Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

stickguy

No rust, clean car fax, and recent expensive maintenance means that TL is an easy $5k car even without the used price spike.

stickguy

Just saw an announcement that Ford has so many orders they are shutting down the order process for eco boost engines this week. They already stopped taking hybrid orders back in November. So either order now, or wait until August to submit for a 2023 build.

Should help my resale when my hybrid arrives in the spring!

stickguy

graphicguy said:

Just saw Ford has stopped taking orders for the Maverick as they've reached manufacturing capacity.

You beat me to it. Yup, orders have been taking months to get scheduled already, and they are all booked up. I assume if they manage to build more than expected, they will just build some extra to send for dealer stock.

stickguy

Found this on Maverick forum. It’s what every Thursday is like, when ford announces what orders are being assigned a build date. Some people been waiting a long time. The allocation system, is poorly thought out.

https://www.mavericktruckclub.com/forum/attachments/truck-jpg.32715/

jmonroe1

stickguy said:

Found this on Maverick forum. It’s what every Thursday is like, when ford announces what orders are being assigned a build date. Some people been waiting a long time. The allocation system, is poorly thought out.

https://www.mavericktruckclub.com/forum/attachments/truck-jpg.32715/

So now we know what you looked like when you got word your Maverick was scheduled for production.

jmonroe

28firefighter

Re: the TL - I didn't even bother to go look at it. Not going to take up someone's time just to offer 40% less...

graphicguy

Well…here’s a TL that was a bit ratty for $7K+….

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhOCFtMXodw

sda

I don't understand how someone would allow their car to become so ratty and filthy. The perforated leather in TLs is prone to crack and split, but to let it go like that, jeez.

jpp75

stickguy said:

Found this on Maverick forum. It’s what every Thursday is like, when ford announces what orders are being assigned a build date. Some people been waiting a long time. The allocation system, is poorly thought out.

https://www.mavericktruckclub.com/forum/attachments/truck-jpg.32715/

Tell those people to talk to a Rivian pre-order holder, they'll feel much better about things.

au1994

Just watching the news and the story stated that they expected the current car supply situation to continue through 2023. So the good news/bad news scenario continues for us!

Interesting data point. Current dealer new inventory: ~800k. Typical dealer new inventory: ~3M.

I had a lunch meeting today and passed a few car lots. Toyota dealer had (by todays standards) a boatload of 4Runners. Don’t know if it was a glut of lease turn-ins or what. Not much other new inventory and a decent amount of used.

Kia was bare of new inventory and not very well stocked on used.

Honda had little new but was well stocked with used. It almost seemed that they were mixing new and used on the lot to make it appear fuller.

mjfloyd1

That guy on flying wheels on YouTube is hilarious. He walked up to an M6 convertible and said” BMW V8s are terrible, I’ve never seen one that doesn’t smoke “

fintail

Quite a few basic 4Runners in rental fleets.

au1994 said:

Just watching the news and the story stated that they expected the current car supply situation to continue through 2023. So the good news/bad news scenario continues for us!

Interesting data point. Current dealer new inventory: ~800k. Typical dealer new inventory: ~3M.

I had a lunch meeting today and passed a few car lots. Toyota dealer had (by todays standards) a boatload of 4Runners. Don’t know if it was a glut of lease turn-ins or what. Not much other new inventory and a decent amount of used.

Kia was bare of new inventory and not very well stocked on used.

Honda had little new but was well stocked with used. It almost seemed that they were mixing new and used on the lot to make it appear fuller.

mjfloyd1

This says used car prices may drop by up to 30% by this time next year.

https://www.autotrader.com/car-news/report-used-car-prices-could-finally-come-tumbling-down?LNX=SOMEDFBGENPOST

stickguy

I will be done sometime this spring for an extended period. Will just be waiting for sports car prices to fall to something affordable!

oldfarmer50

fintail said:

Quite a few basic 4Runners in rental fleets.

au1994 said:

Just watching the news and the story stated that they expected the current car supply situation to continue through 2023. So the good news/bad news scenario continues for us!

Interesting data point. Current dealer new inventory: ~800k. Typical dealer new inventory: ~3M.

I had a lunch meeting today and passed a few car lots. Toyota dealer had (by todays standards) a boatload of 4Runners. Don’t know if it was a glut of lease turn-ins or what. Not much other new inventory and a decent amount of used.

Kia was bare of new inventory and not very well stocked on used.

Honda had little new but was well stocked with used. It almost seemed that they were mixing new and used on the lot to make it appear fuller.

And that is where they are staying until they are either miled up or trashed. 60k miles is when they go to the auction. The other day we did two dealer deliveries which were the first cars sold in almost a year.

corvette

Just put in an order request for a 2022 Maverick through Granger Motors in Iowa. Supposedly this is the last day to get $3,000 off MSRP. $100 non-refundable deposit, I figure that's cheap insurance in the event I decide to do something different. For my build, that looks like a better deal than 4% off invoice from one of the dealers in the northeast.

fintail

Things to avoid when seeing the Carfax! Especially as that 60K mile ex-rental 4Runner will probably be listed at 98% of MSRP in my region.

When I rented at Christmas, I looked for a 4Runner, but the only one there had a defect. They also had a couple of zero option Tacomas and the lowest spec Tundra I've ever seen without a commercial fleet sign on the side (probably where it was originally destined).

oldfarmer50 said:

fintail said:

Quite a few basic 4Runners in rental fleets.

au1994 said:

Just watching the news and the story stated that they expected the current car supply situation to continue through 2023. So the good news/bad news scenario continues for us!

Interesting data point. Current dealer new inventory: ~800k. Typical dealer new inventory: ~3M.

I had a lunch meeting today and passed a few car lots. Toyota dealer had (by todays standards) a boatload of 4Runners. Don’t know if it was a glut of lease turn-ins or what. Not much other new inventory and a decent amount of used.

Kia was bare of new inventory and not very well stocked on used.

Honda had little new but was well stocked with used. It almost seemed that they were mixing new and used on the lot to make it appear fuller.

And that is where they are staying until they are either miled up or trashed. 60k miles is when they go to the auction. The other day we did two dealer deliveries which were the first cars sold in almost a year.

oldfarmer50

fintail said:

Things to avoid when seeing the Carfax! Especially as that 60K mile ex-rental 4Runner will probably be listed at 98% of MSRP in my region.

When I rented at Christmas, I looked for a 4Runner, but the only one there had a defect. They also had a couple of zero option Tacomas and the lowest spec Tundra I've ever seen without a commercial fleet sign on the side (probably where it was originally destined).

oldfarmer50 said:

fintail said:

Quite a few basic 4Runners in rental fleets.

au1994 said:

Just watching the news and the story stated that they expected the current car supply situation to continue through 2023. So the good news/bad news scenario continues for us!

Interesting data point. Current dealer new inventory: ~800k. Typical dealer new inventory: ~3M.

I had a lunch meeting today and passed a few car lots. Toyota dealer had (by todays standards) a boatload of 4Runners. Don’t know if it was a glut of lease turn-ins or what. Not much other new inventory and a decent amount of used.

Kia was bare of new inventory and not very well stocked on used.

Honda had little new but was well stocked with used. It almost seemed that they were mixing new and used on the lot to make it appear fuller.

And that is where they are staying until they are either miled up or trashed. 60k miles is when they go to the auction. The other day we did two dealer deliveries which were the first cars sold in almost a year.

Right now the rental companies (at least mine) are buying everything that isn’t nailed down both new a used. That could be contributing to the short inventory. Combine that with not selling to dealers and the shortage in really severe.

It’s starting to loosen up a little bit but nowhere near what it was before early 2020.

fintail

Yeah, on the National lot I saw two cars that were obviously purchased as used cars, and my rental had its window sticker in the glovebox - dealer ADM included, a consumer market car, not a direct to fleet purchase from the maker.

oldfarmer50 said:

fintail said:

Things to avoid when seeing the Carfax! Especially as that 60K mile ex-rental 4Runner will probably be listed at 98% of MSRP in my region.

When I rented at Christmas, I looked for a 4Runner, but the only one there had a defect. They also had a couple of zero option Tacomas and the lowest spec Tundra I've ever seen without a commercial fleet sign on the side (probably where it was originally destined).

oldfarmer50 said:

fintail said:

Quite a few basic 4Runners in rental fleets.

au1994 said:

Just watching the news and the story stated that they expected the current car supply situation to continue through 2023. So the good news/bad news scenario continues for us!

Interesting data point. Current dealer new inventory: ~800k. Typical dealer new inventory: ~3M.

I had a lunch meeting today and passed a few car lots. Toyota dealer had (by todays standards) a boatload of 4Runners. Don’t know if it was a glut of lease turn-ins or what. Not much other new inventory and a decent amount of used.

Kia was bare of new inventory and not very well stocked on used.

Honda had little new but was well stocked with used. It almost seemed that they were mixing new and used on the lot to make it appear fuller.

And that is where they are staying until they are either miled up or trashed. 60k miles is when they go to the auction. The other day we did two dealer deliveries which were the first cars sold in almost a year.

Right now the rental companies (at least mine) are buying everything that isn’t nailed down both new a used. That could be contributing to the short inventory. Combine that with not selling to dealers and the shortage in really severe.

It’s starting to loosen up a little bit but nowhere near what it was before early 2020.

stickguy

@corvette said:
Just put in an order request for a 2022 Maverick through Granger Motors in Iowa. Supposedly this is the last day to get $3,000 off MSRP. $100 non-refundable deposit, I figure that's cheap insurance in the event I decide to do something different. For my build, that looks like a better deal than 4% off invoice from one of the dealers in the northeast.

Good luck. Hope you aren’t in a hurry!

What configuration and options? There are some to avoid since there are availability constraints.

corvette

stickguy said:

Good luck. Hope you aren’t in a hurry!

What configuration and options? There are some to avoid since there are availability constraints.

LOL... XL 2.0T AWD with CoPilot 360, no other factory options. I told them I'd be interested in dealer installed spray in bedliner, soft tonneau cover, and all weather floormats, but I didn't want them added to the order, for the reason you mentioned.

I've got until the last part of August before the Tundra lease ends. If it's not built by then, I guess I lose my $100 deposit and lease a Tacoma or whatever is available.

xwesx

Aw, you could make it a few weeks with just the Prius!

stickguy

Late august maybe you get lucky for that since it’s a strippo model. Still drives nice. That’s the build I originally test drove just with a moonroof. Not as bad for me because I’m the rare person that actually doesn’t care about not having cruise!

corvette

@xwesx said:
Aw, you could make it a few weeks with just the Prius!

Or, hear me out… do a Mrs. @breld and buy something to tide me over in the interim.

stickguy

That Maverick I think gets built by then. Plus that dealer has a lot of allocations.

stickguy

Also, what color?

corvette

@stickguy Cactus Grey. That one doesn’t seem to get a lot of love for some reason. I’d consider the orange or metallic red if I were getting an XLT, but the color choices on the XL are more limited.

stickguy

Cactus is nice. Looks good on the shape.

sda

corvette said:

@stickguy Cactus Grey. That one doesn’t seem to get a lot of love for some reason. I’d consider the orange or metallic red if I were getting an XLT, but the color choices on the XL are more limited.

Sounds nice. I think the XL is a solid value and a fine vehicle without needing a lot of extras.

au1994

corvette said:

@stickguy Cactus Grey. That one doesn’t seem to get a lot of love for some reason. I’d consider the orange or metallic red if I were getting an XLT, but the color choices on the XL are more limited.

Cactus is a great choice. I like that red as well but I bet you are right that it looks better on the higher trims.

au1994

stickguy said:

Late august maybe you get lucky for that since it’s a strippo model. Still drives nice. That’s the build I originally test drove just with a moonroof. Not as bad for me because I’m the rare person that actually doesn’t care about not having cruise!

I don’t use cruise either. I think its because my first 2 cars did not have it including the 89 Beretta I took to college. My drive there was about 2.5 hrs and 2/3 of it interstate. I guess it was a situation of you can’t miss what you don’t have.

corvette

I think the metallic red is only available on XLT and Lariat. I also think a disproportionate number of them are going to be that Area 51 blue-grey color.

I will be adding the Rostra cruise control kit once it’s in my driveway.

stickguy

That XL is a good value. 250+ HP, all wheel drive, utility value but can fit in a garage, for an MSRP of about $26k.

@corvette, one thing I would add is the trailer hitch. That package is a great deal at only about $100. A full size spare is $125 (though that might not be useful if you plan to get aftermarket wheels).

I haven’t heard of the hitch being a constraint and you could never add it later for that cheap.

oldfarmer50

stickguy said:

That XL is a good value. 250+ HP, all wheel drive, utility value but can fit in a garage, for an MSRP of about $26k.

@corvette, one thing I would add is the trailer hitch. That package is a great deal at only about $100. A full size spare is $125 (though that might not be useful if you plan to get aftermarket wheels).

I haven’t heard of the hitch being a constraint and you could never add it later for that cheap.

Talk about a stripper. Only option is a trailer hitch but not bad if you don’t mind the less powerful engine.

https://www.windowsticker.forddirect.com/windowsticker.pdf?token=+6spZoUDYJ69uFiVVSS9W4Wuy/zHzJrCWFhTA6u2teHKEm3hqelUsW3vS6Es7ZWHxRdTAkFwH6zb8szO2oZeDnofg+1X7gIr/C+4fWiLB9qsIdlFXTaeBKUWqLaGa66twqUEE3zS2puda+n4mCh4x/k73dR1hveUp6k5ZDGsTKs=

It’s one of only four listed in dealer inventory in my area.

qbrozen

too bad they didn't make the Maverick a PHEV. Even if that cost an extra couple grand, fed money would make it an incredibly cheap new car.

stickguy

The hybrid works great in this application. Def the way to go if you don’t need AWD. And that is incredibly cheap for what you get. A useful truck for the price of a bare bones Elantra.

mjfloyd1

@qbrozen said:
too bad they didn't make the Maverick a PHEV. Even if that cost an extra couple grand, fed money would make it an incredibly cheap new car.

Ohhh, a maverick 4xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxe???

mjfloyd1

Ugh. It’s just a maverick forkseyfour

breld

Speaking of trucks (or truck-like vehicles), I think we're gonna order (reserve) a Santa Cruz.

I'm not even quite sure how she was aware of them to begin with, but my wife brought them up the other night as a utility vehicle that'd be perfect for her trips to the reservoir and other location for paddleboarding. So we went to check one out yesterday and she liked it quite a bit (and I was impressed as well).

Of course, it started out as "we just need the basic version to get the functionality." But she likes the factory tonneau cover which comes with the Activity Package, which also comes with an outlet in the bed that she requires so she can easily inflate her paddleboard(s).

But then, if you're getting that Activity Package, it's only a few grand more to get the model with the turbo engine, and that model comes standard with the Activity Package and other fun features.

So, SEL Premium trim in either Sage Gray or Stone Blue it is.

The dealer network we most often work with has both those options in-transit - they're at MSRP, but then add $699 for D&H and apparently another $199 for some theft insurance silliness.

Another dealer is straight on MSRP with no D&H, but they have nothing that fits the bill in transit. They'll take a $500 deposit to get on the list for the next one available to them.

I'm leaning toward the straight MSRP option - we're in no hurry. Given the market, I'm not totally opposed to the extra $900 itself, but on principle I just hate to effectively pay more than MSRP, at least for a Hyundai product.

28firefighter

breld said:

Speaking of trucks (or truck-like vehicles), I think we're gonna order (reserve) a Santa Cruz.

I'm not even quite sure how she was aware of them to begin with, but my wife brought them up the other night as a utility vehicle that'd be perfect for her trips to the reservoir and other location for paddleboarding. So we went to check one out yesterday and she liked it quite a bit (and I was impressed as well).

Of course, it started out as "we just need the basic version to get the functionality." But she likes the factory tonneau cover which comes with the Activity Package, which also comes with an outlet in the bed that she requires so she can easily inflate her paddleboard(s).

But then, if you're getting that Activity Package, it's only a few grand more to get the model with the turbo engine, and that model comes standard with the Activity Package and other fun features.

So, SEL Premium trim in either Sage Gray or Stone Blue it is.

The dealer network we most often work with has both those options in-transit - they're at MSRP, but then add $699 for D&H and apparently another $199 for some theft insurance silliness.

Another dealer is straight on MSRP with no D&H, but they have nothing that fits the bill in transit. They'll take a $500 deposit to get on the list for the next one available to them.

I'm leaning toward the straight MSRP option - we're in no hurry. Given the market, I'm not totally opposed to the extra $900 itself, but on principle I just hate to effectively pay more than MSRP, at least for a Hyundai product.

What are your thoughts on the usability of the backseat? I know it's been a while since you had car seats, but just curious if you think it'd be functional. It looks tight, from what I can see.

stickguy

It’s compact but not too uncomfortable. From what I remember of my one test sit. Backrest is pretty upright though.

Fine for kids.

stickguy

Can’t see this lasting long. Should just get a wagon. More usable space!

au1994

Nice @breld!

@qbrozen, care to counterpunch?

breld

stickguy said:

Can’t see this lasting long. Should just get a wagon. More usable space!

You may have missed it, but long-term ownership hasn't really been a primary goal.

My wife likes the idea of the storage area separate from the passenger space - during the Spring/Summer she likes to just keep her paddleboard and equipment in her car....over time that apparently led to a not-so-pleasant odor in her MINI.

Basically, we're totally the target audience for Hyundai's marketing of the vehicle...hook, line and sinker.

And I agree with @stickguy's assessment of the rear seat space...I just glanced back at it since it's not a primary consideration, but it looked adequate to me. Pretty much what you'd expect from a compact SUV.

qbrozen

au1994 said:

Nice @breld!

@qbrozen, care to counterpunch?

should be picking up the TRX any day now.

corvette

Granger Ford already emailed me a preview order and asked for my DL and insurance. I’m impressed with the quick response.

breld

I just got off the phone with a Hyundai dealer in Colorado Springs, figuring if it was a decent deal I'd be happy to make the hour drive.

$6,000 over MSRP.

stickguy

How short is this paddle board? The cargo bed is not very long in a Santa Cruz.

breld

stickguy said:

How short is this paddle board? The cargo bed is not very long in a Santa Cruz.

It's inflatable, though it seems you could transport a regular one resting on top of the tailgate with one of those padded accessories that drape over the tailgate.

breld

Yeah, Q and I...it's like we're pretty much getting the same car