Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous

andres3

I am in the you can't have too much power camp. I mean, I'm able to press the accelerator partially, and not at full throttle to varying degrees. Now if you mean too much power for full throttle; perhaps, but I can't see that happening often with cars today.

andres3

I suggest driving the fun and fast car fast, quick, and swiftly, just don't get caught by the tax revenue generators.

ohenryx

I would agree that there is such a thing as too much horsepower. But I've never owned one, only read about them. (smile)

nyccarguy

I had an absolute blast driving my Prelude today;). Lots of fun, not a lot of hp.

Mr_Shiftright

Well drive a Viper at serious speeds and you may change your mind, to say nothing of probably changing your direction of travel in a split second.

If the HP is so much that you can't press on the gas for fear of it, then really, the car is rather pointless unless you are racing.

michaellno

Really? You posted that here?

Almost everyone on this board is gonna flood the inbox with their stories.

Shouldn't that be pr@edmunds.com?

EDIT - ok, why isn't the at-sign showing up? grrrr

jayrider

If you have a powerful ride and you have the skills, reaction time, and common sense to deal with it, I can see no problems. If you drive your Ferrari like a Kia Soul, no problem there either. Mix immaturity with poor attention span and a sense of grandiosity --- might be an issue.

stever

We mask the "at" sign to try to foil spambots.

michaellno

We mask the "at" sign to try to foil spambots.

Ah, good to know!

stever

No idea if it does much good but it sure makes legit users stumble and wonder why their email bounces.

Sandman6472

Guess the Mazda will be staying in the stable a bit longer...replaced the battery yesterday and will fix the a/c when it goes soon. She won't hear of getting a new ride now, no way...no how! Was in the car for dinner and settings 1 & 2 are just warm air with the a/c light off but 3 & 4 blow cold with the light on. A a/c guy said it's possibly a sensor or something but he has to look at it. I said we should just bite the bullet and fix it now...she wants to wait till it goes out completely. Silly, silly idea but hey...it's her car!

The Sandman :sick: :shades:

Mr_Shiftright

"If you have a powerful ride and you have the skills, reaction time, and common sense to deal with it"....

Aside from common sense, which quite a few people do have, that statement otherwise excludes about 99.9% of anyone who walks into a showroom and buys a 550 HP car.

As we used to say at the speed shop: "If you're a bad driver with 200 HP, you're going to be a REALLY bad driver with 400"

michaellno

As we used to say at the speed shop: "If you're a bad driver with 200 HP, you're going to be a REALLY bad driver with 400"

Geez, shifty, don't let my wife read that statement!

My Ferrari drive is a week from Saturday, and you're starting to make me a bit nervous. This will be my first high speed event .. the fastest I've gone before that was around 95 or so on US 285 here in Colorado in my old '03 Saturn L300 ..

...downhill.

For about 15 seconds.

tjc78

That has to be the control head in the dashboard. Hopefully your guy get source one from a local junk yard and save you a ton of money.

I probably wouldn't fix that either, I usually keep the A/C cranked up anyway. Now if only speeds 1 and 2 worked that would be a different story.

michaellno

I usually keep the A/C cranked up anyway.

Wimp! :-)

The fan in the ION has 4 settings ... depending on how hot it is, I'll use either 1, 2 or 3. Rarely do I use the top setting.

In the wife's CX-7, I think the fan has 6 or 7 speeds available. Seems too many.

corvette

The HVAC fan in my 2009 Altima (with manual climate control) had an infinitely variable speed control with probably 50 different detents on it, with the lowest one being "off." The detent going in to the lowest selectable fan speed had a larger bump on it, as well, so you could tell you had the fan turned down as low as possible. I loved that, it was one of those little features which made the car feel more expensive than it was.

Mr_Shiftright

Ah, no problem. I was nervous when I took an open-wheel course at Skip Barber but before you know it, triple-digit speeds seemed quite comfortable.

Just remember the golden rule of unfamiliar powerful cars---don't hit the brakes or the gas or the steering wheel very hard if the car is not in a straight line and balanced. Also, wherever your eyes are focused on the road, that's probably where the car will go, too.

Of course, taking too much advice from me will probably get you into lots of trouble, so listen to the pros.

dieselone

"Just remember the golden rule of unfamiliar powerful cars---don't hit the brakes or the gas or the steering wheel very hard if the car is not in a straight line and balanced."

Or driving fast for that matter. I went to a Solo II school several years ago and the instructor told me to pretend their was chain from the steering wheel to the brakes. Basically do your braking before you need to turn and don't ask your tires to do more than one thing at a time (particularly with braking and turning). It worked too, my runs got a lot faster that way.

Mr_Shiftright

A good driver is a SMOOTH driver, I always say. I did 3 days of track time, and I just concentrated on being smooth in all my moves---not on being the "fastest". And by the 3rd day, I was certainly in the top 1/3rd in speed, and got no flags or finger-wags of any kind, nor did I spin.

Of course, the hotshot 18 year olds who grew up in go-carts were faster!

dad23

I joked last week about getting a new ride instead of replacing the tires. I was getting my back side handed to me last night playing Xbox with one of the kids and a message popped up saying his remote lost connectivity, low batteries. I told him we needed to pick up some new ones. He looks over and says, "maybe we should just go get the new blue remote I want!" I might have wiped away a tear or two...

andres3

Smooth also saves tires and brakes.

I got new track pads and front rotors on my A3 and the squealing noise is unbearable, I hope this is only for the first 100 miles or so. I've had performance pads before, and it was a "shhhh" noise, not screeching high pitched metal on metal shreak.

xwesx

Hahahahahaha; oh, dad.... you are in for it!

steine13

>>..she wants to wait till it goes out completely. Silly, silly idea but hey...it's her car!

It may be her car, but it's still both-a-yas money.
You fix AC when it goes soft but before the system goes empty.. then becomes contaminated from the outside when the pressure is gone.. and corrodes and does all sorts of nasty things.

Fix it now.
Everybody's opinion counts... but only if they know what they're talking about...

Cheers -Mathias

tjc78

His problem isn't under the hood it must be in the control panel. Sandy said the A/C light doesn't even come on with speeds 1 or 2 selected but 3/4 work fine.

I just had the receiver/drier spring a leak (why Ford moved it so low to ground I'll never know) and dump all the Freon out in my car. $350 later and I'm cold again. That's not bad in terms of A/C repair.

ronsteve

Clearly, my record doesn't qualify me as a CCB, having driven my current ride for 7 years, the one before it for 5 years, and marrying a bride who would end up going 7 years with her Elantra.

But, we didn't think it was a great idea to have two 7-year-old cars continuing to get old at the same time. Not only that, but with my Volvo at 120K and racking up 18K a year since we moved to Louisville, it was probably time to have something nicer for our long roadtrips, to relieve some of the workload from the V70.

She didn't want another Elantra. The Corolla and Civic were quickly written off as boring. The Ford Focus crossed our minds briefly, but never did draw us into the showroom. We had an Impreza as a rental on a trip last year, and the CVT definitely lagged behind what Nissan has done. So it was down to the Sentra and the Jetta. Nissan has done a good job with the Sentra, to make it a lot less cheap-feeling than many other small cars. But the Jetta just had a much more substantial feel to it, and even if it's not as "nice" as previous generations it still has the better ride quality that seems to go along with the European brands.

Was really surprised at the gaps in product knowledge in some salesmen. The guy at the Nissan dealer didn't realize some Sentras had 4-wheel discs and some didn't. VW salesmen made more than one reference to the DSG even though we were driving a Jetta 2.5SE, which has a 6-speed torque converter automatic.

The bottom line is now that I've gone Euro twice in a row, I may never go back. My Volvo now has a 5-cylinder, European-branded companion in a new 2013 Jetta 2.5SE. Got her at invoice with the 0% financing, and they even went midway between KBB fair and good on the Elantra, even with a noticeable dent in the RR quarter panel where a weed-whacker got dropped on it a few years ago. I was surprised at the trade knowing that Hyundais rarely fetch book, and the number I got matched the high end of a RWTIV estimate when I posted about the car LAST year.

Sandman6472

Just copied and pasted your reply so hopefully she'll listen. The car has been stalling since the new battery was installed and they re-checked everything...alternator, etc. and all is good. Don't think we've ever replaced the spark plugs which might be the culprit, in fact didn't do anything at the 100k mark so think we'll do the plugs and go from there. Would love her to do the a/c also and just keep the vehicle for another year which is her ultimate goal here...keep the vehicle! So spend the $ now and put off the purchase till 2015 and get to 150k. Since I'm just at a tad over 43k now, I'm good to go and unless my boy takes it back to Milwaukee next month, the Civic stays in the herd indefinitely!

The Sandman

corvette

"VW salesmen made more than one reference to the DSG even though we were driving a Jetta 2.5SE, which has a 6-speed torque converter automatic."

LOL. Which dealer? I bought my GLI at Swope in Clarksville, and they really stepped up on my trade in, as well.

Congrats on the new car! I updated the punch list, and we're now at 18 vehicles for the year!

crkyolfrt

Congrats on the new Jetta with the 2.5. I agree totally with your comment about the ride quality and overall tautness of the chassis. I'd add that it is one of the quietest in its class too. I also like that 2.5 both the exhaust note it makes on an aggressive pass, and the 6sp works very well with it. I was impressed more than I thought I would be with both. I know some tend to get on the 2.5's case as being dated by its output compared to some of the comp, but I found in real world, its torque felt greater than the specs suggest. I trust seat-of-the-pants ahead of what is written on paper every time. :thumb up: Enjoy.

rayainsw

.. on the punch!
I was impressed enough by the 2.5L Jetta I rented
this past Spring to try out the GTI.
- Ray
Bought a GTI...

roadburner

VW salesmen made more than one reference to the DSG even though we were driving a Jetta 2.5SE, which has a 6-speed torque converter automatic.

Bachman I suspect? Back in 2007 when I looked at a GTI the sales guy insisted that the car had Brembo brakes. Ummm... no, it just has calipers that are painted red.
Idiot.

ronsteve

Bachman I suspect? Back in 2007 when I looked at a GTI the sales guy insisted that the car had Brembo brakes. Ummm... no, it just has calipers that are painted red.
Idiot.

Yes it was Bachman. We really didn't feel like hauling our butts over to Dixie Highway to shop Huffman or across the river to Swope, for maybe a little bit of money and maybe better product knowledge. Didn't make sense to do that only to likely end up with back-of-the-line treatment in Bachman's service department because we didn't buy there.

ohenryx

I think I would have been tempted to wait for the 2014 Jetta, and the new 1.8T engine.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/2014-volkswagen-jetta-passat-get-new-1-8t-engine-ot- her-vws-get-r-line-trims-and-more/

Jettas, Passats, and Beetles will begin hitting showroom floors this fall with a turbocharged 1.8-liter four-cylinder engine, just about two years after we first broke the story that Volkswagen would be replacing its not-so-awesome inline-five. The new engine produces 170 horsepower and 184 lb-ft of torque, a modest improvement from the 170 and 177 lb-ft delivered by the 2.5-liter five. Fuel economy and refinement should be vastly improved with the 1.8T—which, it bears repeating, is a downsized version of the EA888 2.0T engine in the GTI, and has no relation to the old turbocharged 1.8 from VWs and Audis a decade ago. The 2014 Jetta launches with the new engine, while Passats and Beetles will change over from the 2.5 sometime in early-to-mid 2014.

...

For 2014, all Jettas will come with an independent rear suspension.

...

Volkswagen hasn’t announced fuel economy numbers yet, but according to the EPA website, the Jetta 1.8T will be rated at 26 mpg in the city, 36 on the highway (25 city with the auto). That thoroughly trounces last year’s five-cylinder Jetta—24/31, 23/33 with auto and stick respectively

crkyolfrt

the Jetta 1.8T will be rated at 26 mpg in the city, 36 on the highway (25 city with the auto). That thoroughly trounces last year’s five-cylinder Jetta—24/31, 23/33 with auto and stick respectively

Do you think so? Trounce is a strong word. And let's face it, we all know how quickly a gas turbo can get thirsty when dipping your foot into the turbo too often. They have an intoxicating urge and is hard to discipline one's self at times...just ask any Ford Eco-boost owner..

I am guessing they will allow electronic parameters that will allow it to run on 87 at an urge and slight FE penalty?

michaellno

I'm still helping my best friend in CA with buying a car for his sister. We're pretty sure she's going to get a 2013 Mazda 3 i GT w/ tech package, graphite in color.

Anyway, while looking, they ran across this:

This seems too good to be true

Is it? Carfax shows clean, but 2 owners.

Mr_Shiftright

3 owners actually. It's not that great a deal. I found 22 G35s with miles under 45,000 with an average asking price of $17,000, and some of those were high trim levels with more options. So if we presume that selling price average would be $16,000, an that most of those cars would have some tasty options, this isn't a deal you'd have to jump on.

Mr_Shiftright

friend, well acquaintance, wants to sell me a 1993 GMC Sonoma extended cab pickup, V-6, AC, blah blah, with only 80,000 miles, but at a rather premium price of $3500.

One can buy Sonoma PU in the high 1990s for that price, albeit with 2X or more the miles.

How much are miles worth in a basically fully depreciated vehicle? Really the truck should book out at $2000.

michaellno

Thanks, shifty. I'll pass this info along to my friend. He's currently driving a mid 90's J30 with almost 200K on the clock and thought it might make a good replacement.

breld

Understanding there are incentives and a greater willingness to deal on the outgoing 2013 model, but I'm sure you've suggested to your friend to possibly wait a few weeks for the all new 2014 Mazda3?

corvette

It's the "base" model with no sunroof and no audio controls on the steering wheel. I look for more features in a luxury car. Also, the tires are mismatched (I see one Falken and one Uniroyal).

michaellno

Understanding there are incentives and a greater willingness to deal on the outgoing 2013 model, but I'm sure you've suggested to your friend to possibly wait a few weeks for the all new 2014 Mazda3?

I have .. she's not much of a car person, but her test drive of a Civic EX-L left her cold. Too much noise is what I heard. She also test drove a Buick Encore; don't know the trim level. Of the three, she preferred the Mazda 3.

Remember, she's coming out of a Protege that is at least 10 years old with 220,000 miles. Even the "old" 3 is full of features that she's never been exposed to.

As car guys, I'm sure we'd wait for the refreshed 3 to be available. But to her, not much difference between old and new, other than price.

I'll keep everyone posted.

And, thanks to all who replied on that G35. You all are quite sharp - mismatched tires?

tifighter

Too much noise is what I heard. She also test drove a Buick Encore; don't know the trim level.

Did she drive the Verano? Seems like the cross between a Civic and an Encore, and it is supposed to ace the road noise test.

jayrider

Trucks of any age in good condition sell for 3-4k. Working folks have cash to pay for them and they are very desirable. A beater will cost $1500 and sell easily. The price sounds ok if it runs nice -- bet a dealer would get at least $4500-5000 after a detailing.

michaellno

Did she drive the Verano? Seems like the cross between a Civic and an Encore, and it is supposed to ace the road noise test.

I don't think so, but it is something she should drive. I'll pass that along to my friend.

Mr_Shiftright

Yeah I have to keep that in mind about old trucks...they have a "utility value" beyond what a car of the same age might have.

I don't want some beater--they always end up costing you as much as if you had bought a clean one, and since the cosmetic condition of beaters is generally bad, you don't really get any benefit by repairing them....the old "rebuilt engine/rusted frame" scenario.

michaellno

Did she drive the Verano? Seems like the cross between a Civic and an Encore, and it is supposed to ace the road noise test.

I don't think so, but it is something she should drive. I'll pass that along to my friend.

They did look at the Verano when they were on the Buick lot. She didn't care for it, so they passed on the test drive.

andres3

Speaking of unknowledgeable salesman at car dealerships....

I test drove the 2.0T and 3.6 ATS at Cadillac despite my deeply held belief that the bailouts were wrong. Knowing it was nearly impossible for GM to win my business, I decided to still take a look so I'd be familiar with their latest and greatest offerings.

The sales person tried to tell me he thought the ATS was Front Wheel Drive...... Oh boy!

When I drove it hard, he seemed a little timid (and I don't test drive that hard with them in the car; makes it awkward). But out of all the test drives I did, and I did many, it seemed no one had ever driven a Cadillac that way. The Lexus IS 350 test drive also created that feeling/aura/sensation unspoken of the salesman thinking I was abusing the car (and I'm probably going 6 to 7/10ths around one or two curves just briefly).

I was probably too conservative in the Acura salesperson's eyes for the TL-SH-AWD test drive; partly because a dawdler got in front of me during a freeway ramp exchange.

fintail

I remember I looked at the ATS when they first hit the dealers. Dealer knew about the cars. I was most taken aback by the prices - loaded ones were hitting 50K. Didn't drive it.

I did drive a 2014 IS - the car becomes more appealing inside, when you don't see much of the "styling". The gauges in the F-Sport are cool, and I would have to have an F-sport, the alien maw looks best when it is most brash. The young outgoing salesman actually wanted me to toss it around and drive it hard - took it to a winding road and tried, but traffic kept me from getting too wild.

I remember a few old test drives - when I drove the Bluetec, I think the salesman was surprised at how fast I took an off-ramp corner. When I bought a W126 years ago, I remember the salesman said something about how mellow a driver I am - but a car like that makes one mellow.

andres3

Yes, a lot of the ATS's on the lot (both many '13's and '14's sitting; not a good sign) had MSRP's around $45-51K.

Honestly, the ATS felt and looked like a $30K car to me. Maybe $33K sticker and they sell for real-world $30K price. If they want to know why it's not selling; that's th answer; it's way WAY overpriced.

My test drive of both the F-sport and regular RWD IS350 (2014) left me cold. The car felt devoid of personality or spirit.

I like the interior, and the outside is not bland as you put it (but I agree it's too much). It's quiet, comfortable, luxurious, but when I put the throttle down it was as if they programmed the car to only provide 205 HP instead of 305 HP for the first 1,000 miles (possible break-in period?)? I wasn't getting the feeling that I was driving a very powerful car.

Also, it's not designed for someone much over 6'1", and I'm 6'3" tall. Lastly, switching between regular and sport and sport + modes changed the character unnoticeably to me.

fintail

I wonder what they can be had for. Even if they are every bit as good as the competition (and I am sure they are fine), they are a new entrant, and need to seriously undercut the existing models, all of which have a dedicated fanbase. Otherwise, finding converts won't be easy. 50K buys a lot of ATS, but it buys a lot of C/3er/A4/IS as well.

If only the IS was bland outside, now it is overdone to my eyes. The old one was bland, mostly due to age. I only drove a 250, but I remember it didn't feel particularly fast either, in fact, not any faster than my large diesel car, only smaller and lighter. I am 6'1",but don't remember how I fit - tighter than my car though, for sure. It wasn't engaging in any way - just a nice car, but for the money it should be.

If you want value, the G37, especially once Q50 is widely available, could be a bargain. It's 2007 on the outside and 1997 inside, but they will lease for no more than 300 and maybe less, with a lot of toys. Kind of odd to have a loss leader offering like that. I've seen some good lease deals on many models lately - 3er for 299, 528 for 439, ILX (I know) for 209 - and all would be less with negotiation.

ronsteve

the Jetta 1.8T will be rated at 26 mpg in the city, 36 on the highway (25 city with the auto). That thoroughly trounces last year’s five-cylinder Jetta—24/31, 23/33 with auto and stick respectively

Do you think so? Trounce is a strong word. And let's face it, we all know how quickly a gas turbo can get thirsty when dipping your foot into the turbo too often. They have an intoxicating urge and is hard to discipline one's self at times...just ask any Ford Eco-boost owner..

I am guessing they will allow electronic parameters that will allow it to run on 87 at an urge and slight FE penalty?

We thought about that, but we were thinking we were in the market sooner than later, and weren't inclined to wait a significant amount of time before new engine bugs were sorted out. Throw in the fact that underachieving real-world MPG and premium fuel costs might offset any advertised gains in fuel economy, and that made it easier to pull the trigger.

My Volvo is "91 octane recommended" but other than putting mid-grade in it a couple of times, I have gone on the assumption that running at more optimal conditions should give me longer engine life. Therefore I don't have a good data set to know what my MPG in the Volvo is like on lower-grade fuel.

Who knows... if this Jetta does well, we could end up a two-VW family in a few years.