Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

nyccarguy

I think that's a smart move on your part. I know you guys had good luck with that escort you bought for $1000, but when you bought it used car values weren't as crazy high as they are right now. Let us know what she ends up with. Plus it will add to the 2013 punch list

nyccarguy

You are probably right stick. Not smart to give a teenager a 22 year old Even driving my Prelude as little as I do, I'll definitely put 50K on it in the next 9 years.

I'm most likely going to go with option #2 which is buy a cheap, fun, new car maybe 2 years before he starts driving. Something like a Civic Si. Although son #1 has been OBSESSED with Mini Coopers since he was 2.

nyccarguy

You really can't beat some of these cheapo lease deals out there. Especially since you barely drive and your son is going to need something dependable for job interviews/work. I know you are "1 phone call away" from being fed up with the TL.

I was getting gas at Costco a few weeks ago and noticed the girl behind me pulled up in a new Jetta. The Costco guy recognized her as a regular and asked "What happened, no more Infiniti?" She replied, "No, no more Infiniti, but for $217/month I like it."

I know leasing is expensive, but in your case or Jolie's case, it is cheap & reliable transportation at a fixed cost.

tjc78

Unloved by many, but This is a lot of car for 13,500. These ex rental 2011s are being blown out really cheaply.

suydam

I would be a little leery about leasing a car for a teen because they are prone to make mistakes. And if not them, their friends. Every car my teens had had dents in it from the high school or college lots. But with the high cost of used cars these days I see why it is difficult to find a beater that isn't a death trap. No wonder so many 20-something's don't have cars. Only 1 of mine does and he is still driving the car he got after the Navy -- a '98 Buick.

nyccarguy

That would make an awesome beater car. Especially if you consider what else that 13,500 buys you nowadays. You know it will last. Even the wheels are decent looking and don't scream "EX-RENTAL!"

nyccarguy

my 2nd car was actually a cheap lease. Back in 1998 before I graduated college, my 1992 Chevrolet Beretta GT was giving me lots of problems (AC/Window that kept falling off the track/2nd camshaft loeb that wore down). My parents leased me (as a graduation gift) a 1998 Ford Explorer Sport. Black/Grey Leather, 4.0L V6, 5 Speed Automatic, 6 Disc CD Changer, 4WD, Dealer Installed Sunroof, 16" Chrome Wheels... for 2 years. It was a "one pay" lease and I think cost $6,500 or $7,000. Worked out great. At the time (after my Beretta), that was about as long as I wanted to own an American Car for anyway. It worked out great because my parents used it an an extra car when I moved into the city & I always had something to drive if I wanted to go away or just visit someone who lived outside the city.

akangl

I would be a little leery about leasing a car for a teen because they are prone to make mistakes.

Yes they are, but I am lucky and have a very careful teenager. Both of my kids are obsessively careful. My son had the escort for almost 2 years and up until the snowmobile got it, he didn't put a mark on it. Neither did his friends. He always parked far away from everyone and they knew better than to mess with his car. Daughter is the same way, guess they learned that from me. The rules are no driving to school unless there is an after school activity, no driving anywhere without permission, and only 1 tank of gas every 2 weeks. Any tickets or contact with police results in loss of car for 2 months. Any recklessness results in permanent loss of car. Those rules worked well with my son. He treats his Elantra exactly how he was taught.

suydam

Mine were extremely careful and responsible too. But they are inexperienced and that can lead to mistakes. Mine had to drive to school because our district abolished busing. Worst dent occurred in college for my youngest. I was visiting and we came back from a concert so she could drive me to the hotel. Some drunken student had slid on the ice and put a huge dent in the passenger door. I just looked at her and said, "It's an old car. Just adds character." She drove it like that until we sold it 5 years later.

jpp75

Agreed, you can't do much better for that price. Solid car and based on history you can get a lot of miles out of them.

nyccarguy

I actually saw a Mercury Marauderer (sp?) in really good shape one day last week. The Black, The Dual Exhausts, The 5 Spoke wheels really make that car cool.

stickguy

I like the color. That is about it. I could never own or drive one of those.

and man, does that baby scream antiquated. The 90's live on!

ohenryx

$13,500, plus sales tax of 6.25% in Texas, tax is $843.75. Plus doc fees, etc, probably put you at about $1100 on top of the $13,500.

So let's say you finance the whole thin, including TT&L, and get a really good rate of 2.5% (very good rate for a used car). Your monthly payments are going to run $413.98 for 36 months. Total out of pocket for the 3 year period is $14,903. The residual value I'm figuring at $7,647. To arrive at that number, I took the trade in value of a 2008 Crown Vic with similar equipment, clean, with 70k miles. The car presently has 34k miles, and I'm figuring on 12k miles per year.

So $14,903 minus residual value of $7,647 leaves you with a cost of $7,256 to own the Crown Vic for 3 years (plus any upkeep or repairs).

The Jetta will cost you $199 per month for 39 months, with nothing up front, as I understand it. So the cost of the lease is $7,761. Putting 36k miles on a new Jetta, you will probably never replace the tires. The Crown Vic looks like it will need tires fairly soon. And the warranty is going to expire in less than 2k miles, so ...

I think the Crown Vic would wind up costing a little more, what with new tires, etc, but the difference would probably be negligible. I guess it comes down to, would you rather drive the Crown Vic or the Jetta, and would you rather spend twice as much per month and have the residual value?

akangl

Just did an electronic payment and paid off hubby's Focus. Now just have to wait a few months to punch the old CCBA card.

andre1969

and, in a Borg-like way, has been assimilated. Here's what he ended up with...


It's a 2013 Camry LE, and I think it MSRP'ed for around $24,412, including a power seat, floor mats, and freight. I think he got it for around $22,500, out the door with tax, tags and everything. Oh, and they even gave him $2000 in trade for his ratted 2003 Corolla CE with 225,000 miles on it!

I drove it around a bit a couple hours ago, and as much of a generic yawn-fest the Camry is stereotyped as being, it's actually not a bad car. And I love the color. Its blue reminds me a bit of my first car, a 1980 Malibu.

stickguy

not a bad deal, and certainly a heck of a step up from a Corolla. Camry's bore me, but I despise a Corolla. Uncomfortable, horrid little beast.

jayrider

A big plus is all the safety features -- airbags all around, esc,antilocks etc. There really aren't any "bad" cars if you stick to the major domestics and asian brands when it comes to mid size sedans.

corvette

I don't care for the "powder blue" color, but that car has a lot of equipment for the money. Good for another 225,000 miles, at least!

Jack Baruth at TTAC tested a Camry LE and a Camry SE on different racetracks, and was very impressed with the tautness of the SE, but the reviews of both cars were positive overall.

Sandman6472

Looks pretty nice...much better than the last generation.

http://www.autoblog.com/photos/2014-mazda3-on-top-gear-russia/#photo-6010258/

I'm gonna do all I can to get one of these to replace her '05 model!

The Sandman :sick: :shades:

Sandman6472

Looks nice and for folks like him...and my wife who look at a car as just an appliance to get them where they need to go in relative comfort, this is the perfect vehicle! Think he also gets the 1st two years of scheduled maintenance included and they do dry with no drama...what's not to like! For the rest of us, think we'd be bored to tears with one and at least for me, I'd only look at the XLE or possibly the SE as I'd want some extra goodies. But especially here, she needs it to start every time she turns the key and for the a/c to be blowing out cold air, styling isn't something that's noticed or cared for in the least. And the easier it drives, the better which is one thing that her Mazda does in spades! Since day 1 she's commented on how easy it is to drive and to get into and out of parking spaces...those are the two things she looks at in every vehicle she tries...if those two criteria are met, she's a happy camper and can live with most anything else, unless color, as I did find out while buying her silver 3. They had that "unusual" purple color on the lot, ans "S" model identical to the one we have now but they just couldn't move it. Personally, it wasn't that bad actually, it was different that's all and people did notice it. She said no way even as the salesguy knocked off $250...then $500...then $750! I'm going nuts inside but she wouldn't have it. So we settled on the dark titanium. Three days later they bring in the silver thinking we'd cave and to be honest, she really liked it so she bought it.

Point here is that to most folks their vehicles are an appliance that they must have which is totally understandable. I just want mine with a bit more...just like the rest of us in here! And sadly, work has dried up tremendously! Was called in only once this week after someone didn't show up and have heard through the grapevine that only 5 folks worked a couple of hours on Wednesday. Am unhappy and I really feel for the one's who have this gig as their only source of income. Nothing else out there and I might need to become creative soon!

The Restless Sandman :surprise: :sick: :shades:

fintail

Nice color! I'll admit I notice the light blue Camrys. Also good line about being assimilated. The cult got to my mother several years ago, and she too stepped up from a Corolla. She's still happy with her appliance.

And as boring as that thing is, it's a lot of machine for the money, it will hold its value while probably being reliable.

andre1969

Nice color! I'll admit I notice the light blue Camrys. Also good line about being assimilated.

Yeah, it's funny how sometimes a color that you like can make all the difference in the world on a car. And, I think my uncle is trying to get me assimilated as well. He said that the dealer also had a pretty green Camry on their lot!

nyccarguy

You are 100% correct Fintail! Boring cars sell & like you said, can sometimes be a lot of car for the money. Auto manufacturers have even stepped up their game and injected just a hint of sportiness to make boring cars not so boring. The same thing with economy cars. Growing up in the '80s & starting to drive in the early '90's economy car used to mean "crap box."

I saw some crazy cheap screamer ads in the NY papers yesterday:

2013 Chrysler Town & Country with LTHR, NAV, & DVD with an MSRP of $31K - $0 down lease/10K miles per year/24 Months - $119 per month plus tax. Now this is from MAJOR WORLD who advertises like crazy on the radio & in print, so there has to be something shady about this deal, but still

A VW Passat S with a stick for $192/ month for 39 months w/ 10K per year sign & drive + Tax

A 2013 Nissan Maxima S with an MSRP of $33,950 for $24,990. Almost $9K off sticker.

mark156

Well, we actually drove the motorhome w/Honda attached 'over da bridge' back in 2008 when we drove ALL the way around Lake Superior into Michigan.

I can go 1,200 miles to a tank in the motorhome (if I drove it to empty) so we didn't have to buy fuel in Canada. It was $5.34 a gallon for diesel at that time and $4.99 in the USA.

Mark156

breld

Hi Breld, what kind of motorhomes were you looking at? We've been 'motorhoming' for 6.5 yrs. now (2008 Monaco Dynasty). Currently on a trip in Michigan. Our odometer just turned over 60,000 miles.

So, I've been 'eye-balling' a new one. They have two on display at the the RV park that we are staying in. Both are 2014 Newmars.... one was $903,000 MSRP and other in the $700,000 range. Makes mine look even better! LOL!

Well, we know nothing about them, so we were just intrigued enough to go look and learn a little bit. I paid little attention to the brands or models, just thought more in terms of size. We looked at some yesterday and liked one particular model for its efficiency with a relatively small size (I think it was 28'?). It was a "Thor Motorcoach" brand. Sadly, compared to some others we looked at, it seemed like a relatively good price at about $100k! :surprise:

My wife really would like to try an RV trip sometime, so I see a future rental sometime in the next year or two. That will give me time to summon up the courage to actually drive one.

stever

That's pretty good range. :shades: We've done most of that loop but it took a few years.

stickguy

not really that bad driving something big. You get used to the size pretty quick, and learn to plan ahead.

I put a lot of miles in a 28' box big mama diesel Freightliner box truck from Ryder, carting the HS marching band gear around. That baby filled up a lane! But, darned thing drove like a big (and slow) Buick. at least when loaded.

The International I had sometimes was even more carlike to drive. But very bouncy.

I am sure the motorcoach is a lot more smooth. And unless you get into the big pusher class like Mark has, no where near as big as a FS truck.

fintail

We both grew up in the same era - looking back on the early 90s when we started driving, and the cars kids had then (heck, when I'd take the Tempo to school, people thought it was nice!), things look pretty good today. Andre's uncle just wants a comfortable reliable commuter. The Camry is a good answer, especially for ~20K - when 20 years ago, the same thing still would have cost 15K in those dollars.

I'd have thought a nice T&C would be more expensive - my dad's cost more than that in 1997. Maybe there is a catch - 0 down, but a big "trade in". A local dealer tried playing that game once, offering cars with insane low payments - a 30K car for 99/month etc. Fine print read "25K down or trade", seriously.

Manual Passat, that can't be common. Maxima is getting old and is a rental favorite these days, I am sure deals can be found for those. I'd expect some blowout prices on leftover 2013 Lexus IS and Infiniti G, too.

fintail

Oh, I can't see you joining that club just yet.

Although, if I had a long commute, kids, etc, I wouldn't have any problem with a boring mainstream car - especially some of the better ones today. I drive a relatively small mileage (easily under 10K between both cars), so I can have the car as more than an appliance - but I think once you drive enough, it really becomes just a transportation tool.

That reminds me, I am at about 5 months into my car now - I am used to it. There's no way I am going to hit the 10K mileage limit, I wonder if that will help me in any way at the end of the term (I am doubting I will buy it).

breld

There's a good quote in this month's Road & Track from one of their editorial articles. It's basically about the editor's experience owning and selling his 1989 M3. In it, he states:

"If you are a person of limited means and want to try a variety of cars, you have to embrace turnover."

It's like the mantra of this group.

breld

That Road & Track issue also has an interesting comparison between a 2008 328i and a 2012 328i.

Just last week, I had a new 328i as a loaner while the wife's wagon was in service. I'll spare the details of my impressions, as they are overall similar to nyccarguy's well written account of his own loaner experience. Overall, I enjoyed the pull of the new turbo 4, but it certainly comes at the expense of a nice exhaust note and some character. The interior is a bit roomier, but overall just seems different, not necessarily better.

The article, not surprisingly, preferred the 2008 328i over the 2012, citing the steering, a better quality interior, and its "musical" straight-six. What was a bit surprising was that the 2008 was a basic model, while the 2012 had the sport package. At the end of the article, the writer said they hopped into a post-facelift, sport package E90 and it was "no contest."

I appreciate the F30 and may have one some day, but am more than happy to hold on to my 2011 335i for now (and you'd have to pry the keys of the 328i wagon from my wife's hands).

corvette

"There's no way I am going to hit the 10K mileage limit, I wonder if that will help me in any way at the end of the term (I am doubting I will buy it)."

I think that's unlikely. Start planning some road trips!

corvette

"...2008 328i over the 2012..."

Yeah, and I like the way an E39/E46/E90 drives, but at some point, you have to get something newer and more dependable (even if it lacks the je ne sais quoi of the older car).

nyccarguy

The fact that ordinary cars are so much better today than when we started driving is going to make my "next car" decision that much harder. I'm not going to buy my BMW out at the end of its lease. 2011 328xis are currently trading on the auction block for what my car's stated residual will be about 14 months from now.

Like I've said, there's nothing that WOWs me. So I might just do "ordinary" for a few years. There's the Accord Sport (old faithful), the CR-V EX-L (it'll ALWAYS be worth more than what I owe). There's the aging Maxima (early '00 GM style $10K off sticker discounts), the soon to be replaced Acura TL (next year will have lots of rebates and maybe some conquest cash + cheap financing. Heck, even MB has been known to throw large cash incentives + conquest cash + cheap financing at slow selling models (a guy here on TH got $5K off sticker of his GLK 250 Blue Tec). Speaking of diesels, for under $30K a Chevrolet Cruz Diesel might be hard to beat.

nyccarguy

If used car values continue to stay at their high levels, your E350 BlueTec might be worth more than the lease end residual value. So you could actually have some equity in it as if you financed the car.

nyccarguy

I'm glad you appreciate my writings and ramblings;)

And we've got very similar tastes in how cars drive.

michaellno

Here's my .02 on the subject.

Some of us here have 'fun' cars, others don't. If you've got a 'fun' car for special occasions, I don't see any problems with having a 'boring' car as your DD.

If you aren't able to have a separate 'fun' car, then your DD should have some fun built into its personality.

nyccarguy

Agreed. Since I've got the Prelude which is a BLAST, then boring might as well be what the doctor ordered for my DD.

What's going on with your DIL BTW?

mark156

I'm in Michigan attending my nephews wedding. His father-in-law, who is only 3 yrs. older than me, has a 1955 Buick 4 door sedan, Sea Foam Green (repainted in '94), original interior, dynaflow transmission, 38,000 miles.... gorgeous car! Nothing like good American iron!

There was also a 1955 Ford Fairlane convertible, bright red, tan leather, excellent condition to be part of the photo shoot for the young couple.

Mark156

michaellno

What's going on with your DIL BTW?

Been busy the past week or so around here ...

DIL has been diagnosed with cancer (ALK positive anaplastic large cell lymphoma, to be precise).

They have moved in with us and will see an oncologist here in Denver next week to figure out treatment options.

What we've read on this type of cancer is that it responds well to chemo and radiation, with high levels of long term remission. Only 1500 people are diagnosed with it each year in the US.

To keep this car-related, the kids drive an '07 Caliber R/T (silver, to match the CX-7 and the MINI).

michaellno

So, since my only car is the '06 ION, I should immediately replace it with something more 'fun'.

Like sandy, I've got to get the wife on board. If the budget allowed, I'd go for either a new GTI or a used 128i.

stickguy

Sorry to hear about the DIL. But, at least you know and can move forward. Sometimes the unknown is the worst part.

and having personal experience with the "mixed message (you have the big C, but it is one that is treatable with a good remission rate) I wish her the best of luck. The doctors really can do amazing things with the drugs and tech these days.

stickguy

if you drove an Ion that many years/miles, you should not only get a new car, you should get a medal.

something new but reasonably priced seems like a reasonable idea.

roadburner

Agreed. Since I've got the Prelude which is a BLAST, then boring might as well be what the doctor ordered for my DD.

I have to disagree, I follow the mantra of fellow Kentuckian the late David E. Davis Jr.- No boring cars! While I don't require that every car in my garage be electrifying, I DO want each car to be at least somewhat entertaining to drive.

stickguy

you can get a modicum of fun even in a "boring" responsible car. A Mazda 6 say for a good size 4 door sedan that is still somewhat of a driver's car. Among other options.

I also think you probably have more of a chance for driving on driver's routes. I know where Bradd spends most of his time, and it is some hideous roads and traffic. From that standpoint, I can see where he is coming from.

you just drive a little Japanese econobox anyway, so who are you to talk!

fintail

I think about the same thing - although my lease is not up for some time, the day will come, and I will have a decision to make. The expense of this new car isn't too irksome, but it might be a bit frivolous. Would I be as happy in an Accord or something normal like that? I might. I already have a hobby car for fun. Or do I even want a new car? Some MBs of the 80s and 90s still turn my head more than most new cars...and with the E55 money slowly but surely growing, I could buy one outright. But two old cars might be asking for headaches. And I like the lease ideal, I get to experience newness with no strings and no risk, and often a subsidized price - and it will keep me from being a hoarder. It'll be a tough choice, although if we have the C diesel by then (or better yet, a diesel hybrid), I will probably be looking hard at it.

The TL might be cheap, but you have to look at it :P

I don't know if low miles will give me anything extra - I think the lease is pretty subsidized, and real world values will be lower than their residual. I do know my OCD tendencies will help at the end of the term, the car will be spotless.

akangl

I succumbed to temptation today and drove a 2013 Equinox, while I hated it, it did get me thinking about how nice a fuel efficient SUV would be. Something like a new Escape or CR-V. I cringe every time I fuel Chippy up, $90 gets me about 350 miles in the summer. I've been putting off the next service since I know it will be about $155 because with all the dust this summer an air filter is a given. Just bought shocks yesterday and need to get them put on plus an alignment.

I do really love my truck but I'm trying to convince myself a small SUV would be easier with the baby and all. Believe me, dealers are hoping I'll give Chippy up, an immaculate, low mileage Duramax is a mythical truck here it seems.

There, the confession is out. Must have something to do with paying off the Focus........ :sick:

I miss my '07 Pilot.

tifighter

Before we all take dates (1st to call begin of Aug, BTW), remind me, don't you use this thing to tow a trailer?

akangl

Before we all take dates (1st to call begin of Aug, BTW), remind me, don't you use this thing to tow a trailer?

We sold the trailer a little over a week ago, didn't need it anymore and couldn't see letting it just sit. So, sold it and paid off the Focus. Now my truck is pretty much just a family vehicle with an occasional dump run or Home Depot trip. Ugh, I wish I could keep Chippy and lease a small SUV but not with having to buy the kid a car in a couple months.

rayainsw

Labor Day