steep SF hills and thru the mountains up north. (over 1,000 miles of driving total, with a fully loaded car.)
in late August (last week) when I too delivery of my Prius, Longo's wait list for the car had grown to just over 800! Demand continues to grow and as the word get's out it'll just increase. GOOD! I read a consumer review by a new Pruis buyer who said he loves giving the finger to the oil companies. I would add to that that I will now love to give that same finger to OPEC!
Shame on Ford, GM & Daimler for not having the guts, leadership and foresight that Toyota has demonstrated. While I'm very pro US and very much a patriot, I hope that Toyota eventually passed GM as the world's #1 auto manufacturer. There's no excuse for the American companies to not have developed this technology. Now they're 5-8 yrs. behind. For shame! Do they have any cars that have waiting lists? Well, you know the answer...
How does this affect the packages that included the rear wiper for the 2004?
JPrice
Hello back - that's why I asked. Is there any info on the packages available for the 2005?
jprice
My reason for pursuing this thread is that I had originally (April '04) asked for package 3, which is just the rear wiper and side airbags. If the rear wiper is standard on the '05, what happens to the packages (all but #2) that had the wiper included? Are the package prices reduced, or will the '05 have a completely different group of packages?
jprice
Thanks - that answers my question.
jprice
jprice
Yep, there seem to be alot of Priuses here in the SF Bay Area. The Toyota dealer in Berkeley sells the most Priuses in the area. I really like the color of the SRP (Salsa Red Pearl), but I'll keep my Driftwood Pearl. I've been told that waiting time here is 2-3 months unless you're real picky.
Thanks,
Rich
I never received the letter that I've seen postings about on this forum notifying purchasers of a $300 rebate to those who placed orders before March 10. My dealer in NC seemed to not know anything about this rebate. I received a letter from Toyota USA dated April 9 that only mentioned a $300 price increase. A couple of months ago I called Toyota USA to inquire why I never received a letter regarding the rebate, explaining my order was placed Nov. 11. The representative explained that their system showed my order date as being March 18. They referred my "compaint" to my dealer, who explained that the March 18 date was actually the "registration" date , the date the dealer actually registered my order with Toyota USA, per the process dictated by Toyota USA. The dealer's records show that my my actual order date was Nov. 11.
My plan is to write a letter to Toyota USA requesting the $300 rebate, including supporting documentation such as my credit card receipt of the $500 deposit on Nov. 11, a copy of some of the Edmunds.com postings regarding the rebate, and a letter from my dealer verifying my order date.
Our new Prius so far has achieved 47.5 mpg for its first 75 miles, per the dashboard consumption display. That's outstanding in my book. Bob.
I thought it was the local dealer. When you order a Toyota can't you get it exactly as you want it?
I have ordered several vehicles because they could not find what I wanted. They are built to your specs at the factory in a couple months not 10 months or a year. I find that very shabby business.
In my book it is. No wonder people end up with SUVs & big PUs that is what the dealers have available with discounts. If I can't buy a hybrid or diesel vehicle I like, I may get a diesel Excursion to replace my Suburban. It gets better mileage than many of the wannabe SUVs & mini-vans.
SE Toyota distribution is handled by a company independent of Toyota, the Corporation. They have had the franchise from the beginning, have a death grip on it, will probably never sell it to the Toyota parent [Toyota has tried multiple times to take this back to bring SE policies in line with the rest of the country]. They have forever forced "packages" of mandatory extras on all buyers in the SE distribution area - this is legal, in the sense that Toyota Motor can do nothing about it because of the nature of the initial franchise agreement - but what it means is that all SE buyers pay higher prices than the rest of the nation. It's all pure profit for the family that owns the SE distribution rights.
None of this is in control of the dealers, who just have to play the cards they're dealt by these pirates. And good luck getting the franchise laws changed - these people own the legislatures involved.
When I moved to Alaska in 1970 the dealers there had that kind of control. Most of the people I knew bought in Portland, Seattle or Detroit and made a vacation of their vehicle buying. They always saved more than enough to pay for all the expenses of the vacation.
Anyone looking for a Prius & So CA vacation, I just looked up Longo Toyota in El Monte CA and it shows 5 Prius available. Package 3 to 9 with prices that seem correct $22k -$27K.
http://www.longotoyota.com/en_US/
Please disregard it for this corrected version. Thank you!)
_______________________
This is to alert all those interested in a Prius to a dealer scam that I just encountered through a friend, after placing a query through NYTimes' auto/Edmunds.com website. It has become a horrible mess. I feel compelled that I warn you of this scam, so that you can advise your readers of similar pitfalls.
I am posting the story for the poor Prius victim, as follows:
She became involved in this "mischief" after a dealer responded to a query made in curiousity through Autos.NYT.com. She had been led to believe by many "experts" and participants on the "consumer review" board (not the Town Hall boards, however) that the Toyota Prius was only available after months of waiting, due to an enormous backlog.
As you probably know, this has led to price gouging, and outright confusion on the part of consumers.
I don't know if you are aware that 2004 Prius in the past month have not been that tough to come by. In fact, a survey of dealers in the NJ area seems to have stopped taking spurious deposits for vehicle, and often, just maintain a waiting or should I say, calling list.
Sometimes, the Prius becomes available through a cancelled order, too. For example, someone who couldn't wait because their lease was expiring on their car, or someone who could not be approved for the financing in the end.
Also, I have learned that the majority of dealers within NJ, at the very least, are not charging a premiums over the MSRP for the car, or so they say. They are still promising a wait of 3-8 months to even a year, nonetheless.
The Prius, sometimes, can become available by routinely calling dealerships (just in case), or sending out requests through the Edmunds.com, Carsdirect.com or similar websites.
All of this was learned in hindsight. Because she wasn't aware of this in advance, she's in a terrible amount of trouble.
What I mean is that a Toyota dealer has her family member's car (without the title), she was charged $4900 over the sticker price for their "effort" to get the car, and pressured to sign up for financing at a 15.75% interest rate through Toyota!
In addition, she was talked into an extended Platinum Toyota warranty at the amount of $2,200 (saying it would be much more expensive later), and lojak (not realizing the car wasn't equipped with an alarm).
What the interest rate means is that she is now liable for not a $23,000 car, but a $42,000 car, as the bank will charge a $10,000 plus in finance fees for giving her the loan, because of bad credit.
All of this happened, despite telling the salesmen she had little disposable income, due to serious health problems, and was expecting family help (very elderly parents). When the parents heard what happened, they were horrified, and wanted her to immediately return the car, and only then, did she understand the consequences and ramifications of what had happened that night.
The people she dealt with now, claim she "signed" a contract, although it was only supposed to be temporary until her family took care of the car.
The narrative is as follows:
The dealer in question here, who responded to her was from Hudson Toyota in Jersey City, NJ. She later heard that this dealer is well known to take advantage of people.
She received an e-mail from the internet sales manager after signing up for a quote through NYT, and when she initially responded, was told the Prius wouldn't be available for many, many months. Out of the blue, one of the salesman called from the dealership on her cell phone, claiming that a customer who had ordered a car, couldn't wait for her Prius to arrive, one had become available, and was she interested?
Soon, he faxed information printed out through Carsdirect.com. The car only was minimally equipped with a rear wiper, and a package #4, which didn't have side airbags. If a Prius was available, and her parents would help her as co-signors, etc., she would have really preferred package #9, which would have included all the options.
In any case, the salesman and this gal spoke off and on, over several weeks. He claimed to have 5 people wanting to take the car, and would have ten by the next day. She thought it was a little strange when she didn't respond right away, he just didn't move on down his list. I guess he found his patsy. Any case, he said the car wasn't supposed to arrive for about 4-5 weeks.
When said that she really couldn't wait that long, and/ or there were concerns because the car wasn't fully equipped, including side-air bags, a message appeared on her machine, that the car had suddenly arrived, and didn't have packages 1 and 4, as he thought, but package #6 (with the side air-bags).
He said that it was pretty critical for her to come over, as soon as possible, to see the car, because otherwise, he would offer to someone else. Needless to say, she dropped almost everything, and drove quickly that evening to meet with him. He said that he'd even wait past closing. It was August 31st -- you know now, the end of the month.
When she arrived, a bunch of people in the area was asking her how I got so lucky to find a Prius. She was told that she was the "luckiest woman in the world,' in fact.
The problem was that the car she was driving was not hers, and she never expected to apply, personally, for financing knowing her credit problems because of her health., mentioning that she was on disability. All she had gone over there to do was to "see" the car.
This matter also seems to have had something to do with meeting the dealer's August quota, since she offered to come back the next day, because she wasn't feeling well and needed to have a family member to help her apply for the payment details, anyway, She was advised, instead, this all needed to be done for the last day of the month. She couldn't reach her family, and the next thing she knows, she's being approved for a loan, not hearing of the finance rate, or all the charges involved until several hours and discussions later, and being presented with the paperwork at the last minute. By this time, she had a headache and was shivering.
Further, by 9:30 pm, or so, she never expected the car to be prepped after closing time, but the next thing that happens is the salesperson is sending it to whomever it was, and he's giving her the keys to the car, and she's getting detailed instructions, and more papers to sign. She wasn't even informed that the car didn't have an alarm, and only heard of it, after she was about to leave, at 1 am!
By that time, the plates had been taken off her family's car, put in the trunk, and he had key. The majority of her stuff was left in her family member's car, supposedly to have her return
Needless to say, she was sick for several days after this incident. She's trying to negotiate with them to take the car back, given it's desirability status. The salesman says that some dealers charge $7,000 over sticker, she remarked, "Good you can make a profit off this car."
When she came home, she found what he had originally faxed to her on August 28, 2004. I noticed it was from Carsdirect.com and dated not recently, but from May 28, 2004.
So, this is a tale of woe, and it's my hope, one of Edmunds editors can put together an article, regarding how to avoid being price=-gouged over the Prius.
As for her, she may just have to declare bankruptcy if this situation is not resolved. You see the back of the loan she signed for Toyota's loan, says that if she defaults on the loan, she will not only have the car repossessed, but the bank can demand the payment from her in full (ie, the $42,000), as well as auction off the vehicle, and whatever dastardly deeds they can think of.
And wouldn't you know it, just the other day, another dealer responded to her query, who has a 2004 Prius, package #9, which was ordered by someone, who in the end, couldn't get financing.
Check out the Toyota.com website on this model. They seem to be fueling some of the confusion, after all, they have a bulletin that the Prius has limited availability.
Is anyone up to the task to figure out, just what's going on?!!!!
And finally does anyone know how this car does in the snow?
Thanks for listening!
There are many other good lessons here too, such as:
* Always read the entire contract, even the fine print, before you sign it.
* Never hand your car keys over to the dealer until you and they have signed a contract for them to buy it from you. If they need to test drive it to appraise its value, go on the test drive with them, and take the keys back afterwards.
* If you aren't good at negotiating and dealing with high-pressure sales tactics, bring a friend or relative along who is. Or go to a dealership that has a "no-negotiating" policy, with sales reps who are not on commission. You may not get the lowest possible price on a car, but you will not subject yourself to high-pressure tactics either. Or buy through a car-buying service or an agent. Again, you won't pay the lowest possible price for a car, but you won't get a rotten deal, either.
This is called the "rule of 78s" loan, where you pay the majority of the interest in the first years. It makes sense for an automobile, because the car loses most of it's value in the early years. It isn't illegal as far as I know.
However, always go for "simple interest". The best bet is to go into the showroom with pre-approved credit, up to a certain limit, from your bank or credit union. Then you can have the dealer draw up paperwork that only takes effect if you fail to deliver the check from your bank within a couple of days.
See: http://www.hondapreview.com/
mebman "2006 Honda Fit (Jazz)" Sep 7, 2004 10:19pm!make=Honda&model=Fit&ed_makeindex=.ef0ae5b
Or http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_1762/article.html
This car has been available in Japan and in the UK for a couple of years now, and has outsold everything else in it’s class.
----
regarding the Honda Jazz,
And it's not just about mileage either, it's about the whole package. What safety features does the Jazz offer? accessories? I swear the waiting list for the Prius grew over time and notably so when NTHSA released their crash results.
I read that article and it starts at *about* the same base price the Prius has, not quite sure I understand where the savings lie. It's just another choice. And choices are great, competition is great. The consumer always wins when there is competition.
As for safety equipment, all Honda cars sold in the U.S. by 2006 will have side air bags and curtains and ABS as standard equipment. As for accessories... the Jazz is an entry-level car. Good luck if you want nav, Bluetooth, and some of the other features the Prius offers.