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Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)
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If you are concerned about resale (which YOU should be), then there is only one choice. We bought our Pilot with nothing down on a 6-year note and we were able to trade it in just 2.5 years later for almost exactly what we owed. There isn't a chevy on the planet you could do that with.
Oh, and we averaged 20-21 mpg along the way.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
A Suburban just seems like overkill for normal use, unless you plan to tow a large trailer.
But, after sitting in one at the car show, the new GM interior is light years ahead of the old one!
Also pass on the TB. I remember reading about them, and aren't they every bit as big as a Tahoe (length wise)? And in real world use, don't really get better mileage.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
It is smaller than the Pilot.If you are only putting kids back there who cares if knees in their chins will stunt their growth.
Thing that sucks abou the TB though, is that to get a third-row seat you have to get that extended model, which has a wheelbase almost as long as a Suburban! Less overhang though, so overall it's still shorter. But it's also narrower inside, so you don't really get a whole lot of interior room.
The '07 Tahoe/Yukon have a third-row seat option, so if you want a GM, you're no longer limited to the Suburban.
I would buy a used full sized van (e.g. Ford E-150). No question. You can pick those things up for insanely cheap, they'll get the job done, and they'll run forever.
Better yet, if you want to ride in style, get a 2-3 year old conversion van. You'll still pay a lot less than a new Burb, and it will be like riding around in a small apartment.
I know full sized vans are, ah, less than sexy, but if money was tight that's what I'd do. I'd buy one at a price that I could pay off in two years, so instead of throwing money away on cars, you can do something that will result in positive equity; e.g., save up for a down payment on a house.
Are you keeping the Titan or trading it?
2WD, Pewter w/ tan leather, 3 rows, 20K miles on an '03, 20" chromed rims, rear DVD system, XM equipped. Pretty much loaded.
Of course, the car is in San Diego. Heck, it might still be available when you're ready to pull the trigger!
I just spent the weekend driving to/from Cheyenne (130 miles one way). Third time in 6 weeks, all in the wife's VUE. Now, while the VUE has it's assets (250HP and AWD, for starters), for me it's not the most comfortable long distance vehicle.
I'm thinking about a fairly generic sedan that has a high seating position -- one of the major complaints the wife has with the Saturn L300 is that the seats are so low to the ground.
Ford 500/Mercury Montego would fit the bill, plus it comes with AWD as an option. And, for some odd reason, the Buick Lucerne is somewhat appealing (must be the lemko influence!). Am very curious about the new Saturn Aura coming out later this year, but don't know about the seating position yet.
Of course, I would like it if the Impala came with the V8 in something other than the SS trim level.
Just dreaming at this point, but I know one of the most favorite pastimes on this board is spending other people's money and arguing over our opinions.
Owning bmw's w/o losing your shirt.......I'm one of those nuts who thinks that's possible. Most of the truly crazed bmw nuts seem to own 10-15 y.o. 3-5-7 models that aren't even that great.....
*It can get expensive to own bmw's.*
As far as brands, it's really a tossup between Ford, GM, or Dodge. They're all older than dirt (you'd probably be hard pressed to tell the difference between a 2005 and 1995), and dead reliable. The only "real" advice I have is to not buy new, unless you're going to drive it for an eternity (since you'll find that 200k miles is nothing for one of these guys, plan on it!).
Here's one way.
Buy a late 80's/early 90's 7-series (either the 735 or 750) after doing the usual checks.
Do nothing but required oil changes/tires/brakes. Nothing more. Don't worry about any dash lights that come on. If something electrical breaks don't fix it.
Drive it until no longer driveable.
Repeat this process until the fever passes - or until you find an example that goes on forever.
(This is pretty much my approach to car buying - except I don't buy beemers).
The Chevy van is the newest design, AFAIK. The older style, which ran from the early 70's to mid-late 90's couldn't hold a big block in its engine bay, which was a strike against it in heavier applications. That's the main reason Dodge and Ford used to pretty much own the Class-C motorhome market back in the day, although Dodge started to lose their reign once they quit making big blocks.
As for the Ram van, which they just quit making in the past couple of years, I think it also dates back to the early 1970's. They gave it a more modern looking nose around 1996 or so, but didn't update the sheetmetal to nearly the extent that Ford did.
Big difference from the Titan, was very nimble and fun to drive. The Titan is fun in its own respect (I love my truck don't get me wrong), but its big and a major bear in parking garages or anywhere else for that matter.
The price difference between 4WD and 2WD is less than $800 from what I could tell. I drove a 4WD EX-L, very nice, I really liked it.
Legroom was a little tight, but the second row seats move forward to give the 3rd row extra room, was pretty cool.
Anyway, I think if I do trade the Titan the Pilot is going to win out. Only drawback is it can't tow much, which is fine for a few years.
BTW, I've had the Titan for 15 months and she has 39k on her. Still being a pretty good truck, can't complain really. Last I heard Zippy was doing fine, has around 53k on her, she is coming up on her second birthday in July, I miss my little car.
In any case, I'm surprised you felt any lag. I found ours quite peppy and responsive. But they have made some changes since our '03 model, so who knows.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I know that our Ody gets up and scoots. If there is ever a lag, it's when the trany is in a high gear for the speed, and needs to downshift to get any serious motivation going. hauls tookie on the highway though.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Maintains a pretty solid 80MPH on the interstate, but is blown around by crosswinds quite a bit. North of Fort Collins on I-25, it's like God's own wind tunnel. Goes from zero crosswind to a steady 35-40MPH.
Anyway, I was driving to work one morning and thought about how my current car ('03 Focus ZX5) is similar to the car I first bought when I moved to Colorado ('93 Honda Accord DX). I mean, they're both burgundy with a grey interior, both have stick shifts, similar engine size and power (2.2L and 125HP for the Honda, 2.0L and 130HP for the Focus).
So, I decided to get onto Edmunds site and do a little comparison:
Focus Accord
Curb weight 2699 lbs 2778 lbs
Torque 135 lb/ft 137 lb/ft
EPA city/hwy 25/32 24/31
Length 168.1" 185.2"
Wheelbase 103" 107.1"
Height 52.8" 53.9"
Front headroom 39.3" 38.9"
Rear legroom 37.6" 34.3"
Now, the Focus has A/C, ABS, power windows and locks; the Accord had none of that.
Still, seems interesting that in 10 years, I could be driving two cars from different manufacturers that are so similar in many ways.
Cars are bulking up so fast, I dunno....maybe the smallest cars will still be that light then.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Smaller dimensions, same weight, same HP/torque, basically the same mileage.
And, IIRC, pretty much the same price! I think the Accord was the last DX they had on the lot (the '94 redesign was just coming out) and they let me have it for around $14K. The Focus, OTOH, was fairly well loaded (we had to go to 4 different dealers to find a ZX5 with ABS) and stickered for something like $17-18K, but with the X-plan and rebates, we ended up paying around $14K for it as well.
Doesn't sound like progress to me. Guess we'll have to see what happens in 7 more years!
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I really like the way the Focus drives. The most demure thing about my Altima was the way the power steering was overboosted--the Focus' steering has a nice, firm feel. I wish they would bring over the current model from Europe, though.
Since the Focus is Ford's bread and butter car in Europe, it made sense for them to get the new model as quickly as possible. Here in the US, the Focus is Ford's "entry level" model, and they are perfectly content to sell the old model (albeit with the new 2.3L engine) for a few more years as the tooling is already bought and paid for.
I do agree with you about how the Focus drives -- quite a bit more fun than most compacts. However, it's not like we drove a lot of different cars and decided on the Focus. We got a letter from Ford indicating that they would pay off the remaining lease payments on our Explorer if we bought or leased another Ford product.
Convinced wife that we could reduce the payment size and increase the gas mileage if we traded down - the other idea was that our daughter would be driving it. Spent a very long Saturday visiting 4 different dealerships before finding the car we ended up buying. Payment dropped from $580/mo to $320/mo with no cash out of pocket (gotta love X-plan and rebates!).
27 months and 36,000 miles later the only things the car has required is oil changes and a new set of tires at 33K.
I actually owned two of those models -- one being a '92 LX that my first wife and I bought after she totalled her Protege and the second being the '93 DX, which I leased not long after moving to Denver. The first wife got the LX in the divorce - she kept it for a few years, then traded it in on a Dodge Ram pickup.
While I was leasing the DX, I thought seriously about trading it in for a '95 or '96 LX Coupe. Dealer would have taken the DX in trade and the payments on the LX coupe would have been somewhere around $300/mo. At the time, I was financially strapped, so I passed.
Other than that.. I agree wholeheartedly..
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NO idiot belts.
NO upshift lights.
NO undefeatable daytime running lights [OK, got me there]
NO self-locking doors, either.
NO manual transmissions with skip shift [Camaro etc.]
Ugh. Who comes up with this s[uperfluous stuff]?
-Mathias
I agree with the self-locking doors. Have you ever locked a one year old in a car with the motor running? Yes I did, but have not told his mother yet.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Of course the locksmith had to ask "can't your son unlock it?". Why didn't I think of that?
He's 2 1/2 now and doing fine. He face twitches a little though whenever I hit the remote button. I wonder what that could be? :confuse:
Why don't we suspend your posting privileges for a week while you think about an answer.
Sheesh.
This is CCBA, Dude. It's not that kind of a support group.
-Mathias
Some people just don't get it.
The only thing I like more than cars is trance and drum & bass music. That's another expensive habit.
The Aviator IMO is a fanatastic truck and my wife loves it, that's what counts most. We were coming out of a Caddy SRX to put some perspective on that. (She got 3 speeding tickets in 3 weeks in the SRX so she had to go, the SRX, not my wife
The Amanti, well it won some kind of most appealing award if that counts for anything in your mind. And if one were to sit in one and drive it with an open minded, non biased opinion they may be surprised... For the price of a new mid-level Civic, I am laughing all the way to the bank
I do get it, and just for the record I have had more than four at once on many occasions through the years. And I'm just me, no spouse to blame a couple of them on! ;-)
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Anyway, there have been times when it would lock itself the moment you put it in gear. Or sometimes even when it's just sitting there, in Park, idling. When I used to deliver pizzas, I'd leave the car running. I worked a fairly safe neighborhood of mostly single-family homes, so usually I'd be right up in the driveway. I know, still not a good idea!
As for automatic climate control, my Grandma's '85 LeSabre had it. It was smart enough not to engage the fan until it was ready to give you the temperature that you wanted, but it had some other annoyances. For one, it only had two fan speeds you could select. Low or High. There was a middle button called "Auto", but when you pressed that you were at the mercy of what passed for a computer. The display was cool looking, a flat membrane surface that was almost futuristic looking. It had buttons on it that were flat, similar to those on an old Intellivision II hand controller. I know I'm digging into the past there, but that was the first thing that popped into my mind!
Another thing that was annoying was how you set the temperature. It had a range that went from something like 60 degrees to 90 degrees. There was a button on the left that made it colder, and a button on the right that made it hotter. Where with the old fashioned type where you just slid a lever, you could go from full-cold to full-hot in a fraction of a second, here you had to sit and hold the button, and it would beep and a spot on the control would light up for every degree. I'd say it probably took about 30 seconds to get that sucker from full-cold to fulll-hot, or vice versa!
My Altima did not have automatic locks, but the manual lock for the door had very little resistance and was positioned right on top of the handle so that it was easy to bump (and lock the door) after pulling the handle to open the door. Several times, I inadvertently locked the driver's door on my way out, with the keys in the ignition--thankfully, the other doors were unlocked each time this happened.
My grandparents' 1987 and 1990 Park Avenues had the same climate system--I remember the membrane control panel, and the two fan settings, but didn't remember that the system was smart enough not to fully spin up immediately. I also remember that it had an external thermometer, but you had to push a button on the membrane to view it (Ext Tmp or some other abomination [like Check Gages]).
1955 Packard Clipper Custom
1955 Packard Clipper Constellation
1961 Chevrolet Apache 10 Long Stepside
1965 Plymouth Barracuda S
1965 Dodge Coronet 440 (with the 361)
1965 Dodge D100 Flatbed
1968 Plymouth Valiant
1968 Pontiac Lemans
1969 Cadillac Deville
1970 Ford Maverick Sport
1970 Plymouth Duster V8
1972 Volvo 142S
1973 Chevrolet Vega GT Kammback
1973 Ford Pinto Wagon
1973 Cadillac Eldorado
1975 Chrysler Cordoba
1975 Dodge Dart Custom
1975 Dodge D200
1975 Plymouth Duster Custom
1975 Plymouth Gran Fury Suburban
1975 Plymouth Valiant Brougham Hardtop
1975 Plymouth Valiant Custom
1976 Mazda 808 Coupe
1976 Chrysler Cordoba
1977 Datsun 200SX
1977 Dodge Aspen
1977 Datsun 620 Deluxe Kingcab
1978 Ford Pinto Wagon
1978 Ford Fairmont
1978 Chevrolet Nova Concours
1979 Chrysler Lebaron
1979 Chrysler Cordoba
1981 Ford Escort GLX
1981 Mazda 626
1983 Chevrolet Impala 9C1
1986 Oldsmobile Calais
1988 Mazda B2200
1989 Plymouth Acclaim
1993 Geo Metro
1995 Nissan Hardbody XE Kingcab
1996 Chrysler Sebring SLX
1996 Dodge Neon
2002 Dodge Caravan SE
What are the 5 you still have?
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
1978 Ford Fairmont
I had the sister to that car, a '78 Mercury Zephyr. Mine was the 2-door with the 200cu.in. I6 and 3-speed auto. For some bizarre reason, I have fond memories of that car.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S