So, all I have to do is make 4 payments, then pay it off, and they're satisfied. APR is 3.99%. My HELOC is only 3.5%, but I can write that off on my taxes, so it's really more like 2.4%.
Watch it, now. The tax law allows that interest to be written off only if the prinicpal was used to upgrade your primary residence.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Parking the Ram outside does make the house look better.
Funny, I was just about to say that! Plus, if I drive it to Home Depot a few times and buy something for the house, does that count as upgrading the primary residence?
I think one area where you'll really notice the difference in a V-6 versus a 4-cyl is if you regularly have several passengers.
And, there's just something about the effortlessness that a V-6 goes about its business. Often with the 4-cyl you have to really floor it and wind the snot out of them to get good acceleration, whereas with the V-6 you just tap it and go, without all that straining.
Although, if I was shopping for a modern midsized car, I'd probably be happy with most 4-cyl engines. And even with something like a Charger, I'm sure I'd be happy with the V-6 they use in it, versus the Hemi.
At the time, I was pretty much focused on the following attributes:
Mid sized sedan V6 w/ automatic transmission Leather and sunroof
I looked at the following:
Nissan Altima VW Passat Honda Accord Toyota Camry Saturn L300
Ended up buying the Saturn as they were offering 0% financing (hey, who doesn't like free money?).
Why the V6? I wanted the smoothness of the 6-cyl engine. I had been driving 4-cylinder cars for some time ('98 VW New Beetle) and was tired of the buzzing at highway speeds. Fuel economy wasn't a priority at the time.
It sounds like Honda is actually increasing the production of manual transmsision Accords and I can't understand why they would do this?
Every year I was in the business, I watched demand drop for sticks. They just didn't sell well.
Some very vocal people asked..." Why won't Honda build V-6 sedans with six speed manuals?"
So Honda did produce some. Without asking, they sent our store two of them.
We wer the highest volume Honda store in nine states and after a year, we still had both of them. One finally sold and we got rid of the other one on a dealer trade.
Honda has either lost their minds or else they know something I sure don't know.
Nice truck andre! I pulled up the Dodge Ram site and they are showing the ST and Tradesman with black grills, the Tradesman has the upgraded wheels like you have. Do you have the built-in tool box on the side of the bed? It looked like a standard item on the site.
Enjoy your new truck! Mark156
2010 Land Rover LR4, 2013 Honda CR-V, 2009 Bentley GTC, 1990 MB 500SL, 2001 MB S500, 2007 Lincoln TC, 1964 RR Silver Cloud III, 1995 MB E320 Cab., 2015 Prevost Liberty Coach
The Camcord 4 cylinder drive trains are pretty smooth. Not like the old days. Getting what you like is the most important thing .
10 years later, my priorities have shifted. I now work from home and use my car sparingly (local errand running and part time pizza delivery). My priorities now are good gas mileage and decent utility.
I have a crossover (2010 Mazda CX-7) that is used for family duty.
I'm one of those guys who for tears was saying "Where's the 6 cyl sedan with a stick?" When they came out I wasn't in the market and when I went looking later for a used one they were scarce as hens' teeth.
Such is life. They had a good reason for not offering them.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
Thanks Mark! Unfortunately, no tool-box on mine...I feel deprived now! Now that I think about it, my uncle was looking it over yesterday to see if it had a tool box, so maybe it's a common thing on Dodges? Or was, at least?
Oh, so you're one of the guys who pined for a V-6 sedan with a stick but somehow "weren't in the market" when Honda finally relented and against the advice of their dealers decided to build some.
Shame on you! :P
Yeah, they did have a "good reason" for not offering them....they don't sell!
Now, it looks like they didn't learn their lesson very well!
When I was 17 my dad realized over that summer we'd be a two car family with four drivers so he bought this old 56 ( think) Crown Vic with a Thunderbird V8 in it and basically told my brother and I to sort it out.
That car was your basic rocket in a plain brown wrapper.
I remember one evening stopping for a red light in an extremely familiar place next to some guy a Mustang. He starts revving his engine in a "watch me leave you in the dust" mode. Well, being me I look over his car and figure there's no way this guy can beat me if I pay attention. So the second the light turned green I was off like a shot and he was none too happy. Started tailing me. I take a turn or two to make sure that he's indeed following me and drove into the next town where there were loads of little streets to lose him and did so.
Good thing he wasn't better at following because my next step would be to drive to the police station which might have kept my body in one piece but hardly seemed like a good idea under the circumstances.
This is a real rarity. It's not every day I have a racing story.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
You are bored with a loaded 2012 528i?!? Sorry to say it, but I think you are a little bit crazy? Maybe you should drive a little faster around the corners??
Have you driven an F10 528i? I got one for a loaner and this is what I wrote about it:
I absolutely despise the steering- it is so devoid of feel that it belongs in a Buick or Lexus. And the sled is also quite porky, of course. My 1975 2002 and 1995 Club Sport 3er are exponentially more fun to drive than this bloated 5er.
My wife's response?
"It's a boat; I want my X3 back."
These comments come from a couple that have owned 10 Bimmers over the last 30 years- and currently have four in the garage.
Which is a roundabout way of saying, "Yes, the F10 528i IS boring."
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
is that it has gotten too big and porky, heavy, 3.5L! They need to go back to the smaller and lighter 3.0 V6 VTEC and just fine tune that sucker to get more power and economy from it.
It was quick and powerful on its feet. I enjoyed that engine a lot in my '03 Accord LX V6 coupe. The 4 cylinder didn't do anything for me, then again, I wasn't going to put up with a stick in San Diego traffic.
'18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
I say "bored" as the way it drives compared to my previous gen E60 is so different, less engaging, more artificial. Its very capable and I'm getting better mileage and like some of the new features I didn't have before. But they have really made the new 528i so artificial feeling. I had read this in reviews and such and drove the car and but it seemed fine. I was under pressure as my lease had only a few days left and I wasn't able to do all of the cross shopping and test driving as in the past. I mention the others as they are likely much less expensive and different. Thanks for listening!
LOL, wut? The 3.5 in the 2013 Accord gets 34 MPG highway, which is way higher than the EPA rating on the 3.0. I haven't driven a V6 Accord in recent memory, but that same engine is very capable in the Acura TL.
I don't think there are many who share this opinion, but I think Honda has stayed true to their roots as a "motor company." Their four cylinder engines are noticeably smoother than Toyota's or Nissan's.
In the long run, I think 3.0+ liter displacement family sedans and coupes are doomed. The EPA requirements, as well as market demand due to higher gas prices, will force a transition to smaller displacement turbo engines.
I thought one could [ in such a circumstance ] if pressed for time, extend a current BMW lease??? - Ray Current BMW lease running out in a year, or so.....
In the long run, I think 3.0+ liter displacement family sedans and coupes are doomed. The EPA requirements, as well as market demand due to higher gas prices, will force a transition to smaller displacement turbo engines.
Sadly, I think you're right, and it really is a shame, because the V-6 engines have gotten so powerful, yet are economical when they need to be. In many cases, the 4-cyl really doesn't save you that much fuel, anyway. For instance, with the Camry, according to the EPA's variables, the 4-cyl will cost around $2100 per year in fuel, compared to $2350 for the V-6.
With the Altima, the gap is a bit larger...$1900 for the 4-cyl, $2350 for the V-6. And the Accord is about the same: $1950 for the 4, $2350 for the V-6.
Over time, the 4-cyl engines will keep getting better and more powerful. But, I just worry about all that high-tech stuff as it ages. I guess if you buy new/newish and trade before it gets too old, that's no big deal. But I tend to keep cars until they die or get totaled.
I know it's not supposed to be a sports car, but whenever I go to the auto shows, one of my favorite cars to sit in is the 7-Series. It's big, cushy, and luxurious...adjectives that you'd think would be more apropos to a late 60's Fleetwood 60-Special than a brand advertised as "The Ultimate Driving Machine" :P
The 7 series is really nice inside. The owner of the company I work for has one and I've ridden in it a few times. Huge back seat, probably the biggest out in the marketplace (except for maybe a Town Car "L").
It rides very nice and technology everywhere. I guess for 100 large it should.
I took a short drive in a 535i, I think it was. Not a fan of the engine response, it hesitates before it really gets going. Then I drove a 550GT and all was forgiven, but the price tag started with a $7. :surprise:
It wasn't a long enough test drive to really sample the steering.
Oh well, there's always CPO. Also, when BMW errs, they usually address the issue within a model year or two.
Comments
OK, so you're bored with a 528i, can I ask why? Bored driving a capable car in slow traffic, or do you want even more capability?
I ask because a lot of the alternatives you mention are likely more boring than what you have now, save for a properly equipped A4 or 3 series.
Unless you'd prefer to drive a slow car fast?
Watch it, now. The tax law allows that interest to be written off only if the prinicpal was used to upgrade your primary residence.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
If you really think you need that much more power than the V-6 is the way to go. for myself, the 4 cylinder is more than adequate.
But...that's me. I don't pass people on two lane highways or live in Denver where the thin air saps power.
Just think, for about $3000 more you could have gotten a base Prius C with no options.
Parking the Ram outside does make the house look better.
Funny, I was just about to say that! Plus, if I drive it to Home Depot a few times and buy something for the house, does that count as upgrading the primary residence?
And, there's just something about the effortlessness that a V-6 goes about its business. Often with the 4-cyl you have to really floor it and wind the snot out of them to get good acceleration, whereas with the V-6 you just tap it and go, without all that straining.
Although, if I was shopping for a modern midsized car, I'd probably be happy with most 4-cyl engines. And even with something like a Charger, I'm sure I'd be happy with the V-6 they use in it, versus the Hemi.
For commuting and around town, smaller engines tend to be just fine.
0-60 with 1 foot of rollout (sec.) .. 7.5 ... 6.1
1/4-mile (sec. @ mph) ..........15.8 @ 91.2... 14.3 @ 98.1
- Edmunds tests of 2013 Accords
So get the manual, it virtually ties the V6, would have less weight over the front axle so probably handles and brakes better, too.
These sets of test #s are both for automatics,
and from the same source...
At the time, I was pretty much focused on the following attributes:
Mid sized sedan
V6 w/ automatic transmission
Leather and sunroof
I looked at the following:
Nissan Altima
VW Passat
Honda Accord
Toyota Camry
Saturn L300
Ended up buying the Saturn as they were offering 0% financing (hey, who doesn't like free money?).
Why the V6? I wanted the smoothness of the 6-cyl engine. I had been driving 4-cylinder cars for some time ('98 VW New Beetle) and was tired of the buzzing at highway speeds. Fuel economy wasn't a priority at the time.
Ended up with a 626 ES V6. A Probe sedan, sorta.
For the extra cost and fuel costs, I see no real use for the V-6 over the 4 cyl.
But, that's me!
Every year I was in the business, I watched demand drop for sticks. They just didn't sell well.
Some very vocal people asked..." Why won't Honda build V-6 sedans with six speed manuals?"
So Honda did produce some. Without asking, they sent our store two of them.
We wer the highest volume Honda store in nine states and after a year, we still had both of them. One finally sold and we got rid of the other one on a dealer trade.
Honda has either lost their minds or else they know something I sure don't know.
Sporty side of mainstream, of course.
Enjoy your new truck!
Mark156
10 years later, my priorities have shifted. I now work from home and use my car sparingly (local errand running and part time pizza delivery). My priorities now are good gas mileage and decent utility.
I have a crossover (2010 Mazda CX-7) that is used for family duty.
Now, this is the Seattle market where we have a lot of traffic and hills. I'm sure sticks sell better in other parts of the country.
Still, not THAT much better I wouldn't think!
Such is life. They had a good reason for not offering them.
Shame on you! :P
Yeah, they did have a "good reason" for not offering them....they don't sell!
Now, it looks like they didn't learn their lesson very well!
It never ends.
Looks like a BHPH Pot Lot but that doesn't make it a "bad" car. It would need an extreme looking over though.
WTH is that hanging on the rear bumper?
Now is your chance Steve!
Funny thing that. Probably my two favorite cars were 6 cyl automatics but if you asked what I normally like I'd say 4 cyl sticks.....
A guy in a turbo PT Cruiser tried beating me to a lane closure the other day.
He won't try again I don't think.
That car was your basic rocket in a plain brown wrapper.
I remember one evening stopping for a red light in an extremely familiar place next to some guy a Mustang. He starts revving his engine in a "watch me leave you in the dust" mode. Well, being me I look over his car and figure there's no way this guy can beat me if I pay attention. So the second the light turned green I was off like a shot and he was none too happy. Started tailing me. I take a turn or two to make sure that he's indeed following me and drove into the next town where there were loads of little streets to lose him and did so.
Good thing he wasn't better at following because my next step would be to drive to the police station which might have kept my body in one piece but hardly seemed like a good idea under the circumstances.
This is a real rarity. It's not every day I have a racing story.
The 271 HP high performance 289 that was available in 1965 Mustangs were a handful to beat!
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/1209_2013_honda_accord_first_test/vie- wall.html#ixzz27QVPn4za
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Have you driven an F10 528i? I got one for a loaner and this is what I wrote about it:
I absolutely despise the steering- it is so devoid of feel that it belongs in a Buick or Lexus. And the sled is also quite porky, of course.
My 1975 2002 and 1995 Club Sport 3er are exponentially more fun to drive than this bloated 5er.
My wife's response?
"It's a boat; I want my X3 back."
These comments come from a couple that have owned 10 Bimmers over the last 30 years- and currently have four in the garage.
Which is a roundabout way of saying, "Yes, the F10 528i IS boring."
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
It was quick and powerful on its feet. I enjoyed that engine a lot in my '03 Accord LX V6 coupe. The 4 cylinder didn't do anything for me, then again, I wasn't going to put up with a stick in San Diego traffic.
Sounds like they have messed up this generation.
I don't think there are many who share this opinion, but I think Honda has stayed true to their roots as a "motor company." Their four cylinder engines are noticeably smoother than Toyota's or Nissan's.
In the long run, I think 3.0+ liter displacement family sedans and coupes are doomed. The EPA requirements, as well as market demand due to higher gas prices, will force a transition to smaller displacement turbo engines.
if pressed for time,
extend a current BMW lease???
- Ray
Current BMW lease running out in a year, or so.....
Sadly, I think you're right, and it really is a shame, because the V-6 engines have gotten so powerful, yet are economical when they need to be. In many cases, the 4-cyl really doesn't save you that much fuel, anyway. For instance, with the Camry, according to the EPA's variables, the 4-cyl will cost around $2100 per year in fuel, compared to $2350 for the V-6.
With the Altima, the gap is a bit larger...$1900 for the 4-cyl, $2350 for the V-6. And the Accord is about the same: $1950 for the 4, $2350 for the V-6.
Over time, the 4-cyl engines will keep getting better and more powerful. But, I just worry about all that high-tech stuff as it ages. I guess if you buy new/newish and trade before it gets too old, that's no big deal. But I tend to keep cars until they die or get totaled.
It rides very nice and technology everywhere. I guess for 100 large it should.
I actually preferred it to the S550 I rode in.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
I took a short drive in a 535i, I think it was. Not a fan of the engine response, it hesitates before it really gets going. Then I drove a 550GT and all was forgiven, but the price tag started with a $7. :surprise:
It wasn't a long enough test drive to really sample the steering.
Oh well, there's always CPO. Also, when BMW errs, they usually address the issue within a model year or two.
2024 Audi Q8 e-tron - 2017 911 C4S - 2025 BRZ - 2023 A6 Allroad - 2024 Genesis GV60 - 2019 Cayman