BMW Z4 Prices Paid and Buying Experience

peakpro

You did do well. I could not get that deal last month at a NJ dealer. Would'nt even consider 37.5K

mond

Kyfdx is correct when he says "you just have to look for another car". The instant you insist on a particular car the dealer usually wins. Test drive a few different models and hopefully will find more than one you like. This also changes your attitude and the dealer will sense that you don't "need" their car.
In addition, to get the best deal you may need to be willing to purchase or lease from a distant dealer.
Keep your mind open, your wallet closed and always question authority. If you do this, they won't get the better of you.

peacefield1

I agree with some of the earlier statements: know the numbers, talk in terms of the dealer's profit, and don't fall in love with any one car on the lot.

I bought my 2004 z4 (3.0 and all three option packs) last October while the $6500 incentive was on. Thanks to the internet (and Edmunds in particular), it's easy to understand dealer's invoice and all incentives whether to the consumer or the dealer. It put me in a position to negotiate not for my buy price but the dealer's profit. Without even stepping onto a lot, I called a dozen area dealers, asked if they had what I was looking for in stock and if they'd do the deal for $1,0000 profit based on my understanding of the numbers. Every single one of them said yes. In the end, I was able to convince my selected dealer to throw in a wind screen ($285 retail). I charged a deposit over the phone and the whole process took only about an hour. An MSRP of $48,500 turned into a buy price of $38,000. That spread was mostly owing to the rebate, but also from knowing the numbers and negotiating specifically for their profit.

I am, by the way, delighted with the car. It's a blast; especially now with the warm weather starting to return to the northeast. Good luck.

mame

Thank you!
I feel much better now. Regards,
mame

wantone5

I know it's early in the month, but I have seen nothing about incentives on the Z4 for April. Has anyone heard anything or are they really gone for now?

tmchow

I've recently become interested in a 2003 Z4 3.0 and found the Edmunds forums by chance on an MSN Search (yay Microsoft ).

In the northwest, low/decent mileage 2003 3.0's are going for anywhere between $35-$37k. Certified pre-owned (CPO) are between $37-$39k.

In reading the above messages, someone stated "An MSRP of $48,500 turned into a buy price of $38,000". WOW!

At that rate, is it even worthwhile to buy used? I'm guessing the same type of negotations can't happen on a CPO since there are no "Dealer incentives" here AFAIK. Comments welcome.

ukjim

Hi:
I own an RX8 6 Speed ( that forum seems much livelier than this one BTW) but I recently helped my GF buy a Z4.

After much driving around including a horrible Bait and Switch at one dealer where we walked out with the manager on his knees trying to get us to go back( I have owned BMW's and was surprised at this behavior, both the grovelling, and the B&S, not a typical dealer in my experience), she purchased:

A Silver/Black 2003 3.0 auto ( she doesn't drive a manual), with 600 miles, full warranty, for $34K. it is basically brand new.

She is not a slave to fashion and living in RI it is only a 3 season car so the "older" model doesn't bother her.

A good deal?

ukjim

Read my posting earlier, ( for what its worth) I forgot to mention that the car was also CPO.

wantone5

I had a great experience today. I had sent out emails to three dealers looking for prices on a 2.5 Z4 with power top, and heated seats. I was using the TMV price as a target and my preferred dealer came back with a price just over $2000.00 below the TMV price. I was more than pleasantly surprised. I realize they have incentives going on now, but I thought that the TMV price took those into consideration. I just returned from putting down my deposit and I will pick up the car in a few days. I had the most pleasant experience that I have ever had in purchasing a car.

dpz4

While shopping for "something else" I test-drove a pre-owned Z4, and liked it! I then found one that I thought I would buy, and had made what I considered a decent deal. Then, while looking for other info on the web, I found this forum, and maybe wondering if I am doing a smart thing (being smitten sometimes makes you lose focus).

details: 2003 Z4, jet black, tan leather, 2.5, 5-speed, premium pkg, convenience pkg, xenons, heated seats, wood trim, foglights, premium hi-fi.

less than 3,400 miles. from a BMW dealer, and is CPO. so that's the balance of the 50k original factory warranty, plus 2 add'l years and another 50k for 100k total
(I understand that the second 50k isn't as comprehensive as the first 50k, but the CPO plan looked pretty good to me).

Purchase price: $30k.

Thoughts? For me, it's a lot of money, and I just want to be prudent with it.
Thanks, DPz4.

thankthepasser

Just bought mine (end of March).

3.0, PrPkg, SpPkg, Xen, Heat, Step

$41k cap cost. mf = .0022

I'm fairly certain others could do better, but owing to the complexity of my situation, this dealer really went to bat for me and thus I am more than happy with it and more than willing to give them something on both the cap cost and the mf.

Oh, and fwiw, he DID try to raise the fee from $625 to $825, but grinned rather sheepishly when I called him on it.

Second fwiw, I had to walk out (literally) on this deal, get in my car, and drive home. During said drive, they called 4x, so I know this deal (and probably one even better for less complex deals) is not difficult to achieve.

tmchow

I'm seeing wildly different prices here on 2.5 and 3.0.

I'm now thinking of leasing as it may be a better option as I plan on only keeping the car for 3 years.

I'm looking for either a 2.5 or 3.0, but want it fully loaded WITH navigation. I figure I'm getting a new car, why scrimp on the creature comforts

1) I'm located in Seattle area, just wondering what people have managed to swing in terms of deals lately. I that "thankthepasser" scored a fairly nicely equipped 3.0 for the invoice price that Edmunds quoted me for a fully equipped 2.5! Only diff I see is navigation.. seems like "Thankthepasser" got a GREAT deal.. or are there other options that he is missing?

2) Is the Money Factor to shoot for these days 0.0020?

3) Is the standard "acquisition fee" $625 or $675?

rockhound_ms

Does the current $4500 dealer incentive on the 3.0 apply to cars that are ordered, or just to cars already on the lot? I can't find the car I really want anywhere, and if I get it, it will have to be ordered.

peakpro

the car would have to be delivered before the incentive period is over....

unless th eincentive period is extended.

tmchow

I went to the dealer today and he gave me some figures to think about. Pricing is for 2005 models (brand new).

-Both have premium audio and M sport seats, WITHOUT navigation

2005 2.5i
-~$40,000 with $1500 dealer profit
-includes $2500 incentive and further $1500 discount

2005 3.0i
-~$42,250 with $1500 dealer profit
-includes $4500 incentive and further $2000 discount

The salesguy showed me his computer screen and stated that the MSRP is 8% above invoice price, and showed me his screen with a "wholesale" cost, which he said is the same thing as the Invoice. I did notice that there were charges for "MACO" ($200) and "Training" ($180). Not sure if I shoudl be paying those.

WHen asked about "money factor" for leases, he stated it was 0.0024 (5.76%).

Any comments on the above pricing, "wholesale" vs. invoice and the money factor?

kyfdx

1) Did the dealer happen to show you the MSRP on these two examples?

2) Training is broken out on the dealer's invoice, but it all adds up to the same invoice price you see from other sources.. MACO is a regional or local advertising charge that the dealer pays to BMWNA for that particular car.

3) The "base rate" money factor is .0020, so the dealer is marking up the rate the maximum allowed (not good).

Kirstie_H

BMW Z4 enthusiasts - We noticed there's been a lot more interest in this vehicle lately, so the regular (non-pricing) BMW Z4 discussion has been reactivated. Enjoy!

kirstie_h
Roving Host
Host, Future Vehicles & Smart Shopper discussions

pnol

Well, here we are sports car owners! We have a Cadillac Escalade and a Dodge Super cab Hemi, but we always wanted a fun car, two seater convertible! At our ages, it was soon to get one or forget it! This last Saturday we went to breakfast, went to a Golf shop, and then we decided to just browse the dealerships for a sports car. I told my husband I always wanted red with tan leather and tan top. That was my only criteria, except it had to be a 2 seater and very sporty! We went to GMC dealers first to check out the vets. I am not too crazy for the new body style and the used ones did not meet my criteria. We then went to a Honda dealer to check their 2 seater out, well, comparing it to my Escalade, the Honda deffinetly was a cheaply built car. Then my husband decided to go a BMW/Cadillac dealer close to our home. We drove onto the lot, and their set this gorgeous Z4, red with tan top and interior. We had never drove a BMW, so the salesman told us to take it out for a ride, which we did for 45 minutes! It was a blast to drive. We returned to the lot and their stood another couple about our age looking at another Z4, black on black. without leather and the sports package. We drove up in the red one with the top down and she turned to her husband and said something like WOW, needless to say, this Z4, low mileage, 10,000, with the 100,000 mile maintenance program, and all the bells and whistles, had found new owners. The dealership had just got in it on a trade for another BMW.
Anyway, at 57 years of age, we are having a blast driving this car. We put the top down on Saturday night and cruised the downtow streets! There are a lot of us baby boomers enjoying their dream of owning a sports car, and now we are one of them. We feel very fortunate to have found this car and be able to afford it!

buulu

2006 325! @ $1400 + ED invoice (including options)!
Titanium Silver
SP
Heated Seats
Power Seats
Black leatherette
The dealer is the most friendliest (yet professional) i've seen so far - BMW of Eugene.

kyfdx

Maybe you could post this in the 3-series forum?

lenunbiased

My local dealer has a bunch of 04 3.0s on the lot with signs on them offering them at 9k-10k below MSRP -- which given their configurations appears to be right at invoice less the $5500 (for $1000 profit net of incentive). For instance, they've got an 04 3.0 with performance, auto, heated seats & xenon fin black or silver or $37,900.

Two questions:

1. How much lower do you suppose the dealer might go given his large inventory?

2. What have posters here meant when they talked about the '04s being "punched" and would that have any impact on me, e.g., starting the warranty clock early, etc.?

Thx
Len

kyfdx

1) The dealer may want $1000 profit on an '04, but I wouldn't make it my problem... Their fault for not moving the cars.. I wouldn't pay more than invoice minus $6500, and even at that, I'm not sure it is worth it.. There is a $4500 incentive on the '05.. So, at $1000 over, you'd only be paying $2K more for a new '05..

2) I'm not certain about the warranty issue.. But, if the clock has been running, that would make the '04 deal worse...

3) I don't have any inside info on what a dealer might take for the '04, or even if they would consider a loss on it.. My target price would be invoice minus $6500 incentive minus another $1000 ($2K under their asking price).. But, the fact that they've held onto them this long, shows they may not be that flexible...

I find that demos, service loaners, leftovers... rarely sell for enough discount to make it worth it... I'd be aggressively low with my offer, and walk away if they can't do it..

regards,
kyfdx

z4_2k4

Ok, looking to buy an '04 Z4 2.5i. Whats a good price? Here are 2 cars I found

2004 z4 2.5i - $33,2995
400miles
Red-Tan Leather
Automatic
6yr / 100,000 maintenance
Heated seats, xeon, premium sound, wood trim, Convenience Package

or

2004 Z4 2.5i - $32,495 - CPO
11,500miles
Automatic
Silver - black leather, Convenience Package, Sport Package
Multi-function Steering Wheel, Foglights, Premium Hi-fi System
Premium Package, Heated Front Seats, Xenon Headlights

How low should I go?

fundir

I am looking at 05 z4 3.0 deluxe. $50,100. MSRP. Invoice price is$46,267.
Incentive at this dealership is $5000. Salesman says if I buy this car I pay
MSRP minus $5000 incentive = $45,100. That is $1,167 below invoice price.
But you say you paid $10,500 less than MSRP on your car.
I would be paying $5000 less on my car. The car you got at MSRP $48,500 had
an invoice of approx. $44,700. And you paid $38,000. That would be $6,700 under
invoice price. How did that ever happen. and what dealership did you get this done at. If I order one, salesman said it cost me MSRP if the incentives are gone when it comes in, which will be June. Do I need to find another dealer or just walk away now? Please reply, need help fast. May decide this week. Anyone can respond to this. My salesman says BMW's are normally sold at MSRP. Is he right or wrong?

kyfdx

1) The BMW-to-dealer incentive on the '05 Z4 is $4500..

2) If they sell it to you for $5100 off MSRP, you are only getting an effective discount of $600 from MSRP.

3) "My salesman says BMW's are normally sold at MSRP. Is he right or wrong?" hahahahahahaha... he is a real joker

Take their invoice $46,267.. add $1000 profit, then subtract the $4500 incentive.. That gives you $42,767.. I would offer $42,500... and hope to take it home for $43K at the most..

They don't have $4500 incentives for no reason... they aren't selling well..

regards,
kyfdx

lizc3

I understand that there is a $2500 dealer incentive on the 2.5 Z4. Does the dealer still get this incentive if the car is leased? Does anyone know how long this incentive goes for?

There is also a lease deal for $359/month with $3259 down for 36 months at 10,000 miles. It is good till May 31, 2005. How can I negotiate a good sale price and then take advantage of the lease incentive?

Thanks,
Liz

kyfdx

The incentive is compatible with the BMWFS lease rates, so the dealer gets it whether you lease or buy..

The advertised lease deals for BMWs almost always assume a dealer discount of $1000 from MSRP, in addition to any incentives... But, that lease price is for a specific car with few options.... There is always a little extra room to negotiate lower..

Use your knowledge of the $2500 incentive to negotiate a low sale price.. then insist on the dealer using the base rate money factor and acquisition fee.. That will get you a good lease price..

regards,
kyfdx

miata007

If any guys are not sure about how much to pay for a car, go to several dealers and lowball them. Salesman are full of lies trying to make an extra commision on people who are too lazy or not capable of during research. Just be sure to walk when they are wasting your time at the dealership usually when they try to wear you out. Treat the car buying process a fun one by taking your time and shop around between dealers/brands/models. There are plenty of supplies out there.

007

solin

Greetings everyone, I'm interested in leasing a 2.5 Z4. I know BMW has a $359 a month lease with a down payment of $3,493. Is is the the best deal I could expect to get in Southern California? I saw a lease this weekend for $299 a month but the down payment may have been closer to $4,000. The car advertised included a power roof.

I don't think I would keep the care longer than 3 years, hence my interest in a lease which I've never had one.

Lastly, I keep seeing a 0.00020 or something like that number that appears to be the magic equation. Can you explain what that means and how you derive to it?

Thank you very much for your help.

kyfdx

The advertised lease assumes a selling price of $1000 under MSRP minus the current $2500 dealer cash incentive... The large amount due at signing is there just to make the monthly payment seem lower... You do not have to make that large of an initial payment.. Of course, with a lower initial payment, the monthly payment will be higher..

The advertised lease also assumes a fairly low-optioned car.. and is for 36 months and 30K miles (10K miles/yr)

The .0020 is the money factor.. This number is used to calculate the finance charge portion of the lease payment... lower is better..

A typical $39K MSRP Z4 2.5 lease would be about $483/mo.+ tax..

This is with only 1st payment and security deposit due at signing.. and also for 3yr/30K term..

This assumption is for the same discount in the advertised lease... If you negotiated another $1000 off the purchase price, the payment would drop to $453/mo.+ tax..

regards,
kyfdx

kh08

There are a couple of dealers that still have 04's left in both the z4 and 330i. I saw they had incentives way back and was wondering if the BMW gave them to the dealers already. What would be a good price for the z4 with just a pwr top or a 330i with the perf.pkg.? Could I go lower than the 04 inv. minus the incentive? Thanks.

rits

Guys,

I am planning to buy used 2003 Z4. The car has 19K miles on it plus premium package. I am not sure whether it is premium leather but it has red color leather seats. The color is SILVER.

My offer is $25K. Its 2.5lt. Do you guys think I am making a reasonable offer or its high? If high the what should be me arguments?

Thanks
Rits

kyfdx

Are you buying from a dealer or a private individual? From an individual, you might be able to go a little lower, but you'll be fighting their impressions of what their vehicle is worth...

From a dealer, that sounds fair... If the interior is RED, it is definitely leather.. BMW doesn't make red leatherette..

The arguments for a lower price? BMW has put massive incentives on the Z4, every year it has been out.. This lowers the re-sale value of the used one..

regards,
kyfdx

rits

kyfdx
Thanks for the message.
It is frm a private seller? So, do you think considering all the discount which BMW is giving on new vehicle...$25K is a okay price?

Thanks
Ritesh

kyfdx

I'm not a very good appraiser of used cars.. I can't see, touch or drive the one you are looking at.. But, the later the model, I can at least compare it to the price of a new one, and see what kind of value you are getting..

Is he asking $25K? I'll tell you... privately selling a used car in the $20K and up market is tough... He'll have a hard time doing that... If he is asking that, I think I'd hit him up at $23K, and see where it goes... I can guarantee you he'll come down at least $1000, if he is serious about selling the car..

Go to RWTIV and put in a complete description of the car.. Terry will be along in a day or so, and give you a good private sale price for it.. Be sure to follow the template at the bottom of the thread, and give a complete description, including location, and that you are considering buying it from a private seller.. He is a dealership owner/used car buyer, and knows much more about values than I do...

RWTIV

regards,
kyfdx

jlettie1

Too bad that the Z-4 does not offer a spare tire. The run-flat tires are premium tires that last about 10,000 miles. They are noisey and most garages do not want to repair them. When you contact the tire manufactures they do not stand by the product. The want you to contact the dealer. The dealer claim that there nothing they can do to assist you. Everybody passes the buck. This applies also for the Nissan 350Z, Chrysler Crossfire and other manufactures who offer run-flat tires. The are not reliable or possibly safe.

peakpro

Buy a set of regular tires, carry a can of fix a flat and air compressor and a AAA card.

problem solved.

kyfdx

Get used to it.... All BMWs have, or will have runflats.. and all other premium brands are headed that direction..

What are your alternatives?

john72

I just purchased a 2005 Z-4. No floormats. Dealer said floormats did not come with the car. I thought this wierd as I had them as standard on the 530i. BMW USA said they were standard and not option. Before I go back I would like to hear from others as whether they came with your Z4. Thanks.

kyfdx

Don't know about Z4s, but I know they are not standard on the 3-series..

james_oc

Hi kyfdx,

I am planning to lease a 05' 3.0, my friend (actually a former employee of mine) is an indep. auto broker and has stated that after shopping around and negotiating with the dealers, he was able to secure a deal. Basically the deal is the vehicle I had specified, 3.0, sports package, xenons, auto top, heated seats at 7k below MSRP, 2500 down, 12k milage alloance/year at 495$/mo. including taxes.

I have also seen your previous advice in this forum that 7k below MSRP is a good deal,

james_oc

what do you think of this offering?

kyfdx

$7000 off MSRP sounds good.. Hard to know if the lease price is good, without knowing the MSRP.

Also, is it a $2500 downpayment, plus 1st payment, security, etc.. Or is $2500 the entire amount due at signing?

A good deal is all in the details... What would be a good deal on a $42K car, wouldn't be so great on a $45K car..

$2500 due at signing is a big difference from $2500 down, plus other charges for a total of $4300 due at signing..

vizzini

I'm going z4 shopping next week and was curious what current money factors and residuals are for 15k/36mo leases for a 2005 z4 3.0. Anyone have recent data?

Thanks.

james_oc

Hi kyfdx,

Thanks for the response, a little more details....

The MSRP is $45,600 and total deal negotiated is roughly a little over $7k off MSRP
$2500 total due at signing.
$495/Month (including tax) for 36 months (12k miles/year)
Sterling Gray/Black Interior
3.0 Steptronic Trans., Sports Package, Automatic Top, Xenons, Heated Seats

Thanks in advance!

kyfdx

Not knowing your exact tax rate, or what "fees" are included in your $2500, the payment looks pretty good... That MSRP minus $7K gives a lease payment of $468/mo.+tax... So, it looks like you are on the right track.... I would have no problem with that deal..

regards,
kyfdx

ragazzonc

Hey everyone--
I really wish I'd discovered this site and all the good advice BEFORE I bought my Z4--so much great info and in advance thanks to the folks with the knowledge for helping out the ignorant like me. I love the car. I'm increasingly unsure about the deal I got.

So after doing some test drives I decided I wanted a Z4. The MSRP for the car I wanted was $46,795 and they said they could give it to me for 40042.91 which, from the research I'd done seeked like a great deal (though now it seems like it's good but not great). According to the dealer this was the "Duke discount." (I work at Duke.) They'd also throw in the wind screen and mats if I'd buy that day. I didn't bargain hard, not my personality, but was happy enough and eager to have the car. Now that I'm not so happy I'm mustering my confrontation skills and considering discouraging my colleagues at Duke from ever going to the dealership I dealt with. Let me explain and please let me know if I'm getting hot and bothered for nothing.

I met with the finance guy after agreeing on the price with the dealer. He pushed leasing as an option hard and I ended up buying the sales pitch. I was obviously confused. Now I'm wondering if, at this point, I was scammed... here's what happened. I'd love thoughts on the numbers, to begin with, and then also advice on what if anything there is to do, if folks care to offer that too, if indeed I've been had.

So at a certain point, the finance guy started talking about "Silent Security" and 'Hendrick Auto Care" and I said, emphatically, that I did not want them. He said 'You haven't heard the price yet" and I repeated that I didn't want them. He said "What if I told you they were for free?" What was I to say to that? So I agreed...

Then when I got home I noticed something... the price we had negotiated was 40,042.91 but on the lease document the agreed-upon value of the car was $1,000 dollars more than this. I called the finance guy who of course didn't return my call and then went in to the dealership. The head of the finance department spoke with me and his explanation was that the guy who had made the deal with me had raised the price of the vehicle but discounted the money factor to make up for the raised price, thus in effect giving me those items for free. He said that the money factor I got (.00215) was better than the standard of .00255 or something like that, which from what I can tell from reading this list is not true. (If this matters--I live in North Carolina and I have excellent credit.) This is the deal I got:

MSRP 46,795
LEV% 56%
LEV 25,205
Selling price 41,042.91 (we'd agreed to 1,000 less than this)
Term 36 months
45,000 miles
money factor .00215
I put $3,000 down
of which 1,935 went to cap reduction
aquisition fee was 625
my base monthly rental is 517.52
and the tax rate is 3% adding 15.53 to the monthly payment which comes out to 533.05

Thanks again in advance for any input! I'll look forward to a time when I'll have some wisdom to share.

Best,
Marc
aka
ragazzonc

kyfdx

The good news? You got jerked around a little, and wasted some money, but not a large amount. You are still leasing a $47K car for under $600/mo.. And your original negotiated price was decent..

Silent security? What is that? window etching, maybe? Virtually useless..

Hendrick Auto Care? What does that include? Might be good for a Honda, but BMW already covers all of the maintenance.. Not sure what they could give you extra..

What went wrong?:

1) You should have known the base money factor going in.. If you knew it was .0020, then they couldn't have added the other crap "for free", by lowering their inflated money factor..

2) You should have had them apply part of your $3000 upfront to a security deposit, instead of cap cost reduction.. This may have raised your payment by $6/mo, but you would have received $550 back from the deposit at the end of the lease. A net gain of $334. That is why the money factor is .00215, instead of .0020.. They had to bump it to waive the security deposit.

But, overall, you did a decent job..

If everything had gone perfectly...
Original negotiated price
No $1000 bump for useless crap
$550 of your upfront used to make a security deposit
Base MF of .0020

If all that happened, your payment would be about $23/mo. lower, and you would have $550 coming back at lease end..

As you can see, not the end of the world... Think about how a truly uninformed buyer might have been taken.. $2K off MSRP, bumped up rates, $2000 of useless add-ons, etc.. Someone that didn't know what they were doing, could easily be paying $750/mo. to lease the same car..

regards,
kyfdx

ragazzonc

Thanks kyfdx ... I feel somewhat better now, and will enjoy the car more, which is crucial, knowing that it's not as bad as it might have been though still miffed that I'm paying for the thing I emphatically said I didn't want. As usual your knowledge is impressive and I appreciate your taking the time to go through this so carefully. And I'll know better next time around.
RagazzoNC

james_oc

Hi kyfdx,

Thanks for the advice, I actually was shopping around and had another dealer quote me the following...the only difference would be the addition on the premium package...what do you think?

MSRP 48545
Selling Price 40655.58
Residual 58% of MSRP = 28156.10
12000 miles per year
The total cap cost of the car (amount financed before reduction of residual value) is $39988.00
Money Factor 0.00215
2500 Total Drive-Off Down Payment
$475.17 + 7.75% O.C. sales tax = $512 per month total x 35 months