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Owe more than it's worth... I'm upside down and I can't get up!

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    johnnyvolvo07johnnyvolvo07 Member Posts: 29
    your right. S60 Lost about 7% but XC90 is only 2%. I guess my theory doesnt make much sense now, huh? :cry:
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    151ranch151ranch Member Posts: 109
    Sorry, I should have said they depreciate like Kias....

    when they are out of warranty

    I can just go by my experience...I put a lot of miles on my vehicles, so I run of warranty pretty quickly. Having had 6 major repairs under warranty, I thought about getting a different car at 50k. Except that I was barely even, after two years on a 48 month loan with a 10k downpayment.

    I don't think I've had another car with so many pretty lights on the dash. :P However, I still miss it...it was fast, safe, got great mileage, and was the perfect size for the four of us. I would still have it if there was a mechanic that could fix the $@!$% car within a 100 mile radius.
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    johnnyvolvo07johnnyvolvo07 Member Posts: 29
    :sick: ouch sorry to hear that. You have to admit though 50,000 miles in 2 years hurts any cars resell value no matter what it is. Sorry you had a bad experience
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    a5drivera5driver Member Posts: 2
    I am $8000 upsidedown and need a lease that will keep me under $600 2 years, or under $525 30 or 36 months on a car with enough room that this is a sign and drive. Does a Volvo fit this? Any other ideas? Can do it by Monday to take advantage of sales trunk money. Tried a Jetta the payment was fine but bank would not take 6k over sticker.
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    johnnyvolvo07johnnyvolvo07 Member Posts: 29
    Yes a 2007 Volvo S60 2.5T base or maybe one with Premium package only will work. it has 9k in dealer cash but the lease ends on sunday.
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    cccompsoncccompson Member Posts: 2,382
    Eight grand upside down?

    Wow
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    tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    I am $8000 upsidedown and need a lease that will keep me under $600 2 years, or under $525 30 or 36 months...

    That $8,000 will cost you $358 a month for 2 years or $247 a month for 3 years at 7% a.p.r. so you don't have an abundance of slack.

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
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    british_roverbritish_rover Member Posts: 8,502
    Some of those special leases have essentially zero percent interest though.
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    a5drivera5driver Member Posts: 2
    thanks. why isnt that dealer lease cash listed on the incentives page in edmunds? i noticed the same with the audi dealer money.

    is that volvo money likely nationwide? i am in florida.
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    tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    Some of those special leases have essentially zero percent interest though.

    That $8,000 debt isn't just going to disappear. Even if they were willing to give the OP a free ride (no interest) on that $8,000 it would still cost him $333 or $222 per month for the two scenarios.

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
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    volvomaxvolvomax Member Posts: 5,238
    thanks. why isnt that dealer lease cash listed on the incentives page in edmunds? i noticed the same with the audi dealer money.

    Because they aren't rebates. They are money paid to the dealer.
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    joel0622joel0622 Member Posts: 3,299
    We had a guy in here Saturday night who had a 2005 M3 BMW. He owes $52600 on it. We hit it for around $35K.
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    cccompsoncccompson Member Posts: 2,382
    Who's dumber, the owner of the car or the lender?
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    british_roverbritish_rover Member Posts: 8,502
    WTH was he going to trade a M3 in on?
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    shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    A used Civic. :P
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    joel0622joel0622 Member Posts: 3,299
    WTH was he going to trade a M3 in on?

    An F150. Actually I think he was trying to trade it in on a lower payment.
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    roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 17,366
    WTH was he going to trade a M3 in on?

    An F150. Actually I think he was trying to trade it in on a lower payment.

    Were the poor guy's lobotomy scars very obvious?

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive

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    bolivarbolivar Member Posts: 2,316
    His $900,000 house's variable loan rate is probably going to increase by 50% in October. Gotta cut back somewhere.
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    lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    Are people fierociously stupid with their money or what? Does a BMW M3 even cost $52K to start with? Maybe he traded a 745i after 18 months to get a lower payment with an M3. He's had the M3 for 18 months and wants to trade down to a F-150. I bet in 18 months, he'll be trading his F-150 with $75K negative equity for a Kia Rio in order to get a lower payment.

    Flash forward to 2038, his widow standing next to his grave, "He lived a long, long time. Darn near almost paid off the Kia."
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    im_brentwoodim_brentwood Member Posts: 4,883
    Does a BMW M3 even cost $52K to start with?

    If you don't get too many options... one with a sticker price that low may be tough to find tho.. they usually stickered around $55k or so... easy to hit $60k with a coupe, especially with Nav and SMG... you could get convertibles close to $70k if memory serves.. if you throw in 19s, HIDs, Nav, SMG, etc.. assuming it's a loaded ragtop and he bought it new and did longer term financing, oh yeah.. he's going to owe plenty on it.
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    qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 32,951
    I am $8000 upsidedown and need a lease that will keep me under $600 2 years, or under $525 30 or 36 months on a car with enough room that this is a sign and drive.

    Why?
    Why do you need to trade?
    Why do you NEED a lease?
    And what exactly is "enough room"?

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '08 Maser QP; '11 Mini Cooper S

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    johnnyvolvo07johnnyvolvo07 Member Posts: 29
    You cannot see dealer cash on edmunds or bonus cash because it is money for the dealer not the consumer. Also, every market has different money. I am in LA South Region and we typically have the most cash.
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    im_brentwoodim_brentwood Member Posts: 4,883
    Plus Volvo info isn't always online either...
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    fezofezo Member Posts: 10,384
    A friend's ex has hit the wall on this "let me use negative equity and...." scenario. Been doing the leases for years and managed to blow through his inheritance with it. Of course the next thing you hit is the house and do some real nice sub-prime borrowing. It's taken several years but they lost the house now and as near as I can tell are still digging.

    Choose to keep creating mountains of debt that you'll take care of eventually at your own risk.
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
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    roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 17,366
    Choose to keep creating mountains of debt that you'll take care of eventually at your own risk.

    But you don't understand...

    I WANT a new car!

    I NEED a new car!

    I DESERVE a new car.

    And by golly, I'm worth it!

    So don't try and confuse me with rational financial arguments; I NEED A NEW CAR!!!

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive

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    fezofezo Member Posts: 10,384
    Oh, but of course. I didn't mean you.... It was that other guy over there.....
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
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    joel0622joel0622 Member Posts: 3,299
    This is Tennessee boys, a truck is a step up :D
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    corvettecorvette Member Posts: 10,267
    It's taken several years but they lost the house now and as near as I can tell are still digging.

    Wow, crash and burn, just like a lot of lottery winners (the paradigm also applies to other recipients of sudden wealth)... Can you even lease/finance a car (other than at a BHPH lot) with a foreclosure on your credit report?
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    fezofezo Member Posts: 10,384
    I can't imagine being able to do that, which is why I think BHPH exists, but I never fail to be amazed at what lenders will throw money at. Heck, they'd probably lend me enough to buy Ecuador. Doesn't mean I can afford it.

    These folks managed to find a house in the next town over to rent. I can't imagine being the landlord.

    I feel sorry for their kids. They are adults - late 20s and early 30s - but that's gotta leave a mark seeing your dad go through that. The younger one still lives with my friend - her mom. Said mom is doing OK and paying off her house in the next couple of years and making a nice life with good credit on less money. It's all in the decisions.
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
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    im_brentwoodim_brentwood Member Posts: 4,883
    You sure can... expect to pay .10% under the state Usury cap though and put $3k down on a $10k car.. at a minimum.

    Short term.. 24-30 month financing as well.
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    fezofezo Member Posts: 10,384
    Oh, swell.

    Whatta ya got? :P
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
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    im_brentwoodim_brentwood Member Posts: 4,883
    Couple of nice used Vauxhalls.. low miles, free beer holders ;)
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    fezofezo Member Posts: 10,384
    Sign me up!

    Can I get it checked out by my local Vauxhall dealer?
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
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    qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 32,951
    Can I get it checked out by my local Vauxhall dealer?

    LOL! Of course!
    That's the one next door to the Citroen dealer, right?

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '08 Maser QP; '11 Mini Cooper S

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    fezofezo Member Posts: 10,384
    Yeah. That's the one!
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
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    im_brentwoodim_brentwood Member Posts: 4,883
    Well, there's no need as the Vauxhall is the world's most reliable car you know.
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    mcrrtmcrrt Member Posts: 93
    Hope this is the best forum to post this in (Hosts, please let me know otherwise!). I currently own a 2004 Jeep Wrangler; still have about 20 payments left, but not upside down (approx. $9K equity). Jeep has 38K miles and a 7yr/70K mile powertrain warranty. We have more credit card debt than I'm comfortable with (although we're making all the payments OK), and am considering getting out of the Jeep payments by selling it and using the equity to buy a used car outright. Depending on what I bought, $9K should get me something around a 2000-2003 with 60-80K miles. The money saved on Jeep payments would go towards quicker credit card repayment.

    I'm stuck between two rational decisions: Sell Jeep to pay off debt faster, or keep Jeep with the idea that in 20 months it's paid for, still has warranty, and I know who's owned it (me, since new.)

    What would you do? :) :confuse:
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    dtownfbdtownfb Member Posts: 2,918
    I think what you are proposing is a great idea. If you buy a car, you will also save in gas. Thing you have to be careful of are:

    a) Is the Jeep worth what you think it's worth? I suggest a trip to the Real World Trade-In Values forum for that one.

    b) make sure there a vehicle you can live with in your price range. Nothing worst then buyer's remorse on a used vehicle.

    c) Make sure the extra money goes towards the credit card bills and not a new big screen TV. This is harder then you think as "life happens".

    Good luck.
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    blueiedgodblueiedgod Member Posts: 2,798
    Hope this is the best forum to post this in (Hosts, please let me know otherwise!). I currently own a 2004 Jeep Wrangler; still have about 20 payments left, but not upside down (approx. $9K equity). Jeep has 38K miles and a 7yr/70K mile powertrain warranty. We have more credit card debt than I'm comfortable with (although we're making all the payments OK), and am considering getting out of the Jeep payments by selling it and using the equity to buy a used car outright. Depending on what I bought, $9K should get me something around a 2000-2003 with 60-80K miles. The money saved on Jeep payments would go towards quicker credit card repayment.

    I'm stuck between two rational decisions: Sell Jeep to pay off debt faster, or keep Jeep with the idea that in 20 months it's paid for, still has warranty, and I know who's owned it (me, since new.)

    What would you do?

    If you have top of the line Rubicon with all the options and a spare Hard top you may get $15,000 for it. Since you say you are $9,000 right side up, that means that your loan is only $6000, or you are paying about $300/month on it.

    I would stay with the Jeep. Like you said, you already know who owned it, you already know its maintenance history, and it has warranty.

    If you go out an buy a 4-7 year old car, who knows who drove it and how they drove it, and why they are selling it. So, you have this risk of unexpected repairs, which will most definatley eat into your profits.

    I don't know how disciplined you are, I can't assume that you have no discipline at all because you have this credit card debt, but stuff happens.

    But, if you are disciplined and can stick to a plan no matter what and have good credit history, you may want open up a new credit card that offers 0% for a year or two on balance transfers with no fees. Consolidate all your credit cards into that one. And then, pay it off in 12 months without having to pay interest. It will make your debt disappear faster, since you are not paying 15%-25% in interest every month.

    This will only work if you are willing to make sacrifices to reach your goal of being debt free. This means that whatever you have done to accumulate this credit card debt, can no longer be done. If you don't have the money in the bank today to pay cash for the purchase you make with a credit card, then you simply can't buy this item.

    Good luck.
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    oregonboyoregonboy Member Posts: 1,650
    Whoa! Tough love (good advice). Debt free: what a concept! It's like, like, almost like; un-American! You know? I like it! :)

    james
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    qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 32,951
    well, $9k equity does seem unlikely to me ... but let's assume that is accurate.

    As blueiedgod said, you owe less on the Jeep than you would pay for the used vehicle. You are proposing paying $9k for a 2000-2001 with 60k miles to replace your '04 with 38k miles that you owe less money on. It just doesn't make good sense, IMHO.

    My advice? Take one step at a time. If your vehicle is the highest interest bill you have, then make minimum payments on your credit cards and hit that car payment with everything you've got till it is paid off, then you can concentrate on those cards. In the meantime, as others have said, transfer the balances if you can and need to. I've got us down to just 1 card now, and it has a 1.9% fixed rate till it is paid off ... so I'm in no rush to pay it off, but I'm not making minimum payments, either. It wasn't too long ago I also had a 2.9% fixed balance. I made small payments on the 1.9% and hit the 2.9% with everything I could. The 1.9% now will be gone by next summer. My car payments are high, and that bugs me, too, but they are leases and I have determined that finishing out the leases and then buying used vehicles with cash is the best course of action.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '08 Maser QP; '11 Mini Cooper S

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    corvettecorvette Member Posts: 10,267
    As an added bonus, they cite statistics from Edmunds:

    http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-autoloans30dec30,0,4315064.story
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    qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 32,951
    The way the article started, I was prepared for more lender-bashing. But at least the subjects of the article admitted it was their own fault. That's the first step to recovery, right? ;)

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '08 Maser QP; '11 Mini Cooper S

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    kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 237,369
    I like the part where she claims they don't have any options.. Uh, keep driving the car until it's paid off? Time will heal all, as long as you don't buy another car.. :surprise:

    Edmunds Price Checker
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    qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 32,951
    yeah... and its only a year old!! What the hell did they think would happen?!

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '08 Maser QP; '11 Mini Cooper S

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    sky23213sky23213 Member Posts: 300
    Talking about picture being worth a thousand words....
    I laugh every time I look at the picture, their expressions are priceless.
    And as I have stated before in this discussion, I have absolutely no pity for people like that. 5 cars in three years! Man! And an Expedition at that, why ?!?! I'm sure their neighbors are very impressed though.
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    kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 237,369
    I'm sure when they lived in California, and it cost $2500/mo. to rent a 2-bedroom apartment, those car payments didn't seem like all that much...

    But, once you move home to Kansas, and Daddy says, "Your car payment is HOW much!!", then you start to look like an idiot..

    Good old Midwestern values.... can't beat 'em! ;)

    Edmunds Price Checker
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    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

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    sky23213sky23213 Member Posts: 300
    2500?! Wow! That's more that my mortgage, car pmt and insurance :surprise:
    That reminds me of Craig T. Nelson in "Coach" reacting to the price his daughter was paying for 1BR in NYC : 1600!!! Kelly, you can a get a little farm with a farmer for that in Minnesota!" :D
    I'm still still amazed at an earlier post that you can't get anything under 650K in some parts of CA. That means that people have to make twice as much compared to other region, or hold multiple jobs.
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    oregonboyoregonboy Member Posts: 1,650
    The classic clueless Americans who conclude that they must be able to afford it, or the banks wouldn't loan it to them. Now they are stuck with two TRUCKS that they can't afford to sell, and with rising fuel prices may soon be unable to afford to drive.

    Doesn't anyone pay attention to what is happening on this planet??? I admit that credit is too easy and the lenders must share the blame, but good grief people, THINK before you buy. :sick:

    rant-off
    james
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    gussguss Member Posts: 1,167
    the average amount financed hit $30,738

    I thought the average new car purchase price was like $28k. So the average new car financed is for more than what it is worth ? If thats the case the credit arms of the manufacturers are going to be the next one to be looking for a government bail out for their customers.
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