Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

isellhondas

Not everybody is afraid of high miles.

I have said many times that choosing a used car because of it's odometer reading as most people do can be a mistake.

Modern cars given even spotty maintenance can easily rack up 250,000 miles or even more.

That 2008 Lacrosse is probably priced lower than others because of it's high miles. It may have never suffered destructive kids, meals in transit or smelly dogs. It may have been pampered by an owner who cared about it.

Conversly, the 45,000 mile Lacrosse that is 3000.00 more may have been trashed by an abusive owner, may have pulled a overloaded trailer etc.

Still, most of the time, when we decided to keep vs. wholesale a high miler they sat around so long we eventually wholesaled.

In the "old days" car lots had a "cure" for high miles!

stickguy

Made a few more stops today while out running errands. And man, it still astounds me that the wife is a willing participant (if not instigator) to many of these forays.

went to a different sube dealer to see colors out in the daylight. So saw most of the color selection, and sat in a tan and black interior one. My wife didn't seem to mind the black, but I'll fight for the Ivory and win!

found out all the changes to the 2013 outback. Front end face lift, new engine/trans, adding rear seat air vents, and some new colors. Overall worthwhile upgrades, and the MSRP for a limited is only going up $400. Plus, you can custom order exactly what you want which is nice.

But, made the mistake of stopping at the Acura dealer and actually driving an RDX on the roads. have to admit, it is nice. And very, very quick. And the wife still seems to be in love with it.

so, might be a hard sell convincing her that the Subaru is a worthwhile alternative (since it will be way way cheaper). I do know that if we got an Outback, she would really like it, once she got it out of her head that she "settled".

So, the process is on hold for a couple of weeks. We want to see a color on the Acura this is not available yet (we are on a list of people that want to see it). I want to see the new style sube. And I am waiting for my source to get the Santa Fe so I can see that.

stickguy

I saw a nice 3 series today ( I posted a link to it a week or 2 back). It was at the subaru dealer I stopped out. I liked it.

a 2008 328i. Black over black, 6 speed stick, sport/premium packages. If you don't mind all black, it was very sharp. 47K miles, asking $20,985. And under warranty until December, so a bit of coverage for surprises.

http://www.millersubaru.com/used/BMW/2008-BMW-328-bf44aedd0a0a000200bb5aa9f04839- ce.htm

of course, after reading Q's horror stories, the 17" wheels/40 series tires were a serious turn off.

jayrider

The one "problem" I have with the Prius is that since I get 50 mpg, I'm less likely to combine errands.

Jayrider:" I knew I'd forget to get the widgets at the hardware store when I bought all those whatsits and I need them to finish the project."

Mrs. J: "So go get them."

Jayrider: "Are you sure?"

Mrs. J: "Yeah---and pick up an order of fries at MacDonalds -- it's on the way."

Jayrider: "What size?"

Mrs. J: "Extra large--we can share."

Jayrider: Have I told you lately that I love you?"

Mrs J: "Make sure they're hot and keep your hands out of the bag."

tifighter

The truck hunt continues; I had a little extra time today and stopped to drive the Ridgeline. Not the easiest thing to find, since Honda dealers know they are slow sellers and don't order many...supply is short. Ended up driving a RTL - this one has leather and moonroof, no Navi, which is a blessing, the navi unit is the old-as-dirt last generation model (think Garmin 2006-7), and they want an extra $2350 for it. No thanks.

Pros - Right sized cabin. Much roomier than the Frontier or Tacoma, but not I-can-barely-see-the-passenger-door-much-less-reach-it big like a full size. Rear seats are adult friendly. Smooth ride, adequate power but no more. In-bed trunk is huge; way bigger in person than it appears in pics. Looking online, it looks like people are beating the EPA estimates.

Cons - Bed is short. Not pretty though its growing on me. No bluetooth without Navi...what? Honda again shows their love of 2007 tech here again. No back up camera without navi either, and this thing would benefit from one as the high bedsides and tailgate obscure the rear view like crazy. I guess you could go aftermarket. No low range, etc. Spendy compared to a Frontier.

I admit that the just-right size appeals to me. The Tundra I drove was really nice, but I'm struggling with the size...its huge. The Tacoma was small and uncomfortable, with its sit on the floor seating position. Haven't driven a Frontier but looked at one at a car show...back seat is shaped like this -> L , 90 degrees and all. With no legroom.

List is $35k for the RTL, $32k seems doable without much work. Used market continues to be nuts, but did find an 11 CPO RTL for $27k...is it worth the extra $5k to go new? Its black/black, which I'm not crazy about. Dirt and scratch magnet.

Happy weekend, all.

michaellno

Nice. A local used dealer has a 2007 328xi coupe for$23k. 60k black on black 6 speed manual. Been on the lot for some months now.

The one you link to is one year newer, 14k less miles and two grand cheaper. Hmm mm.

mark156

The only problem with the Hybrids is that they are not paying their fair share of road taxes as they don't use enough gas. We should tax them heavily, $4,000 per unit! Ha!

Mark156

ronsteve

At the risk of going off-topic, I have to disagree with the proponents of basing the use tax on miles driven. Highway taxes based on fuel consumption, as they are now, make sense because the vehicles using the most fuel are typically the heaviest vehicles, and do the most damage to the road surface.

stever

Lots of trucking companies are converting to natural gas - cheaper (so less fuel tax paid overall) and sometimes better mileage (so less fuel burned). (WSJ)

Time to get this one going again:

Who Pays for our Roads?

ateixeira

I think the cross bars on the Outback were moved farther apart. Lots of Subaru owners have kayaks and canoes, so to them that was an important change.

ateixeira

I should also get a sneak peek at the new model Santa Fe

Let me know once those are in. My sister still didn't buy anything.

She's getting her 2003 service for now, so she can take her time car shopping.

I did find her a good indy mechanic and she spent $525 less than she would have at the dealer (timing belt, water pump, front pads and rotors). I always thought they were pricey, but wow.

ateixeira

people who for whatever reason perfer the outgoing models

They probably figure the bugs are all worked out. Generally I'm sure they're more reliable than v1.0.

I usually prefer the new tech, but not if I think the design took the car backwards.

ateixeira

Compare the RDX to an Outback H6, to keep the comparison "fair".

ateixeira

Black paint for a pickup?

Then again, the powertrain is covered for longer on the CPO.

I like those in Silver for some reason, and I don't usually like Silver unless it's a Benz.

stickguy

They won't really be at dealers until most likely early September (could filter in late August).

I hope I get to see it in person this month, through the guy I know who works for Hyundai corporate, and gets the new stuff a few months early to try out.

stickguy

I don't want to be "fair". I want to get my way!

I know though that performance wise they are the ones to match up, but power was not really an issue for her, expecially on a brief test drive.

but, after much discussion, if we get the OB it will be the 4 cyl.

qbrozen

How about a gussied up Contour with AWD and MANUAL!!

whattya know, another loaded up Fusion with a stick.

stickguy

Fusion looks nice. Forgot to look and see what they want for that. Interesting car, but not anything I would want at this piont (too darned close to the Accord I used to have!)

The jag? I actually thought about that oddball (a version of it) at one point, if it comes cheap enough.

But man, old school tape deck (and if it has CD, probably in the trunk). And no moonroof? No go there!

ateixeira

Let her pick...especially if you go with the pricey option, she'll never let you forget it if she has any remorse at all.

ateixeira

X Type is just $2 grand as of now, but I'm sure it won't go that cheap.

Weren't those very problematic? A bunch of them sold here in Potomac, a make-believe luxury car.

ateixeira

$510, reserve not met. Wonder what the reserve is. I'd pay $520 for that!

qbrozen

IIRC, the last one I posted went for around $5500 with 95k miles.(??) Not sure it was the same year. I think that was an '06.

qbrozen

reliability rating from MSN is a 5/5.

And, actually, the mileage ain't all that bad at 19/28. And at 3400 lbs with the stick and near 200 hp, it wouldn't be all too shabby to drive, I would think.

Huh. I might talk myself into this one.

ateixeira

reliability rating from MSN is a 5/5

It's called ballot stuffing.

Funny thing is the new Fusion steals my attention away from both of those auction cars.

tifighter

Yeah, the silver is good. Worst to me is white...horrible color on the Ridgeline.

I don't mind black, I just don't want to clean it. Whatever we get will be parked outside, and my grey RDX looks like it has a pollen blanket as it is. I do like the black interior, though.

mark156

Oh, by the way, I was kidding about taxing the Hybrids. They are light, use less fuel, let'm enjoy it!

Seems like so many cars I've bought recently and in the past had the 'gas guzzler' tax added. So, I'm making the extra contribution for the hyper-milers! LOL!

Mark156

oldbearcat

I had 2 of the X Types, a 2003 2.5 and a 2006 3.0. They had a few problems, but, Jaguar constantly improved them through the end of the Model run. A gussied up Contour - not hardly. The Jag's 2.5 made 192 HP, with a very flat torque curve. The 3.0 made 227 HP, and, had more bottom end grunt that the 2.5. These engines were high compression, had VVT, and a tuned dual plane intake manifold. Either engine will pull strongly all the way to redline, and, haul these cars quickly well into triple digit speeds. The AWD is biased to rear drive under normal conditions, so they drive accordingly, and, cornering was excellent. I test drove a BMW 325i with automatic in 2003, and, bought the Jag because it felt quicker to me, had way more trunk room, and was much nicer and roomier inside. The 2.5 with automatic I owned would easily get 28 MPG on trips, the 3.0 about 24. The build quality on them was excellent for an entry level lux vehicle. The fact that Jag never upgraded/upsized the engines' output, or, gave it a 6 speed tranny to keep up with competition doomed the X in the marketplace. After the X Types, I owned an S-Type 4.2 for a while, and, it was an incredible vehicle - a muscle car in a tuxedo. I left Jaguar after Tata bought them out, and, parts for warranty work suddenly involved long waits with the car sitting in the shop.

Regards:
Oldengineer

qbrozen

I was half joking with the contour comment, although they were on the same platform, and I do have to agree with my wife who always said the x-type looked a bit too much like a Ford.

stickguy

the parts supply issue (at least for the non-Ford ones!) might give me pause on one of these. But, not a half bad car, at least with the manual trans!

ateixeira

Either way, Contour wasn't a bad car to begin with.

My wife's cousin owns a Lincon LS...we could call that a de-contented S-Type.

I didn't like Ford's strategy of owning all those brands - having Jaguar limited what a Lincoln could be. They had to keep a hierarchy and that put a glass ceiling above Lincoln.

stickguy

I owned 2 contour derivatives. And they were vastly differnt.

1st I had a 1995 (first year I believe) Mercury Mystique. V6, top line model with a 5 speed stick. Very well built car, quick, excellent handling, lots of features. Seemed European (which makes sense given what it was based on). Looked sharp too.

then, a 1999-2000 (I forget which) Contour SE 4 cyl AT. What a dog. I hated driving that car, and my son (it was his learn on car) was none to fond of it. Drove like a cheap car, decontented, crappy seats, etc. Hard to believe it was a 4-5 year newer (and facelifted) version of the same car.

qbrozen

The LS was VERY similar to an s-type. I had an LS and drove both before buying. They did have different engines, but they felt pretty darned similar. The S was a bit silkier, most likely due to the suspension .... which is what ultimately made me choose the LS. When I looked up the cost of replacing the Jag shocks, I put the idea of owning one right out of my mind.

ateixeira

We test drove a 1995 Contour V6 with a manual, not a bad car. The 4 bangers used the CD4E auto trans, those were awful. How many times did you have to rebuild/replace yours? It was every 60k miles on the Mazda 626 4 banger (which shared that auto tranny).

Luckily we got a V6/manual and didn't suffer from trans issues. The 626 boards were full of people rebuilding the CD4Es. Some multiple times. :lemon:

rayainsw

I had 2 LSs - only 'repeat' in buying cars
since the 1960s.
Negotiations to buy an S-Type R stalled
with about $1,500 difference.
Fun car to drive.
- Ray
Oh, well....

stickguy

never, but we only probably but 2K on it at most, and maybe not that much. it did shift a little hard at times though.

Not a car we miss, especially my son, since it was replaced by the 2000Acura Tl that he still has, 3.5 years later!

nyccarguy

My uncle had 2 X Type Jaguars. 1 2.5, then the second was a 3.0. He loved the way they drove. The 2.5 was PERFECT. He had 1 (VERY BIG) problem with the 3.0. The center differential crapped out on him in a snowstorm & he was stuck on the side of the road for hours waiting for roadside assistance.

I always thought the S-Type R was a cool car. 488 hp Supercharged V8, not too shabby. What are those doing at the auctions these days?

ateixeira

S-Types were a bargain used, but the R was expensive to begin with.

laurasdada

Driving to work this morning, saw a previous generation white Camry with a stand-up Toyota hood ornament a la Mercedes-Benz. Way to keep it classy, San Diego! (Well, on Rte 128 in Dedham, actually).

I think I'm out of the winter-beater car biz, wife told me to have a talk with my daughter about snow and the use of "her" car. Wife does not want our driveway to look like a BHPH lot! If it snows, and I have to travel, I'll drive kids to school, wife will pick them up. Daughter seemed none too pleased. C'est la vie.

stickguy

I was thinking the same thing. Our plan is for my daughter to have normal use of my Volvo when she can drive solo (right at Thanksgiving). And I will be getting some other car around then so I have something to use. In theory, it will be "fun", but it could also just be an oddball. But, if I end up with say a convertible or sporty car, it may not be usable in snow or slop.

so, in that case, or if I need a "real" car for some reason, I will repossess the Volvo and she can suffer with riding the bus, or bumming a ride!

stickguy

All this looking I have been doing has really got me looking forward to actually having a new car to enjoy. too bad you have actually pay for them. A minor detail...

jayrider

I turned 16 in 1962 and any car I got to drive was the new best thing. My mindset was blank to anything but traveling down the road by myself with the windows open and the radio blasting. No concept of handling, performance, soft touch materials, or how bad the brakes were. Just a big smile on my face. Heck, I'd have been happy with a car that drove like you were being dragged down the road sitting on a shovel. Except for maybe some farm kids, I think that attitude is pretty hard to find these days.

michaellno

I felt the same way in December 1979 when I turned 16. Couldn't wait to drive myself wherever I wanted. My first car was a '65 Bug with a "Baja" kit added to it. Totally unreliable, but I loved it.

I think the current generation is more interested in technology than automobiles. I know we had to force our stepdaughter to get her license (and a job!) and my son didn't get his license until he turned 18.

Kids! Sheesh.

stickguy

I was the same way, but I was also a car guy then too (in a big way). So style still was a concern. Just not much i could do anything about.

My kids both wanted to drive. My daughter could not wait, and is a maniac about always wanting to drive when we go someplace. heck, Sunday she was bugging me to just go take a drive, just for the heck of it!

It is a different time now though. Cars we had, if you let your 17YO loose in one, DYFS would be knocking on your door! So safety is a concern, and some measure of relaibility.

at least with my son, the 1st car (POC countour) was only about $2,400, and the Acura TL that replaced it was a cool $2k! hard to pass up that (family) deal, which is how he ended up with such a nice car (it did have 145K on it at the time). Besides, a better car up front can save money in the long run (repairs and aggravation factor)

oldbearcat

gbrozen: Actually the X Type shared some platform parts/pieces with the European Ford Mondeo - not the US built Contour. Its a common misconception. I agree - they did look a lot like a scaled down version of a Taurus/Sable.

Regards:
Oldbearcat

oldbearcat

From what I've read on the forums when I used to own the Jags - The 4.0 Liter version of the S-Type was essentially a Lincoln LS. The early S-Tpes even had Ford Trannies in them. Then in either 2004 or 2005, Jag upsized the V8 to 4.2 liters (300 HP N/A or 400 HP supercharged), went to a ZF 6 speed tranny, and extensively modified the rest of the car. The engine Ford used in the LS lacked some of the enhancements that the Jag version had, and, made less power. I drove one of the first year Jag XFs with the N/A 4.2 - it didn't feel as athletic as my S did, because the XF is a bit heavier. Didn't Ford stick the Lincoln version of this V8 in the new Thunderbirds as well?

Regards;
Oldbearcat

oldbearcat

The S-Type Rs are cheap these days - I suspect the last ones built could be picked up for $15k or less - if its nice and reasonably low mileage. Not that bad for a car that'll do 0 - 60 in 4 something seconds.

Regards:
Oldbearcat

ateixeira

I wonder what it would cost to service and repair, though.

If you have to ask....

kyfdx

Here is one for $11K

'03 Type R

ateixeira

That's a lot of car for the money. It is a decade old, but wow...

Jeez, at least dust the interior.

nyccarguy

I'd have to think that an E55 AMG or an M5 might be the better (more reliable) buy in this particular vintage.