Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

guss

It better warm up or Santa will not leave his house next week.

How many days begin with a minus each year?

stever

I just put Anchorage company on the flight north a couple of hours ago. It's not the cold, it's the dark.

It's still a good place to take your unique Lower 48 ride (or clean 4x4 pickup) up for resale and help pay for some of your vacation. Chronic car reseller anyone?

akangl

-52?!?!

Dang.. just cuddle up... Leave the poor Pilot alone.

LOL, I hear ya, but had to take the kids down to meet the bus, normally they walk, but not in these temps! The Pilot was a good sport this morning, had been plugged in for about 4 1/2 hrs, so started right up. This evening was a different story, I forgot to plug it in until about an hour before I had to leave for EMT class. It started, but was a little pokey on the turnover and made some obnoxious noises after it started. I just used the auto start but listened carefully out the door to make sure all was well.

Its been a really warm winter, this cold snap was a shock. Although its relatively normal to see these temps in Dec and January. Last winter we had 3 weeks of this in March.......was terrible!

My tire pressure monitoring system is NOT amused at all with the cold, it can't make up its mind which tire is low or not low, lol.

qbrozen

I think you should be punished for cruelty to automobiles. ;b

michaellno

My tire pressure monitoring system is NOT amused at all with the cold, it can't make up its mind which tire is low or not low, lol.

We have the same problem with the VUE. When the tires are cold, the warning light comes on. However, if we drive the car for a while and the tires get warm, the light goes back off.

Frustrating, if you ask me. Wife is constantly bugging me about putting air in the tires.

However, that may all change. Wife found and applied for a job in Tucson, AZ yesterday. 20% increase in pay, and the cost of living seems to be about the same as it is here in Denver ... at least, we can find a comparable house for what we think we could sell ours for.

Wife is tired of the snow and wants to live somewhere where, as she puts it, "I don't have to wear socks anymore".

We shall see.

-52???

Oh. My. God.

It's been down to about 10 below here in Colorado a few times and that was bad enough. However, I gotta believe that it's like heat .. once you get to a certain point, it just becomes a number. When I lived in Phoenix, there really wasn't any difference between 102 and 110 in the summer. -25 versus -50 probably isn't all that different.

akangl

-25 versus -50 probably isn't all that different

Quite the contrary, -25 feels like a heat wave compared to -52. I can stand to be outside for 30-45 minutes at -25, but -52 just 10 minutes and its painful!

Cars are different at the two temps as well, so are the tires. At -52 tires are square, takes a mile or so of careful acceleration to round them out again.

I don't blame your wife for wanting to move, I wish I could move somewhere warm! I love Alaska in the summer, but I hate winter, always have!

qbrozen

I love Alaska in the summer, but I hate winter, always have!

You should get a winter place somewhere warm ... like Ontario. ;b

stever

My wife would move back to Anchorage in a minute. I'm trying to stock up on as much sunshine as possible in the event...

woodyww

It started, but was a little pokey on the turnover and made some obnoxious noises after it started.

The engine heaters that you have--what exactly do they heat, do you know? I wouldn't think it was positive for the future of the engine to be starting it in such low temps that --it's almost brand new, but makes "obnoxious noises" when you start it.

Also, what kind of oil do you have in it now?

woodyww

'Course "now's the time" to be out there shopping for end-of-year car deals. I bought my current bmw on Dec. 30 a few years ago; haven't regretted the deal, or the car, since (knock wood).

Are you a BMWCCA member? After 1 year membership you get an additional rebate on most new or CPO bmw's. I got a $500 check after buying my current (then CPO) bmw.....the membership is $35.....

michaellno

I don't blame your wife for wanting to move, I wish I could move somewhere warm! I love Alaska in the summer, but I hate winter, always have!

What's funny is that our daughter wants to move to Alaska after she finishes college. She just loves the cold weather .. .sleeps with the window open as much as possible, closes the vent in her room so that no air from the heater comes in.

Whatever .... we think she is crazy.

I've been to Alaska ... but it was May, and we had unseasonably warm weather while there. Never got used to the sun setting at 10:30-11 each night. We ended up eating dinner around 9:30 or so ... just odd.

kyfdx

$40 now... I've already collected $500, as well...

roadburner

$40 now... I've already collected $500, as well...

Me too, twice! Plus, I get 20% off parts and labor at my local dealer- CCA membership knocked $50 off my transmission/transfer case service...

nippononly

I wouldn't mind living in Anchorage, one of my favorite spots away from home. I think I would have to move to Seattle for a few years first, to get the hang of winter days with little sunlight and very short days.

OTOH, when we had the cold snap last winter, I thought -10 was a painfully cold temp up at Tahoe, so I don't know how well I would do in temps colder than that...

Does it routinely get much colder than -10 in Anchorage? I would have thought not, since it is by the ocean...

tifighter

I wouldn't mind living in Anchorage, one of my favorite spots away from home. I think I would have to move to Seattle for a few years first, to get the hang of winter days with little sunlight and very short days.

My girlfriend is from Kodiak, and says that the gray days here in Seattle, while way longer, are more depressing constant dark up in AK during the winter. Me, I didn't even notice that it was gray out... :surprise:

stickguy

now that you aren't buying cars on a monthly basis, put a few $$ together and build a garage.

I couldn't stand having my car live outside, and I'm only in NJ.

Get one of those prefab 2 car jobbers with a heater, and save a lot of wear and tear on the cars.

stever

Can't XC ski in town in Seattle but Anchorage usually has good snow much of the winter on the bike paths. When there's snow on the ground, it brightens things up a whole lot. 20 above was pretty typical and that was a comfortable temp for walking or skiing. I didn't ski much when it hit minus 10 or colder but that's pretty rare.

Let's see - you'd need a roadster for those long days of summer, an old 4x4 with a plow on it for clearing your driveway, a new 4WD SUV or CUV for cruising up to the ski resorts and something like an Audi A6 Quattro for commuting. The far north is good territory for a CCBer!

akangl

Let's see the Pilot has a battery heater (its a pad under the battery), an oil pan heater (a pad glued to the bottom of the oil pan) and a block heater (freeze plug heater, heats the anti-freeze). The noises the car makes are more or less just stuff that's cold protesting, all vehicles seem to do it when its really cold out. I don't worry too much about it.

As for a garage, I'd love to have one, but its a long story and we can't build where we are. Hoping to have things paid off in the next few years (now that we are reformed CCBA members) and possibly move somewhere else.

qbrozen

Are you a BMWCCA member?

no. and i'm not sure why. you've probably just kicked me in the butt to join. But, in any case, we got our first and only bimmer just this past summer, so I wouldn't have been a member for a year yet, anyway.

corvette

The prefab garages are generally uninsulated--it'd cost a pretty penny to heat them.

As for the TPMS, I think tires have lower pressure at colder temperatures, so it could be that they're below 30 psi (or whatever the cutoff is) when it's very cold out.

mark156

Akangl, I have a couple of questions...

I think today is the first day of winter so now the sunlight will start lasting a little longer each day. How much daylight are you having now?

Also, how do you heat your modular home when it's -52 degrees? I would think your heater would never cut off and it would be difficult to get above 50 degrees. :surprise:

Again, stay warm!
Mark

stickguy

There are 2 big BMW dealers near my. Both actually jsut built new facilities, 1 of which is a palcae (looks more like the museum of modern art or something.

Anyway, I stopped at the palace since I was "in the area" this morning, and took a look at the CPO lot (after going inside andnot even seeing a saleman). If anyone pays their asking prices, they are nuts.

A typical 2004 X3 2.5 (moonroof, heated seats, otherwise pretty much standard) was tagged for ~29,000 (with normal mileage, somewhere in the 30s). THis for a car that is now 4 model years old!

the 3 series sedans were just as bad. a 2005 330i auto for 34K+? Just buy a new one instead.

akangl

I think today is the first day of winter so now the sunlight will start lasting a little longer each day. How much daylight are you having now?

Also, how do you heat your modular home when it's -52 degrees? I would think your heater would never cut off and it would be difficult to get above 50 degrees.

We have about 4 hours of daylight right now, today is the winter solstice so we'll start gaining after today.

As for our home, we have a boiler system and a woodstove. Even at -52 I can keep it 80 in here and the boiler rarely comes on. Gotta love firewood!!

woodyww

Plus you get "the roundel" mag with membership--invaluable info & articles--esp. in the "tech talk" section......

I keep thinkin'--if I let my membership lapse--that'll be the time I go out & buy another CPO bmw.....

roadburner

A typical 2004 X3 2.5 (moonroof, heated seats, otherwise pretty much standard) was tagged for ~29,000 (with normal mileage, somewhere in the 30s). THis for a car that is now 4 model years old!

That's pretty wild; we didn't pay that much for my wife's CPO 2004 X3 2.5 back in December of 2005. It had 16K on it and came with the Premium Package, Cold Weather Package, Xenons, heated wheel, and Satellite Radio prep. Now at 57K the only non-scheduled repair has been a bad SRS sensor in the passenger seat, which was fixed under warranty. It's a pleasant -if unexciting- ride.

qbrozen

ok, i need to attend a meeting and get this idea out of my head. ending my accord lease early would be SUCH a bad financial decision. I mean, why do it? just because I dislike the car? I'm sure it will last me through the next 17 months of my lease without a problem (other than annoying me). A 330i would be mighty sweet, though. I'm seeing them at multiple dealers for the mid $20s. I haven't gotten an answer on the real-world trade-in values board yet, but I'm thinking $23-$24k?? After this and that and a down payment, I could probably get out of there with payment in the low $400s for 6 years (if the rate is as good as I've heard, its lower than my investments yield). SO, what's my penance for having these thoughts?

lilengineerboy

I mean, why do it? just because I dislike the car? I'm sure it will last me through the next 17 months of my lease without a problem (other than annoying me).

Doesn't your wife have a 3-series convertible? Isn't there some clause that says if she gets a BMW you do too?

BTW my Accord annoys me too, but it has been getting phenominal mileage so I can't bring myself to dump it yet.

guss

What is wrong with the Accords, let me guess, the are an appliance. They do everything well , so they have no soul.

Now a BMW coupe has soul. But a 6 year loan on a used car ? You will be so buried you'll need a back hoe to get out. How much will it cost to get out of the lease ?

I normally endorse all trades but this one will be tough to justify.

But if you do it, can I borrow it ?

lilengineerboy

What is wrong with the Accords, let me guess, the are an appliance. They do everything well , so they have no soul.

It is dull. It gets excellent fuel economy, it has plenty of power with a 4cyl/5spd manual, but the handling is slow, the body roll is more than I would like, the suspension could be a bit more reassuring when cornering. The stock tires are sub-par but are okay among OEM tires. The stereo lacks features that it should have in 2007, and there is no decent iPod interface.
It gets 34 mpg at speeds in excess of 75 mph, the back seat is very roomy even with an infant seat, and Honda still makes a very nice manual transmission.

corvette

Strange that we're talking about BMWs and Accords--the new Accord coupe's styling seems to be inspired by the 6-series.

growwise

Quite the contrary, -25 feels like a heat wave compared to -52. I can stand to be outside for 30-45 minutes at -25, but -52 just 10 minutes and its painful!

You seem to be a prime candidate for Amsoil ASM 0W20. Pourpoint is -65 F. Helps the crank to turn over. Granted it would still be a gel at that point but still..

http://www.amsoil.com/StoreFront/asm.aspx

Cars are different at the two temps as well, so are the tires. At -52 tires are square, takes a mile or so of careful acceleration to round them out again.

Try looking up Nokian tires. Those scandinavian guys know a thing or two about severe cold. They have metal studded tires as well.. Here's an article if you know how to read norwegian
http://extra.expressen.se/pdf/dacktest.pdf

Gislaved is probably owned by continental. Nokian hakkapelittas, RSI are considered top notch. Even their WR allweather tires are good. Forget the bridgestone blizzaks and Michelin X-Ice. You definetely need something finnish

akangl

We actually have an amsoil dealership, just haven't switched the Pilot over yet........will do it eventually, lol.

As for winter tires I've run about everything and the Blizzaks are the best I've found. All tires square up at -52, can't say as I blame them either. On our 2 trucks we have Cooper Discoverer M&S studded snow tires, works great for what the trucks do. For me I'm totally sold on Blizzaks, have saved my tail more than once on bad roads. 'Cides, does anyone *really* need to drive at -52?? :sick:

qbrozen

But a 6 year loan on a used car ? You will be so buried you'll need a back hoe to get out.

Yes ... well ... sort of ... I mean, I think one would be LESS buried than a 6-year loan on a new car since the depreciation will be slower, no? PLUS, we actually just need lower payments at the moment. In 9 months, when my wife's lease is up, we can pretty much double our payments to an existing car loan (because the plan is to pay cash for the wife's next car .. probably a used volvo wagon). And, really, how can I argue with 4.9% APR?

I still don't know the numbers as far as my lease goes because I am awaiting feedback on the RWTIV board. My rough guess right now is about $4500.

I talked to the wife and she is all for this transaction. She feels that the problems the Accord has been giving me will only get worse. I had to spend 5.5 hours in the car on Friday and it was torture. I think that is where the mags really fail when it comes to the Accord. They think its great, but that's because they only spend a couple of days with it. I think its around the 6-month mark where it completely loses its luster.

We also rationalized that if I were to pay another year on the lease and then get an '05 bimmer at that time on a similar 6-year note, it will make almost no difference in total out-of-pocket ($385/mo for 7 years or $450/mo for 6 years). The math is really a strawman argument, but I haven't told her that yet.

In any case, I think I'm talking myself out of it. I hate to spend the money right now. And, like I said, that math argument is really flawed for obvious reasons.

woodyww

payment in the low $400s for 6 years

Ouch! I think I agree with guss on this. And you too, from the way it sounds, as "you're talking yourself out of it".

Personally, I'd drive around in an old Toyota if I had to (& I have), before paying $400/mo. for 6 years in car payments. Or more likely, buy whatever older bmw I could pay cash for........

qbrozen

turns out i'm about $6k in the hole on the accord. Ouch!

Personally, I'd drive around in an old Toyota if I had to (& I have), before paying $400/mo. for 6 years in car payments.

I think that's about the only choice you'd have these days. Cars are expensive. Period. I mean, even a loaded Civic will run ya $400 for 5 years.

I did this similar thing back when I traded a leased 626 for an off-lease volvo S70 T5. Ran me about $425 for 6 years. I didn't regret it. (although I paid it off in 4 years)

kyfdx

I wouldn't trade in a lease early, and eat $6K...

But, 72 payments of $400? That part is no problem... This is CCBA, after all..

Ride out that lease, though...

nippononly

I agree! This is why leases are a bad idea for CCBAers, and is exactly what has kept me out of a lease, despite the sometimes very tempting promo leases that have come and gone. I may yet give in to the temptation of a promo lease, but I'm trying hard not to...

guss

the theory on leases is so that you can buy more car than you can afford normally. If I were ever to lease(not likely), I think I would be more inclined to go the other way. Something like a dirt cheap Focus for 2 years and $179/month. That way I would not fell as boxed in. If it was really that bad I would still heave some room to fit something else in under the cap.

woodyww

But, 72 payments of $400? That part is no problem

Yeah, it's $28,800. What car was it for? A 2-3 y.o. 3 series? (I'm getting lost).

I guess I'm thinking: $400/mo. would pay for "some" chunk of a House Payment. Even in the Northeast, or other expensive areas, that would go for......well a not-insubstantial portion (15-30%?) of payments on a decent-if-modest property in not-the-most-expensive-town.

I also think guss's idea of leasing a ride for around $200/mo. makes sense.....even if for a Focus.

(I'm in my house-buying-obsessed, cheapskate mode today).....

qbrozen

the theory on leases is so that you can buy more car than you can afford normally.

well, I can't discuss the theory because I didn't invent leasing. But, I can say there is much more to it than that. Both of my current leases carry incredibly low rates. Nothing that any financing could touch (well, ok, except for a big money loser 0%). I could easily afford to buy a car much more expensive than I have, but I just couldn't stomach it.

Plus, in the case of both my leases, they will be worth less than the buyout at the end of the term. So, not only did I get a ridiculously low rate and pay well below invoice for my vehicles, but I don't even have to pay their full real-world depreciation. To me, the right lease is a financial winner.

The problem comes if you wind up not liking the car after a while and want to trade early. But only because alot of the financing is built in up front. You'd still lose your shirt trading a financed car early.

ANYWAY, my wife said "let's go anyway." So we went. For those curious about the current BMW deal, it is 2.9% for 60 months. That's it. No 72-mo term and no lower rate on a shorter term.

I did test drive an '04 330Ci automatic coupe with premium, sport, and cold weather. It is a very nice and fun car. A bit tighter on the headroom than I would care for, but livable. Its still amazing to me that bimmers have much more power than the numbers on paper would indicate. I took it on a couple of windy roads and some 90 degree turns and I love the balance and feel. In any case, the numbers, of course, were not favorable. But it gives me hope for the future. I'll ride out my lease and next winter I could be in a bimmer. And, as I said to my wife, a new 128 should feel very similar to the 330.

stickguy

Q, maybe we can get apackage deal?

So, what do you all think a 2004 X3 with normal mileage (30-40K) should go for as a CPO? 22K-24K? I still can't get a good feel for it.

Although my Accord is fine. Only issue is some of the typical squeaking from the A pillars when it is cold, but that can be fixed by turning up the radio.

Other than that, it is relialbe, and get 25ish MPG short hopping around town. And it is paid for. Now, what is RRTIV on this? hmm...

My lame reason is my son could drive the X3 since we aren't doing the learn to drive a stick yet.

stickguy

I'm starting to think that my Accord isn't the car to go first. The Odyssey (2005, now with 33K) is starting to get on my nerves. I'm afraid that it is going to start eing more problematic, and is now out of warranty.

In the future, the family truckster (van or SUV) will be leased, although it is nice having the Odyssey paid off now!

corvette

I'm afraid that it is going to start eing more problematic...

Sounds like a made-up worry to me, but hey, if you need an excuse, I do hear from Consumer Reports that first-model-year vehicles (even Hondas) tend to be more problematic than their older counterparts.

kyfdx

My local dealer is advertising them from $22.9-$24.9.... CPO..

guss

Aren't you afraid of the wear and tear a family hauler takes. I know my kids are younger than yours but they beat the crap out of our mini-van. If I had leased it I probably would have to pay for a new paint job and new interior with all of the battle scars it has. It is five years old though, by far the longest I have ever owned a vehicle, although that has more to do with my wife than me.

I gave up on the MR-2 Spyder search, just too darn expensive when compared to a Miata. I thing somehow I can make a NA Miata work as a weekend car with a little tweaking.

woodyww

This is an interesting thread: to buy (or keep) a Honda, or to buy a CPO bmw. I rode in a friend's roughly 8 y.o. Accord today. It was fine. It really didn't make any impression on me one way or the other.

My 8 y.o. 5-series still impresses me in all kinds of ways--it's not even from the same planet, really. I think--buying a really nice CPO bmw is a great idea (at a good price of course). If it's troublesome; you can sell it still with a warranty. If not, you can probably keep it for many years, & amortize the cost.....

growwise

My 8 y.o. 5-series still impresses me in all kinds of ways--it's not even from the same planet, really. I think--buying a really nice CPO bmw is a great idea (at a good price of course). If it's troublesome; you can sell it still with a warranty. If not, you can probably keep it for many years, & amortize the cost.....

Is this still valid if you substitute a Merc Benz in place of BMW? In my mind, BMW connotates with sport while MB is more of a comfort cruiser.

stickguy

Found a wagon for you. 2000 E320 AWD. Tan, 68K on it for 18,900.

No idea if the price is any good. And, you would have to shlep to Johnstown, NY (past ALbany). Saw it in the local paper (I'm at the family place in NY).

http://www.steettoyotajohnstown.com/Preowned-Inventory.aspx?InventoryId=20962821-

stickguy

Hmm, I hope I can figure out a way to sneak out for a couple of hours Monday to check out an X3. I sat in one and liked it, but have never driven one.

I expect that a deal would fall apart when I requested a trade in price on my car. ALways a bad time!

qbrozen

Yeah, I think that's more than the wifey is looking to spend on the next ride. Maybe. I mean, one minute its "I just want an $8k volvo so we can save," the next its "hey, this CPO X3 might do the trick."