Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

fezo

You're selling the Alfa? You should NOT be telling me this...

Down to four cars. You'll be back in my territory.

guss

I did follow you saga in Project Cars. If my Miata experiment was not so fresh I would be taking a ride over to Jersey to check it out.

You do know it is September, not the month to be selling convertibles .

qbrozen

I thought September was perfect. (?)

I figure the best months are when you actually want to be cruising in one. That would be May, June, and Sept, in my book.

Here's the pics I took this morning. *sniffle*
http://share.shutterfly.com/action/welcome?sid=8AbMWjFm2bs2MD

rworrell

Great pictures--really nice car. My first convertible was an '83 Spider Veloce. I see the '86 went away from the wooden steering wheel and shift knob and the dual pods on the gauges.

Beautiful car and I really like how you made sure to take pictures of all the flaws. You know you can trust a guy who makes sure to highlight what's wrong with the car--has to be an honest seller, right?

Are you sure you're ready to sell? Just from the pictures I can tell how much you love the car... :shades:

P.S. You're right--May, June and September are the primo convertible months (at least in Minnesota, they are--the Garden State must be similar).

qbrozen

Thanks.

I try to be as upfront as possible. I would hate to have someone come back to me because they were surprised by something. Guilt has too much power over me.

fezo

I can spare you guilt. Just give the car to me. No problem. That is sweet. Dare I ask why you'd go down to a mere four cars? Using the car a collateral on a meat loan? Gas loan?

qbrozen

Funny thing is, it is probably my most economical car and here I am dumping it.

Truth of the matter is, I don't drive it much. And I could use the $$.

fezo

If you decided that earlier I could have bought that instead of the Celica! I will grant you it's liekly a touch trickier to get a mechanic who know his way around an Alfa than a Celica.

qbrozen

Uhhh... yeah. Just a "touch." LOL!
In 10 years, I have not found any mechanic who didn't either say "get that thing away from me!" or "what the hell is that?"

fezo

Or some other phrase that wouldn't fit within the TOS....

Way back in 1980 I remember my mom buying a new Datsun 510 wagon. All well and good but the dealer also sold Alfas. I just about wet my pants.

guss

Up until 5 years ago the mechanic(Tony, go figure) that worked on my Fiat was only 3 mile away from me. He worked on Fiats,Alfas and MG's. Then he just closed up shop and his 15 or 20 parts cars were gone. I guess they ether deported him or there just was not enough cars around any more to keep him in business.

After he closed up I pretty much abandoned the idea of buying my old Spyder back from a good friend of mine that has let it sit for the past 18 years.

fezo

Ain't that a killer? Back when I had my old Saab and managed to figure out taht the dealer knew nothing about them I found a guy who did Saabs, MGs, Triumphs, ALfas and a few other makes. He was fabulous - meticulous and very into doing it right as opposed to maximizing profit. Then he moved to Colorado. Rats.

guss

Then he moved to Colorado. Rats

Hey, maybe michael or dad23 would like to buy the Alfa. Unless you mechanic turned into a ski bum.

fezo

Alas, I don't know what he ended up doing. This was many years ago. He was amazing though. Would take the time to check every little thing that could be the cause and wasn't terribly expensive considering the kind of stuff he worked on.

stickguy

spent some time shopping today. Even had the wife along, with no complaints. Getting sick must have made her feel sorry for me or something!

Either that, or the leg cramp I developed spending 2.5 hours on the drive home from work (44 miles, basically all highway) clutching away did it? That was a tiring drive.

so, went to Volvo and BMW. Looked at an S60, S40 and a V70. Actually liked the seats in the 60/70 better. Bigger, shape fit me better, and generally more comfy. Wife also liked the 60 better for some reason. I also decided I want the turbo engine, and the 2.5T is better than the base.

But, I really liked the wagon. More rear seat room (a lot), and the great trunk area. Especially since we are in the process of getting a dog (good sized Lab), and he will need somewhere to ride! Of course, finding a recent model V70 2.5T front wheel drive without black guts will be impossible!

Checked out the 3 series at the BMW dealer, and an X3. Very nice sedan, but pricey. And maybe not the best thing for the commute (beating it up and the miles). The X3 actually worked very well interior and space wise, and the price might be doable, but the lower mileage is an issue (when you do 90 miles a day).

The Accord has been averaging about 33+ overall, and I don't want to drop too much! at least highish 20s.

So, what other wagons or wagon-like vehicles are there to consider? I will go look at a Legacy Wagon, but not sure of the comfort. A series series wagon hits the sweet spot, but they are AWD and impossible to find (and I don't want to get something more than a couple years old).

And I really don't want an SUVish thing, unless it is really a tall wagon that drives like a car. A Venza might be perfect, if they were already out!

Such decisions.... and advice, other options I haven't thought of?

woodyww

Of course, finding a recent model V70 2.5T front wheel drive without black guts will be impossible!

It seems like you really want a V70 2.5T! You keep coming back to that one........Volvo seats are great, & the V70 is roomier than most wagons for dogs/whatever.

I too have a black interior aversion. Can't tell you how many Volvo wagons I turned down a few years ago because of that, and a really sweet E39 wagon stick/SPP with black interior. But unless you're in FL or TX personally I'd consider compromising on the interior color........(esp. if you get a Black Lab!).....PS I had a Saab with black interior for 10 years, & loved the car. The heat of the black bugged me in summer, but I had fold-out sun-shades for when parked.

stickguy

my Accord is silver with black leather, and I have sworn never again. But, if the perfect car came along at too good a price to pass up, I could do it, and just get seat covers.

Looks like the lab (if we get the one I think we will) will be yellow, so a Tan interior will be even more of a good idea!

Euro cars with black guts also seem to be really stark too.

DId see an X3 with the weird redish/orange leather. Wife hated it, I liked it.

Need to do some more checking for V70s. But, if the Subie fits the bill, I know an Exec for SofA that should be able to get me a real good deal!

fezo

If a Subie will do the trick for you that's great. They build an awfully nice wagon.

IMO you can't beat Volvo for wagons. They've just about perfected them.

stickguy

what a day...

anyway, the Subie didn't really do it for me. Although I will say the new Forester is a nice piece. Not quite right for me at this piont.

I had forgotten that they only made outback wagons now (no normal Legacys). It was OK, a bit pricey (having to go to the liited for a moonroof), and the 4 speed AT and mileage ratings were a negative. Probably a bit doggish with the base engine.

That, and I don't want the whole M&S tire jacked up thing. I want a car wagon, not an SUV!

But, at the VW dealer (I know, I know), a new contender jumped forward. Stopped to look at the passat (great front seats), and took a look at a Jetta wagon. Everyone (me, wife, daughter) really liked it. Nice piece, great panaramic moonroof, comfy, decent cargo area. Only drawback was the 2.5l 5 cyl. Need to go back to drive it to see how that works out.

anyone have experience with that engine? If it had the 2.0T, I might have bought one today!

had another idea: buy a car like Woodys. Local used car place has a (IIRC) 2001 525Ti with ~80, for like 12 grand. Probably a stupid idea for a long distance commuter, but it is A) cheaper (net cash in my pocket probably!), the 2001 BMW I was supposed to buy my wife in 2000, but cheaped out, and C) the wagon I want. And if it doesn't work out, cheap enough to sell.

The Volvo wagon is still a contender, although my wife is a little turned off by the wagon part since it is too "square" I pointed out that is beneficial in a wagon, but she just gave me "the look"

fezo

Yeah, I hate the fact that Subaru dropped the Legacy wagon. I liked it much better than the Outback. They've taken themselves out of consideration on the next car move.

You have been bitten by the dreaded VW bug. This is sad. VWs are nicer than almost any competing product where they compete. If the cars actually ran on a predictable basis this would make choices easy. Unfortunately....

kyfdx

I think the current Passat wagon is a lot better looking than the new Jetta.. Plus, you get the 2.0T engine... That 5-cylinder in the Jetta would make a good truck engine..

Out of everything you've looked at, I'd go for the Volvo or the Passat.. If you don't need AWD, no point in getting anything trucky..

qbrozen

Did you tell us your pricerange?

You should call Princeton Volvo. Their online inventory is always behind. For instance, I was just there a week ago and they must have had 8-9 XC90s. Their online inventory shows 1.

Anyway, they do show a couple of wagons on their site. 1 is black over tan, 37k miles, for $25k. The other is blue over ??? (has to be tan, I think), with 43k miles, for $22k. Probably both overpriced, but they negotiate easy. Oh, and they call them XC70s on their site, but they are FWD .... ummmm... K. Think they need a new webmaster over there who knows what he/she is talking about.

stickguy

I am closest to cherry hill (and am freindly with the owner from having shopped so much!) but right now they are redoing the store and have zippo inventory. Maybe I will take a run up to princeton next weekend if I get a chance.

I work close to berwyn, and they show a bunch on the web, so I will try and get there during the week.

And Fezo, I did not realize there was a wagon version of the current Passat. Might have to check that out!

Although for some reason my local VW dealer only had 1 Passat in inventory. I didn't realize there was such a run on them!

Oh price? Well, as always, it started reasonable and sems to escalate as I find nicer stuff. That, and I wanted used (CPO probably), and somehow keep looking new...

kyfdx

...seem to have very few new Passat wagons..

But, they all seem to have 2-3 '06 model wagons in their used car inventory.. Don't know the pricing, but I'll guess it's around $20K.. Most of the new ones sticker around $30K.

stickguy

Yeah, new waons (and probably used) are going to be rare. And since new is over 20K, I doubt I will be able to rationalize it.

Now, the dealer close to my office is listing a 2005 (lst year of the old body style, which I like) 1.8T GLS, dark blue over gray (1st choice color combo) with only 30K on it for just under 17K. That might be a much better option for what I need to use it for, and what I want to spend!

besides, I would barely have to add any cash to the deal once I sell/trade the Accord, since that is paid off.

Pretty much a win/win, unless I end up spending time at the service department every week! And I don't know if that one is certified or under any warranty at this point.

I will, however, give them a call...

stever

My sister found and loved a used Passat wagon last year for around $20k. 2006 iirc. She still has a bit of buyer's remorse about passing it up but she was trading in an '00 New Beetle and couldn't face years of more problems with a VW and the dealer, where she was very familiar with the service department (they did get better over the years though - I think VWofA yelled at them).

She wound up with an '05 Forester for $5k cheaper.

stickguy

I know about the stories, but I am still an optomist I guess. I can also live with a few more visits to the dealer to get what I want. The enjoyment factor can overcome a bit of inconvenience.

I also think the Passats have been better (and always were) for some reason. And anyway, thats what the waranty is for!

Besides, I found a couple that have me hooked. 2007 Passat wagon, dark blue (real dark) over tan. Luxury model (one for sure, the other I can't tell) but the luxo is close to me (if still there), and loaded. Gorgeous car, in myfavorite color combo.

It also has all the goodies (can't give up my integrated sat. radio!), 12 way seats with power lumbar, etc.

GOtta have my goodies. And this has fantastic seats (overall the most comfy of anything I sat in I think). And when you spend 2-3 hours in the car every day (at least, last Friday it was 3.5 just on the commute), comfort and goodies are important.

The 2.0T is also a sweet engine. Lots of performance, and good enough mileage.

Now just have to actually find the car and make a deal...

stever

I have a bud up north who got a new one back and '03 and he still loves his.

I may have to take a look a the VW version of the Caravan when it comes out. Yeah, seriously.

woodyww

(You sound like me in my car-shopping heyday). According to CR, my own experience with a 1990 Passat (the person who keeps cars for 10 years, me, dumped that one after 6 mo.), & everything I've read on boards like this, Volvo S60's, V70's, XC70's, are WAY more reliable than VW's. And I'd feel a lot safer in a Volvo. I mean, it's "square"--it's a Volvo! Sell her on the safety & better reliability.

2001 525Ti with ~80, for like 12 grand. Probably a stupid idea for a long distance commuter

It's kind of a lot of miles--you should budget some for maybe cooling system replacement, suspension parts, &?? My 2000 528i is all around the most comfortable long distance vehicle I've ever had. Only thing wrong with it: it doesn't have Volvo V70 or XC seats

I'd still rank a used low-mileage V70 in the low-$20's first. Of course I like the e39 idea. And I'd buy a Subie any day over a VW, no matter how much prettier or sexier the VW is........ esp. to put on a lot of miles.......

Just my 2 cents, I'm enjoying your search!

stickguy

stopped at the mall today, and what did I park across from? A dark blue Passat wagon! Saw the owner and asked how he likes it, and he said he loved it. So what more do I need?

The subie is out. Not a good fit, and didn't care for the seats.

The V70 is still an option, but finding a fairly new one with decent miles in the low 20s isn't that easy. And I don't want an XC70. Don't need the AWD, don't like the style, don't want to give up the handling, and I am already giving up enough MPG.

I still need to drive the Passat. That could be the clincher. Or del breaker. ssuming it is still available.

For some reason, I always get fixated on cars that are impossible to find... At least this one doesn't require a manual tranny!

anonymousposts

Have put about 2,000 miles on the ES300 and it's great. The suspension is firm enough for highway driving but is too mushy to make going around curves fun. Other than that it is comfortable, smooth engine/tranny, and its getting decent gas mileage for a V6.

As a side note, shortly after I bought the ES, my husband came across a 2000 RX300. Silver over gray, FWD, 106,000 miles. He "had" to have it. Picked it up for $7500. Timing belt was changed at 87k, Only maintenance needed were the brakes, which he has already done.

So now we have our 04 Accord EX-L manual, the 99 ES, and the 2000 RX.

corvette

Sounds nice... Where are you finding these bargains on Lexi?

guss

Well, if we are not worried about reliability, how about a Saab 9-3 sport combi. I hear they have pretty good seats and GM has Employee pricing on them.

qbrozen

Why not get on a list somewhere for a Jetta TDI wagon? Heck, might not be long before they introduce a Passat TDI wagon, I would think.

tifighter

Well, if we are not worried about reliability, how about a Saab 9-3 sport combi. I hear they have pretty good seats and GM has Employee pricing on them.

+1...comfortable cars and there is always a deal to be found on one. I'd wager it would be more reliable than a VW, too...

stickguy

Even with the GM deal, a SAAB combi (while nice) will likely be out of budget range. At this point, I am trying to keep to late model used (CPO).

saw the Passat tonight. Pretty nice. Had no gas (dumb dealers) so just spun around the lot. Seemed to be a nice driving car. The family was with me so I didn't bother to get serious. I am going to stop back after work to take a real drive, check service records, and see what kind of deal is on the table (if the drive and records check out!)

The '09 we sat in did have some more goodies on it, like a full power seat, but not a big deal really.

Do need to call around about Volvos. DOesn't seem to be any on the web sites.

Oh, the sales guy actually mentioned a deisel Jetta wagon, but I don't think I will go there.

stickguy

stopped to look at the Passat wagon after work. ALl of you VW worry warts will be glad to know if was sold 2 hours before I got there. The new owner was still at the desk doing the deal.

Oh well. Time to move on!

I have decided to look at a Mazda 6 wagon (07 or 08 left over). It wil lbe a V6, but probably gets similar mileage to a V70.

Overall, I think I will look cheaper. Either fairly new in the teens (like the mazda), or maybe a little older (sy a 2001 V70 with 80K on it) for below 10. I may not have this lousy commute for a super long time, so it is hard to figure out just what I need. A big payment, however, is certainly not it.

So tomorrow, off to the Mazda dealer!

On Thursday, I plan to stop at another VW dealer near work (they have a 2005 wagon I liked) and a Volvo dealer (to see what they may have). Hey, it is something to do!

guss

I had a Mazda 6 wagon for about a year and a half. The 3.0L V-6 is a little harsh but I would get 26 on the highway and 22 in mixed driving. It does have a 5 speed automatic with manual shifting.

One thing to look for is roof rails, for some reason Mazda made them optional. Why have a wagon if you can't put stuff on top ?

With all the rebates and the redesigned '09 here you should be able to get at least $5k off sticker.

michaellno

I think the Mazda 6 now comes with a 6-speed automatic when ordered with the V6.

guss

True, I think 2005 had the first 6 speed. That wagon must be a 2007, because that was the last year for the wagon. For some reason the wagon was not a big seller.

woodyww

ALL of you VW worry warts will be glad to know if was sold 2 hours before I got there

Actually, I'm not, or wouldn't be, if that was truly what you wanted, but it sounds like a VW is just part of the shopping/test driving quest that most of us know so well.

I'm LOL about the term "VW worry warts", partly because I am one, but it's also a truly funny, & very descriptive phrase. Good luck on the quest, whatever you decide on......altho now that I remember it, my 90 y.o. Grandmother, was also a "VW worry wart" when I bought my 1990 Passat, & Rained on my Parade big-time. (I can't even begin to explain that.......).

qbrozen

Stickguy, I was going to email this to you, but your address is private.

If you find you definitely want the Volvo, you could try a poster by the name of JRL on swedespeed. I haven't dealt with him personally, but I've read from several folks who have. He is a private dealer, of sorts, who will buy at auction on behalf of swedespeeders for a relatively small fee. They say he is very picky and will only buy very very nice examples at reasonable auction values (again, this is all 3rd party info). I was going to go through him if I decided to buy an S60R, but as we know, I chose the G35X instead.

You won't get CPO, but, personally, I don't feel its needed on a FWD V70.

stever

I just noticed a reference to a bank repo of a RAV4 over in Edmunds Answers. I used to cruise the credit union lots back in the 90's and some of the cars looked pretty good. Just curious if anyone here is stalking for a creampuff repo (bit of an oxymoron perhaps...).

anonymousposts

The good deals are a result of me still working for a car dealer. The deals arent as good as they used to be but still far better than buying at a dealer and paying retail or gambling with a private owner sale.

boomchek

There's a big place in Vancouver that only sells repos. The deals are awesome, as they're all priced below dealer wholesale;s prices.

My brother in law bought a car from there(merc Cougar), and it's been ok so far (apart from expensive maintenance).

HOWEVER, I will say this to everyone: if you baby your car, and want to get the best, a repo lot is not the place to get it. Why? If people don't have money for payments to the point that their car gets taken away, then chances are they didn't have money on maintenance either, and I wouldn't be surprised if some of those cars were driven for 6 months to a year or more without any oil changes being done.

Otherwise, yeah, there's deals to be had.

stever

I wouldn't be surprised if some of those cars were driven for 6 months to a year or more without any oil changes being done.

Well, yeah, but I change my oil about once a year too. :shades:

I did see some obviously neglected rigs on the lots back in the day, but I still wonder if I should have sprung for the cheap early 90's VW T4 Eurovan and used the savings for the repairs that were sure to follow. I had more energy back then for chasing after parts and finding mechanics though.

boomchek

Eurovans are funky to drive. We had one on the lot before, and you feel like you're driving a bus because of the steering wheel angle and seating height.

For some reason most VW vans, especially the Westfalias retain a lot of their value. I guess it's a cult following.

stever

I drove a '69 bus for a year until the head pulled off. I was bummed that VW didn't follow through with their Microbus concept. They have me seriously considering the VW Caravan though, it it's still around in a few years.

stickguy

got the wife to stop at the Toyota dealer today, intending to look at a Rav4 (just to explore the small cross-over version of a wagon).

Actually kind of nice, but not really what I am looking for as my daily driver. Would, however, be anice option if we had to replace the minivan.

what did catch my eye was the new Matrix. Surprisingly roomy inside, and even the cargo area was large. Much roomier than a Mazda3 hatch,

Since one of th ecriteria is a big enough cargo area to hold an 80# lab, it makes a difference! The Matrix would be fine. Plus it should get better mileage than many of the other choices.

Have to go back and take one for a ride at some point. Or actually, stop at the POntiac dealer. From checking the pirce guide, it looks like you get the same car for thousands less MSRP with the Vibe. Plus the wonderful deals GM is cutting thees days!

sticker on a loaded up vibe the way I wold do it is only about 20,xxx, invoice ~ 19.5, so "you pay" price was already down to about 19K, before the rebate ($500 now).

Not quite the luxury car I started out looking for, but a good price for brand new.

Ah, decisions...

Oh, the Vibe/Matrix actually seems to have a bigger cargo area (especially with the seats folded) than a V50. Not sure how much is height though (61cf vs. 48cf with seats down).

nippononly

I took a minute out the other day to drive one of the '09 RAV4s - AWD, 4-cylinder. This is a car that makes more power than the Matrix AWD, has better fuel economy (because it uses a brand new engine), and has WAY more space. I wish the back seats still came all the way out like they did up until '05. It felt like it had plenty of pep. Best part is it is not much more money to BUY than a Matrix AWD - there is maybe $2000 in it.

It doesn't have the same moves as the Matrix, due to the higher weight and roof, but neither is a sports car and it moves pretty well. Definitely one to consider if you wind up back on the Toyota lot, looking for Matrixes.