Buying Tips - How Do I Get the Best Deal?

jmonroe

Product on your feet and price in your seat.

Heck, I thought there was a lot more to it than that.

Well...I guess when you pass the spelling test that 'tidester' will be sending you, you'll get the Edmunds book. I hope you're paying attention, I'm teaching the test here.

FWIW, I picked up on this but I didn't want to say nothin.

jmonroe

joel0622

The day I get real worried about my spelling on a message board is the day I pack it in You Import/Hyundai buyers are a different breed :shades:

micosilver

I will mut a different perspective on the Internet buying:

I work as a VW Internet Sales Manager.
I desk my own deals within the guidelines set by GSM.
These are my observations:
99% of Edmunds.com, Cars.com, etc. shoppers don't buy. The goal of a company such as Edmunds is to get you to submit a quote request, regardless of how serious you are, and to sell you as a lead to dealers. I still respond to every lead, and I try to call every lead to get a feel of the customer. I also try to send a quote - if I have something to work with, anything more than model and a year.

Here is my advise how to buy a car online:
Go through either factory or dealer website.

Be as specific as possible

Add comments

Put a real phone number, and don't be affraid to talk to a salesperson on the phone

Don't be hostile. "I am sending this to 10 dealers, and I will go with the best price", "if you call - you lose my business", "you get one shot" - that kind of sweet-talk will not get you a better price.

Give your local dealer first and last chance. I would rather lose money on a local customer, than break even with someone from 50 miles away.

jmonroe

I'll be putting a lot down, and I'll be financing but paying it off real quickly. You're probably doing the same, and saving a bit more than the $300 i may give up, since your research is probably superior to mine and you want to be a bit more agressive in the tete-a-tete dept.

I never said or hinted that my research was superior to anyone’s. I just want it to satisfy me. I’m sure I’m leaving money on the table; I just don’t want to leave more than I’m satisfied with leaving. As for that “tete-a-tete”, I don’t get into that stuff. I have one price I’m willing to pay and until I’ve been proven wrong, I stick with it.

Why would anyone, knowingly, spend more than what they should spend for anything?

jmonroe

joel0622

Why would anyone, knowingly, spend more than what they should spend for anything?


To line my pockets and allow myself and my family to continue to live in the lavish lifestyle we have become accustomed to.


Our latest house

kiawah

Too bad you didn't have enough money to put in a bigger pool...........

Looks like Tiger Wood's house.

british_rover

Bah thats nothing...



Check out my new boat. :shades:

epiney

I didn't know palm trees were native to TN? On wait, I forgot, that's the winter house when things get slow

epiney

Here is my advise how to buy a car online:
Go through either factory or dealer website.

Be as specific as possible

Add comments

Put a real phone number, and don't be affraid to talk to a salesperson on the phone

Don't be hostile. "I am sending this to 10 dealers, and I will go with the best price", "if you call - you lose my business", "you get one shot" - that kind of sweet-talk will not get you a better price.

Give your local dealer first and last chance. I would rather lose money on a local customer, than break even with someone from 50 miles away.

I always go through the dealer web site and believe it or not, I prefer to talk to you on the phone as it saves time for both of us and I can get a good feel for you and how serious you are about making a deal. I would also pay a little more to buy from my local dealer.

Looks like we could business. Got any Phaeton's lying around?

micosilver

Looks like we could business. Got any Phaeton's lying around?

No - Thank God! :sick:

However, I am looking at a beautiful Audi A8L with your name on it, and a sticker of $80K...

british_rover

I would rather have the Phaeton for half the price.

jmonroe

Check out my new boat.

Dog gone, that looks like the boat that 'graph' wants to get. Maybe you guys can set up a boat race. I'm sure he'd go for it.

jmonroe

graphicguy

I'd be all over that.....if I was Thurston Howell III :shades: :shades: :shades:

jcorelitz

i'd like to offer 5% over dealer cost on a new Subaru Outback 2.5i.

Invoice is $24000, Subaru holdback is 3%, and there's a rebate right now for $1000.

So, dealer cost comes out to $22250 + 5% = my offer of $23500

What I'm confused is whether my offer INCLUDES the credit of the rebate or not. Just as an example, if this offer were accepted and I payed cash, would I be paying $22500+tax?

Am I doing this right? If anyone can clear this up, I'd appreciate it.

kiawah

Tax will be prior to rebate. Rebate will be considered cash.

> MSRP whatever (incl dest)
> Invoice 24000 (using your numbers)
> Negotiated price 24480 (uplift invoice by 2%, forget talking about holdback)
> - Tradein, if there is one
> Taxable amount
> + Tax
> + Tags
> + Doc Fees as negotiated
> Summary Price
> - Rebate -1000, have it go to dealer
> Total price Out the door

You don't say what year this is, but assume 2007 since you mention a rebate. You could try for lower price, but I have no idea what Sub's are going for....and how competitive your geography is.

jcorelitz

thanks for the reply - i think i was confusing factory to dealer rebates with consumer rebates (which is what the $1000 in this case is). it's a 2008.

negotiated price from today at the dealership is $24500, and they're valuing my trade in at full blue book (trade-in) value. so the final amount is that minus trade, minus rebate.

i was thinking that based on some of the things i've read about factory to dealer incentives that it might be worth trying for a better deal, but don't want to push my luck.

cccompson

Don't count on getting book for your trade everywhere (or, possibly, anywhere) else.

british_rover

If they are giving you full KBB for your trade then they are almost certainly over allowing for your trade.

verdugo

Unless he's taking advantange of Subaru's current program. They garantee a really good value on your trade in. For example, on my 06 Subaru Impreza 2.5i Wagon (auto, 21k), they said the *minimum* they would give me is $15k.

oldfarmer50

I often hear people talking about "the market" determining what is a realistic price for any car. The market makes it difficult to get discounts on hot car while less popular cars can be had near cost.

What specific sources should I be looking at to determine "the market"? I read comments here of course but I'm wondering where there might be more quantitative information. I've looked at the J.D.Power site but it lists some cars I know are dogs as being in high demand.

Any one care to share their secrets?

tidester

The "market" is the aggregate of all purchases and sales. Try this reputable source for reliable information about the market: TMV new car prices, used car pricing, used car values at Edmunds

tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper

im_brentwood

Basically,

"The Market" is what wholesalers will pay or what it will NET at auction... No dealer that I know uses VMR, TMV, NADA or KBB to appraise cars.

Tidester makes a good point but TMV is starting to get inaccurate of late.

TMV on a 1991 M3 is still hysterical!

oldfarmer50

"...Try this reputable source..."

What is this TMV you speak of stranger? I've been living under a rock lo these many years and have never heard of such a thing!

Seriously though, I guess what I'm asking about is info on the "aggregates". For example, I was trying to find out if sales of a particular car were up or down this month and found it hard to get specific data. I thought perhaps one of the posters here had sources.

TMV is a great tool but salespeople in particular say it can be off sometimes.

plekto

True. At best, they pay low trade-in(read: average condition no options KBB trade-in) and most of the time they pay a lot closer to auction value, which is about 80% of that. (unless it's a special or hot car in which case you might be able to get close to private party).

tidester

I was trying to find out if sales of a particular car were up or down this month.

That information is probably contained in the database used by TMV. You may want to try "Contact Us" link at the bottom of this page and suggest making some of that information available.

tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper

nealj42

I'm looking at buying my first "new" car and I've finally settled on the one I want. The problem is there are only two dealers within 100 miles (and one is exactly 100 miles away). While I can shop the offer to the distant dealer, I don't think it's practical and I'd like to buy from the dealer that I'll probably be working with for any maintenance/problems.

Anyway, with some 08's on the lot, I plan on making an offer on an 07 which has been there for over a month, but has some options that'd be nice, but won't I pay a lot for. And of course, I'll have my trade in and financing ready to go for a quick close. Is there anything else I can do to try and get the best deal possible?

Also, if I can't close the deal on the first car, there are some 08's (with fewer options) that I could go for (or possibly put one on order). Has anyone had experience trying to do a second deal if the first one didn't pan out (providing everyone isn't mad at each other from the first deal).

Thanks for any advice you can give!

im_brentwood

Not exactly.

Again, hardly any dealers, if any, use kbb.com to value cars. We tend to use books and guides that are based on actual market activity.

As far as auction values go, I hardly ever would put auction value on a trade, that's generally all the money you're going to get for a car on a wholesale level. Also there's auction fees, transport fees, etc and no wholesaler will ever give us that except in very rare circumstances.

greanpea68

Also, if I can't close the deal on the first car, there are some 08's (with fewer options) that I could go for (or possibly put one on order). Has anyone had experience trying to do a second deal if the first one didn't pan out (providing everyone isn't mad at each other from the first deal).


It doesn't sound like you have been to the dealership. It is the salesman's job to sell you a car. If he is a good salesman than he will probably offer the switch for you. If he doesn't don't be afaid to ask. The idea of getting the best deal well I can't help you there. Next competitor 100 miles away it probably won't matter. What kind of high line are you buying?

nealj42

You are correct, I haven't spoken to anyone at the dealership yet. I've been on the lot during off hours to check the inventory and look at color/interior combinations to see what I like. I'd rather not start working with anyone there until I have more of a plan together.

I'm currently looking at buying an Infiniti G35 at the end of this month. The good news is I don't have to have a new car at this point, so if it doesn't pan out, I'm not walking everywhere.

plekto

I know hardly any actually use KBB, but basically the average consumer can take the lowest value possibly spit out by KBB for their car in the worst condition possible("fair", IIRC) and that's about the most they'll ever be offered. Mileage is moot, options, and condition is moot to them. You get reamed, essentially by trading in a car.

BTW, that also makes KBB and the rest about as useless as the toilet paper they are printed on.

epiney

Seriously though, I guess what I'm asking about is info on the "aggregates". For example, I was trying to find out if sales of a particular car were up or down this month and found it hard to get specific data. I thought perhaps one of the posters here had sources.


Sales data by month and year to date are readily available through manufacturer press releases. What car are you looking?

oldfarmer50

"...What car are you looking?...

I've been tracking a bunch of mid-sized coupes from Nissan, Pontiac, Honda and Mitsubishi. The one that's toughest is the Mitsu Eclipse. I haven't been able to find any specific monthly data since November of 2006.

One can assume that when a company stops reporting sales data it is because they have a dog on their hands. This might mean large rebates or good deals are to be had. I like to know ahead of time though.

epiney

You would pick the one model that doesn't report much :confuse: Mits is here link to Mits press

But no Eclipse. Didn't know they still sold those. Pontiac, Honda, Nissan numbers are easier to find.

oldfarmer50

"...You would pick the one model that doesn't report much..."

Exactly. This is my problem. The best deals can usually be had on cars that are not selling well even though they may have performance similar to the "hot" models. Without current sales figures it's hard to tell who's hot and who's not.

Do you use any other data to determine the market? I'd like to rely on TMV but sometimes I question it's accuracy. To use the Eclipse as an example, TMV has it at close to full MSRP but the cars at a local dealer have stickers in the window offering discounts of $1300, about $1000 less than TMV.

patg2

hi,

i sent out emails to 4 dealerships for the bottom-line price on a 2008 Nissan Rogue 2WD base model...the price was to include every cost...is this the way to begin...i have received a couple of replies...i remember reading on this forum about 2 years ago how a person went step by step, so he was always comparing apples to apples and eventually got the deal he wanted...this is what i would like to do...i refuse to go into the dealership to negotiate...please advise...thanks...pg

210delray

The best sources for me are Automotive News and Ward's Auto Reports. Unfortunately, these are subscription-only and fairly expensive to boot. I get them at work; I'd never pay out of my own pocket.

I can get you the exact numbers if you'd like, but I can tell you right off the bat that no Mitsubishi products are exactly flying off the lots, including the Eclipse. IIRC, the Endeavor is currently Mitsu's biggest dog.

oldfarmer50

"...I can get the exact numbers if you like..."

Yes, that would be helpful. I'm not sure I'll end up buying an Eclipse but it pays to keep track. Sometimes the difference between a great selling car that everyone wants and the dog that no one wants is not that much.

It's my natural inclination (cheap) to seek out the underdog.

BTW, Mitsu doesn't give sales figures on the Endeavor either.

cccompson

Automotive News is available at some libraries.

greanpea68

i sent out emails to 4 dealerships for the bottom-line price on a 2008 Nissan Rogue 2WD base model...the price was to include every cost

If you are going to buy a Rouge right now expect to pay sticker price plus tax,reg and doc fees.

joel0622

Off topic, but am I the only person who thinks that the "Rouge" is one of the worst names in history for a car? If you search the net for it you get both spellings as we have here and a Rogue [rohg] means anything from a cheat to a scoundrel, to an inferior organism. Where a rouge (rōōzh) is a make up.

I don't get it :confuse:

greanpea68

Yeah i don't get it yet either. We are supposed to go on a ride and drive at the end of the month. So maybe I'll learn what there thought was coming from there.

grandtotal

They are looking for a "bad boy" image. Sometimes you wonder what these marketing people are paid for.

oldfarmer50

"...Yeah i don't get it either..."

Come on guys, that cute little cheerleader from "Heros" drives one. Isn't that reason enough to buy one?

snakeweasel

Off topic, but am I the only person who thinks that the "Rouge" is one of the worst names in history for a car?

Second only to GM's "Impact".

A while ago me and She Who Must Be Obeyed went looking at Nissans. This was the first time I even heard of this car. They guy told me the name and I laughed saying :"what a god awful name for a car" and walked away.

fordfool

> Off topic, but am I the only person who
> thinks that the "Rouge" is one of the worst
> names in history for a car?

> I don't get it

At one time The Rouge was the largest factory in the world. Located at the confluence of the Rouge and Detroit Rivers, The Rouge employed more than 100,000 workers producing Ford products.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/River_Rouge_Plant

fordfool

Transposing two letters to Rogue, one finds:

"The Rogue name was chosen to reflect its independence-oriented positioning, though we certainly believe that all buyers, regardless of age or life stage, will positively respond to Rogue's fun-to-drive, all-weather performance and aggressive styling," said Bill Bosley, vice president and general manager, Nissan Division.

http://news.carjunky.com/a-sports-car-in-disguise-2008-nissan-rouge-cde689.shtml-

lilengineerboy

They had a mini car show at work the other day and I thought it was a Kia Rondo (this was partially because the Nissan and Kia dealers are the same network).
I had never seen it before, is it Sentra based?

snakeweasel

though we certainly believe that all buyers, regardless of age or life stage, will positively respond to Rogue's fun-to-drive, all-weather performance and aggressive styling,"

I am going to seriously question the "fun to drive" claim as it has to have a higher center of gravity than a typical car would have plus at 167 HP it seems rather underpowered.

Not to mention that the lack of a manual transmission automatically brings down the fun factor a notch or two.

Kirstie_H

I’m posting this on behalf of a journalist at a national publication writing a story about negotiating new-car prices and the car-buying experience. He writes, "I’d like to talk to car buyers about their views on negotiating a car’s price and hear your recent experiences about buying a new car. I am particularly interested in the experiences of woman and all shoppers under the age of 35. Would you prefer to haggle or just get one price and pay it? Are you attracted to brands like Saturn and Scion because they boast one-price selling? You must be willing to chat by phone and be quoted in print. If you have some experiences or thoughts to share, please send an email to carguy147@hotmail.com and I’ll set up an interview."
Alternately, you can write to jfallon@edmunds.com and I'll be sure to connect you. Please respond on or before Wednesday, October 17, 2007.

british_rover

Not any more it got stolen.